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csummers

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Everything posted by csummers

  1. Well ya, that makes sense. The 20 year old who has scored 30 points in two straight seasons straight out of junior is going to be replaced by the 25 year old who scored 30 points once in five seasons. You should call Fletcher, he needs to know.
  2. Well, there is that thing where Leclair scored two overtime goals in the stanley cup finals to help the habs win the cup in 93. Thats not a bad way to flounder. Hayes on the other hand, is not exactly what anyone would call clutch in the playoffs. He did save a goal here though, just too bad its his own goal he stopped. Smooth hands there. https://twitter.com/i/status/1119056241878282245
  3. No its not a pattern at all that the flyers have no idea how to judge the players they have. Its an organizational thing, always has been. They overvalue what they dont have and undervalue what they have. But we get to see the players excel elsewhere so its exciting for us, like seeing a baby bird hatch and then go on to live a good life somewhere else. Patrick Sharp, Sergei Brobrovsky, Schenn, Hartnell, JVR(1st time), all good players that never seemed good enough in Philly but seemed to just do fine elsewhere. Hey, lets not forget we got to see richards and carter raise cups in order to build for the future only to let half of what that future is go in order to..........build for the future. Sooner or later, you should try to win. If your organization consistently undervalues its own players and over values other players it will keep happening. Every time they do it we hear about how these are the guys of the future, how these guys are the ones, how this trade will pay off. Then they pull the chute before they even know what they have, rinse, repeat. It would not be so bad if they didnt take slugs. The schenn trade was great because they have young guys coming up ready to step up......... but they didnt have anyone and instead got into two bad contracts with older players that will haunt them for years. They sure have got mileage out of frost, whether he ends up a good player or not. They can screw up anything they want right now and the answer is "but its okay, they have Frost coming up". I hope he is good but when I saw every scouting system picking him 2nd round and only the flyers excited for him being first round I thought about their track record of talent judging and its not exactly making me confident. If patrick didnt fall into their lap they wouldnt even have that hope. They let JVR go just in time to let someone else get his best years and then they over paid to get him back while he is going on the decline. Thats real smart planning for the future right there. Toronto had a team they thought was a cup contender but one guy they didnt think they needed for that was JVR. When a cup contender lets a guy walk, it might be a good idea to stay away from him long term. Want to trade a young guy for futures thats fine, but why take a piece of crap in the deal that will be unmovable and you are stuck with for 2 or 3 years? They did it with umberger and they did it with lehtera and for the 5 or so years we had to watch them there was zero chance of winning anything. And now that time is up and they still dont have the pieces to fill what they had and have spent 14 million in 2 years trying to plug that hole up front while they see that all those prospects arent ready. Now we get to watch 7 years of Hayes, who has played about 70 games in two seasons and never broke 50 points. I cant wait.
  4. They might be great players, like Lehtera. Maybe they will be good, at which time the flyers will trade them for a useless player and some draft choices. Then they will turn around and dump what they get in those moves for more futures. If teams won awards for dumping players for draft choices surely the flyers would get it. Its what they do but at least we get to watch them all hoist the cup at their new home, so theres that. You see the pattern? They traded hartnell, saddled the team with umberger for a couple seasons while Hartnell went on to play well for 4 more years in columbus. And then they had nobody to play with giroux for a few years. But its okay because it was for the future. Then when they got out of that finally they traded schenn, for a useless guy who made about the same amount and draft choices. Thats 6 wasted years right there of watching umberger and then lehtera when the team should have just said outright they did not intend to win anything. They could have just kept the players they had and let them play it out and then leave, or in Hartnells case retire. I dont think frost is useless, I think he is gamble and not worth giving up a young, cheap, pp goal leader, proven center with size(you can add Stanley cup winner to that now). And if the flyers thought that Frost was the future at center then why did they just sign a plug for 7x7? Looks more like the flyers dont think he will be ready either. I hope frost is great, they will get more draft choices and maybe two useless players for him when they trade him in his prime. Its all about the future you know.
  5. Why did he have to take another step? They just paid a few million more for a 27 year old that has never done what schenn did three times before he was 25. And his pay was in line for what he was producing. Now they are paying 7 mil a year for a guy who has never came close to the steps schenn has already taken, and likely never will. If they have the future center in frost then why sign a plug for 7 years? they could have had Filpulla again last year for less than 3 million if they needed a placeholder. If frost ends up being good, good luck moving that contract.. If Frost ends up being as good as schenn everyone will be okay with that. You need more than one or two centers. And I didnt forget about the picks for schenn, ive been talking about frost in this thread. Farabee could be good, who knows. I had to remind others about Lehtera. If Hextall didnt make that trade, he would still be GM of flyers, the flyers would have made the playoffs, and St Louis wouldnt have a cup.
  6. You should cherish every one of them, I dont there are many left.
  7. Oh, I see, he has not been given the option to make the team. If only they would have invited him to camp. This must be a misprint. And you call my argument silly. Ratcliffe may end up being the better player, who knows. I hope frost is good but another thing to remember is they didnt need that trade to get frost, he would have been there with the pick they used on ratcliffe. So Frost is gonna get better but Patrick wont. Got it. https://www.prohockeyrumors.com/2018/09/morgan-frost-isaac-ratcliffe-sent-back-to-junior.html
  8. They saved no money with the schenn trade, lehtera cost about the same. They got out of one year, next year, and nobody would want out of one year at schenn for 5 million cap hit next year. Frost hasnt played a game, the other guy is gone isnt he?. Schenn didnt do anything except score over 50 points three straight years and lead the league in power play goals tied with two guys, one named ovechkin and one named kucherov. He was the center they are currently over paying trying to find. They had him and they let him go to draft a second round player in the first round for whatever reason. So what did the flyers get for schenn besides Frost and watching Lehtera skate around like he is on mushrooms? and what the odds Frost ever turns into what schenn already was? The flyers were the only ones, or one of the few, who seemed to have him ranked in the first round. He may end up being really good, I hope so, but that trade destroyed the team and started hextall on his way out. Hextall overvalued his prospects, he thought someone would step up and fill what schenn was doing and there was nobody there to do it. .
  9. Its a bad signing, pure and simple. He is not coming into his prime, he is going out of his prime. The entire league is getting younger, (or people are just noticing that its always been young). Yet here the flyers are signing guys long term into their 30's for big money. Its ridiculous. They are STILL chasing the Schenn trade(who just happened to win a cup as a top 6 center for the 5.2 mil salary cap hit that hextall traded him during). Oh, and they have him for that next year too. Then they will probably let someone else overpay for him into his 30's and he will start a steady decline. Its a pattern. You have to get guys that are young and let them go when they get to 28 or so when they demand term and money. You only do that for very exceptional players. Look at pittsburg, their money goes to top players and they spread the rest around to younger, faster, cheaper guys wherever they can. Guenztel is a cap hit of 6 mil a year and is 24 signed till he is 28 or 29 and then they will probably walk way and let someone else over pay for him. And he will get a huge contract from some team and it will handcuff them for years while they watch a guy decline. Its always been a young players league. Bruins never regretted not signing Lucic, they knew they already got his best years. You know what a guy is before he is 25, and you likely have seen his best years by then and if not, you have before he is 27 or 28. Just look at all the stars through the years and their best years and what age they were, you might be shocked at what you see. Age is just one aspect, I get that, but its still interesting that most stars have their very best years when they are very young. Its different for dmen probably but even active players you can look at their stats and their best years and most come very young, first few seasons. gretzkys very best year he was 24 Orrs very best year he was 22 Lemieux best year he was 23 Jagr very best year he was 24 bossy best year he was 24 Ovechkins best year he was 22 Lafleurs best he was 25 yzermans best season he was 23 My best year I was 8
  10. Well, its the only thing we have of frost to compare with isnt it, considering he cant make the team. The point is pretty self explanatory, Patrick is heads and tails better. He got 102 point in junior in 2015/16, now has two nhl seasons complete while frost is still playing in the soo and hasnt had a sniff. If patrick was on the soo, Frost would be behind him in the depth chart. If patrick was on the soo, Frost would be behind him in the scoring. I know it, you know it and the flyers know it. Just me and the flyers admit it. If he was good enough, he would be there. I like how every month goes by the expectations on frost changes. He went from the future top/second line center to maybe a third line center. He is a good junior player, may never be an nhl player but thats okay. He is what he is.
  11. Frost is a junior player the same age as Patrick, same draft. One is an NHL center, one is a junior player. How many points do you think Patrick would get playing for the Soo? You cant even compare the two. One is going into his third NHL season, the other has not been able to make the team.
  12. He didnt this year. Doesnt mean he wont ever again. Okay sorry, kesslers cap hit is just under 7 million. A second line center on a playoff team that might win the cup. You want a revolving door trade grioux, trade ghost, he had a down year too, trade schenn...not living up to his potential, trade voracek....high cap hit. Just rip the team apart every three years then complain that they never keep a group together long enough to gel. Its the same old story, blame the best players and dump them. They have young talent, they are slowly working them in. They also have veterans. They arent about to blow this up again and start over. It would set them back. Its knee jerk. They made the playoffs last year. They didnt make it this year but i would say the outlook long term probably looks better. If you think getting rid of your best players will improve you as a team you are wrong. Blame him, go ahead. Trade him and start over. Lord knows flyers fans have been lathering, rinsing and repeating that for 40 years. I heard it every time.......lindros is the issue, his parent are the problem, richards and carter party too much, they are the problem, dump them........on and on it goes. Hextall is trying to build a team with a mix of young players and veterans and he wants stability. I know its new to flyers fans to not just dump the best players every time theres a down year but get used to it. This group is probably going to be around for a while and if they trade a top player like giroux, it wont be some 3 or 4 million dollar slug or they simply just wont do it. It will be someone who makes them better, which means a better player than giroux. The trade for fillpula should have shown you that hextall believes this team is not far off. If you can trade giroux, go right ahead but if you do it for future picks and not a player who makes the team better right now then back on the merry go round we go. Another rebuild from scratch. Sooner or later you have to keep a team together for a while if you want to win. You cant just keep trading your best players for young kids and draft choices and then do the same thing in four more years. Unless perennial rebuilding is what you want out of a hockey team you gotta wait. And guys will have down years. Peoples skills degrade slowly over time, except for richards of course. Good players dont just fall of the cliff, they slowly degrade. I dont think its fair to judge giroux on this bad year. Could be worse, could have stamkos. But you would be calling for him to be traded too so it wouldnt matter. You would just find the best players, and blame them.
  13. I just told you, lucic for one. it changes over time and in three or four years what will you see? . Right now, bobby ryan, 7.5 million dollar cap hit, has not scored 60 points since the 10/11 season. Lucic cap hit is 6 million, Ryan oreilly, 7.5 hit, only scored over 60 points once in his career, rick nash was a special kinda player this year with 36 points and a 7.8 million dollar cap hit. Is kopitars cap hit of 10million worth the 50 whole points he got? how about Kesler? Kesler is a second line center on anaheim with a 7.8 million dollar cap hit, almost the same as girouxs. Thats a second line center, cap hit almost the same as girouxs. Its a long term deal, judge it as the market moves up arouund him. Basing a career on a bad year he went into with an injury from the world cup is not fair.
  14. No jagr, no production. I guess thats why he was a hart trophy finalist two years after jagr left......3 or 4 million at best? ridiculous. You think simmonds and schenn are gonna lead or be close to leading the league in power play goals if you take away giroux? You gonna find somone to run the power play and lead the league in power play assists, or be right at the top almost every year, with 3 or 4 million? good luck. You should call hextall
  15. Its just a certain bunch of flyers fans that always want to get rid of the best players in order to rebuild. Giroux has a cap hit of 8 million. In a couple years, it almost is now, that will be the going rate for a second line center, grinders are getting 6 million against the cap now. Thats why they do these long term deals. They know his production will drop off but the cap hit stays the same while the median cap hit for each position continues to rise. Is he really being paid as a superstar anymore when toews and kane are making 12 million? Ryan Oreilly is making 11 million with a cap hit of 7.5 right now. Parise is making 9 million with a cap hit of 7.5. Lucic is making 8 million with a cap hit of 6 million. louis erikson is making 8 million, cap hit of 6 million. The next flyer superstar to come along will probably be making 12 or 13 million. Everything changes and as pay and cap hits rise, giroux will stay constant as others way less valuable in the league meet and exceed it. He will begin to look like a bargain. Why people never saw this as the reason for the long contract in the first place is baffling. In his last two contracted years, slotted as a 2nd line center he will probably be making about the same as every other second line center. The bar is rising. The issue is not giroux and what he makes and his cap hit. The issue is he is getting older, getting injured, and people still expect him to produce like he was before. Its not his fault they dont have an heir apparent. Anyone who thinks you can get someone like crosby, kane, mcdavid or mathews in the next couple years, at girouxs price, term and cap hit are fooling themselves.
  16. Canada day is all about the butt grabbin. The cop needed to chill out and enjoy it like the ones at mardi gras do with the beads tradition. Instead of shaking hands we butt grab up here, deal with it.
  17. He was so drunk he thought the officer was Crosby and was just trying to hand his A$$ to him once again like he always does.
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