GratefulFlyers

The season was fun to watch but the appraisal I'm really interested in is where Jones/Briere say it fits in their rebuild timeline. Are the Flyers closer now to becoming a Cup contender or did this season convince them to trade TK and begin a more thorough rebuild? They're never going "tank" we know that, either legitimately or the way the Pens did it (twice); that's just not in their DNA. But the "accelerated rebuild" didn't get them very far this year. Tortorella got everything possible out of them, which made for exciting Flyers' games. I'm not sure it advanced the team much toward the goal of becoming a Cup contender. Remembering where the Flyers were before Jones/Briere/Tortorella took over I congratulate them all for turning it around. Exceeding expectations this year was the icing on the cake. But now it's turned around and a repeat of this year, with Tortorella driving a roster of decent players to "overachieve" is probably not good enough. To end on a positive note: something we haven't seen from a Flyers' roster in ages...a few guys actually developed their games on the fly and did so convincingly. Not just Shaw's guys. Foerster's got a complete game already; if he improves his skating he'll be a monster. Some good came out of this season I only wish it hadn't left me wondering more instead of less about the overall direction of the team.

"reading tea leaves" is picking apart shifts or maybe speculating about the "soul of the team" or some such twaddle. I'm sure avoided it in this thread. And I understand now why we're not connecting: we're looking from different altitudes. You look from 40K feet and conclude, and that's unquestionably true. Apparently that explains it for you. Fair enough. I can't disagree with that or anything else in your post. It's just that (to me) after what happened in Montreal (and the preceding weeks) the Flyers' performance at MSG was so out of the blue there's no shrugging it off with "eh, no great shakes sometimes ACBA." I'm not looking for some deep meaning but there's more to it than "shithappens." The timing of the performance and the performance itself are both in their own WTF? category. As an ending to Flyers' losing streaks that one was the most unexpected and by far the most confounding (hence: "whack jobs"). To put it in perspective we don't need tea leaves but we do - I do - need more than ACBA.

Me too. That's all just a good fight - an intelligent fight. If Ersson is good again maybe they relax and play their game. Who knows...?

I see. So it's basically a crap shoot. I accept that if we're talking about where the Flyers are now. But earlier in the season they played consistently good, fast hockey - goaltending was solid - and it wasn't a crap shoot at all. Certainly ACBA is "the bottom line" it's just not very helpful.

Hardly that. You said ACBAOAGN explains the result. I said it doesn't. "Anyone can beat anyone..." is obviously true but it sheds no light on what happened. It's like saying, "there were a lot of Flyers' fans at MSG last night." That's undoubtedly true (there always are) but it's irrelevant or incidental to the outcome. I offered a partial explanation for the result, namely how well Ersson played. But why he and the Flyers suddenly played so well, that's what I find interesting don't you? The parity among NHL teams can't help us with that. The team is so unpredictable now I called them "whack jobs" and imho it's a fitting description. Some games this year ACBA probably is the best explanation. In Dallas, in Winnipeg, in Sunrise ... but after going winless in 8, to get some perspective on whipping the legitimate Cup-favorite Rangers 4-1 at MSG (who were trying to secure the #1 seed) I need more than "anyone can beat anyone."

This is true but imho it only applies to last night's game in the most general sense. Parity has grown steadily since the salary cap but what we saw last night had little to do with parity. The game wasn't a one-off; it was potentially (and expected to be) the Flyers' 9th consecutive loss. Instead they go into MSG and play the kind of hockey that had them sitting 3rd in the Metro for months. The biggest on-ice factor that allowed the Flyers to beat the Rangers last night was Ersson playing so well. When the Flyers get the early big save(s) they can play their game. When they don't they (naturally) go into a shell and since their talent is not very deep on either side of the puck the game is basically over for them. We've seen losing streaks before but the Flyers most recent one has been remarkable. For it to end against the best team in the NHL (%-wise) with a complete 180... in attitude, confidence, execution, in every aspect of the game ... that wasn't about "anyone can beat anyone" that was ... frankly I don't know what that was...and I have no idea if we'll see it again tomorrow.

what a whackjob team.... I'd love to believe in the Flyers, in Jones/Briere and Tortorella but how can I? What kind of team spends weeks sabotaging their PO hopes then goes into MSG and beats maybe the best team in the NHL? Beats them convincingly too. This team makes no sense to me. It's like a switch was flipped back to "ON" and last night they started playing professional hockey again. whackjobs...

With vs without Hart the numbers are pretty staggering… I don’t know if anyone should’ve foreseen this level of suckage. A handful games the Flyers gave some good teams a real battle but the W/L record, Ersson’s game etc. all went South in a hurry after Hart left. Tonight at MSG, Ersson starting again… 12-2 sounds about right. Either that or the Rangers rest some guys, the Flyers play halfway decent and lose 5-2 instead. But honestly who the hell knows what to expect!

btw that .875 is a gigantic reason for the collapse - and it is on the goalies. Hart's departure marks the turning point where Ersson was 17-3 I think with a .930 and afterwards he's 9-13. I'm guessing at his W/L record but it should be close. The Flyers had a huge strength with Hart/Ersson. The Flyers' game - the transition game, where they did 90% of their damage to the opposition - keyed off good goaltending. When that became a liability it all snowballed downhill. The quick outs disappeared, led to fewer goals off the rush, plus now the opposition gets to play half the rink instead of starting behind their own net. Bad goaltending - Hart leaving - doesn't explain it but it's a huge part of what we're seeing...except for the Montreal game. God only knows what explains that.

For weeks now Ersson has not been very good but we all know Save% and GAA are team numbers. I'm not exonerating him or Fedotov, not at all. I still think (hope) Ersson can be a reliable NHL starter but he's obviously not one now. "clown-show histrionics" - you're referring to benching Couturier? So soon after naming him captain was absurd, made Tortorella look stupid I agree. OTOH did anyone think Couturier was earning even 4th line minutes? I can't get too worked up about it. I'm sure his feelings were hurt but "alienated" good god I hope not.

This is an interesting thread but it presupposes the Flyers are a regular NHL team with regular problems. I'm not sure they are; their problems seem deeper to me than who's on the roster and who's the HC. Maybe I'm overreacting to the blowouts, maybe I'm finally catching on that the Senior Advisors' stink is still all over this club. All I know is a team that rolls over like that has serious issues. They're playing even worse than they did in Giroux's final season. I thought for sure that was rock bottom but it wasn't. So it's hard for me to imagine regular, normal changes doing much good. I wish I knew what would.

LOL! Flyers' fans don't mess around you can't cut it in the first 20 minutes Get Lost!

I did but only bc I knew they weren’t relying on talent they were doing it “by committee” as they say. The committee was broken up just a bit at the TD, then the injuries but lord I still believed they’d beat Chi, Columbus. And if they lost I certainly didn’t expect a freaking blowout! You make a lot of sense re: Tortorella’s approach but I still can’t believe “exhaustion” explains this total collapse.

That stadium is quite nice though….well it was when it opened anyway I haven’t been there in a long time. I agree tanking sucks…sucks the life out of everyone. But trading for the overall 3, 4 or 5th pick is a tough ask (forget the overall 1st and 2nd) so if @flyercanuck is right and teams absolutely must have those top prospects to win the Cup how do we get them? I think he’s wrong but I’m not exactly brimming with confidence that Jones and Briere can pull off what they said they want. Let’s face it the odds are slim the Flyers win the Cup in the next 5 years. That so many other teams share the same lousy odds is no comfort. But building a Cup champ by tanking is at least a 5 year project. So as you can tell I don’t know what I want lol!

Thanks. But baseball is way too sleepy. Sleepy to play (90%) and sleepy to watch. I couldn’t possibly read about it lol! Still I know you’re right. Sure it can get worse. I don’t really want them to BITFU but I’m beginning to wonder…maybe it is the only honest rebuild, the only shot at building a champ. I hope not bc KJ and DB ain’t interested…