Polaris922

35 times out of thirty teams and literally thousands of opportunities. So all of the writers and GM's quoted as saying it's bad business are lying? And I never said Poile wouldn't improve his Club, but he's made bad trades with the Flyers in the past where you can almost hear the "remember I did this for you" with it. And you're not going to see that anymore. Package Vinny in a way that the Preds win the deal and he does it. But he won't be doing any favors for future considerations after that. Business is business, but GM's often do one another small favors for future consideration. I just don't think you'll see that from Poile again. A definite gaffe by Holmgren. To deny that is to view through blinders.

@jammer2 Was it? A team who'd traded with you regularly to benefit both sides, but bringing you Timonen, Hartnell, Upshall, and a first round pick through the years is the one Holmgren screws with? A team that took an aging ailing overpaid Forsberg and overpaid for him? A team that right now could absorb VLC's contract easily under their cap and again foster that relationship? But alienating that team that you would only see in the Stanley Cup finals was a win for Philly? The only ones smirking are Penguins fans. @Lindbergh31 I'd agree if he'd done it to the Pens or Rags... Or even a conference opponent. But honestly the team he did it to was a partner in trades. And what if he's just kept the trade talks open? Called Poile again asking what it would take? Or waited a year till Weber was a free agent. Expressed his interest in seriously acquiring him when that day came and willingness to spend big $? Perfectly legal negotiations. What if he hadn't tried forcing it and giving Poile the chance to call? I seriously think Weber would be in black and orange. Thank you Paul Holmgren. @doom88 Sorry bud! I just see this as a clear strike out by Holmgren. Swing for the fences though no doubt.

@Lindbergh31 @jammer2 The idea that Nashville APPRECIATES this is ridiculous. And it IS an unwritten rule not to offer sheet another twam's star players. There are plenty of write ups on how that IS still the code amongst GM's. Was it within the rules? Absolutely. Did it still piss off Poile? Absolutely. This wasn't doing the Preds a favor. It was throwing crazy money at someone they may have been able to sign for a decent amount less.

I guess I see it differently. You're absolutely right about the NTC, but I think he DID have the choice just the same as a free agent. He chose to sign the offer sheet. And with the money offered I don't think he could've done any better. Free agency wouldn't have brought any more than he got. And it left Nashville in a pay or die situation. Regardless... I think it remains relevant. They won't do Philly any favors. To strike a deal its going to have to favor the Preds.

One of our best fourth round draft picks in history!

NO to reviewing the icings. That just allows the offending team to rest their players while the officials review the play. And if the officials were correct what is the penalty? They lose a timeout they didn't have anymore anyway? If you're going to allow it, there have to be guidelines on how it could be used.

If Weber had waited another season then you would be correct. At the time though, Nashville was trying to sign him to alleviate that issue, and the club was making offers and receiving counter offers with Weber's agent. Nashville was also shopping him around to see what could be had for him so they wouldn't lose him in free agency if at all possible. They were actively seeking a good trade for Weber, and negotiating with him on the side. When Holmgren made that offer, it took all of Nashville's leverage away. Not only could they no longer control what terms a possible extension would be, they could no longer entertain the idea of a big trade with him to strengthen their club. Their options were completely stripped down to sign him at a crazy contract, or let him walk for four first round picks that would all be low round fodder. Weber couldn't wait a year. Poile wouldn't allow it. He'd either sign Weber to an extension or make a big trade with him as the centerpiece.

I do think it matters. Poile wasn't playing hardball with Weber, they were in negotiations when Holmgren through a crazy contract offer in. That blew up Poile's negotiating power and gave Weber ALL of the leverage. To Nashville's credit, they matched it. As for hurting his team, Poile would make a move that benefits the Preds if the Flyers offered one, but I don't see one to be had here. Lecavalier didn't have a top six year last year, and that's what the Preds need. Not a bottom six guy getting top six money. Where does that help the Preds? And I think the Weber offer sheet DOES taint Poile's willingness to roll the dice on something just to help the Flyers out. Without that history, MAYBE Poile is more inclined to say "well lets see what he can do here. Remember you owe us one though" for future dealings. You're not gonna see that now. And yes it gets done that way. Right here though it won't be.

Honestly as much as I like Tocchet I hated that trade. I'm glad both live here and see them both regularly, but Recchi won a Cup here leading the team in scoring on the way. I'm glad the organization found a place for him. He's a great example for the young players.

By Michelle Crechiollo Development camp marked the first time the entire Penguins staff got to watch and spend time with 2014 first-round draft pick Kasperi Kapanen - and he didn't disappoint. "He's even better than I thought he would be," Penguins assistant general manager Bill Guerin said. "I was very happy with him." Kapanen, however, wasn't totally thrilled with his play these past few days, as this past week marked his first time on the ice this summer. But he feels like he ended the week on a positive note following Saturday's camp-ending scrimmage. "It was good we had the game at the end," Kapanen said. "I felt good, I felt good with the puck. I think I made some good plays and I think I played a good game. So that's just building some confidence for me and hopefully rookie camp will go better." Kapanen was one of the players who stood out the most to Guerin on Saturday during the scrimmage. "He's this high-end talent, high-end speed," Guerins aid. "He's a very, very mature kid for his age. Obviously having his father (Sami) playing so many years in the NHL and playing with him and bringing him up that way, he's already a pro, so he's ahead of the game in that department. You got a little screenshot of what's to come and he's not even 18 yet, which is kind of cool." In addition to his strengths as a player, one of the things Guerin likes the most about Kapanen is how hungry the 17-year-old to make the NHL roster this September. "He definitely (has a chance to compete for a spot this year)," Guerin said. "And he made it clear that's what he wants to do. Those were some of his comments in the paper after the draft, that he was going to try to come in and compete for a spot. That's the business that we're in, you come in and you try to take people's jobs. That's what pro sports is all about. And if he's already thinking like that, I love it." Kapanen is certainly thinking that way. He knows it won't be easy to secure a spot with Pittsburgh, and that training camp is going to be tough. But Kapanen said he's ready for the challenge. "These camps, I try to take everything out of it," he said. "I try to have fun, because hopefully I wont come back to this camp again. But if I do, that's not a problem. (Training camp) is going to be tough. But I'm ready. I think I'm up for the challenge. I know that some people might doubt me, but I'm just going to bring everything to the table and hopefully make the team."

Penguins Name Jacques Martin Senior Advisor of Hockey Operations The Pittsburgh Penguins have named Jacques Martin senior advisor of hockey operations, it was announced today by executive vice president and general manager Jim Rutherford. Martin, 61, has over 25 years of NHL experience as a general manager, head coach and assistant coach with Pittsburgh, Montreal, Florida, Ottawa, Colorado/Quebec, Chicago and St. Louis. His duties will include monitoring NHL games, with an emphasis on Eastern Conference teams, assessing how the Penguins compare to the competition. He will report his information to general manager Jim Rutherford. Martin, who spent last season as an assistant coach on the Penguins' staff, has won 613 games and made 12 playoff appearances in 17 seasons as a NHL head coach. He won the Jack Adams Award as the NHL's 'most outstanding coach' with Ottawa in 1999 and was a finalist for the award on three other occasions. Martin won gold medals as an assistant coach for Team Canada at the 2002 Olympics and the 2004 World Cup of Hockey. He was also an assistant coach on the 2006 Canadian Olympic Team.

I think Vinny's contract is too handicapping. Salary cap or no there's a term to consider and to give up a pick would have to be a 3rd or 4th rounder... At best. He's just too overpaid.

No doubt about it injuries have taken a serious toll on this squad. But aside from numerous issues adding up to failure, I have to give the Rangers a little credit for grabbing St.Louis' loss and using it to turn their series around. The Pens let one go no doubt. But the positives are Fleury played real well, our youth got experience, Bylsma is gone, and they've toughened up. Getting rid of Neal is debatable, but Glass and Pyatt are gone. I'm ok with all that.

You Mean your favorite Penguin turned Flyer turned Penguin again. . Lol

The Pens are no more guilty of embellishment than your Flyers are. Despite James Neal's recently departed theatrics. Skilled players thrive where obstruction is called. We've ALL noticed the league's letting obstruction back into the game, and its impact. For years your Flyers have had more power play chances than my Pens, so does that mean they were diving more?? Or just started seeing some skilled players step up instead of the goons of yesteryear? The Pens failures with Bylsma were in line combinations and changes, his reigning in the offense for worrying about defense, and his refusal to adjust to the game plans of their opponents. Those were the biggest issues I saw. That's what we're excited to get away from. The stagnation of our skilled players.

By these last two posts I can tell you don't watch them much at all, and you've chosen to ignore the points made that show the pros and cons I argue make them equal in value. As for the reason the Pens have had playoff struggles, you clearly haven't watched them there either. I think your bias against them clouds your lenses quite heavily. You should set aside the routine Flyers fan mentality (the Pens dive, the Pens whine, the Pens cheat, the Pens are favorites, the Pens sacrifice first born children) and just watch the hockey they play. Their failure had nothing to do with not getting calls or similar melon head thinking. It will be interesting what a very offensive minded coach brings back to the team. Bylsma started that way and they were a dominant offensive juggernaut. His philosophy shifted and the success went with it. So now that he's gone this could create some very fast paced wide open hockey.

They kept Jacques Martin and the goaltending coach they just started last season Mike Bales. Bales I think was being rewarded for helping Fleury get past his playoff disaster stage. Fleury had a 2.4 GAA and his best save % (.915) in a few seasons. So I think they figured Bales had been helpful.

I put a lot of the team's struggles on Bylsma to be honest. We've talked ad nauseam about Bylsma's failings in the playoffs. I'm excited to see what a new mentality does for the talent on this team.

@jammer2 Until Mason proves he can win a playoff series I don't see him as an upgrade at all. Fleury has outperformed him in the regular season and you still need a ticket to get to the dance. I agree Mason is young and if he continues to improve I'll change my opinion, but until then, this is all ridiculous home team favor. I understand the $1.5 mill cap difference but that's the difference between a fourth and third liner these days. And I like the idea that if Fleury stinks this coming season his contract is done. Free market. My point remains they're two mediocre goalies very much on par with one another till you add all the pros and cons. I wouldn't trade one for the other. The difference really isn't worth the paperwork. Fleury better in regular season. Mason unknown quantity in postseason (but I'd take that over Fleury's recent history.) Mason saves $1.6 million (but signed three years so he needs to prove himself.) Fleury is more expensive (but for one season then you can be done if he fails.) Score tied at 2... Equal. *shrugs* believe in your goalie with high hopes for the future, that's great. But if I'm a GM I'm basing a trade on what I know, not what "might" be.

Heh heh... Man-desert? Tough sand?

He's going to be made into a pie?

I think the difference for me is having watched all of those seasons games and knowing how badly the team played in front of him. Average GAA all but those two seasons with a team that's more than struggled in front of him. The number of odd man breaks and power plays the team has surrendered has greatly damaged the statistics for Fleury. And the injury list during at least two of those four tears was extensive. this past season was a better reflection of standard Fleury. Again I'm not a supporter of his, but to say Mason is a better goaltender is a stretch to me. He may yet be, but the regular season stats he's actually a little behind. And I'd like more than one well rested playoff series to judge his postseason success by. The only argument anyone can reasonably have in my eyes is he costs less per season, but to me that's offset by Fleury's contract being up after this season.

Welcome Yorick! I liked Engelland too, but he's WAY overpaid by Calgrlary and in all honesty, he didnt step into his role of protecting Sid & Gino all too often. That frustrated me.

Won't disagree Mason MAY be moving in the right direction where Fleury has just now recovered from two abysmal postseasons, but I'm sorry, I'm not judging what MAY happen. I'm judging what they did last season and where their stats show them to be. They're both very middle of the pack mediocre. Neither stands out above the other in any significant way to me. And if anything I have a DEFLATED sense of Fleury these past few years. @flyercanuck Don't Mistake my comments as saying Fleury is great. Hes got more wins over the past five seasons than any other goalie, and i still think hes average. Just understand that I'm saying Mason is no better yet. He may prove otherwise if he sharpens his skills, but not yet. @ Sorry bud just gonna have to agree to disagree. I just don't see the little cap difference to be off setting when this is the last year of his contract. It should be make or break time for Fleury.

Then I can add you to the list of people who are judging Fleury by two bad post seasons and who are clearly ignoring his positives. The guy is not Lundqvist, and I consider him mediocre. But he had more wins than Mason, tied Niemi, better GAA than both, better save% than Niemi (Mason had .002% better), more time on the ice, more shutouts, and went 6-2 in shootouts with one of the best save percentages in shootouts of all goalies, particularly with more shootouts to participate in. Fleury's stats are overall better than both Mason and Niemi, and did so with a largely AHL roster in front of him last season. Now I'm not claiming Fleury is a dominant goalie. Far from it. But you're nuts if you think Mason or Niemi are better at the position. They are ALL THREE very much equals at mediocrity in my eyes. Fleury has proven he can win a Cup and gets paid accordingly. Niemi has as well. Mason is a question mark. Does the contract difference offset that? Would you pay the extra $1.6 million for a goalie that's proven he can win a Cup and just had a good rebound playoff season? I stand by my comment that Fleury and Mason are very much on par with each other these days. And certainly if the Pens were going to dump Fleury they'd be looking for more than Mason to fill that role.