Is this our D-men Strategy?

[JackStraw]

@aziz - while that's a reasonable breakdown that you're giving, there is still the idea of taking away time and space from the puck carrier, without necessarily committing to hitting him. I agree, the forwards do not consistently do a good job but even so, you can't have two defensemen just back away from the puck carrier that deep in your own zone.

[aziz]

@JackStraw

i don't disagree in theory, but looking at those screencaps, how can either dman take even a single step towards stajan without giving one of the two guys wide a completely clear lane to the net? take a single step towards stajan, and a simple saucer pass to the faceoff dot puts someone one on one with bryzgalov.

if, on the other hand, the backchecking forward decides to get involved, everyone is covered and time/space is taken away from the puck carrier. i don't know, seems to me the dmen played it correctly, but received zero support from a forward who was right there but opted against doing anything.

[JackStraw]

@JackStraw

i don't disagree in theory, but looking at those screencaps, how can either dman take even a single step towards stajan without giving one of the two guys wide a completely clear lane to the net? take a single step towards stajan, and a simple saucer pass to the faceoff dot puts someone one on one with bryzgalov.

if, on the other hand, the backchecking forward decides to get involved, everyone is covered and time/space is taken away from the puck carrier. i don't know, seems to me the dmen played it correctly, but received zero support from a forward who was right there but opted against doing anything.

But if you watch the video (if it exists) it looks different than what you see in those stills. Both defensemen simply floated back and away from the middle of the ice. They just opened up the whole high slot area. At some point you would want them to slow their retreat and at least close the space between them and the attackers. They didn't need to take a step towards him, they just needed to slow their retreat.

I agree with you that if the forwards do a better job of back checking things get a lot easier, but just because they didn't doesn't mean the defensemen can also screw up.

Edit: The video is on the Flyers website. JJ even says, "Stajan holding on, given room, fires and scores"

And he was given a lot of room.

Edited February 27, 2012 by JackStraw

[Podein25]

Interesting discussion. Not sure where I fall on it yet....

The announcers (I was watching CBC) certainly were emphasizing that the Flyers D were backing up "all night," so I was inlfuenced by that a little bit. It certainly did seem like it. It suggests poor gap control that's for sure.

But, at the end of the day, if I'm a D-man looking at Matt Stajan taking a slapper from there, with no screen, I'm just getting out of the way so my goalie can see it and making sure the rebound isn't a problem. Of course, if you're a Flyer D-man, it ain't nearly that simple. And that's thing about lousy goaltending: it makes the game so much more complex and difficult.

[aziz]

But if you watch the video (if it exists) it looks different than what you see in those stills. Both defensemen simply floated back and away from the middle of the ice. They just opened up the whole high slot area. At some point you would want them to slow their retreat and at least close the space between them and the attackers. They didn't need to take a step towards him, they just needed to slow their retreat.

i took those grabs from the video. yes, at full speed the impression is different, but the stills show you exactly what was going on. as it was, the flames wingers were square to the flyers' dmen. if either dman slows his retreat, those flames forwards end up goal side of them. would you rather the dman allow a winger behind him? i can only imagine what would be said if that happened and stajan flipped a little toss up to that guy who was now left entirely alone behind the defense.

the dmen had to stay goal side of the passing threats and had to make the decision to allow the backcheckers and/or goalie to take the puck carrier. just like any odd man break.

and again, the one risk-free option that wouldn't have allowed any flames skater a clear path to the net was if JVR picked up stajan. every other scenario involves someone dropping coverage somewhere else. i have a very hard time blaming defensemen for playing an odd man situation by the book, especially when there was a forward standing right there who could have neutralized the entire play, but apparently didn't feel like it.

we can agree to disagree on this one, i guess.

[JackStraw]

we can agree to disagree on this one, i guess

Works for me.

[OccamsRazor]

@JackStraw

i don't disagree in theory, but looking at those screencaps, how can either dman take even a single step towards stajan without giving one of the two guys wide a completely clear lane to the net? take a single step towards stajan, and a simple saucer pass to the faceoff dot puts someone one on one with bryzgalov.

if, on the other hand, the backchecking forward decides to get involved, everyone is covered and time/space is taken away from the puck carrier. i don't know, seems to me the dmen played it correctly, but received zero support from a forward who was right there but opted against doing anything.

Bingo!

That is why i'd rather move JVR before he's coasting around @ 4.25mill....

...and he's just barley score 40pts just once in his short career...

...Schenn @ 3.1mill (more than Simmonds and Read combined) holy christ this guys haven't done schitt to warrant those #s.

I'm going to go throw up now.