Trade Talk Flyers Need A Dman

[ruxpin]

Alright, defense is going to be a problem.

We really don't have cap money without moving someone, so who do you send and who do you want? Realistically, of course. No Shelley for Chara trades.

Go.

[Vincent05]

Realistically I will trade Carle for a defensive dman and one that makes less than Carle so that will give us cap space. I had really like this guy but he's been bad with the puck lately. I will understand if he is more offensive but he isn't. Right now I can't think of any names to give you but there's gotta be someone who fits the profile I describe. As of right now I would rate Gustavsson hight than Carle.

As for Coburn, he had a bad game tonight too with alot of turnovers in the d-zone. He is too inconsistent with his play. Where's the nastiness we have seen him play with? Would love to see it more often, more physical play with body checks and crease clearing. His offense game sucks badly but if you can't contribute there atleast concentrate on defense.

I've posted on the old forum about these 2 and who to resign. I would only bring back Coburn but if he doesn't improve his play the rest of the season, we will need 2 new defenseman to replace these 2. At 4 mil or more apiece we need better play in our d-zone then what they have shown.

[OzFlyer]

How about someone that can win a faceoff?

[colorado_al]

How about someone that can win a faceoff?

Quite a unique idea there ! <g>. ( winning a faceoff )

[Dynamo 47]

I agree that the defense needs to be upgraded. The issue I have is that there are too many puck carriers and finesse guys and not enough physicality as only Pronger provides that.

One move I might explore is almost a cap wash and would give us the physical defensemen with a nasty edge without a long term commitment is trading Carle to the Blues for Barrett Jackman. Both are UFA's and while the Flyers would get their physical guy who plays nasty, they also get leadership. If they are happy with him they resign him if not he walks. But either way they fill a big need.

Both Carle and Coburn are UFA's this offseason. Suter of Nashville is a UFA. I would rather have one Suter for the combined salaries of C&C then resigning both of them.

[fishbulb]

I like that Dynamo. Jackman never really lived up to his rookie year accolades, but he's fairly steady and a crease clearer. I'd do it.

[phlfly]

Carle is known for doing dump passes. He plays better with Pronger. When NJ scored he had open ice, but did pass where were two NJ players. Also I think it's something to do with forwards, they don't take a right position to make D easy job.

And of course Flyers is completely lost blue line in PP. That problem came right after Richards is gone. He was always on right side and time. May be they should try to use forward on blue line. Pronger is not answer too, because he is slow, he skates behind blue line too far.

[flyerrod]

Pronger needs to be on the point for the PP. His long reach along with his slap shot completely change how aggressive opposing teams are on the PP. Their troubles with the PP have more than doubled since Pronger has gone out. Gustavson has no real feel for the point, he was out of position almost every time he was on the ice for the PP.

[Vincent05]

Pronger needs to be on the point for the PP. His long reach along with his slap shot completely change how aggressive opposing teams are on the PP. Their troubles with the PP have more than doubled since Pronger has gone out. Gustavson has no real feel for the point, he was out of position almost every time he was on the ice for the PP.

You sure it was Gustavsson? I remember more of Carle on the PP. Dude can't play anywhere annymore.

[Spinorama]

Carle is known for doing dump passes. He plays better with Pronger. When NJ scored he had open ice, but did pass where were two NJ players. Also I think it's something to do with forwards, they don't take a right position to make D easy job.

And of course Flyers is completely lost blue line in PP. That problem came right after Richards is gone. He was always on right side and time. May be they should try to use forward on blue line. Pronger is not answer too, because he is slow, he skates behind blue line too far.

I don't disagree,but if it's the forwards poor positioning than I'd send them a message and not pass it to them. I'd look them off and try to skate to the half line and dump it or swing back to my defensive partner and attempt another break out. After a little bit of that I'd like to think Lavi would recognize the D men aren't comfortable with the current set of passing options and inform the forwards they need to do a better job with positioning and movement. Those boneheaded passes are beyond baffling.

[The Quigster]

Since Pronger's injury the Flyer's "D" have fallen apart,Coburn is one of the biggest guys on the team and plays like he is one of the smallest. None of these guys will clear the front of the net,harass opposing players,and play scared. Nobody takes the lead! Q

[idahophilly]

I think we should wait before we do anything. We all new this year was going to be rocky. The defence is a mess right now, but it wasn't 6 games ago and might not be 6 games from now.

[touche22]

Alright, defense is going to be a problem.

We really don't have cap money without moving someone, so who do you send and who do you want? Realistically, of course. No Shelley for Chara trades.

Go.

We have a glut of centers on the team, but i can't see any of them being moved. Although he is hot right now, the only player with significant salary that would allow a trade to bring a quality defencemen is Hartnell. If some package was available adding carle or coburn than i would be pretty happy. Return? Sadly, i'm not sure....

[mojo1917]

Alright, defense is going to be a problem.

We really don't have cap money without moving someone, so who do you send and who do you want? Realistically, of course. No Shelley for Chara trades.

Go.

waive Lilja, and bring up Gustavesson, quit pulling the hair trigger with walker, put him out there with a guy that can skate and have a less skilled version of the top pairing. he's physical but slow so help him with a partner with wheels .

[Vincent05]

I think we should wait before we do anything. We all new this year was going to be rocky. The defence is a mess right now, but it wasn't 6 games ago and might not be 6 games from now.

Yes they are in a mess but our defense has been together the past 2=3 years? They shouldn't have any excuses at all and each of them are being paid very well. The chemistry and system should be there for them unlike the new forwards we have. What was our strength the past few years are now suddenly our weakness, I would pair Gustavsson up with Pronger when he comes back to see how this kid plays. Gustavsson has shown me he can play and doesn't make the bonehead plays that Carle makes. If he keeps it up we can package Carle and whoever for another dman that can actually play defense.

[phlfly]

I heard some where Flyers never draft d-man,because they are saying it's easy sign or trade for center, that is plenty on Flyers roster. The D-man NHL ready is about 25 y.o.it's long time to wait, if prospect become one, where center on his 2nd or 3rd year, can make a difference.

[The Quigster]

After Pronger, its a long step down in the Flyers defense. In the Winnipeg had two guys in the Flyer's crease every time they had the puck.Coburn needs to grow a set,somebody has to lead these guys when Pronger is on the bench,he won't be here forever! Whats missing is what Rinaldo has,every time he is on the ice,we're on the edge of our seats waiting to see whats going to happen,that's whats missing on the "D". Think Ed Jovanoski! Q

[Leach27]

Out best opportunity is to trade with a team like The Oilers, who have to many D men, question is would we want any of them? Other possible trades could be with NJ, NYI or sens who need depth at center, we have schenn who seems to be the odd man out. Lets throw in St. Louis as well, if players don't respond to hitch, they could be moved. Thoughts?

[Podein25]

Winnipeg had two guys in the Flyer's

Against the Rangers the other night the Jets had all five guys in the crease, along with the five Rangers. Never seen anything like it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zton8Uu4sW4

[flyerrod]

Against the Rangers the other night the Jets had all five guys in the crease, along with the five Rangers. Never seen anything like it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zton8Uu4sW4

That was hilarious.....I am still not sure how the puck did not cross the line with the amount of bodies there...it probably did but you would never see it with that mass.....

[Podein25]

No kidding @flyerrod, and that was Biron in goal there!

[flyercanuck]

Out best opportunity is to trade with a team like The Oilers, who have to many D men, question is would we want any of them? Other possible trades could be with NJ, NYI or sens who need depth at center, we have schenn who seems to be the odd man out. Lets throw in St. Louis as well, if players don't respond to hitch, they could be moved. Thoughts?

Well, we have too many Dmen too. Just not enough good ones. I admit, I haven't seen much of the Oil this year, but isn't D their weakest link?

Schenn may seem like the odd man out. But in 2-3 years, he should be better than most forwards on our roster. If we were to trade him, I want proper compensation. By that I mean a future #1.

[flyerrod]

No kidding @flyerrod, and that was Biron in goal there!

He was doing his Buffalo Rick imitation....he was the guy on the bottom.......

[Podein25]

LOL!

[Mad Dog]

After Pronger, its a long step down in the Flyers defense. Q

And that, right there, is a bigger and gloomier picture. I would say, however, that Mezsaros and Timonen are good d-men, despite Timonen’s aging in front of our eye. But I know what you are saying… which makes upgrading defense a daunting task.

What has been absolutely maddening to me, as I am sure to everybody, is the fact that all of our d-men, individually, are good. But as a unit, they looked like a total drek. People egg on Carle, but how quickly people forget that last season he had 40 points and was +30. Think about that: +30. This is not to be taken lightly. Clearly, when he was on the ice, good things were happening. The year before that, he had 35 points and was +19. And those years, he played some really good, solid hockey. Do you mean to tell me that at 26 he suddenly regressed so badly?? Sorry, not buying it.

Coburn – the other player who’s taken plenty of heat – has also showed in the past what he can do. He brings a good combination of size, quickness, excellent shot from the point, and nice passing. You don't find a lot of that in the NHL.

I find the very fact that this defense has been so bad absolutely inexplicable. You have to put some blame on coaching. There is just no way that the defense that’s so experienced and so accomplished should look in complete disarray.

But as far as upgrading… I am sure it can be done. But who do you trade? The Flyers no longer have that forward depth where Homer could simply plug one guy away from the roster to address the other needs. It would probably have to be done at a very steep price (Schenn or Bob, I am thinking). I would say give it till at least mid-season. I want to see how this core plays with Pronger in the lineup. As bad as this D has looked, it’s still too early to hit the panic button.