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Voracek faults himself for clean Kronwall hit


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http://www.csnphilly.com/blog/flyers-talk/post/Voracek-faults-himself-for-clean-Kronwal?blockID=665140&feedID=704

Hindsight is always 50/50, but there was no doubting in Jakub Voracek’s mind how he felt about the hit he took Tuesday night against Detroit’s Niklas Kronwall.

“The hit was clean,” said the Flyers’ winger, who remains questionable for Thursday’s game against Florida under a concussion watch.

The NHL obviously concurred on the hit being clean, as it did not fine or suspend Kronwall.

Replays show Voracek had his head down and turned right into Kronwall’s shoulder.

“I had my head down,” he said. “I’ve got to be aware that Kronwall is standing there at the blue line. It was the end of my shift and I look up and he’s standing at the blue line and I’m focusing on the puck and he’s very good at it.

“I was kind of naïve to think he was going to back up, obviously. It was a tough hit to take, but it was a clean hit and from my side, it was my bad. Those hits should stay in the game.”

Asked how he was feeling, Voracek replied, “Not bad.”

“From what I saw last night, it was a pretty tough hit to take,” he said. “I survived it pretty good. We’ll see how I feel tomorrow.”

Voracek passed an initial SCAT concussion test Tuesday night, general manager Paul Holmgren said, but he must be re-evaluated and take a baseline test to play against the Panthers.

“We’ll see what happens tomorrow,” Voracek said. “It can change every day. I don’t want to say I feel too good. Like I said, every day is different. Hopefully, I can get back as soon as possible.”

looks like he might not have a concussion at all we hope

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And here I was all these years thinking it was 20/20 :P

Hope he's ok.

seems like he will be fine tim p twitted he passed the base line test and is a game time decision after he is evaluated tomarrow. jagr problably wont play and is day to day. per tim p jagr stated had he not moved in time he would have blown out his knee

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@FlyersFan4Life

I truly hate that I feel this way and I am disgusted with myself for this, but I really would love to see a forward realize what Kronwall is doing and catch him by putting their elbow up last minute and leave their feet and just wreck the rest of his season.

There are larger injustices in the world than this dirty scumbag not being disciplined and I wish I could let it go today. It just really bothers me because he will not ever be dealt with.

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@FlyersFan4Life

Sorry Jake, you are probably the only one who didn't see it. Way to be classy though. Hope he's ok.

We certainly all hope that he's OK and it sounds like he'll be OK from what he said.

As for "not seeing it" he addresses this specifically:

“From what I saw last night, it was a pretty tough hit to take,” he said

Having taken the hit; having seen the hit; Voracek thought it was a clean hit.

And also adds:

"It was a tough hit to take, but it was a clean hit and from my side, it was my bad. Those hits should stay in the game.”

Case. Closed.

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We certainly all hope that he's OK and it sounds like he'll be OK from what he said.

As for "not seeing it" he addresses this specifically:

Having taken the hit; having seen the hit; Voracek thought it was a clean hit.

And also adds:

Case. Closed.

Its not closed. He's going to say that. The old standards of the NHL are not the same as now. I'll drop the subject, but Voracek taking the high road does not absolve Kronwall of making a dirty hit.

Of course Voracek is going to blame himself for not keeping his head up. But Kronwall still hit him directly in the head as hard as he possibly could while Voracek was blatantly defenseless.

I'll go even further and say that Kronwall lunges back to get forwards to think he's backing up so they duck down and start to drive their legs forward to get momentum and while they're not looking he pops forward again right into them while they're defenseless. He gets them to let their guard down and then he goes after them and then he turtles when someone tries to beat his ***. He's a dirty scumbag.

I thought the NHL was supposed to protect defenseless players? Are they or aren't they? I honestly can't tell.

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I'll let it go. I know we see it differently and that's fine. None of it matters as long as the NHL is going to pussyfoot around the issue of head shots anyway. I know what I saw and I'm sticking to it. Some other night that same hit will warrant a suspension and the NHL will be up in arms over it as long as good old Kronwall isn't the perpetrator.

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@Phillygrump

I disagree with your stance on this, but I respect your issue with the league. They OWE it to the fans to review this hit and verbalize WHY the hit should be legal; WHY the contact to the head in this case is not something the hitter should be responsible for. That needs to be STATED CLEARLY. Even if they went the other way, we deserve to understand WHY.

I think it should be a legal hit, and not just because Kronwall is a Wing. This IS a contact sport, and Voracek was CARELESS. When you play careless in ANY contact sport, you get hurt. Kronwall is cunning, but you'll also note that his hitting technique is almost flawless. He doesn't leave his feet. He doesn't raise his shoulder to ensure that he contacts the head. His arms stay down. No elbows.

The ONLY thing wrong with this hit was that Kronwall was hitting him from the front--where Voracek SHOULD be facing when he is skating forward with the puck. He doesn't even LEAD with his shoulder--like lunging with it. He stays vertical.

If the league says you can hit this way, they owe it to say what the conditions are the make it so. If they say it is illegal, the OWE it to the fans to say what the conditions are the make it so.

The spirit of the law obviously won in their minds. They need to clearly state WHEN the spirit of the law overrides the letter. For than reason, you have a legitimate gripe, and I share that frustration with you, despite the fact that he's on my team.

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@SpikeDDS

I hear what you're saying, but for me watching an up-and-coming player on our roster damn near die for a hit to the head in a game, and YOUR team goes on the PP...let's just say frustration is a serious understatement. I guarantee you that if the hit was the other way around (Wing receiving from Flyer), you would have had a 15 min call right there (major, match).

Also bear in mind, this team has had a LOT of concussion issues this season. Watching Voracek cockroach on the ice was nauseating.

Truthfully, while I would have liked the penalty called, I would have rathered a pound of flesh from at least an equally important Wing at that point in time.

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@Phillygrump

The ONLY thing wrong with this hit was that Kronwall was hitting him from the front--where Voracek SHOULD be facing when he is skating forward with the puck. He doesn't even LEAD with his shoulder--like lunging with it. He stays vertical.

The spirit of the law obviously won in their minds. They need to clearly state WHEN the spirit of the law overrides the letter. For than reason, you have a legitimate gripe, and I share that frustration with you, despite the fact that he's on my team.

Since Grump is back at the trainers table --- it would be interesting to hear a 5' Shanahan post on its legitimacy, And then let Kubina and other bruising blueliners study it in depth on how to deliver a legally targeted headblow. F it, they got youtube.

In this season's spirit, with the best player in the world barely able to play because of concussion symptons, it's a penalty and suspendable as an illegally targeted check to the head. It's the lettered reasons you listed that Kronwall skillfully skates around being penalized and suspended, lunging not leading, from backshoulder not elbow, leaving skates after contact to finish hit, etc., apparently.

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@SpikeDDS I hear what you're saying, but for me watching an up-and-coming player on our roster damn near die for a hit to the head in a game, and YOUR team goes on the PP...let's just say frustration is a serious understatement. I guarantee you that if the hit was the other way around (Wing receiving from Flyer), you would have had a 15 min call right there (major, match). Also bear in mind, this team has had a LOT of concussion issues this season. Watching Voracek cockroach on the ice was nauseating. Truthfully, while I would have liked the penalty called, I would have rathered a pound of flesh from at least an equally important Wing at that point in time.

But you're saying that as if when a player gets a concussion due to a hit, that it's always the hitter's fault. I STRONGLY disagree with that position. If you play carelessly or stupid, you are asking to get hurt. That definitely applies here. Voracek himself ADMITS it! That should tell you something, and it should make those feelings of wanting to injure a Red Wing dissipate. If it doesn't, then somebody's got a problem.

Again, I share your frustration for the "no comment" on this hit. This is the PERFECT opportunity to comment, and the NHL is remiss and irresponsible for the "no comment." You deserve that much as a Philly fan.

I want the league to validate why Kronwall's hits are legal. I believe that they are, and I think it is fair to use his hits as a case study in how to officiate and discipline our game...and how not to.

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I'm not saying that at all about concussions. What I am saying is that the league has pretended to care about these types of hits and reducing concussions, but totally brushes Kronwall under the rug. You didn't see that. Nothing to worry about here. Voracek was bleeding because his visor hit him in the face. How does that happen? Principal contact to the head with enough force to break the visor loose enough to slice open the player's face.

The Flyers crew and employees will not say anything. The NHL has also made a recent habit of fining the **** out of people who speak out against the NHL in any manner. Philly already has enough bad karma/juju/luck/whatever, no need to pile on another jinx by pissing off refs/disciplinarians. It was pathetic listening to Clement try to clarify his statement about the ref not blowing the whisle for a penalty and spin it to making it only about an injured player. The whistle should have gone immediately for BOTH, not neither. I thought Voracek was seizing while he was laying on his back.

As far as trying to say I've got a problem, your problem is reading comprehension. I clearly said "at that point in time" at the end of the quote.

If Kronwall's hits are legal, I hope Kesler, Getzlaf, or Doan smashes his nose in with one of those 'clean' Kronwall hits. We'll see how the tune changes, and if Kronwall suddenly has a little more respect for his fellow players on ice.

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As far as trying to say I've got a problem, your problem is reading comprehension. I clearly said "at that point in time" at the end of the quote.

Seems the reading comprehension problem is yours as I clearly said, "If it doesn't" at the beginning of my last sentence of the first paragraph. Since you imply that it no longer does, the statement doesn't apply to you, does it? There's no reason to take that personally unless you're not being honest about letting that feeling go or unless you misread what I said.

And in response to your last statement, that opportunity is afforded to them every time we play. The difference is that some players make themselves vulnerable, and some play smart enough to minimize those opportunities. Nick Lidstrom is the best example I can think of. How many really punishing hits has that guy received in his entire career? Two? Three maybe? I think my response is similar to what I think Kronner's would be, "If I'm careless enough to make myself vulnerable like that, and the opportunity presents itself for a hit like that, you've got every right to dish it back to me." And if it happens, I'll be the first Red Wing fan to admit that Kronwall deserved to get his bell rung, just like I'm the Red Wing fan who, without being prodded, is scolding the league for not even publicly reviewing a hit when doing so is not to the advantage of my team. Just like I'm the Red Wing fan who acknowledges that Philly fans may have a legitimate gripe suggesting that there may be favoritism at play here, as this "no comment" from the league suggests.

I try to switch the uniforms to help me decide how to rule on hockey issues. If the sweaters were switched, I'd still say what I'm saying. Can you say the same?

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Yes. We all agree the league is a joke at the mgmt level.

I assume no one likes seeing players get hurt in reality. Furthermore, I think most people would like some sense of fairness. To that extent, I myself certainly think every hit leading to injury should be reviewed at the league level. What issues are at stake - inadequate equipment protection, intent, fluke play, blown call, nothing, etc. it should encompass more than simple punishment, and look forward to prevention. Even if it was Rinaldo scrambling Kunitz, I would say the same. The sport deserves no less.

Imagine a fair NHL. They can do it in the Winter Olympics...

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@SpikeDDS

Just like Letang the other day where he put himself in a vulnerable position. My only complaint with Kronwall, is he does leave his feet (though he did not yesterday). He also knows what he is doing in regards to lulling the forward to sleep by thinking he is skating back to play d and then reversing and going into the player. Other than leaving his feet, to me he is playing within the boundary of the rules. I would like to see him answer the bell once in a while (ie. particularly when Kessler wanted a piece of him). If Kronwall is going to make a career out of attempting to knock people out (which is exactly what he is trying to do), then he should be willing to drop the gloves when a player wants him to man up.

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"Voracek faults himself for clean Kronwall hit"

He's concussed and in no shape to make a cognizant evaluation, really.

I wrote elsewhere that some the comments coming out of the Flyer dressing room sounded suspiciously like the league's official statement on the matter (Jake doesn't want to see those kind of hits taken out of the game...), so I have some doubt about their sincerity. Regardless of that, there is no way the team isn't going to be looking to even the score with Kronwall next time the team's play. I'm sure Kronwall won't be giving any credence to those comments.

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I will be quite amused when anybody from any team returns the favor on Kronwall. Let the bastard **** teeth for a week and see if he changes his tune about head shots. The problem is, cowards are hard to hit and only strike when they can take full advantage of it. Even players like Cooke, Tootoo, and Neil man up when the take a shot at someone. I don't like them and don't want them on the Flyers but at least I can respect them....... compared to Kronwall that is......

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