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Breaking News! Neal will have 2 seperate


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on the NHL Network highlights last night, they showed a hit earlier in the game by Couts on Neal at center ice, both were going towards a puck side-by side, and Couts stepped into Neal shoulder to shoulder and sent him to the ice, then carried the puck into the offensive zone. Honestly i think Neals hit was a combination of retaliation for the hit earlier, and sending a message to Couts out of frustration for all the shutdown work hes done. If Shanny takes that into consideration, we may actually see something like a 4 game ban which would guarantee he doesnt play in this series.

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So if Asham, Adams, and Neal all get suspended, what do the Pens do Wednesday?

Start Malkin and Crosby on the same line?

Vitale comes in for sure. Who else?

Three forwards were healthy scratches yesterday. The others were Eric Tangradi and Dustin Jeffrey. My guess us Staal goes on Malkin's wing, Vitale centers Cooke/Kennedy, and the other two join Richard Park on the 4th.

Looks good for fans of a sweep.

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I was part of the standing ovation that Philadelphia gave him at the Big Bank Building after his last game in 1997. One of my most cherished hockey moments.

@radoran

I was there too. The building chanting "Mario" as they went through the handshake line, and Mario acknowledging the crowd at length. Philly fans may be a lot of the things they say about us, but we 'get it'. Mario did actually come back briefly I believe, something about saving a crippled franchise. Not the topic of this thread but I had to comment on that, great day great memory.

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I was at that game too. That was pretty special to get a standing o from us. Do u think Cindy would get the same treatment 10 - 15 years from now in Philly? :)

Um, no. He might get the Michael Irvin treatment if you know what I mean.

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I think most times, players will do that. But what Crosby did yesterday in the post-game presser tells me we are definitely in his head. Flicking away a glove is poor sportsmanship, but no different than stealing game pucks. The difference is in how they address the media. Pronger was just funny about the whole thing whereas Crosby seemed genuinely rattled.

While stealing pucks IS unsportsmanlike, it isn't a penalty. Knocking a players glove away is...unless you're Crosby. Or Malkin.

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on the NHL Network highlights last night, they showed a hit earlier in the game by Couts on Neal at center ice, both were going towards a puck side-by side, and Couts stepped into Neal shoulder to shoulder and sent him to the ice, then carried the puck into the offensive zone. Honestly i think Neals hit was a combination of retaliation for the hit earlier, and sending a message to Couts out of frustration for all the shutdown work hes done. If Shanny takes that into consideration, we may actually see something like a 4 game ban which would guarantee he doesnt play in this series.

A ONE game suspension should guarantee Neal doesn't play another playoff game this year.

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I have respect for Mario both as an owner and when he played...I however, DO NOT respect his current team or his current crybaby superstar, Cindy.

honestly, mario wasn't all that different from crosby. just bigger and more talented. he whined every bit as much, hacked guys almost as much, dove as much. more whining to the press, actually.

i respect mario's talent, absolutely, but he was a btch in his own right. crosby did not fall far from the tree.

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The Couturier play, however, is clear intent to injure (leaving the feet, defenseless player who has no reason to expect to be hit).

not for nothing, but i'm worried that the phrase "intent to injure" is getting watered down. "intent to injure" is stomping on a guy with skate blades or gouging out eyes with your thumbs or two-handing them in the head. or crosschecking them in the throat.

i don't doubt that neal wanted to hurt couturier, but..."intent to injure" used to mean really trying to maim a guy. like, a once every few years, guy ought to be arrested kind of thing. nowadays, it's getting used every time there is a bad hit.

plus, didn't you say downie's hit on mccammond was clean?

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While stealing pucks IS unsportsmanlike, it isn't a penalty. Knocking a players glove away is...unless you're Crosby. Or Malkin.

well, continuing my role as negative guy, it's a penalty during the course of play. after the whistle, it's just being a jackass.

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and finally, to redeem myself in the eyes of everyone i've pissed off in the last three posts, i'm starting to agree neal will be sitting. two hearings is a bad sign for him. plus, shanny is starting to take heat for going soft in the playoffs and creating the environment for this kind of stuff. he did a whole "defend the decisions" thing on what he has and has not done over the last week. given that the penguins are pretty much cooked, this is the perfect moment to make an example of neal that just because you are a big player for your team does not mean you can go nuts. 4 games wouldn't shock me too much, just to drive the point home that he has lost the right to play in this series.

and asham, asham's gonna get the book thrown at him. 10 games, maybe? should be interesting.

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on the NHL Network highlights last night, they showed a hit earlier in the game by Couts on Neal at center ice, both were going towards a puck side-by side, and Couts stepped into Neal shoulder to shoulder and sent him to the ice, then carried the puck into the offensive zone. Honestly i think Neals hit was a combination of retaliation for the hit earlier, and sending a message to Couts out of frustration for all the shutdown work hes done. If Shanny takes that into consideration, we may actually see something like a 4 game ban which would guarantee he doesnt play in this series.

the hit i'm talking about occured with exactly 4:00 left in the first period, shortly after read's goal to make it 4-2, for anyone with the game DVR'ed. couldnt find it online. borderline interference maybe? but still a shoulder-to-shoulder hit. neal maybe started to lean in towards the puck and was off balance, so he went down pretty easy.

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Huh...not really wanting to hijack the thread, but Boston's Andrew Ference was just talking about physicality to Pierre and said basically, "We need to do it like Philly. They're playing hard but they're doing it right."

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not for nothing, but i'm worried that the phrase "intent to injure" is getting watered down. "intent to injure" is stomping on a guy with skate blades or gouging out eyes with your thumbs or two-handing them in the head. or crosschecking them in the throat.

i don't doubt that neal wanted to hurt couturier, but..."intent to injure" used to mean really trying to maim a guy. like, a once every few years, guy ought to be arrested kind of thing. nowadays, it's getting used every time there is a bad hit.

plus, didn't you say downie's hit on mccammond was clean?

If you want to hurt someone when you are hitting them, I'm thinking you're "intending to injure" them. I'm not arguing against big hits or that every hit is an intent to injure. Obviously, when impacting another player on a legitimate hit (like, say, Schenn or Kronwall) you are GOING to hurt them. It's the difference between a football player making a legitimate tackle and a football player trying to reverse someone's ankle or give them an extra blow to the head - and more to the point, taking that action away from the play (think Luis Zendejas in the Bounty Bowl).

This is about respect for other players. And also the evolving understanding of concussions in the league. This isn't a case of "almost killed a guy" as much as it is Bertuzzi ending Moore's career (by, yes, almost killing him).

Is your position that it was only "intent to injure" if Couturier suffered another concussion and was not able to play the game of hockey again at the age of 19? Because that's exactly what a hit on an unsuspecting player who is clear of the puck can do.

And I'll readjudicate the Downie situation if you think it warrants it :-). I may have been a little hyperbolic but I have thought that the hit was legit (if unwarranted and unnecessary) since the incident. The pertinent question determining the line between "clean hit" and "charging" is whether his skates are off the ice. As I recall, he does not take numerous strides into the player and is gliding from about the top of the circle into McAmmond, who is the puck carrier (thus a legitimate target), skating head down coming out from behind the net. If ya wanna go back and forth, I'll split out the thread :-)

I do agree that Boulerice is the much better comparison for Asham.

And I was as almost as ashamed of the Flyers organization with the antics of Downie and Boulerice that year as Pens fans should be this year - *as* ashamed when it came to Boulerice's stick foul. For Downie, it was a preseason game. But he was a #1 pick almost certain to get a shot on the main roster and had nothing to "prove" beyond excising his own insecurities. Boulerice... well... I never understood Boulerice on the team anyway. More useless than Shelley.

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Is your position that it was only "intent to injure" if Couturier suffered another concussion and was not able to play the game of hockey again at the age of 19? Because that's exactly what a hit on an unsuspecting player who is clear of the puck can do.

i don't disagree that the above could very well have done real damage. it's just, to me, the specific phrase, "intent to injure," should be reserved for the truly extraordinary assaults that happen very rarely. those for-the-ages, over the top moments of insanity that have no place even close to the game of hockey. boulerice's crosscheck on kessler, simons' two hander to hollweg's throat, mcsorley's two-hander to brashear's head. like i said, nowadays, the phrase is getting thrown out there every time there is a big hit with the potential to injure, so long as it falls outside the rules. and sometimes when it doesn't.

it makes no difference. the term means something specific to me, and neal's hit on couturier, as nasty as it was, doesn't fit my definition. it does fit the rulebook definition, so i'm pretty on my own, i guess. those really really really outside the line situations deserve a catagory of their own, imo.

The pertinent question determining the line between "clean hit" and "charging" is whether his skates are off the ice. As I recall, he does not take numerous strides into the player and is gliding from about the top of the circle into McAmmond, who is the puck carrier (thus a legitimate target), skating head down coming out from behind the net. If ya wanna go back and forth, I'll split out the thread :-)

well, no need to really get into it, but....mcammond had gotten rid of the puck 15 feet before downie hit him. passed it up one side of the net and then circled behind to the other side...and then downie came flying in. and while charging requires neither a specific distance or skates off the ice, downie was like 30 feet in the air when he made contact. really, it wasn't all that different than neal's hit. couturier was further removed from puck posession, but the threat (and, as it turned out, reality) of serious injury was *at least* as high. i do still love to watch it, though. :)

and the very slow-mo (with crappy picture quality):

Edited by aziz
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the hit i'm talking about occured with exactly 4:00 left in the first period, shortly after read's goal to make it 4-2, for anyone with the game DVR'ed. couldnt find it online. borderline interference maybe? but still a shoulder-to-shoulder hit. neal maybe started to lean in towards the puck and was off balance, so he went down pretty easy.

I know the hit you are referring to. Malkin did the same thing to Talbot in the game. Its kind of a hit or be hit situation. Better to be the hitter.

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I am by no means perfect and my memory is likely clouded through the years, but this is much more of a "bang bang" variety than the Neal hit on Couturier.

I do not deny Downie intended to hit McAmmond and leave a lasting impression. I don't condone the hit and think, as I said, it was pointless and unnecessary in a preseason game.

Still, 25 games was ridiculous IMO.

If they want to make a similarly lasting impression in the current situation they will effectively end Arron Asham's NHL career with something similar to the Boulerice decision.

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well, continuing my role as negative guy, it's a penalty during the course of play. after the whistle, it's just being a jackass.

Wouldn't that be considered a delay of game, same as knocking the puck over the glass?

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