Go Weber or go home

[Bakanekimiwa]

Harts and timo come off the books soon, followed by briere. It is possible because of the youth movement on this team but homer will have to pull more magic out of his hat (which we all know is something he is good at)

it won't even be 4 first rounder cause it won't get to that point. nashville will trade him if they think it's going to go to RFA status. and even if they do, ala stamkos last year, they will certainly hammer out a deal.

i can't see a scenario where the flyers would be giving up 4 1st rounders for weber. he'll either be had via trade or he won't be had at all.

[mojo1917]

Practically every year the Flyers have come up short in the playoffs due to injuries to their top high paid d-man. Dejardans, Hatcher, Timonen, Pronger. .......ENOUGH. Build a defensive team solid players. .....no superstar.

seems to work for the rangers... they have a pile of #2's and 3's, would you say girardi , is the top dog there ? mc donaugh , staal, del zotto girardi , that's nice. there isn't a weak defenseman 1-6 they all skate decently they all shoot well enough, we all know the block a pile of shots...we're sort of there with our guys but 1-4 we've got nice players and i'm not counting the viking who when healthy is probably the best of them. i wish our guys wouldn't break in playoffs, this team, damn , lots of games lost to injuries, and because of injuries, especially on the blue line,

[Mad Dog]

seems to work for the rangers... they have a pile of #2's and 3's, would you say girardi , is the top dog there ? mc donaugh , staal, del zotto girardi , that's nice.

Thinking of it, this is an impressive group they assembled on the back end over there. None of them are flashy (well, maybe with the excpetion of Del Zotto), but that group gets the job done to a "t". All 4: Girardi, Del Zotto, McDonough, and Staal - steady and stable group. Add Lundqvist to that group and there is no wonder that team is so good defensively.

[Clarke2Leach]

No way, who are we going to get rid of except maybe JVR???? We get Weber we probablly will have created 1-2 other holes in our roster, For What? Weber can get hurt just as fast as the next guy. I'd rather have 2 50% Webers's than 1 100% Weber....

This one's simple. Since Weber > (Almost anyone else) it doesn't matter to me who's contract goes except Giroux's. Weber is a special player. I think you can also do defense by committee - in fact I'd rather do that than chase Suter.

[Clarke2Leach]

Nashville has 11 guys signed for next season.

They can keep both Weber and Suter if they want them. And Suter wants to stay.

They did everything they could to prove to Weber/Suter that they want to "win now" - and they would be in a very nice position with a backend starting with Weber, Suter and Rinne.

That's the first I've heard about Suter wanting to stay. EVERYTHING I've read and heard says that if he wanted to stay, he would have already re-signed. Wouldn't be the first time I was wrong, though.

[radoran]

That's the first I've heard about Suter wanting to stay. EVERYTHING I've read and heard says that if he wanted to stay, he would have already re-signed. Wouldn't be the first time I was wrong, though.

I'm not saying Suter "wants to stay" - I'm saying Nashville has the cap room to put up the money to make it happen.

Nashville was one of the last eight teams playing and made moves to win (regardless of how effective they were or how good we thought they were).

I think what Nashville need to prove to Suter is that they will pay him, pay Weber and spend to the cap (they're at $52M this season). Rinne is signed through 18-19.

If they have the money to spend, they can do it.

http://www.capgeek.com/charts.php?Team=19

[toughbrotherlylove]

awesome discussions! all you guys are gems. great thoughts here!

[aziz]

Nashville was one of the last eight teams playing and made moves to win (regardless of how effective they were or how good we thought they were).

I think what Nashville need to prove to Suter is that they will pay him, pay Weber and spend to the cap (they're at $52M this season). Rinne is signed through 18-19.

well, ok, but i don't know that what they did cuts it, though, in the eyes of an elite player who is feeling very alone on a skinflint team. they made moves to win, kind of. cheap, easy moves to win. as little as possible while still being able to claim to have done *something*. adding paul gaustad, andrei kostitsyn, hal gill, and brandon yip, and then allowing radulov back on the team aren't really "holy crap they are serious" moves. it's tough to see them as much more than halfhearted gestures, really. i suppose it could be argued that there weren't other moves to be made late in the season, but the fact remains they entered the season with no offensive talent whatsoever, and were comfortable sitting literally closer to the cap floor ($48.3mil) than the cap ceiling ($64.3mil) all the way through.

if a condition for either suter or weber to resign there is an indication that management is willing to do what it takes to be a top competitive team, they will have to do things in a completely different way than they have to this point. they have tons and tons of cap room to play with this summer, but have never shown a willingness to use that to any advantage. to date, nashville has had a strong tendancy to spend as little as possible, and i would think a guy like weber trying to decide where the prime of his career will be spent would require a drastic change from that stance. a stance i don't have any reason to think their management is willing to change.

all of that said, i would expect that weber would be willing to give them next season to do what they can to impress him, signing a one year deal at about what he's making now, and then letting loose as a full UFA next summer if their penny pinching management keeps up with the penny pinching.

[terp]

I say guess again. Philly management an I guess the fan base want to solve the team's problems by signing another super star. Before this it was Bryzgalov and before that I was Pronger. We have a great nucleus, so let's not destroy our depth and become a one trick pony by tying up another $8,9 million in another stupid, long term contract.

[Polaris922]

Buy out Pronger and Timmonen.. they're really not worth having anymore. You're asking a lot for JVR if you expect more than an even trade for Schenn. I could see Toronto maybe going 1 for 1 though. I think Weber is a pipe dream though... Weber will be hugely sought after by clubs that throw money at unreasonable levels (read Kovalchuk), and other than Bryzgalov, your Flyers haven't really been that kind of Club. Neither have my Pens for that matter.. so I think we'll all be spectators on this free agency.

[radoran]

well, ok, but i don't know that what they did cuts it, though, in the eyes of an elite player who is feeling very alone on a skinflint team. they made moves to win, kind of. cheap, easy moves to win. as little as possible while still being able to claim to have done *something*. adding paul gaustad, andrei kostitsyn, hal gill, and brandon yip, and then allowing radulov back on the team aren't really "holy crap they are serious" moves. it's tough to see them as much more than halfhearted gestures, really. i suppose it could be argued that there weren't other moves to be made late in the season, but the fact remains they entered the season with no offensive talent whatsoever, and were comfortable sitting literally closer to the cap floor ($48.3mil) than the cap ceiling ($64.3mil) all the way through.

if a condition for either suter or weber to resign there is an indication that management is willing to do what it takes to be a top competitive team, they will have to do things in a completely different way than they have to this point. they have tons and tons of cap room to play with this summer, but have never shown a willingness to use that to any advantage. to date, nashville has had a strong tendancy to spend as little as possible, and i would think a guy like weber trying to decide where the prime of his career will be spent would require a drastic change from that stance. a stance i don't have any reason to think their management is willing to change.

all of that said, i would expect that weber would be willing to give them next season to do what they can to impress him, signing a one year deal at about what he's making now, and then letting loose as a full UFA next summer if their penny pinching management keeps up with the penny pinching.

So, what you're saying is

I think what Nashville need to prove to Suter is that they will pay him, pay Weber and spend to the cap (they're at $52M this season).

I can agree with that

[aziz]

Lol, right, sorry. I guess my point was to comment on how very far they are and have been from that, and to say I don't see it happening.

[FlyersFan4Life]

please no weber. flyers need not to put all their eggs in one basket. they signed pronger to a long term deal look how that ended, look at liya long term deal look how that is working out. just because you get the best d man out their does not guarantee and where is Nashville now with weber not in the playoffs

[flyercanuck]

@FlyersFan4Life

Pronger was TEN years older than Weber when we got him. Bryzgalov is a nutcase who never should have been given that contract. Weber is arguably the the best defenceman in the world. He's great offensively. He's great defensively. And he's mean as a junkyard dog. Nashville has nowhere near the Flyers talent up front (and yes, we have nowhere near their goaltending.)

I don't want to give weber a 10 year $100 million dollar contract. But if he becomes available, we'd be nuts not to see if he wants to become a Flyer.

[canoli]

i would expect that weber would be willing to give them next season to do what they can to impress him, signing a one year deal at about what he's making now, and then letting loose as a full UFA next summer if their penny pinching management keeps up with the penny pinching.

That's the most-likely scenario. He may get some push-back from Poile who will want a longer-term commitment, and Poile can work that to his advantage in the negotiation - "we're going all out and to prove it we want you long-term." He may (will) have to find some goal-scorers to "prove" to Weber they're for real, maybe Semin or Parise (or both)...

OTOH, although Nashville may not look like a Cup-worthy team on paper - you noted their history of under-spending - they play like one during the season. That tells me things are more forward-looking and cohesive behind-the-scenes than their trading and spending history would suggest. Something is going right for them and has been for quite awhile now; it's not all Pekka's doing and it's not only their #1 D pair. Their weakness is still offense but if they're ready that can be fixed pretty easily this summer.

Whatever Nashville does let's not dream about Shea Weber - not yet. Sure like FC just said let's find out where his head is at - if he wants to join the Flyers absolutely, make some moves and get it done. But I guess next summer is more likely, that is if he makes it to UFA status. Then we can join the bidding war with a realistic shot at landing him, assuming we let Hartnell and Kimmo walk.

sorry but I just can't resist crying about it again -

IF ONLY we'd given Bob a year to grow, to mature as a #1...the kid has so much natural ability, we're such FOOLS to shove him under the bus.

IF ONLY we'd never hired this Bryzgalov clown...

Stupid Ed, really stupid. Lavy too, forced the owners into a PR nightmare by mismanaging the goaltenders: 3-ring circus and for what? For nothing. So now we're stuck with a terrible goaltender who apparently doesn't believe he's so terrible. It doesn't get much worse than that for a hockey team, when your goalie is out to lunch and doesn't even know it.

[Dynamo 47]

I wouldn't mind seeing the Flyers do kind of a Chris Gratton type deal with the Preds for Weber. I would have no issue with giving up two number 1's, and JVR for Weber if that would get it done.

Defensemen like Weber are a rare commodity of skill, grit, physicality, and scoring potential. He will fill multiple needs for the team with one signing (leadership, a physical presence on the blueline, a steady presence on D, and a RH shot from the point).

[Clarke2Leach]

The second hardest shot in the league!

[doom88]

The second hardest shot in the league!

And they go on net too.

[InHexyWeTrust]

I wouldn't mind seeing the Flyers do kind of a Chris Gratton type deal with the Preds for Weber. I would have no issue with giving up two number 1's, and JVR for Weber if that would get it done.

I was thinking similarly. Maybe Gus would need to be included, but that's not such a bad deal for the preds, especially if Suter gets resigned.

[Bertmega]

@Polaris922

Due to CBA restraints I do not think that Pronger can be bought out since he signed the contract over 35. I could be wrong, but it is a long shot. Why buy out Timmonen? He is the Flyers best defenseman that is entering the last year of his contract. I'd sooner trade him to a contender and save the $$.

Weber is a long shot. It is possible, but I think the brass may have finally realized that in a cap conscience era, it is best to develop your own talent and stay away from $$$$$$ long term contracts.

Weber would be great to have on any team, but the cost is going to be steep, like Courtier or Coburn and four 1st rounders steep .

Edited May 17, 2012 by Bertmega

[DaGreatGazoo]

I think the brass may have finally realized that in a cap conscience era, it is best to develop your own talent and stay away from $$$$$$ long term contracts

So, you think they came to that realization..when...AFTER signing Bryzaster for 9 years???

[Bertmega]

@DaGreatGazoo

After.

I am going to make an Aziz like prediction here: Ilya Bryzgalov will have 42+ wins next year.

Oh and he'll be the starting goaltender for the 2012-13 Philadelphia Flyers

[radoran]

@Polaris922

Due to CBA restraints I do not think that Pronger can be bought out since he signed the contract over 35. I could be wrong, but it is a long shot. W

Buying Pronger out saves real money, but no cap money.

Why buy out Timmonen? He is the Flyers best defenseman that is entering the last year of his contract. I'd sooner trade him to a contender and save the $$.

Timonen has a NMC. Which "contender" would pick him up and what, of value, might you get in return.

Timonen is going nowhere. He will be a Flyer next year barring retirement due to injury.

[idahophilly]

@Polaris922

Due to CBA restraints I do not think that Pronger can be bought out since he signed the contract over 35. I could be wrong, but it is a long shot. Why buy out Timmonen? He is the Flyers best defenseman that is entering the last year of his contract. I'd sooner trade him to a contender and save the $$.

Weber is a long shot. It is possible, but I think the brass may have finally realized that in a cap conscience era, it is best to develop your own talent and stay away from $$$$$$ long term contracts.

Weber would be great to have on any team, but the cost is going to be steep, like Courtier or Coburn and four 1st rounders steep .

Look up amnesty... It's something that has happened before. The current CBA would have no effect since it's more or less just been terminated. We'll be lucky to even have hockey come October.

[Bakanekimiwa]

@DaGreatGazoo

After.

I am going to make an Aziz like prediction here: Ilya Bryzgalov will have 42+ wins next year.

Oh and he'll be the starting goaltender for the 2012-13 Philadelphia Flyers

no no.. an aziz type prediction would be that bryz will start less than bob and marty biron will have more wins than him. and it will all be done for PR.