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Jagr signs with Stars


Guest jkearse123

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He found a team that would overpay safe in the knowledge they didn't have to worry about his playoff production adn they can trade him mid-season for an asset that will benefit them going forward.

Man you and @flyerrod are both really cynical.What you are suggesting is that he has fallen back on his days of old and only cares about money and himself and the least amount of effort he needs to put forward.

I don't see that. I don't think last year was a mirage in his work ethic. In fact, I have ALWAYS known him to be a fitness freak, back to his pittsburgh days. Maybe that did not translate onto the ice (particularly with Washington and NYR), but I do not get the sense the he is just out for a free lunch ticked to ride into the sunset of the NHL. Afterall, he could get twice the money in the KHL and play around 50 or so games (his average over the three seasons in the KHL 51.5). The skill is less than the NHL- so easier for him to play, etc.

I did not put this on my initial post, but Kari Lehtonen is a far cry from Bryzgalov.

I just struggle with Dallas, because I still find their defense very suspect (not withstanding Lehtonen). I guess nieuwyndyke thinks that more firepower up front will win him more games.

Keep in mind that Dallas choked on the chicken bone the last five games of the year (lost 5 in a row). Had they won 3 of those, LA would not have made the playoffs and Dallas would have been the 8th seed in the west.

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Sorry, 4.5 is just completely insane for Jags at this point, as much as I enjoyed him on the team last season. He clearly wore down w/ regular groin injuries down the stretch & in no way was as effective in the playoffs. At most I would've said Ok to low 3's for him / 1 year deal all things considered. Clearly it's not even remotely aboot team loyalty to him for a second; all last year was about was getting his feet wet in the NHL again.

He better have a Rolex overnighted to G - that's who he owes for that past-his-prime payday.

A dude like Shane Doan is way more the type of veteran leader / mentor you want to plug in on the 2012-13 Flyers roster than a Jagr for the money or even a Parise for that matter.

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Clearly it's not even remotely aboot team loyalty to him for a second; all last year was about was getting his feet wet in the NHL again.

Go read my post regarding why I think he signed there. If you want to talk about loyalty, if was the Flyers who were not loyal to him (on the surface at least).

Also, look at the comparables I posted on guys who scored his same amount of points this year (and those that are a couple above). It ranges- depending on experience, from low 3's to 6m. 4m is what I think was a fair open market price. I would have expected less for the opportunity for him to return to playing with giroux.

I don't think this is Jagr being greedy or not being loyal to the Flyers. It is him looking for a situatino where he will be in the prime time light and paid. He could not sit and wait for the Flyers to figure out the Suter / Parise situation while other teams were spending their available UFA dollars. It is ludricrous to expect him to do that. If the Flyers sign just Parise, Jagr would have been out of their picture.

So if it takes Parise the rest of the July 4th holiday to figure things out while playing on the lakes in Minnesota, and other teams are making their moves to sign key available UFA's, then Parise decides on the Flyers- what is Jagr supposed to do? He would be on the outside looking in for a team that he feels would fit.

I also have a feeling that 4.5 was a bidding war between Detroit and Dallas.

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I dunno Van... I see your point and you're right that a guy can't wait forever or the market is closed. I find it hard to believe the Flyers had no communication with him though. There had to be SOME discussion. I don't think the Flyers were throwing up 4 million for him. I see what you're comparing stats to, and he did have a good season, but I'm also of the thinking the Giroux is largely responsible for Jagr's success. I think it's more than most GM's would say he's worth. But I guess we'll find out.

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@Vanflyer Well, I got this one right from the very start. Not only did I sucessfully predict JJ would be more than respectable, I said last summer we would have to mull over re-signing him again this summer...I thought he would have enough impact that s potential 2nd contract would not be out of the question. Elite hands are elite hands I said, if he has the right surrounding cast (which I knew he had) points would be inevitable. I figured he could skate enough to enter his hands into the equation.

In today's NHL 50 pts a year = 4mill+ a year, esp on the open market during UFA time. I'm sure you can some instances where it's not the going rate, but in general....that seems to be the going rate.

J.J was a good one year Flyer. No prima donna issures (called it...LOL!), no massive ego...by all accounts a solid citizen/teammate and even mentored younger guys. He was a good influence....and because he was, it cleared the path for this nice little retirement fund contract. He got what he deserved, a boat load of cash. Nothing compared to the 10 mill+ a year he raked in during his KHL days. That's why I *knew* that he would be no trouble, he could have triple the money in the KHL, why didn't he just take the easy money? because his sole reason for coming back to the NHL was *one* more Stanley Cup...he wanted to win it one more time.

Hey, didn't work out but I really RESPECT the fact that Jagr thinks that much of the Stanley Cup. A lot of europeans don't get it when it comes to the cup, they think it's the trophy awarded to the winning team in the best league in the world....but (at least up here and some US strongholds)....it's much more than that. Jagr gets it.

Here is my next Jager call. Even though last year went super smooth with Philly...this year in Dallas will be a train wreck, in fact I don't think he finishes the season with them. Nothing to base this on but gut....like I did with the first call.

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What does surprise me is that I thought he would seek out a two year deal in the high 3's-4m range.

Yeah me too. Ray W chose Dallas because they were the only team that would give him more than one year. Jagr surely turned down a two year deal from MTL at less $ per....

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It´s about $$ and playing on a team´s top line, I think. It´s probably his last contract and in Dallas he will be a main guy and a marketable guy with a household name. In Philly he was not guaranteed top line spot, I guess he will get that in Dallas. One year and getting some ink in local media and rile up the fan base a bit, it´s not that crazy. The Stars hope he can give them a spark on the ice and ticket sales. It remains to be seen if it pans out like that. I wonder how much gas he has left in the tank. He did look slow and worn-out in the playoffs. If they are to land Parise, the cap hit will be huge and they need the cap space. They will need a defenseman too. And if Parise comes to Philly, they can´t afford Suter, and Carle will be $5,5 million...so what do we do? At least Timo comes off the cap next year...we need him off the books if we are to go after Weber next year. My wish is to get Parise now, pass on Suter and try everything to get Weber next year. I want Parise over Nash and Ryan because he comes as an UFA, while acquiring either of the other two, will command a hefty price (prospects and draft picks)

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@OSR29

Welcome to the board! With a quality first post like that I'm moving you up to full member. Where are you from OSR?

It´s about $$ and playing on a team´s top line, I think

I agree, but I think there is also more to it. Jagr is in at the point of his career where he he gets the chance to make a difference in the way young players approach the game. With Dallas trading away Ribero and Ott they will be a team with much youth, Jagr's role will be that of leadership. The extra $$ to pay for that is worth it.

The other part of this one year deal I find interesting is that Jagr will likely be moved at the trade deadline to play for a contender. So in essence we could very well be seeing him in the Orange and Black next spring.

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Thanks for the welcome, I appreciate it. :)

I am actually from Norway of all places. Been a die hard Flyers-fan since 1985, when I got to watch my first ever NHL game (with the Flyers) on a sattelite dish. Since then I have bled orange & black...and still do. I watch every single Flyers game on Gamecenter Live and the Flyers are a big part of my life. I pray I will be able to watch the Flyers hoist the Cup soon!

I also agree that Jagr very well might come to a contender as rental at the deadline, depending on how the Stars are placed in the standings. However, with the earlier trade deadlines these days and how most teams are in the playoff race at that time, they might be buyers, not sellers

Edited by OSR29
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@OSR29

Not to take this thread off topic.....of which I'm good at ;), but you must have enjoyed when PatrickThoresen was a member of the Flyers. A player I thought might come back to play with the Flyers, he has had some solid seasons in the KHL. I'm not sure of his current contract status though.

I'd be surprised if the Stars will be buyers this year, I think they are in a major rebuilding mode.

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Man you and @flyerrod are both really cynical.What you are suggesting is that he has fallen back on his days of old and only cares about money and himself and the least amount of effort he needs to put forward.

We are realists Van. Do you really think that Jagr is going to even approach the numbers he had with the Flyers on the Dallas Team? Jagr was a model player for his year with the Flyers but he also played with Giroux whose vision and passing are going to make anyone who is decent look great. He was worn down by the end of the season and it is only going to get worse for him. Dallas picked him up for 2 reasons, reaching the cap floor and as a lead by example player for his work ethic. Good luck to him in Dallas. I am not really sure how that is cynical but this post was made with effort not to offend anyone....just sayin'..........

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Dallas was the only team that guaranteed him 1st line minutes at the highest price.

Remember when the hockey world laughed at Philly sigining a 40 year old 4 years removed Jagr at 3.3mm?

I guess Dallas is trying to fill seats.

Jagr is all about the money. Dallas won't even sniff the playofffs. If Jagr puts up 40 points this year, I'd be surprised.

Don't get me wrong he is a world class talent and I wish him the best in Dallas.

I believe that he had an inpact on Giroux and the young guns. I would have loved to see him back for one more year, but not at that price.

Good luck JJ.

PS

Please don't become the Brett Favre of the NHL.

Edited by Bertmega
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@OSR29 Welcome to the board!! Please don't take this the wrong way, but this has bugged me for years. How is a Scandinavian country like Norway, so close to Sweden, not qualifiing for the Winter Olmypics in hockey? Is it a lack of money for midgit/bantam hockey....ie no grassroots or an infrastructure problem? Anyways, always been curious, just have never had a native Norwegian to ask....until now. I do remember seeing some Norwegian teams at the World Junior Tournament, so I'm assuming hockey is relevant there.

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We are realists Van. Do you really think that Jagr is going to even approach the numbers he had with the Flyers on the Dallas Team? Jagr was a model player for his year with the Flyers but he also played with Giroux whose vision and passing are going to make anyone who is decent look great. He was worn down by the end of the season and it is only going to get worse for him. Dallas picked him up for 2 reasons, reaching the cap floor and as a lead by example player for his work ethic. Good luck to him in Dallas. I am not really sure how that is cynical but this post was made with effort not to offend anyone....just sayin'..........

I'm suggesting that he took more money to play with a team that hasn't been to the playoffs for four seasons - regardless of how they "just missed" this past season, they still missed it.

I'm saying that the Stars had an interest in giving him more money than other teams.

I'm saying that should the Stars continue to suck and be in a position to miss the playoffs again, Jagr will likely be traded. This realizes a return on the investment of the extra cash.

I'm saying the Flyers wouldn't pony up the bucks he was looking for with the guarantees he was looking for in the time frame he wanted. And good for them.

I'm saying that Derek Roy is not quite Claude Giroux. Jagr's not going to be comparing anyone in Dallas to Mario Lemieux.

I'm saying it was nice to have Jagr here, he was a positive influence and productive, aside from disappearing against New Jersey.

I'm saying it's not worth $4.5M against the Flyers' cap to have kept him.

I think it's a pretty realistic analysis of the situation.

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I'm suggesting that he took more money to play with a team that hasn't been to the playoffs for four seasons - regardless of how they "just missed" this past season, they still missed it.

I'm saying that the Stars had an interest in giving him more money than other teams.

I'm saying that should the Stars continue to suck and be in a position to miss the playoffs again, Jagr will likely be traded. This realizes a return on the investment of the extra cash.

I'm saying the Flyers wouldn't pony up the bucks he was looking for with the guarantees he was looking for in the time frame he wanted. And good for them.

I'm saying that Derek Roy is not quite Claude Giroux. Jagr's not going to be comparing anyone in Dallas to Mario Lemieux.

I'm saying it was nice to have Jagr here, he was a positive influence and productive, aside from disappearing against New Jersey.

I'm saying it's not worth $4.5M against the Flyers' cap to have kept him.

I think it's a pretty realistic analysis of the situation.

I think you wanted this @Vanflyer....

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@Vanflyer Well, I got this one right from the very start. Not only did I sucessfully predict JJ would be more than respectable, I said last summer we would have to mull over re-signing him again this summer...I thought he would have enough impact that s potential 2nd contract would not be out of the question. Elite hands are elite hands I said, if he has the right surrounding cast (which I knew he had) points would be inevitable. I figured he could skate enough to enter his hands into the equation.

In today's NHL 50 pts a year = 4mill+ a year, esp on the open market during UFA time. I'm sure you can some instances where it's not the going rate, but in general....that seems to be the going rate.

J.J was a good one year Flyer. No prima donna issures (called it...LOL!), no massive ego...by all accounts a solid citizen/teammate and even mentored younger guys. He was a good influence....and because he was, it cleared the path for this nice little retirement fund contract. He got what he deserved, a boat load of cash. Nothing compared to the 10 mill+ a year he raked in during his KHL days. That's why I *knew* that he would be no trouble, he could have triple the money in the KHL, why didn't he just take the easy money? because his sole reason for coming back to the NHL was *one* more Stanley Cup...he wanted to win it one more time.

Hey, didn't work out but I really RESPECT the fact that Jagr thinks that much of the Stanley Cup. A lot of europeans don't get it when it comes to the cup, they think it's the trophy awarded to the winning team in the best league in the world....but (at least up here and some US strongholds)....it's much more than that. Jagr gets it.

Here is my next Jager call. Even though last year went super smooth with Philly...this year in Dallas will be a train wreck, in fact I don't think he finishes the season with them. Nothing to base this on but gut....like I did with the first call.

Hey Jammer- Great post. I am far from a JJ apologist, but I can't digest the dissent on the board for him signing a 4.5m contract.

The "train wreck" you mentioned will be the straw of which we will all judge. I will remind everyone that if Dallas had not tanked (lost their last 5 games), LA would have not have been in the playoffs. What he did in Philly was tremendous (off ice). Nothing I ever expected.

People should shut about him being "money hungry".

Dallas offense will be better, but a bit tired at the end of the year. Their defense has not improved at all. Lehtonen had a great year last year. If he performs the same way, the extra 12 goals will get them in the playoffs.

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@radoran

I'm just saying that anyone that thinks he is a money hungry d i c k is foolish. The Flyers eff'd him (while we don't know the behind the scenes).

There is nothing that is as black and white is all I'm saying.

We pay Hartnell 4.1m a year for a long time for 60 points a year. He had a career year in half part to Jagr. He won't sniff those numbers again. He wil go back to being a 25-25 guy at 4.1m.

It just amazes me people want to bust JJ balls saying he is money hungry. The FLYERS are the ones that said "we like you allot, but let us see what we can do in the UFA market". Now everyone is on the JJ is money hungry and this that and the other.

If Hartnell puts up 55 / 60 points at 4.1M, what is the difference with JJ??

I mean let us look at valuation. I tried to do it, but everyone on this board for the most part is trashing Jagr. I can't wait until I here the great stories about his contribution, work ethic etc. out of dallas.

The guy got paid .5m more than he should have. Nothing more and nothing less. But he will sell seats in Dallas, and jerseys. So you might snicker at the .5m extra, but those seats and jerseys will wash it out.

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@Vanflyer My numbers were way off on Jagr's KHL pay, but he still made 5 mill US over there for one year with Avargard (sp). He then signed here for 3.3 and now with Dallas for 4.5....he took a paycut to win Lord Stanley again....how are people missing this? The guy is NOT greedy!!

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I'm just saying that anyone that thinks he is a money hungry d i c k is foolish. The Flyers eff'd him (while we don't know the behind the scenes).

How exactly did the Flyers screw him? By giving him a chance to play next to Giroux for a season? By not ponying up 4.5 mil for a season? The Flyers did not "eff" him. There are only a few people here that are calling him money hungry. Most people here are happy for the season he had and have wished him well in Dallas. Would you like to make a (token) wager as to him reaching the numbers he put up this year?

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Jagr had some some nice things to say on twitter:

jagr_twitter_normal.jpg

Just to everybody knows:Max Talbot is the most underrated and underpaid player in NHL.Holmgren did a great job signing him last season.

jagr_twitter_normal.jpg

To@28CGiroux:Keep working and soon you will be the best player in NHL like I said.To@Hartsy19:work hard and you will score 40.

jagr_twitter_normal.jpg

Special thanks to my linemates Scotty and G.

jagr_twitter_normal.jpg

Thank you the Flyers for the opportunity you gave me.Thanks to all fans and teammates for great support! I had so much fun! Will miss you.

https://twitter.com/#!/68Jagr

Edited by JackStraw
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@OSR29 Welcome to the board!! Please don't take this the wrong way, but this has bugged me for years. How is a Scandinavian country like Norway, so close to Sweden, not qualifiing for the Winter Olmypics in hockey? Is it a lack of money for midgit/bantam hockey....ie no grassroots or an infrastructure problem? Anyways, always been curious, just have never had a native Norwegian to ask....until now. I do remember seeing some Norwegian teams at the World Junior Tournament, so I'm assuming hockey is relevant there.

Thanks for the welcome! The way hockey is treated in Norway is an utter embarrassement. People here only care about soccer, cross country skiing. Unlike Sweden and Finland, were kids get the opportunity to play hockey where & when they want, only a few hockey rinks are located in South East. It´s embarassing...hockey has NO resources in Norway and is a fringe sport. The interest is rising ever so slowly as the national team does remarkably well in the Worlds etc. North American friends have asked me the same questions for years and everybody´s surprised by the fact hockey is treated like a fringe sport in Norway. Shouldn´t be like that... :angry:

Ok, needed to vent...thanks for listening! :D It´s good to be here and discuss my beloved Flyers with others who bleed orange & black!

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