New Captain or Not?

[idahophilly]

So do we need a new captain or not? More importantly, do we want one?

Consider these captains of the Flyers since Bobby Clarke...

7 Poulin, DaveDave Poulin* Center 6 (1984–89) Stripped of captaincy in December 1989. FHOF 2004 08 !

8 Sutter, RonRon Sutter Center 2 (1989–91) Traded to the St. Louis Blues on September 22, 1991. 09 !

9 Tocchet, RickRick Tocchet Right Wing 1 (1991–92) Traded to the Pittsburgh Penguins on February 19, 1992.

09.5 !– Zz !No captain – 1 (1992–93)

10 Dineen, KevinKevin Dineen Right Wing 1 (1993–94) Stepped aside in favor of Lindros on September 6, 1994.

11 Lindros, EricEric Lindros Center 6 (1994–2000) General manager Bob Clarke stripped him of the captaincy on March 27, 2000 after he criticized the team's medical staff.

12 Desjardins, EricEric Desjardins Defense 3 (2000–01) Resigned captaincy on October 23, 2001.

13 Primeau, KeithKeith Primeau Center 4 (2001–06) Retired due to post-concussion syndrome on September 14, 2006.

14 Hatcher, DerianDerian Hatcher Defense 1 (2006) He was captain on an interim basis from January 29, 2006through September 2006.

15 Forsberg, PeterPeter Forsberg Center 1 (2006–07) Traded to the Nashville Predators on February 15, 2007.

16 Smith, JasonJason Smith Defense 1 (2007–08) Signed with the Ottawa Senators on July 8, 2008.

17 Richards, MikeMike Richards Center 3 (2008–11) Traded to the Los Angeles Kings on June 23, 2011.

And we all know about Pronger so is there a Captains curse and if so do you risk giving it to any one player this year? Most were traded with being stripped or injured as the next likely causes of losing the captaincy. And it's not unprecedented to not have a captain at all as the 92/93 season suggests.

Just seems that our captains as a whole since Clarke don't have happy endings... Dineen may have been the smartest in stepping aside to get out of the line of fire, so to speak. However, one has to wonder if he was TOLD to get out of the way???

Thoughts?

*Poll Note- If there really is a curse then give the C to one these guys and it will gaurantee they will be gone one way or another...

[Irishjim]

i say give it shelly or ilija. make sense no

[AJgoal]

You don't strip a player of the captaincy due to an injury. Period. Regardless of whether he's never going to play again or not, you don't do it. It sends the wrong message to the players. Unless Pronger publicly steps down, saying the team should have a captain on the ice, he keeps the "C."

Second, there are leaders in the locker room. The guys know who they are. They don't need a letter on a teammate's sweater to tell them who to listen to. Three "A"s are fine when you're talking about dealing with the refs in game.

[jammer2]

I voted no captain. The reason...I don't like seeing stop gap measures like Jason Smith donning something as important as the Flyers C. My one execption would be Kimo, but I'd still rather have G or whoever is deemed Captain material for the long haul. If that particluar player is not ready, wait and make the right choice. Plus, as AJ stated, it's not cool to strip a guy because of an injury, although in Pronger's case, it certainly seems like a career ending injury, which might put it in a different light. He simply can't expect them to have no captain till 2017 when his contract is up.

[murraycraven]

Stays w pronger for all of th reasons AJ stated...

[flyercanuck]

With the history of Flyer captains over the last couple of decades I wouldn't put that cursed thing on anyone. Other than Bryz.

[mojo1917]

Until Pronger , steps down he should keep it. If that takes place this year, i would seriously consider Timmonen because I love him, in the hetero sports way. If it is next year , I would consider Giroux, provided he doesn't accept an offer sheet to play in nashville with weber

so i voted no captain.

[Vegas Flyer]

You don't strip a player of the captaincy due to an injury. Period. Regardless of whether he's never going to play again or not, you don't do it. It sends the wrong message to the players. Unless Pronger publicly steps down, saying the team should have a captain on the ice, he keeps the "C."

Second, there are leaders in the locker room. The guys know who they are. They don't need a letter on a teammate's sweater to tell them who to listen to. Three "A"s are fine when you're talking about dealing with the refs in game.

Totally Agree....go with the 3 A's for the year....Briere, Timmo, Harts,etc are leaders, plus some of the kids will step up, I might let Simmonds wear the A once in a while......Prongs prob will hang them up......then give the "C" to Giroux next year.

[idahophilly]

You don't strip a player of the captaincy due to an injury. Period. Regardless of whether he's never going to play again or not, you don't do it. It sends the wrong message to the players. Unless Pronger publicly steps down, saying the team should have a captain on the ice, he keeps the "C."

Second, there are leaders in the locker room. The guys know who they are. They don't need a letter on a teammate's sweater to tell them who to listen to. Three "A"s are fine when you're talking about dealing with the refs in game.

I agree, you don't strip them because of an injury. But this isn't a normal injury. It's very likely career ending. By that standard then, the Flyers don't have a captain for another 6 years or so? At some point he has to be replaced, injury or not. Maybe not now which is why I support leaving him captain this year. But next year, it's gonna have to change.

[idahophilly]

Until Pronger , steps down he should keep it. If that takes place this year, i would seriously consider Timmonen because I love him, in the hetero sports way. If it is next year , I would consider Giroux, provided he doesn't accept an offer sheet to play in nashville with weber

so i voted no captain.

I think that's the most likely scenerio. Pronger is a class act and at some point in the next 3-9 months or so he will step down if he is sure he can't return. I just wish we had some more info on how he is feeling lately...

[flyerrod]

Agreed idaho...I think it is as much that Pronger has to come to terms that he will not ever return at this point. It's as if him holding the "c" maintains his hope of returning to normal.....

[jammer2]

@flyerrod ha ha....the whole topic is so touchy for so many Flyer fans. Everybody is compared to Clarkie, which is not really fair, but a reality nonetheless. The whole Richards fiasco, guys like Jason friggin Smith having the C....I just want to wait and make sure it's the right thing for the team and the individual who eventually has it bestowed upon him.

[Hexy27]

@jammer2

Couldn't agree more. I can still remember Richie's coronation ceremony. At the time I was ok with Richie as captain but I hated that damn ceremony!

[Bertmega]

You almost have to let Pronger keep it until he officially retires. I would under no circumstances give it to Giroux just yet. Let's nit rush things with him and leave him to focus on playing hockey and developing his skills 100%.

Maybe in a few years he will be ready. I just think that a Captain should be around 28 and played in the NHL for at least 6-7 years.

[King Knut]

Just seems that our captains as a whole since Clarke don't have happy endings

I think Dineen took it as a temporary fix. He knew he wasn't a long term captain and the team wasn't doing well with him in the seat.

Think about it, why didn't they give it to Rod or Rex? They Knew Eric was going to be captain, but couldn't see giving it to him that early... but giving it to one of those guys would have been smarter long term, but they weren't interested in a long term captain. Probably the same with Smith to be honest. I think they knew they were giving to to Richie in the not to distant future.

Speaking of Richards, I will say that he's an indication of my theory on the captain's curse. We think there's one and he's a reason why we do, but think about it... how much of a failure was he as a captain? People wanted him run out of town on a rail, but seriously... His teams did fairly well (aside from having to play the penguins in the first round in 2009). Every team that ousted the Flyers under Richards went on to win the cup. How's that make him a bad leader and a failure? Most teams would kill for that level of success.

Which brings me to my point: The curse is in our expectations far more than in their performances. Part of it stems from Clarke's success and part of it stems from the expectations that Lindros would be the next Gretzky (in some ways he was, he changed the game forever apparently).

But in regards to winning and what makes a good captain, many of the captains on that list have been successful. If the curse is in their early dismissal, then I think the curse comes from flawed expectations and misdirected blame for failures.

For example, it certainly wasn't Hatcher or Smith's or Pronger's fault the team didn't win cups under them. Though it may have been management's fault for suggesting that defenseman over 35 with a history of performance drop off due to injury late in the season (and the playoffs) should be the guy to handle the mantle of that leadership.