Uh oh, Schenn's coming back soon...

[The Quigster]

Schenn didn't produce as expected,in camp or in the early season,some of the other rookies did,so unlike Peter White(you guys remember him,right?) Schenn has to earn his way on the "BIG" club.I for one hope he makes it.

[flyercanuck]

. Is he a playmaker? Finisher? Two-way

We don't know yet.

There's also no need to rush Schenn into the lineup. If there's space, put him in. If not, he's a very nice insurance policy for a top 9 forward in Adirondack.

Yes. There's a reason he's a top prospect.

There's no need to rush him. On the other hand we traded our captain, just entering his prime years, who just happens to be one of the top two 2 way players in the world, and it wasn't solely for Wayne Simmonds. Actually, he was the secondary player coming our way. Schenns already shown he can handle the AHL, and then some. Well, the NHL is the next step. And he's got the talent to make this team better.

[doom88]

Is he really good? After I'm seeing him for couple game he was average player. I don't know if Shenn is better then Nodl. He didn't impress me yet. I'm afraid he is going be a lot expectation but zero result or almost zero result.

I think is now a good time trade him and Bob for future number one defenseman.

Give him time to develop. Schenn is a future 1/2 center...

[LegionOfDoom]

People we need not have short term memory, or be in a panic, Schenn is the type of player that works on his game, works on the little things, shows attention to detail.

Our own Team staff has talked great things about him, while watching him all day after day. Sometimes your put in a new situation and scramble. Sometimes you fall into a situation and roll off the cuff.

Schenn has fundamentals, just like Couturier and Read. I like Harry Z also, and Rinaldo can possibly grow into being like Tocchet.

These are the tender ages when a player can blossom, given good surroundings and can exponentially grow....look at G.

Our concern is focusing on Team D, we need to make it an imprinted part of our identity.....remember from the net out. Our offense is already known as quite capable.

[radoran]

Yes. There's a reason he's a top prospect.

There's no need to rush him. On the other hand we traded our captain, just entering his prime years, who just happens to be one of the top two 2 way players in the world, and it wasn't solely for Wayne Simmonds. Actually, he was the secondary player coming our way. Schenns already shown he can handle the AHL, and then some. Well, the NHL is the next step. And he's got the talent to make this team better.

Honestly, the proximity of the trade is the worst possible reason to force him into the lineup. As you note, Richards is entering his prime. Schenn essentially is playing his first post-Junior season. It's apples and kumquats.

The trade(s) made the Flyers (IMO) better, cheaper and - most importantly - younger. Having a 20yo #5 overall pick as your backup insurance policy this season (if nothing else) is a great addition to the lineup. Simmonds has a place and role on the roster - there really isn't one for Schenn at this point. I don't understand the CBA logistics of it, but not having him on the opening roster apparently lowered his cap hit this season - another important consideration beyond the window-dressing of an off-season trade.

If you add up Harry Z, Rinaldo and Read they together cost barely more than Schenn's potential cap hit (with bonuses). And those guys are good candidates for 3/4 line duty that can also add some offensive punch in a Top 6/9 role.

I'd simply rather have Schenn playing a Top 6 role in the AHL with solid minutes than trying to find 5-10 minutes on the 3/4 lines in the NHL.

[aziz]

there are three things that worry me about schenn

1. you'd like a 1st round pick who played out his entire junior eligibility to be able to step into the NHL and start off on a 40 point kind of pace. there's an adjustment period, absolutely, but i would think the fundementals would be polished to a point where some kind of effectiveness would be there off the bat. schenn hasn't had much of an opportunity to show his stuff, but what chance he has had he really hasn't stepped up, at all, really. very much a step behind. as opposed to, say, read, or zolnierczyk, both of whom are also in their first real professional season. they're a few years older, but they also weren't top-5 picks, and they had enough game out of the gate to lay claim to roster spots. not saying schenn doesn't have it and never will, but an inauspicious start.

2. i really don't know where he is going to play, roster-wise. certainly not center, at least not in the next 3 years. so..wing? who gets bumped to make room? injury call up, sure, he can take the vacated spot, but is there really any way he can find a permanent spot on the NHL roster this season? barring a season ending injury somewhere, or a hartnell trade, i just don't see it.

3. his brother. also entered the league with a ton of hype, and has slid backwards ever since. 5th overall pick in 2008, and now is only being saved from the bench as the leaf's #7 dman by an injury to komisarek. to the extent bloodlines mean anything......

again, not saying brayden won't put it together at some point, but signs aren't as great as you'd like them to be. i'm trying to see the richards trade as addition by subtraction with the bonus of simmonds and a maybe prospect.

[flyercanuck]

@radoran

Hey rad- I'm not saying he should be in the lineup because he was traded for Richards, I'm just saying he was the key piece, not Simmonds. I think a lot of people are caught up in the Flyers vying for 1st place. I honestly think we'll drop down in the pack, and that playing Schenn now and letting him adapt to the NHL will benefit the team come playoff time. Something that might temporarily take away but payoff a lot more at a later date.

Read has been an absolute bonus. But reality is, Harry Z and Rinaldo aren't really going to factor in the long range plans of a playoff team. So if Schenn goes back to the A and starts racking up 2 points a game again, isn't it obvious he needs to play against a higher level?

[flyercanuck]

@aziz

1. You mean like JVR? Who basically played out his eligibility, and as the 2nd overall pick, didn't hit 40 points til last season. I thought Schenn looked ok for a kid starting out in the NHL. He didn't have points, but his play was fine IMO.

2. He played a lot of RW at the WJs and racked up the most points ever by a Canadian. I think that means he can handle the switch. I admit the team is overloaded at center. That's a problem very few teams have, and it isn't a problem.

3. His brother was the Leafs best defenceman last year. This year they're playing a wide open no defence run and gun. It's not Luke Schenns style of play at all.

[aziz]

"But reality is, Harry Z and Rinaldo aren't really going to factor in the long range plans of a playoff team."

@FC - why not? harry has speed that not many in the league can match, and hands to boot. i'd be real curious to see what he could do if given a center who can tailor his playmaking to include that almost peerless speed rinaldo does his thing, solid checking energy guy, schenn isn't going to play that role.

i don't see the point to trying to shoe-horn schenn into a spot just to make the richards trade look worth it, or whatever. he's done nothing with his few chances with the flyers. he'll get more chances, and it's on him to make a mark when they come. jamming him into the lineup because of what trade he was a part of rather than what he has earned doesn't really track, especially if it means bumping guys who have earned it.

[idahophilly]

I just don't want to dismantle all the lines just to fit him in. If the team is still playing well when he is ready it's a one-for-one swap in my opinion. Probably a 3rd or 4th liner coming out and incerting Schenn directly into that spot, regardless of position.

[aziz]

1. You mean like JVR? Who basically played out his eligibility, and as the 2nd overall pick, didn't hit 40 points til last season. I thought Schenn looked ok for a kid starting out in the NHL. He didn't have points, but his play was fine IMO.

well, ok, JVR did have 35 his rookie year. 5 points short. just shy of .5ppg. schenn didn't look close to doing anything in his 4 games. only 4 games, but i have to disagree, i don't think his play was fine. i thought it was lethargic and confused. maybe games 5, 6, 7 and on would be different, but in his cup of coffee so far, he looked literally out of his league.

2. He played a lot of RW at the WJs and racked up the most points ever by a Canadian. I think that means he can handle the switch. I admit the team is overloaded at center. That's a problem very few teams have, and it isn't a problem.

and that's fine, so long as he (and the team) are willing to convert him to a wing.

3. His brother was the Leafs best defenceman last year. This year they're playing a wide open no defence run and gun. It's not Luke Schenns style of play at all.

think so? 3rd worst +/- of their blueliners. 22 points is ok, i guess...but seems a little behind kaberle's 38. i'm having a tough time seeing the "leaf's best defensemen" thing. and regardless, he has been terrible this season. he was down to ~12minutes TOI before the other dmen started getting hurt. what really worries me is his problems are the same ones i saw in brayden's brief appearance: lethargic and confused all over the ice.

brayden just really smells like tradebait to me. the flyers aren't in a spot to need him, and really aren't in a spot to give him a real chance at the roster. barring injury, obviously. mightn't columbus or calgary or even toronto be interested in a center prospect? couldn't the flyers turn their #6 center into something a little higher up the depth chart?

[radoran]

@radoran

Hey rad- I'm not saying he should be in the lineup because he was traded for Richards, I'm just saying he was the key piece, not Simmonds. I think a lot of people are caught up in the Flyers vying for 1st place. I honestly think we'll drop down in the pack, and that playing Schenn now and letting him adapt to the NHL will benefit the team come playoff time. Something that might temporarily take away but payoff a lot more at a later date.

Read has been an absolute bonus. But reality is, Harry Z and Rinaldo aren't really going to factor in the long range plans of a playoff team. So if Schenn goes back to the A and starts racking up 2 points a game again, isn't it obvious he needs to play against a higher level?

He was the "centerpiece" of that trade, yes. And he has another two years under contract before he's an RFA. Still, no rush. I do think that Simmonds' is undervalued in the trade scenario. A lot of Kings writers have commented that they're missing some of Simmonds' "intangibles" - like being a skilled player with an edge who's prepared to drop the gloves if needed. I think off the ice, Simmonds is also exactly the kind of player that, for example, the Ed Snider Youth Hockey program could really use to have around.

It sounds like Schenn might be able to play W without much fuss. There seems to be a top line forward position open due to injury at the moment...

I wouldn't be surprised if he was sent elsewhere in a trade, either.

Like "too many centers," having a 20yo 5th overall pick still waiting to make his real NHL coming out is a problem a LOT of teams would like to have...

[flyercanuck]

@aziz

I don't want to shoehorn Schenn in to make the trade better either. I want him to play and adapt to the NHL because I'm pretty sure he'll end up being one hell of a lot better player than Harry Z (no offence to Harry) Schenn earned a chance by playing great hockey throughout his career at every level . He gets 4 games in Philly and we've already seen plenty suggesting he's a bust. I think the guy deserves a longer look than 4 games. Heck, we're still waiting on JVR, (and rightfully so), and he's 171 games in.

You're not really going to compare Kaberles points to Schenns when Schenn actually plays D, hits hard, blocks shots?

Sure, we could trade him. What's Columbus, Toronto or Calgary going to send our way that can actually play on the Flyers? You won't get Nash and I doubt you'd get Johanson.from Columbus. Jeff Carter? Jerome Iginla from Calgary? He'll be done when Schenn just gets going. See anything you want from Toronto? There's a reason none of those teams know anything about playoff hockey since the lockout. And anything the do have would be even harder than Schenn to fit capwise.

[flyercanuck]

@radoran

Don't get me wrong, I was glad Simmonds came in the package. But I wouldn't trade Richards for him unless there was something better coming along with it.

And yes, having too many centers is like having too many defencemen.... you can never have too many.

[Podein25]

having too many centers is like having too many defencemen.... you can never have too many.

Spoken like a true lifer Flyer fan. Old timers like my dad always talk about how a lot of the wingers on the Bullies were originally centers. I always took it to be gospel, and don't know it for a fact to be true, but the Flyers have always placed a premium on centers since before Clarke was a GM as far as I can tell.

The fact that lately we can't seem to find one that can win faceoffs is a peculiar, and perverse, irony to me.

[flyercanuck]

Yet another reason to give Schenn a try. We suck at faceoffs.

[brelic]

@aziz

I don't want to shoehorn Schenn in to make the trade better either. I want him to play and adapt to the NHL because I'm pretty sure he'll end up being one hell of a lot better player than Harry Z (no offence to Harry) Schenn earned a chance by playing great hockey throughout his career at every level . He gets 4 games in Philly and we've already seen plenty suggesting he's a bust. I think the guy deserves a longer look than 4 games. Heck, we're still waiting on JVR, (and rightfully so), and he's 171 games in.

You're not really going to compare Kaberles points to Schenns when Schenn actually plays D, hits hard, blocks shots?

Sure, we could trade him. What's Columbus, Toronto or Calgary going to send our way that can actually play on the Flyers? You won't get Nash and I doubt you'd get Johanson.from Columbus. Jeff Carter? Jerome Iginla from Calgary? He'll be done when Schenn just gets going. See anything you want from Toronto? There's a reason none of those teams know anything about playoff hockey since the lockout. And anything the do have would be even harder than Schenn to fit capwise.

I think the injuries we have coupled with Simmonds mediocre play opens the door for Schenn (though not that it was closed or anything, lol).

Just to be clear, I never said I didn't want Schenn on the big club, only that while the team was hot, why disrupt anything for an unknown commodity? Wait till the team cools down or people get injured. I think Winnipeg 'cooled' us down (figuratively and literally).

I mentioned before I'd like to see JVR/Briere/Schenn again for a better look, and move Simmonds to the 4th. I think we would have 4 incredibly balanced and dangerous lines.

H/G/J

JVR/B/S

V/T/R

Simmonds/Couturier/Rinaldo

You could argue that Coots belongs on the 3rd over Talbot, but the way he's playing with Voracek and Read, I think he's earned his spot up there for a while.

[doom88]

Yet another reason to give Schenn a try. We suck at faceoffs.

I'm on board with this. Get Schenn in the gym to bulk up a bit too, maybe save some wear and tear on Briere?

[LegionOfDoom]

H/G/J

JVR/B/V

T/S/R

Simmonds/Couturier/Rinaldo

We know 1st line = done.

I still think V can help B out and JVR can do what H did last year but only better.

T is versitile, which will help S adjust and R can be the clutch(who gets S in gear)

Simmy, Couts and Rinny ...ah mannn what a powerful 4th line (actually 2 or 3rd line skill)

We now have 3 second liner's on any given night.

....Man were are we gonna fit Z? He can be interchangeable with Rinny.

[browning]

I do not believe that the 4 game hiccup can be any cause for hesitation to put Schenn back in the lineup when he is ready.

The cluster (bad word here) that ensued last time was Lavi's fault. There was not a need to reshuffle the whole lineup.

I want Schenn as the 3rd line center or wing depending on where Couturier plays.

Talbot should be on the 4th line and perhaps Simmonds and Rinaldo.

The only hesitation with this is if Rinaldo can play the extra minutes and not go off the deep end. If not hello Harry Z.

This gives a monster 4th line that plays 10-12 minutes a game.

Third Line

Schenn. Couturier. Read

Minutes interchangeable with Talbots line depending on how they are playing. Three rookies on one line may be a problem come late in the season admittedly.

At least this gives Lavi time to slowly work in other line combinations.

[The Quigster]

One thing I'd like to add about the Carter/Richards deal,there guys were a plague on the club.Homer wanted to get rid of them before their contracts prevented it.Getting a good return may not have been Homers number one priority,he wanted to move "em". The players the Flyers got in the trades are OK,I hope all the new guys go on to be great players and play a long time.

[mojo1917]

@ mmer.

you are underestimating the chairman and his desire to ice a winning team, carter and richards are considered top tier talent , homer wasn't going to just salary dump them, ala gagne. he needed to get players back who could contribute or mr snider would have his scalp.