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Lets face facts here people


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And I hope flyers management faces these facts quickly as well. This team just isn't good enough to compete with the big boys of this league. Are they horrible? No I don't think so. Management needs to come to terms with its the time to sell. There are no less then three players that need to go. They are briere,kimmo,and breezy. Briere will be moved before the deadline as well will kimmo. Briere knows that his time in philly is over. Not because of his play on ice but his salary cap hit makes it impossible to retain him if they want to have money for the young guys needing renewel. Boston is a good fit for him. Should be able to get a 1st rounder for him. It will prolly be 25-30 overall though. Detroit can take kimmo and turn him into a star again. They just have an unreal ability to have players very productive into their 40's lol. Prolly their 1st rounder as well. Again prolly 25-30 pick. In this draft though those picks can be impact players maybe even in the following season. Or package them together for a mid 1st round selection as well as our other 1st rounder. With Seth jones, Darnell nurse,Ryan pulock,Nikita zadorov,Rasmussen ristolainen and josh morrissey as your most likely top defenseman in the draft we can turn the blue line around very quickly. And yes the forwards in the draft look amazing and deep. Breezy? He needs to be bought out. Not everything is his fault. Team plays like crap too on most nights. There is a few goalies out there that can help short term for next season and they should be explored. Tim Thomas is the top of the line though. That's if he returns to action and if he isn't suspended or something by the islanders making this year run through next year for not honering a contract. That's another story though.

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Ok i will say i agree with Danny Mr zero effort out there Briere needs to go but how is another arguement...

..he has already said he wants to stay and doesn't want to waive is NTC...so scratch him....that is what i do if i'm Lavy bring Wellwood up and he will show Danny how if nothing else to HUSTLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And no coasting don't count!

Bryz i guess after the season just buy him out...look around the league goaltenders everywhere are playing huge and giving the teams in front of them a chance when they aren't play good on a particular night. Bryz just can't/won't do that...hell i would just be happy with a breakaway stop...had they been in more shootouts he would have been really exposed...that he is slow and just plain out sucks 1 on 1....PERIOD!!! And i've had my fill...buh bye.

The Flyers shouldn't have a problem finding someone around the league to fill the starter and backup job (no more leighton/boosch please new blood) next season after the buyout.

On Kimmo lets not underestimate his present on this club, he is the #1 guy right now yet he can't do it alone(and playing with a injury)...besides he is nurturing Schenn of which i think he is doing a great job and so i love his passion and effort...and the fact that he is a "Flyer heart and soul" and if the whole team played like him they would be the #1 seed in the east....yet once again he can't do it alone...and he continues to lead by example...this group has a deep seeded mental issue(s)...Coburn sure leaves alot to be desired with his play and i don't think he will ever get it...not singleing him out...ok so i am but he plays alot of minutes and his decision making is sad (the only one who has a worse +/- is Bruno @ -10...Coby -9) his puck handling sucks and he couldn't get a shot on net if someone put a gun to his head...

...there i feel better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :angry:

Edited by OccamsRazor
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@OccamsRazor

I agree about coby. However I'm not trading him to a playoff team for a 1st rounder. Maybe a bottom 10 for that pick. But not a playoff team. He is a dman who teams want. Big and mobile. Maybe a change of scenery is what's needed for him.

I wouldn't have a problem trading him to a team out west regardless if they are a playoff team or not but not for a pick...maybe swap him for a youg Dman in exchange for example Yandle or Oliver-Ekman -Larsson...like is said example...would love to ship Coburn and Danny B to the desert for say Yandle and Klesla or if i had my choice of young forwards Boedker...are you listening Homer...but i know Danny wouldn't waive his NTC to go back to Phoenix..i can't stand how DUMB COBURN LOOKS OUT THERE IN EVEN THE SIMPLEST SITUATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited by OccamsRazor
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How can we trade Coburn? Our defense is weak, and he is the best skating dman we have. We need 2 more defenseman, and there is no help coming via free agency. The last thing we nend to do is trade Coburn. We nned to trade a forward for a defensman

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I'm fine acquiring picks, and keeping the team mostly intact as long as Bryz is gone next season. Even if that means Boosh and Heeter.

These young guys need to grow together, and this is just a bump in the road.

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I wouldn't have a problem trading him to a team out west regardless if they are a playoff team or not but not for a pick...maybe swap him for a youg Dman in exchange for example Yandle or Oliver-Ekman -Larsson...like is said example...would love to ship Coburn and Danny B to the desert for say Yandle and Klesla or if i had my choice of young forwards Boedker...are you listening Homer...but i know Danny wouldn't waive his NTC to go back to Phoenix..i can't stand how DUMB COBURN LOOKS OUT THERE IN EVEN THE SIMPLEST SITUATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Swap Coburn for Yandle or OEL???

While we're at it, how about Hartnell for Stamkos, and Rinaldo for Toews?

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Just to be clear - they don't "need" space next year to re-sign players. The only (roster) RFAs next season are Z, Rinaldo and Gustafsson.

They clear off $2.65M in Foster and Walker; an additional $7.1 in Gagne/Feds/Shelley/Knuble and Boucher's $950K.

They will essentially "need" to sign 2 Fs and a backup G (Timo/Coburn/Mesz/LSchenn/Grossman/Gervais under contract). They currently show $2.225M in cap space (cap geek) which does not take into account Pronger's $4.9M on LTIR (yet)). With the 10% off-season exemption, they have something like $7M to fill those gaps, which then gets taken up by Pronger's LTIR.

The real problems from a re-signing perspective arise after 2014 when Giroux/Couturier/BSchenn/(McGinn) are all RFA and Read is UFA.

Also, there isn't a good goalie "option" after this season (barring a trade for Bernier), but there are several possibilities (including the Halak/Elliot tandem in STL) that open up UFA after 13-14.

From where I sit (and it is a comfy couch) that makes the deconstruction of this mess effectively a year away (assuming the team is still unwilling to 'rebuild') - since they can buy out both Bryz and Briere after 13-14 using the "compliance" option and they lose Timonen's salary.

The last thing I want to see is a replay of the "must sign #1 C" summer that resulted in Briere's albatross contract. Assuming Minny keeps Backtrom and Howard stays in Detroit, "Must sign #1 G" after this season options are: Thomas (38), Khabibulin (40), Nabokov (37), Smith (30), Theodore (36), Mason (36) - and it gets worse from there (believe it or not) aside from maybe Dan Ellis (32).

It is in this context that I *think* the organization will, once again, "reload" pretty much the same gun next season.

And, just for the record, it is significantly different from what I "would" or "want" to do.

SPECULATING: Pronger will be owed just $5.15M from 14-17. Could the Flyers deal his cap hit to St. Louis (with a pick/player) to acquire one of the Halak/Elliott tandem next season? I imagine Pronger would approve "reitiring a Blue" and he lives in STL anyway.

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Swap Coburn for Yandle or OEL???

While we're at it, how about Hartnell for Stamkos, and Rinaldo for Toews?

I didn't mean straight up they work something out it would just be the foundation of the discussion...many around the league think Coburn is a 1-3 Dmen i'm not one but he does have good trade value(while it is dropping by the second...move him now, his value will be no higher) :ph34r:

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How can we trade Coburn? Our defense is weak, and he is the best skating dman we have. We need 2 more defenseman, and there is no help coming via free agency. The last thing we nend to do is trade Coburn. We nned to trade a forward for a defensman

right now he isn't the #1 guy and never will be...#1 Kimmo #2 Schenn #3 GrossmanN (sorry he may not skate like Coby but he is valuable to the blueline has as many goals as Coby and 1 less point yet leads the league in blocked shots) #4 Coburn #5 Gus #6 Bruno (sad to say)

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@OccamsRazor

I doubt Phoenix wants to trade one of the best young defencemen in the league. But even if they did, we'd still need yet another defenceman. Coburn isn't a #1 but is being forced to play one.

It was more of a suggestion (more like a dream) to get rid of Briere they need center man help...i know i know Danny ain't a whole lot of help but he could play more mintutes with them....like i said a pipe dream...i prefer to keep the corp intact and just ride this season...maybe Coburn and Read instead...ok i give.

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@OccamsRazor

I doubt Phoenix wants to trade one of the best young defencemen in the league. But even if they did, we'd still need yet another defenceman. Coburn isn't a #1 but is being forced to play one.

According to TSN Hockey Insider Pierre LeBrun of ESPN, the St. Louis Blues are in the market for a top-four, left-handed defenceman that can be paired with either Alex Pietrangelo or Kevin Shattenkirk.

Ok here is one....

...Coburn and Briere for Jaden Schwartz, Jani Hakanpaa and a 2nd....you said you don't want to make the playoffs and this would free up money for later???

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And I hope flyers management faces these facts quickly as well. This team just isn't good enough to compete with the big boys of this league. Are they horrible? No I don't think so. Management needs to come to terms with its the time to sell. There are no less then three players that need to go. They are briere,kimmo,and breezy. Briere will be moved before the deadline as well will kimmo. Briere knows that his time in philly is over. Not because of his play on ice but his salary cap hit makes it impossible to retain him if they want to have money for the young guys needing renewel. Boston is a good fit for him. Should be able to get a 1st rounder for him. It will prolly be 25-30 overall though. Detroit can take kimmo and turn him into a star again. They just have an unreal ability to have players very productive into their 40's lol. Prolly their 1st rounder as well. Again prolly 25-30 pick. In this draft though those picks can be impact players maybe even in the following season. Or package them together for a mid 1st round selection as well as our other 1st rounder. With Seth jones, Darnell nurse,Ryan pulock,Nikita zadorov,Rasmussen ristolainen and josh morrissey as your most likely top defenseman in the draft we can turn the blue line around very quickly. And yes the forwards in the draft look amazing and deep. Breezy? He needs to be bought out. Not everything is his fault. Team plays like crap too on most nights. There is a few goalies out there that can help short term for next season and they should be explored. Tim Thomas is the top of the line though. That's if he returns to action and if he isn't suspended or something by the islanders making this year run through next year for not honering a contract. That's another story though.

How can we trade Kimmo with that $6 million extension he just signed??? (Don't see that happening.)

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@AndyS

Anybody is tradable. Detroit has the cap space for it and the need for a dman like kimmo. They kicked the tires a year ago for kimmo.

Anybody is tradeable. Guys who re-signed a one year deal with a No Movement Clause, saying that they are re-upping for a last run with an organization are a little more difficult.

Getting real "value" for those types of guys also a little more difficult.

If the Flyers dropped a first rounder on an aging, about to retire defenseman, I think we'd all lose our collective maerd.

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@OccamsRazor

What the heck do we want Schwartz for again? We already have a center logjam. Trading from a weakness to a strength doesn't help much. Hakanpaa might fit in in a few years.

Again when did they have him? Flyers really don't have any defensive prospects...bored i guess..

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Bryz ... Last year I would have said buy him out... this year, I can't find a good reason to dump him yet. Yes sometimes he looks bad.... but how would you feel trying to bail out the zero D that's playing in front of him. Maybe if the D played like they cared, he would also. At times he looks great... when he doesn't I think it's because he has zero help out there in the universe.

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@AndyS

Anybody is tradable. Detroit has the cap space for it and the need for a dman like kimmo. They kicked the tires a year ago for kimmo.

Not at that price tag he's not. Just because somebody has the money doesn't mean they're willing to spend it foolishly.

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For the sake of accuracy, Briere's contract gets very favorable the next two years. Not that i want him on the team because i do not.

If we could trade him to Boston for a G prospect or D-man, I would do it in a second. Playing for the Bruins might get him to waive his NMC.

We can only hope....

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