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An outsider's perspective...


Polaris922
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Nice post Polaris, I think it was Gervais that pinched on the third goal. The game was lost on the third goal, imo.

This team has a difficult time coming from behind against the Devils and just about every team for the most part. They can't play defensive team game, and Bryzgalov can't make a save on a one on one, mainly because Bryz commits too soon and rarely adjusts to the shooter.

This team is better off being sellers this trade deadline and re-tool the defense and goaltending this summer.

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Polaris... thoughtful and spot-on review. Unfortunately, this Team is just terrible and you are right about the defense - they are pathetic. But then again I expected this defense to be pathetic honestly. As for Bryz, I am not sure if he is the right Goalie or not... I am not a hater like most people but his contract is ludicrous and long term. If they amnesty Bryz I wont mind...

I said it a million times... no Goalie is goinng to be successful with a below ordinary defense in front of him and a run and gun offense. I said in a earlier post that we would have run Broduer out of town too... and I believe it.

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@Polaris922

1. Bryz did make a great save on Ponik...whatever his name is. I was shocked. Still am.

2. Agree.

3. Bryz has no clue where his rebounds are going. He has no clue where the rest of the players are on the ice unless they are right in front of him. Don't give me "he directed it where he was taught to" cause he doesn't. As for the bad bounce off Read, ya, it was bad luck. And it happens to Bryz almost every game. Sometimes 2 or 3 times. I've never seen a goalie have so many bad bounces go in on him. Honestly.

4. It was a breakaway. The ref could have signaled goal as soon as Read was beat.

5. Loktionov. My only problem is Bryz' stance. It's like he opens up on purpose when guys shoot. And how about NOT trying to get your stick out of the way of a shot?

6. Missed it. Thought some roofing in the dark while it was snowing with a sandblaster pointed at me would be more enjoyable.

7. Bryz made a "game changing" save when it was 5-1 in the 3rd and his save percentage was below 80%? Wow, that's incredible.

I'm not blaming him for the loss last night. It was a team effort. They're all playing like Bryz now. Play like crap, Make the odd nice play. Make millions. He's all yours if you want him.

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I know some won't read this because I'm the enemy and all, but I just watched the highlights/lowlights of the game you guys had last night and thought some of you may appreciate an outside perspective. I watched each goal and save with a critical eye as I always do, and this is what i saw.

1. Bryzgalov made a great lateral save on a two on one against Ponikarovsky. THAT was your game changing save some of you have been saying he can't make... the real problem is with your defense, he just can't make ENOUGH of them.

2. Debbies' first goal was largely on Meszaros. Maybe it's rust or what have you, but he's clearly standing still and reaching from beside the net rather than skating when Elias skates into the slot just outside the crease. That lack of effort allowed Elias to corral the incoming shot, move over two feet, and then let it go backhand past Bryzgalov. the only way Bryz makes that save is if he never reacted to the incoming shot in the first place. People will claim rebound crap, but let's face it, the rebound was kicked twenty feet out and through two Flyers players, there is no way it should've been allowed to come back in and be controlled that way by Elias. FAULT: Meszaros for the lazy reach rather than covering his man.

3. Debbies' second goal was blockered away by Bryz to the corner/side boards as all goaltenders are taught to do if they're giving up a rebound. A shot to the long side of the net at shoulder height can NOT be absorbed by the blocker/stick and will always go somewhere. Physics don't stop working just because you're paid well, and Bryz did exactly as he should, deflecting the shot away from the net to the corner. Unfortunately for you guys, Read was also doing a good job covering a Debbie at the side of the net, and it hit his butt and went in. Physics scored on you, not bad goaltending. FAULT: Physics

4. Debbies' third goal... Read made a tough call and pinched trying to keep the puck in on the power play. The puck bounced between his skates somehow and slipped through. Meszaros didn't read Read (heh heh) and never pulled back to cover should the puck get through. Result... the NHL's best shootout artist and breakaway goal scorer in recent history gets a breakaway in on your Bryzgalov who has been struggling with breakaways/shootouts. The result here was obvious. Yes you'd LIKE Bryzgalov to make the big save if he can, but since that has only happened less than 25% of the time Kovalchuk has ever moved in alone on net in his career, in any situation, tough to blame that on Bryzgalov. FAULT: Read/Meszaros

5. the Debbies' fourth goal Coburn makes an abyssmal play going down to the ice sliding right past the net as Ponikarovsky pulls up ten feet from the net and picks his shot. What is the stat for goalie reaction to shots from that range? I believe the accepted measurement was half a second for every 60 feet for a 90 mph shot. Say since it's a wrist shot it only hits 45 mph. So Bryzgalov had less than two tenths of a second to react to Ponikarovsky's shot? When goalies make a save from in that close, it's 99% bad shooting or just a darn fine guess by the goalie. FAULT: Coburn for leaving his skates instead of taking the man.

6. The Debbies' fifth goal Timonen follows his man out from the slot and to the sideboards. Meszaros covers his man next to the pipes. Talbot, as center, goes out to the point to cover the point shot... leaving Henrique to skate right past Fedotenko who with amazing speed and skill lifts his stick and waves it at him as he skates by, not moving his own feet, subsequently leaving Henrique to skate in all alone and roof the shot past Bryzgalov from five feet out. Bryzgalov did fall forward trying to snatch it in his trapper, but to no avail. FAULT: Fedotenko not picking up the man. (In our system I believe that would be Talbot's man to cover as center but I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that he knows his assignments in Laviolette's system).

7. Bryzgalov made another "game changing" type save on Clarkson from about five feet out by using good position and reacting well to an off balance soht by Clarkson.

So there you have it... my unattached, emotionless, care free evaluation of each goal or big save in your end of the ice as I see it. It looks to me like Meszaros could be a bit rusty, Coburn maybe tried too hard, and some confusion amongst your forwards on who takes whom. Bryzgalov shouldn't be blamed for THIS game at least. Is it a system failure? An effort failure? I dunno... but it's clear to me the problem is not in the net so much as what's going on out front. No uber-weak goals let up by Bryzgalov in this game.

Thanks for the post, but let's be honest as a Pens fan you want the Flyers to keep Bryzgalov for the next 7 years :) He's being paid to be an elite goalie and yes the defense in front of him sucks right now but I can say the same for the Devils defense in front of Brodeur the last couple of years yet Brodeur still makes the saves when needed, that's the difference. Add in his outspoken comments and you have a recipe for disaster in the dressing room. Bryzgalov is a product of the defensive system Dave Tippett had in Phoenix and nothing else, he's not an elite goalie becasue he's not consistent night in and night out, he's always good for one bad goal at the wrong time of the game. Snider is getting older and will probably die before seeing his beloved Flyers hoist the cup again, it's time for both Snider and Holmgren to realize they have a good core group of forwards but they also need a good core group of defensemen and a goalie. This is the perfect year to start that process and if Snider dies in the next 5 years then so be it.

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NBC Sports showed a replay on the one goal of a brutal pinch leading to a 2-1, and a goal...forget which one at the moment. But Gervais was 100 feet out of the play after he got caught.

Also, I have no idea what Bryz was doing on but on 2 goals last night, he DROPPED his glove as the Debbies took a shot. Both went in, not sure if the glove being lowered had an effect, but anyone knows a butterfly goalie..which is what he was doing at the time, is taught to keep their glove up as they drop. Last night, wasn't on Bryz...even if he makes those 2 saves, and prevents 2 goals, they still lose 3-2. But it's something I want to start looking for..if I can pick it up from my couch, while tanked on rum and coke, I'm pretty sure NHL players will notice as well.

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Your analysis is spot on.

Quit sucking up.

His analysis is not perfect. For example, the first goal starts to go sour when Cooter turns it over with a very weak play in the middle of the neutral zone with his D moving up. They are left reeling as are the forwards. Cooter is doing that 3-4 times a game. Something's gotta give there.

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Quit sucking up.

His analysis is not perfect. For example, the first goal starts to go sour when Cooter turns it over with a very weak play in the middle of the neutral zone with his D moving up. They are left reeling as are the forwards. Cooter is doing that 3-4 times a game. Something's gotta give there.

Yes. And the play that got past Read at the point started with a bonehead play by Briere in the corner. But the argument that most of the goals weren't really on Bryz last night is fairly sound.

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The problem, I think, is that there are 47 percent who are slackers who are dependent upon mindlessly skating, who believe that they are victims, who believe the team has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to a pay check, to playing time, to housing, to you-name-it. ... A team's job is not to worry about those people. They'll never convince them they should take personal responsibility and care for their jobs.

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NBC Sports showed a replay on the one goal of a brutal pinch leading to a 2-1, and a goal...forget which one at the moment. But Gervais was 100 feet out of the play after he got caught.

Also, I have no idea what Bryz was doing on but on 2 goals last night, he DROPPED his glove as the Debbies took a shot. Both went in, not sure if the glove being lowered had an effect, but anyone knows a butterfly goalie..which is what he was doing at the time, is taught to keep their glove up as they drop. Last night, wasn't on Bryz...even if he makes those 2 saves, and prevents 2 goals, they still lose 3-2. But it's something I want to start looking for..if I can pick it up from my couch, while tanked on rum and coke, I'm pretty sure NHL players will notice as well.

Wait a minute...you're just noticing Bryz' horrible glove hand...you are drunk! :blink:

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Quit sucking up.

His analysis is not perfect. For example, the first goal starts to go sour when Cooter turns it over with a very weak play in the middle of the neutral zone with his D moving up. They are left reeling as are the forwards. Cooter is doing that 3-4 times a game. Something's gotta give there.

Never claimed perfection. On my phone screen it looked like Read to me, and obviously I confused Ponikarovsky later on. I could have rewound to Meszaros handcuffing Couturier with a two foot squib pass or Briere's play, but figured I'd focus on the last real chance to prevent the goal before it got to the under siege Bryzgalov.

In a side note, I've submitted a résumé to Bryzgalov's PR guy to get hired on as defense counsel. ;)

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I know some won't read this because I'm the enemy and all, but I just watched the highlights/lowlights of the game you guys had last night and thought some of you may appreciate an outside perspective. I watched each goal and save with a critical eye as I always do, and this is what i saw.

1. Bryzgalov made a great lateral save on a two on one against Ponikarovsky. THAT was your game changing save some of you have been saying he can't make... the real problem is with your defense, he just can't make ENOUGH of them.

2. Debbies' first goal was largely on Meszaros. Maybe it's rust or what have you, but he's clearly standing still and reaching from beside the net rather than skating when Elias skates into the slot just outside the crease. That lack of effort allowed Elias to corral the incoming shot, move over two feet, and then let it go backhand past Bryzgalov. the only way Bryz makes that save is if he never reacted to the incoming shot in the first place. People will claim rebound crap, but let's face it, the rebound was kicked twenty feet out and through two Flyers players, there is no way it should've been allowed to come back in and be controlled that way by Elias. FAULT: Meszaros for the lazy reach rather than covering his man.

3. Debbies' second goal was blockered away by Bryz to the corner/side boards as all goaltenders are taught to do if they're giving up a rebound. A shot to the long side of the net at shoulder height can NOT be absorbed by the blocker/stick and will always go somewhere. Physics don't stop working just because you're paid well, and Bryz did exactly as he should, deflecting the shot away from the net to the corner. Unfortunately for you guys, Read was also doing a good job covering a Debbie at the side of the net, and it hit his butt and went in. Physics scored on you, not bad goaltending. FAULT: Physics

4. Debbies' third goal... Read made a tough call and pinched trying to keep the puck in on the power play. The puck bounced between his skates somehow and slipped through. Meszaros didn't read Read (heh heh) and never pulled back to cover should the puck get through. Result... the NHL's best shootout artist and breakaway goal scorer in recent history gets a breakaway in on your Bryzgalov who has been struggling with breakaways/shootouts. The result here was obvious. Yes you'd LIKE Bryzgalov to make the big save if he can, but since that has only happened less than 25% of the time Kovalchuk has ever moved in alone on net in his career, in any situation, tough to blame that on Bryzgalov. FAULT: Read/Meszaros

5. the Debbies' fourth goal Coburn makes an abyssmal play going down to the ice sliding right past the net as Ponikarovsky pulls up ten feet from the net and picks his shot. What is the stat for goalie reaction to shots from that range? I believe the accepted measurement was half a second for every 60 feet for a 90 mph shot. Say since it's a wrist shot it only hits 45 mph. So Bryzgalov had less than two tenths of a second to react to Ponikarovsky's shot? When goalies make a save from in that close, it's 99% bad shooting or just a darn fine guess by the goalie. FAULT: Coburn for leaving his skates instead of taking the man.

6. The Debbies' fifth goal Timonen follows his man out from the slot and to the sideboards. Meszaros covers his man next to the pipes. Talbot, as center, goes out to the point to cover the point shot... leaving Henrique to skate right past Fedotenko who with amazing speed and skill lifts his stick and waves it at him as he skates by, not moving his own feet, subsequently leaving Henrique to skate in all alone and roof the shot past Bryzgalov from five feet out. Bryzgalov did fall forward trying to snatch it in his trapper, but to no avail. FAULT: Fedotenko not picking up the man. (In our system I believe that would be Talbot's man to cover as center but I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that he knows his assignments in Laviolette's system).

7. Bryzgalov made another "game changing" type save on Clarkson from about five feet out by using good position and reacting well to an off balance soht by Clarkson.

So there you have it... my unattached, emotionless, care free evaluation of each goal or big save in your end of the ice as I see it. It looks to me like Meszaros could be a bit rusty, Coburn maybe tried too hard, and some confusion amongst your forwards on who takes whom. Bryzgalov shouldn't be blamed for THIS game at least. Is it a system failure? An effort failure? I dunno... but it's clear to me the problem is not in the net so much as what's going on out front. No uber-weak goals let up by Bryzgalov in this game.

I think you are right. The rot is deep. And I think that it shows Holmgren is more "tactician" than "strategist." Individually, some of his deals make sense. Collectively they don't add up. I think one of the commentators noted the Flyers have 17 first rounders on their squad. The problem from my vantage is that we collect them as pieces and don't build a cohesive core from within. And while I don't think Milbury is that sharp, his commentary after the game about coaching makes sense. DeBoer is eating Lavy's breakfast. Apparently Lavy is not making adjustments...

Best,

Howie

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