Homer's deals throughout the years...

[pensuck]

In all of his dealings over the years. Which one bothers you the most?

[OH1FlyersFan]

Because I have goalies on the brain and it's still a fresh wound, right now the one that bothers me most is trading Bob for the 45th and 117th overall picks in the last draft. He did also manage to get a fourth round pick this year too. But let's see who we got so far:

• Anthony Stolarz (Round 2, 45th overall). Goalie. 19 years old. His save % has ranged from a low of .898 to a high of .960 - that's over 3 games played this season. His GAA has ranged from a high of 2.84 (Bryz is in this area too, I think) to a low of 1.27 over 3 games this season. Jury is still out. Possibilities, though.
  
• Taylor Leier (Round 4, 117th overall). Left wing (and we have plenty of those, thanks anyway). 19 years old. Played for the Portland Winterhawks this season in the WHL. 27 goals, 35 assists in 64 games. Plus 41. Those are impressive numbers. Could have serious potential in 2 or 3 years.
  

The problem is, the return on investment is years away with these two. It's great to have talent, or possible talent, in the pipeline, but BOB is ready to play now. He's coming into his own and will only get better. And the Flyers needed a goalie. I want his skills, talent at this moment in time. Not Stolarz or who knows who in 5 years. Bad move getting rid of Bob now.

[pensuck]

That's a good one

[jammer2]

@OH1FlyersFan I was checking on Leier's stats the othe day and I noticed he had really good numbers.....and he's not playing on the top line or the top pp (as far as I know, maybe Claude can clear that up, he goes to Winterhawk games)....anyways, a nice solid year from the kid. Gives a lot of promise. I have watched Stolarz quite a few times now. His athleticism is noticed immediatley. He moves great for a big kid. A few of the times I watched him he gave up easy/soft goals, so that was not comforting...but can at least be worked on. At least he has the raw skills to be successful...at least IMHO.

But yeah, giving up Bob...I was pissed from the moment it happened. He's just so quick.....and relitively young for a NHL tender. A blind man coulda seen he has to much potential to give up on him, or make a "classy" move (sickening, really that line of thinking, I hope it's not right) to help the kid out.....outrageous is what is/was....Homer deserves to get fired for that move alone. Esp when you put it in the context that we have not had a legit #1 since Hextall was hacking people up like Jason.

[BearOnIce]

@OH1FlyersFan I was checking on Leier's stats the othe day and I noticed he had really good numbers.....and he's not playing on the top line or the top pp (as far as I know, maybe Claude can clear that up, he goes to Winterhawk games)....anyways, a nice solid year from the kid. Gives a lot of promise. I have watched Stolarz quite a few times now. His athleticism is noticed immediatley. He moves great for a big kid. A few of the times I watched him he gave up easy/soft goals, so that was not comforting...but can at least be worked on. At least he has the raw skills to be successful...at least IMHO.

But yeah, giving up Bob...I was pissed from the moment it happened. He's just so quick.....and relitively young for a NHL tender. A blind man coulda seen he has to much potential to give up on him, or make a "classy" move (sickening, really that line of thinking, I hope it's not right) to help the kid out.....outrageous is what is/was....Homer deserves to get fired for that move alone. Esp when you put it in the context that we have not had a legit #1 since Hextall was hacking people up like Jason.

Bob, Bob, and Bob. Fire Holmgren NOW.

[brelic]

@OH1FlyersFan

But yeah, giving up Bob...I was pissed from the moment it happened. He's just so quick.....and relitively young for a NHL tender. A blind man coulda seen he has to much potential to give up on him, or make a "classy" move (sickening, really that line of thinking, I hope it's not right) to help the kid out.....outrageous is what is/was....Homer deserves to get fired for that move alone. Esp when you put it in the context that we have not had a legit #1 since Hextall was hacking people up like Jason.

[flyercanuck]

I hated the Briere signing cause it meant more of the same ol' philosophy of buy high and keep trying to stay good but never be great. The Pronger deal and the Bryz contract followed the same lines. I didn't like any of them from the get go. Now all everyone wants is out of those three contracts.

The Bob trade was stupid, and brought upon by an unstable overpaid jelly-spined wacko that can't handle pressure. Nice guy to have as your #1. Trading a 1st for Eminger was sheer brilliance too.

[brelic]

Gagne for Walker comes to mind as a recent bad trade.

Kris Versteeg. Homer traded a 1st and a 3rd to get him, then got a 2nd and a 3rd for him. SO, we basically traded a 1st for a 2nd.

The Pronger trade... well, I both love(d) it and hate it. But trades don't work on hindsight.

Upshall AND a 2nd for Carcillo???

Eminger for a 1st rounder (Carlson)

If we had kept Richards and Carter as the core, and drafted Carlson, kept Sbisa, drafted Hamilton and Maata... well, things would be quite different.

[RonJeremy]

Homers bad moves...

Trading a first rounder to the Caps for Emminger who was their #7 defenseman, he was worth a second or third rounder at best. They took our pick and drafted a quality defenseman in Carlson, while we are completely lacking in any young quality defenseman. We have nothing to show for this trade.

Passing up a franchise defenseman Hamilton for another center , Coots.This was not like picking 25 or 26, we were picking 9th. Hamilton was clearly the standout defenseman and we didnt need another center, we needed defense. Now Coots will end up being traded for defense anyway, if we picked Hamilton in the first place we would be much better off, cause Coots is not gonna get us a defenseman with Hamiltons skill.

Trading a first and third rounder for Versteeg - we have absolutely nothing to show for this move.

[RonJeremy]

Oh yeah and the Bob trade and signing Bryz, Bob has the most natural skill since Lindbergh all he needed was alittle coaching and experience and we give up on him to sign Bryz. Who scouted Bryz? who came back and said this guy is worth signing? How could you not see he is just an average goalie.

[ZeZel25]

In all of his dealings over the years. Which one bothers you the most?

I can give you some that come too mind easy

Upshall trade

Eminger trade

Klotz being drafted so high

Passing On Hamilton

Signing Foster

Dealing Sbisa

Shelley

Giving horrible contracts

[radoran]

In all of his dealings over the years. Which one bothers you the most?

Replacing Clarke with Clarke's protege.

[flyercanuck]

@

Oh ya, Klotz!

[flyercanuck]

@radoran

That's cheating. That was Sniders move, not Holmgrens.

[pensuck]

@radoran

that's for another thread entitled Snider's terrible moves...

[aziz]

20-Jan-06 Petr Nedved + 2006 4th Rounder (Joonas Lehtivuori) + option to swap 2007 3rd rounders (not taken) Phoenix Coyotes Dennis Seidenberg + 2006 4th Rounder (transferred to NYI - Tomas Marcinko)

23-Jan-06 2007 6th Rounder (Patrick Maroon) Florida Panthers Jon Sim

9-Mar-06 Denis Gauthier Phoenix Coyotes John Gratton, Tampa's 2006 2nd rounder (transferred to Det - Shawn Matthias), Florida's 2006 2nd Rounder (transferred to Det - Cory Emmerton)

9-Mar-06 Niko Dimitrakos San Jose Sharks 2006 3rd Rounder (transferred to CBJ - Tommy Sestito)

19-Apr-06 2006 2nd Rounder (Michael Ratchuk) Los Angeles Kings Dean Lombardi

24-Jun-06 2006 3rd Rounder (Jonathan Matsumoto) + 2006 4th Rounder (Jakub Kovar) Montreal Canadiens 2006 3rd Rounder (Ryan White)

2-Aug-06 Eric Meloche Chicago Blackhawks Vaclav Pletka

4-Aug-06 Kyle Calder Chicago Blackhawks Michal Handzus

9-Nov-06 Darren Reid Tampa Bay Lightning Daniel Corso

13-Nov-06 Todd Fedoruk Anaheim Mighty Ducks 2007 4th Rounder (Justin Vaive) + futures

16-Dec-06 Alexei Zhitnik New York Islanders Freddy Meyer & 2007 Conditional 3rd Rounder (Mark Katic)

20-Dec-06 Mike York New York Islanders Randy Robitaille & 2008 5th Rounder (Matthew Martin)

15-Feb-07 Ryan Parent,Scottie Upshall,2007 1st Rounder (transferred back to Nashville - Jonathon Blum) & 2007 3rd Rounder (transferred to WASH - Phil Desimone) Nashville Predators Peter Forsberg

24-Feb-07 Braydon Coburn Atlanta Thrashers Alexei Zhitnik

26-Feb-06 Lasse Kukkonen & 2007 3rd Rounder (Garrett Klotz) Chicago Blackhawks Kyle Calder

27-Feb-07 Martin Biron Buffalo Sabres 2007 2nd Rounder (T.J. Brennan)

4-Jun-07 futures Nashville Predators Matt Ellison

18-Jun-07 Kimmo Timonen & Scott Hartnell Nashville Predators Nashville's 2007 1st Rounder (previously obtained - Jonathon Blum)

23-Jun-07 2007 2nd Rounder (Kevin Marshall) Washington Captials 2008 2nd Rounder (Dmitri Kugryshev) + Nashville's 2007 3rd Rounder (Phil Desimone)

1-Jul-07 Jason Smith & Joffrey Lupul Edmonton Oilers Joni Pitkanen , Geoff Sanderson & 2009 3rd rounder (transferred to Calgary - Ryan Howse)

10-Dec-07 2009 7th Rounder Dallas Stars Jussi Timonen

19-Dec-07 Jim Vandermeer Chicago Blackhawks Ben Eager

19-Feb-08 Jaroslav Modry Los Angeles Kings 2008 3rd rounder (Geordie Wudrick)

20-Feb-08 2009 3rd rounder (Simon Bertilsson) Calgary Flames Jim Vandermeer

25-Feb-08 Vaclav Prospal Tampa Bay Lightning Alexandre Picard & 2009 2nd rounder (Richard Panik)

6-Jun-08 Danny Syvret Edmonton Oilers Ryan Potulny

18-Jun-08 2008 7th rounder (Joacim Eriksson) & 2009 conditional pick Tampa Bay Lightning Vaclav Prospal

20-Jun-08 Colorado's 2008 1st Rounder (prev. acquired - Lucas Sbisa) + 2008 3rd Rounder (Marc-Andre Bourdon) Columbus Blue Jackets R.J. Umberger + 2008 4th Rounder (Drew Olson)

20-Jun-08 Steve Eminger & 2008 3rd Rounder (Jacob Deserres) Washington Capitals 2008 1st Rounder(John Carlson)

21-Jun-08 2009 7th Rounder Anahiem Mighty Ducks 2008 7th Rounder (Nick Pryor)

24-Jun-08 Janne Niskala Nashville Predators Triston Grant + 2009 7th rounder

30-Jun-08 Tim Ramholt Calgary Flames Kyle Greentree

30-Jun-08 2009 6th Rounder Tampa Bay Lightning Janne Niskala

1-Jul-08 Patrick Hersley + Ned Lukacevic Los Angeles Kings Denis Gauthier + 2010 2nd Rounder

13-Oct-08 Andrew Alberts Boston Bruins Ned Lukacevic + conditional 2009 fourth-round pick (Lane MacDermid)

30-Oct-08 Josh Gratton Nashville Predators Tim Ramholt

7-Nov-08 Matt Carle & San Jose Sharks’ 2009 3rd rounder (Simon Bertilsson) Tampa Bay Lightning Steve Eminger, Steve Downie and Tampa Bay’s 2009 4th rounder (previously acquired)

4-Mar-09 Daniel Carcillo Phoenix Coyotes Scottie Upshall & 2011 2nd Rounder (Lucas Lessio)

4-Mar-09 Kyle McLaren San Jose Sharks 2009 6th Rounder

6-Mar-09 2009 6th Rounder San Jose Sharks Kyle McLaren (failed physical - trade nullified)

26-Jun-09 Chris Pronger & Ryan Dingle Anaheim Mighty Ducks Joffrey Lupul. Lucas Sbias, 2009 1st rounder (John Moore) , 2010 1st rounder and 2010 or 2011 conditional 3rd rounder

20-Oct-09 Stefan Legein Columbus Blue Jackets Michael Ratchuk

6-Feb-10 Ville Leino Detroit Red Wings Ole-Kristian Tollefsen & 2011 5th Rounder (Mattias Backman)

19-Jun-10 Dan Hamhuis + 2011 conditional draft pick Nashville Predators Ryan Parent

25-Jun-10 2011 3rd rounder (transferred to Phx - Harrison Ruopp) Pittsburgh Penguins Dan Hamuis

26-Jun-10 2010 7th Rounder (Ricard Blidstrand) Carolina Hurricanes Jon Matsumoto

1-Jul-10 Andrej Meszaros Tampa Bay Lightning 2011 2nd Rounder (Lucas Lessio)

19-Jul-10 Matt Walker + 2011 4th Rounder (Marcel Noebels) Tampa Bay Lightning Simon Gagne

21-Nov-10 Danny Syvret and Rob Bordson Anaheim Mighty Ducks Pat Maroon and David Laliberte

14-Feb-11 Kris Versteeg Toronto Maple Leafs 2011 1st Rounder (Stuart Percy) + 2011 3rd Rounder (Josh Leivo)

28-Feb-11 Tom Sestito Columbus Blue Jackets Michael Chaput + Greg Moore

7-Jun-11 Ilya Bryzgalov Phoenix Coyotes Matt Clackson, 2012 3rd rounder (transferred to Pit- Oskar Sundqvist), Pittsburgh's 2011 3rd Rounder (Harrison Ruopp)

23-Jun-11 Jakub Voracek, 2011 1st rounder (Sean Couturier), 2011 3rd rounder (Nick Cousins) Columbus Blue Jackets Jeff Carter

23-Jun-11 Wayne Simmonds, Brayden Schenn and 2012 2nd rounder (transferred to Dallas - Devin Shore) Los Angeles Kings Mike Richards and Rob Bordson

27-Jun-11 2013 3rd rounder Minnesota Wild Darroll Powe

1-Jun-11 2012 or 2013 second rounder and San Jose's 2012 third rounder (Shayne Gostisbehere) Florida Panthers Kris Versteeg

12-Oct-11 futures Los Angeles Kings Stefan Legein & 2012 6th rounder (Tomas Hyka)

2-Feb-12 Matt Ford Washington Capitals Kevin Marshall

16-Feb-12 Nicklas Grossman Dallas Stars LA's 2012 2nd Rounder (Devin Shore), Minnesota's 2013 3rd Rounder

18-Feb-12 Pavel Kubina Tampa Bay Lightning Jon Kalinski, Fla's 2012 2nd Rounder (Brian Hart), 2013 4th Rounder

22-Jun-12 2012 2nd Rounder (Anthony Stolarz), 2012 4th Rounder (Taylor Leier) & 2013 4th Rounder Columbus Blue Jackets Sergei Bobrovsky

23-Jun-12 Luke Schenn Toronto Maple Leafs James van Riemsdyk

13-Jan-13 Brian Boucher & Mark Alt Carolina Hurricanes Luke Pither

25-Feb-13 Mitch Wahk Calgary Flames Mike Testwuide

26-Feb-13 Simon Gagne Los Angeles Kings Phoenix's 2013 4th rounder

12-Mar-13 Futures Columbus Blue Jackets Matt Ford

[JackStraw]

@pensuck - as much as I was a Pronger fan before the trade, that one will probably always bother. We gave Anaheim more than they gave Edmonton.

I don't blame him for Bryzgalov, that was Snider's doing. In general I think his good trades have significantly outnumbered his bad ones. Some of the real bad ones were forced for salary cap reasons (Upshall + 2nd for Carcillo, Gagne for Walker). Although one other horrible one was trading a 1st for Eminger. Yuck.

[Mad Dog]

Aziz' laundry list says it all.

Josh Gratton, Matt Walker, Pavel Kubina, Ned Lukacevic, Jaroslav Modry, Danny Syvret, Patrick Hersley, Matt Ford, Rob Bordson, Gervais Foster, Emminger fiasco, Bob fiasco, just signing Timonen to an unimaginable contract... my God what a total, utter array of stiffs. I am giving him an out for Bryz since that was all The Old Man's doing.

What more evidence do people need to see that Homer is running this franchise to the ground? We are in this pitiful situation almost exlcisvely thanks to the incompetence of the front office.

[flyercanuck]

@pensuck - as much as I was a Pronger fan before the trade, that one will probably always bother. We gave Anaheim more than they gave Edmonton.

I don't blame him for Bryzgalov, that was Snider's doing. In general I think his good trades have significantly outnumbered his bad ones. Some of the real bad ones were forced for salary cap reasons (Upshall + 2nd for Carcillo, Gagne for Walker). Although one other horrible one was trading a 1st for Eminger. Yuck.

Who's responsible for the salary cap?

[Samifan]

what about the fact that Homer hands out full No Movement Clauses like the dude handing out flyers for strip clubs along the Las Vegas strip.

[canoli]

can't rem if these were Clarke's or Homer's but bringing in Darien Hatcher and Mike Rathje right after the Big Change in the NHL...when it was obvious their style of play would be penalized more often than rewarded.

the ones everyone else mentioned - Eminger is probably the stupidest one of all.

Signing Leighton - the 1st time, I'll give him a pass but the 2nd time was just unforgivable. And idiotic.

and then the Bob Fiasco and the BryzASTER that forced it

[DaGreatGazoo]

Also, don't forget another reason Bob was traded, was because Homer failed to monitor his NHL games/waiver rules, so he played 1 too many games to be sent to the AHL. If that doesn't happen, it's possible Bob plays a year in the AHL..is still in the organization, and Bryz is bought out prior to this year.

One mistake compounded by a worst mistake....Homer's ongoing legacy.

Pitt fans must just LOVE today. There team is a powerhouse, Flyers are missing the playoffs, and we are all ready to drive to Philly and start a mob.

[FD19372]

Aziz' laundry list says it all.

Josh Gratton, Matt Walker, Pavel Kubina, Ned Lukacevic, Jaroslav Modry, Danny Syvret, Patrick Hersley, Matt Ford, Rob Bordson, Gervais Foster, Emminger fiasco, Bob fiasco, just signing Timonen to an unimaginable contract... my God what a total, utter array of stiffs. I am giving him an out for Bryz since that was all The Old Man's doing.

What more evidence do people need to see that Homer Snider is running this franchise to the ground? We are in this pitiful situation almost exlcisvely thanks to the incompetence of the front office.

Snider has been the puppet master in many of these deals. All of the sudden he goes on TV, basically saying the goaltending wasn't acceptable and they get Bryz. Once Snider gets interviewed by one of the local networks, and says our D isn't acceptable, Homer will run to fix it. The problem is Snider probably thinks his defense is capable of being better than what it is. It isn't. The problem is their talent evaluation. They don't know how to fix it. Any of us could try and tell them what they need to do, but you know, we fans don't know anything about hockey .

[flyercanuck]

@canoli

The giant pylons were Clarkes moves.

[JackStraw]

Who's responsible for the salary cap?

Bettman!

(I didn't mean to suggest that Homer was a whiz kid with cap)