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Time to play GM...... aka What to do now?


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I almost forgot Jared Spurgeon who wasn't even drafted and played his first season at 21 is all of 5' 9" 175.....so it can be done. So will  Ghsot will succeed i just know it. 

 

I think we're arguing different things here :)

 

I agree that Ghost can be an excellent NHLer. Size is less important now than it was in the mid-90s. He seems to have great speed and hockey sense.

 

What I did say is that Ghost - and I will add Spurgeon - will never be franchise cornerstones like a Pronger, Chara, Weber, Suter, Pietrangelo. Size is a prerequisite to become that kind of complete defenseman so coveted by teams.

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@brelic

 

Sadly, I agree...I don't see a significant overhaul.  IF nothing changes then we are looking at the same defense we had this year.  Homer has really painted himself into a corner with all the dumb contracts he has handed out.

 

Agree...Niskanen will command alot of $$$$.  He definitely would be an upgrade. 

 

It will be hard to stomach another season with such a medicore defense as this.  (If there are no changes)

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I will take some heat for this comment but I am a fan of Grossmann. He plays within himself and doesnt try to play outside of his game. Grossmann is a physical presence and a good shot blocker. He also played with an injured foot/ankle the last few weeks of the season. He's locked in @ $3.5 mil the next two years which seems pretty reasonable. If they move him, it better be for a physical/stay home style d-man at the same cost.

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@brelic

@murraycraven

 

I looked at the UFA D-men. 

http://mynhltraderumors.com/free-agents/2014-nhl-free-agents-unrestricted-defenseman/

 

Who do you want to try to get?

  • Matt Niskanen (Pens) -he looks pretty solid, think he can be lured away from the Pens.  Pens might make him a priority especially considering the health of Letang is in question.
  • RFA - Nick Schultz (Oilers) - I don't watch the Oilers that much.  I know at one time he was highly touted.  How was his play has year?  Is he worth trying to pursue or witll the Oilers try to wrap him up quickluy?
  •  Henrik Tallinder (Sabres) - Just a thought?
  • Joni Pitkanen (Hurricanes) - I know dare I say a Flyers retread?
any other better ideas? 

 

Ok....who wants to sends brelic's idea to Hexy / Homer / Snider!  ;)

 

Doco,

I think you mean Justin Schultz.  I heard/read Oilers fans complaining about his soft play this year.  He only had 30 hits in 74 games this year.  45 hits in 122 NHL games in his career.  Soft.  No thanks.

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Doco,

I think you mean Justin Schultz.  I heard/read Oilers fans complaining about his soft play this year.  He only had 30 hits in 74 games this year.  45 hits in 122 NHL games in his career.  Soft.  No thanks.

 

oops my bad...thanks for the correction...

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I am totally on board with this. I think there needs to be an upgrade to the defense. Gost will not be ready and needs time in the A. Add one dman and I think this could be the lineup.

This is not a "given"

Tory Krug did not need much time in the A...Guys coming from the NCAA adapt better to making the "jump" to the NHL Than all but the most special junior players IMO . They are not 18 and have been living more independently than a junior player. With his ability I don't see where there are 6 guys in our system that are better. He should not be counted on to be the savior in the next year or two but he could be a strong candidate to make the team.

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I will take some heat for this comment but I am a fan of Grossmann. He plays within himself and doesnt try to play outside of his game. Grossmann is a physical presence and a good shot blocker. He also played with an injured foot/ankle the last few weeks of the season. He's locked in @ $3.5 mil the next two years which seems pretty reasonable. If they move him, it better be for a physical/stay home style d-man at the same cost.

 

I don't dislike Grossmann either. I'm just suggesting that if they want to open up a spot for Gus or Ghost, someone needs to be moved given that Timo seems likely to return. There are simply no open spots.

 

I doubt they are moving Luke, and I'm not sure you'd get much in return for him. Grossmann should get you something decent, like a middle round draft pick or a depth prospect.

 

Let me ask you this. Would you be happy with the following defense?

 

Timo/Coburn

Streit/Grossmann

Schenn/MacDonald

 

Because if we do nothing, that's what we have.

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Let me ask you this. Would you be happy with the following defense?

 

Timo/Coburn

Streit/Grossmann

Schenn/MacDonald

 

Because if we do nothing, that's what we have.

 

 

No...it is what we had this year....and the majority agree we needed to improve the blue line.  If we go into next season with that corps on the Blue LIne I will be disappointed.  We should expect similiar results.  I appreciate Kimmo being stoic and wanting to play 1 more season yet again, but it is time to move on.

Edited by pilldoc
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This is not a "given"

Tory Krug did not need much time in the A...Guys coming from the NCAA adapt better to making the "jump" to the NHL Than all but the most special junior players IMO . They are not 18 and have been living more independently than a junior player. With his ability I don't see where there are 6 guys in our system that are better. He should not be counted on to be the savior in the next year or two but he could be a strong candidate to make the team.

Not saying it is a given my mojo... But most likely probable that he is in the A next season.

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I saw this bit in the paper this morning:

 

"To me, we can win a Stanley Cup with the core that's there right now," he said, including forwards Claude Giroux, Matt Read, Wayne Simmonds, Jake Voracek, and Sean Couturier. "I certainly would like to keep that core together for a number of years."
Notice the bolded part that does *not* include Brayden Schenn. Is that editorializing on Carchidi's part, or is he summarizing what Snider actually said? If it's the latter, it's telling that Snider would leave out Schenn. I don't think that's accidental.
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@brelic

 

Very interesting pick up brelic.  That certainly raises some eyebrows.  Then again how much do we "really" trust the Flyers beat writers.  The main question is do the Flyers let another year go by to see if B. Scheen improves upon his potential?  Or does this mean they "might" soon be actively shopping B.Schenn? 

 

Very interesting development.  Gonna have to watch this closely to see what happens.

 

thanks for the insight.....

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I saw this bit in the paper this morning:

 

"To me, we can win a Stanley Cup with the core that's there right now," he said, including forwards Claude Giroux, Matt Read, Wayne Simmonds, Jake Voracek, and Sean Couturier. "I certainly would like to keep that core together for a number of years."
Notice the bolded part that does *not* include Brayden Schenn. Is that editorializing on Carchidi's part, or is he summarizing what Snider actually said? If it's the latter, it's telling that Snider would leave out Schenn. I don't think that's accidental.

 

 

 

Maybe Uncle Ed left Schenn out because he is a RFA?

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@Samifan

@pilldoc

 

Maybe it's nothing. Or maybe it's their way of conditioning the fans to accept that Schenn is not part of the core. If he gets moved, they can say "yes, he is a young player with a lot of potential, but we needed to address the top line winger situation and we did so by keeping the core intact. So please welcome the newest member of the Flyers, Evander Kane."

 

;)
 

Any chance that would mean G/Coots/Laughton/VLC down the middle? I would honestly put VLC on the 4th line before any of those 3, including the guy with 5 games of NHL experience.

 

Of course, that's why I'm not a real coach :)

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I think we're arguing different things here

 

No i'm not arguing your point i agree about Ekblad kid with his skill set don't come along often.

 

I am just reluctant to include him is all...like for example what better future shutdown duo could you imagine than #1 Ekblad a right handed shot a BIG bruiser with a cannon (could be our version of Weber ) paired WITH #2 Ghost a left handed shot puck rusher with a laser from the point.

 

Those two could easily become the best defensive duo in Flyers history and the ceiling to become the best two in all of the NHL in i don't know how long.

 

Ok i just woke up where was i??????  :D

 

I would let you chose from anyone else....anyone..except Giroux....and then if that doesn't get i done then we could discuss him but he is part of my dynamic duo....there is no Batman without Robin....right?

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No...it is what we had this year

 

Exactly...no....change is needed i fully expect barring a set back right or wrong for Homer to give Ghost every opportunity to make the team out of camp kid will be 21 like someone said not 18 out of junior certainly.

 

Hell when i was his age i had just came back from over seas with 18 months in Iraq and up down the Suez canal under my belt during Iraq war so he'll be fine....i mean the kid in the BIGGEST game of his life up until this point in the title game was a +7 and wasn't on the ice for none of the goals scored(one of the best performances i've ever seen from a kid his age period)...not going to be much more pressure than that.

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I am just reluctant to include him is all...like for example what better future shutdown duo could you imagine than #1 Ekblad a right handed shot a BIG bruiser with a cannon (could be our version of Weber ) paired WITH #2 Ghost a left handed shot puck rusher with a laser from the point.

 

I think those two could be a great 1/2 punch for sure! The issue is that I don't think Florida parts with its #1 unless it gets the top defensive prospect in our stable, which right now happens to be Ghost. 

 

Let's say the Flyers had the #1 overall. Would you give up a chance at Ekblad for anything less than another team's absolute top prospect???

 

Top overall picks have the potential to completely change the direction of a franchise. Crosby, Stamkos, MacKinnon, Jones. We're talking about elite players. You do not give those up without getting a King's ransom return.

 

Given what you know about Ghost and Ekblad, it seems clear that you choose to keep Ghost over Ekblad in any scenario. You do not want to part with Ghost. 

 

I would give him up in a second for a chance at Ekblad. 

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Very interesting pick up brelic.

 

And this one too....

 

On Vincent Lecavalier:

 

I think Lecavalier will have a great year next year.  He got off to a bad start with injuries, never found his groove.  That's something the hockey guys are going to have to figure out.  He's a good, good hockey player.  He got 20 goals with all the problems.

 

Craig Berube had trouble finding him a spot.

 

Basically he did have a problem this year, but it's got to be solved before next year.  There's all kinds of things that can happen.  It's ridiculous to speculate, but Lecavalier is not a fourth-line center and we don't want him to be.  But that's going to be up to the coach and the hockey department to figure out how to work that out.

 

Was he injured?

 

He was injured, yeah. Early in the year.  As far as lately... obviously it affected him, let's put it that way.  He wasn't injured when he was playing.  We wouldn't have allowed him to play.

 

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2014/5/2/5676460/ron-hextall-flyers-general-manager-paul-holmgren-ed-snider-quotes

 

Got to read between the lines they are basically saying there was no room for Vinny they will have to make room!!!!!! That is what i read.

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I think those two could be a great 1/2 punch for sure! The issue is that I don't think Florida parts with its #1 unless it gets the top defensive prospect in our stable, which right now happens to be Ghost. 

 

Let's say the Flyers had the #1 overall. Would you give up a chance at Ekblad for anything less than another team's absolute top prospect???

 

Top overall picks have the potential to completely change the direction of a franchise. Crosby, Stamkos, MacKinnon, Jones. We're talking about elite players. You do not give those up without getting a King's ransom return.

 

Given what you know about Ghost and Ekblad, it seems clear that you choose to keep Ghost over Ekblad in any scenario. You do not want to part with Ghost. 

 

I would give him up in a second for a chance at Ekblad. 

 

Yes. So Morin was a first rounder Ghost a 3rd. So give them Morin. Done. I'd include Coburn, Brayden Schenn, even Gus and a the 17th pick!!!!! :ph34r:

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And this one too....

 

On Vincent Lecavalier:

 

I think Lecavalier will have a great year next year.  He got off to a bad start with injuries, never found his groove.  That's something the hockey guys are going to have to figure out.  He's a good, good hockey player.  He got 20 goals with all the problems.

 

Craig Berube had trouble finding him a spot.

 

Basically he did have a problem this year, but it's got to be solved before next year.  There's all kinds of things that can happen.  It's ridiculous to speculate, but Lecavalier is not a fourth-line center and we don't want him to be.  But that's going to be up to the coach and the hockey department to figure out how to work that out.

 

Was he injured?

 

He was injured, yeah. Early in the year.  As far as lately... obviously it affected him, let's put it that way.  He wasn't injured when he was playing.  We wouldn't have allowed him to play.

 

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2014/5/2/5676460/ron-hextall-flyers-general-manager-paul-holmgren-ed-snider-quotes

 

Got to read between the lines they are basically saying there was no room for Vinny they will have to make room!!!!!! That is what i read.

 

so does 1+1 =2 ?  who is gonna be moved to do that?

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Yes. So Morin was a first rounder Ghost a 3rd. So give them Morin. Done. I'd include Coburn, Brayden Schenn, even Gus and a the 17th pick!!!!! :ph34r:

 

Well, I would include those guys too, but they're all ok players... not sure Florida would entertain that package. And Morin is not our best defensive prospect. He's projected as a 2nd pairing defenseman. I think Ghost is projected in the same area (his HF rating is not that great actually... a 7.0C which is 2nd pairing/3rd pairing territory), but I think he's got more hype in terms of value right now because of the Frozen Four.

 

In any case, I think there's a 0.01% chance that Florida trades their 1st overall, let alone to the Flyers.

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And this one too....

 

On Vincent Lecavalier:

 

I think Lecavalier will have a great year next year.  He got off to a bad start with injuries, never found his groove.  That's something the hockey guys are going to have to figure out.  He's a good, good hockey player.  He got 20 goals with all the problems.

 

Craig Berube had trouble finding him a spot.

 

Basically he did have a problem this year, but it's got to be solved before next year.  There's all kinds of things that can happen.  It's ridiculous to speculate, but Lecavalier is not a fourth-line center and we don't want him to be.  But that's going to be up to the coach and the hockey department to figure out how to work that out.

 

Was he injured?

 

He was injured, yeah. Early in the year.  As far as lately... obviously it affected him, let's put it that way.  He wasn't injured when he was playing.  We wouldn't have allowed him to play.

 

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2014/5/2/5676460/ron-hextall-flyers-general-manager-paul-holmgren-ed-snider-quotes

 

Got to read between the lines they are basically saying there was no room for Vinny they will have to make room!!!!!! That is what i read.

 

Interesting post, OR. Sounds like more preparation to get rid of Schenn.

 

I wonder if Winnipeg would entertain the Schenns+ for Bogosian and Kane? Not sure what the "+" would be, but it would be swapping two struggling/unhappy players in the Peg for two underwhelming players in Philly.

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That quote leads me to believe Vinny was playing "hurt", but not " injured". Basically, he got McCrossin'd.

How exactly is one not injured, but affected??? It was not a mental issue in my opinion, and therefore makes the statement very very interesting.

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@brelic

 

Sadly, I agree...I don't see a significant overhaul.  IF nothing changes then we are looking at the same defense we had this year.  Homer has really painted himself into a corner with all the dumb contracts he has handed out.

 

Agree...Niskanen will command alot of $$$$.  He definitely would be an upgrade. 

 

It will be hard to stomach another season with such a medicore defense as this.  (If there are no changes)

 

 

I look at it one of 2 ways here. We either go for broke or we accept that we're rebuilding and bring up some green prospects. People get their panties in a bunch when suggesting bringing up Morin or Ghost. I say, bring them both up. F it. let 'em play out the season and get the experience. Take our lumps and let em learn. Re-sign Timo cheaply as possible. Hope Gus can step up and that GrossmanN can get and stay healthy. Accept that we're NOT winning a cup in 2015. 

 

If we're not going to do that... then we need to drop some money. Niskanen can be had and all we have to do is sign him to another Homer contract™. Overpay now for the immediate upgrade and gamble of a solid D man for years to come. Go for Moulson or Vanek on the FA and try to make some moves for salary space. Gotta dump VLC and/or Hartnell. Get picks, get some low level prospects.. maybe even some pucks. 

 

ORRR... make a big splash. Send Schenn, Ghost and VLC with cash to Nashville for Weber. Which option sounds more Flyers to you? 

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