flyercanuck Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 I'm with Aziz here too.. I'll try to expand later when I get to a lapdance or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canoli Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 it's easy to say the forwards were "the problem" when none of them scored more than a few points in 7 games. But when your D men (and the fwds to some extent) continually mismanage the puck it's awfully hard to establish a forecheck, much less get into some kind of scoring groove. So many shifts wasted, spent defending, chasing, scrambling. That sh-- wears you down over a game, over a series. Credit goes to the Rangers pressure but the Flyers made it way too easy for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 Jokinen hit 30/60 with Carolina (and then dropped to essentially 20/50). Could he get back there with Giroux centering him? Maybe? All comes down to cost - I don't expect to see Jussi in O&B. It's something I'd be willing to take a chance on if the money was right. G is legit and Jake is claiming, so it's not crazy to think maybe he could. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 it's easy to say the forwards were "the problem" when none of them scored more than a few points in 7 games. But when your D men (and the fwds to some extent) continually mismanage the puck it's awfully hard to establish a forecheck, much less get into some kind of scoring groove. So many shifts wasted, spent defending, chasing, scrambling. That sh-- wears you down over a game, over a series. Credit goes to the Rangers pressure but the Flyers made it way too easy for them.I felt like the forwards lost a lot of races and puck battles vs the Rangers and if the defense was better / more mobile and confident a well timed pinch could have helped to maintain possession. there were too many 12 second forays into the offensive zone where the puck carrier is pressured and passes to an area that is unoccupied because the defensemen are more concerned with giving up the odd man rush than making an offensive play. Zero confidence in the ability to make the initial play to maintain possession and not enough speed to stop the odd man rush any way... so i'm with whom ever thinks the D needs some help.... i think that is you canoli . although I think i'm also supporting aziz's assertion as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aziz Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 i'm with whom ever thinks the D needs some help.... i think that is you canoli . although I think i'm also supporting aziz's assertion as well. Lol, I think you did a nice job there connecting the two. Agree with the whole post, well said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 Hmmm, not a bad plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 @doom88 Can't hurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canoli Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 there were too many 12 second forays into the offensive zone where the puck carrier is pressured and passes to an area that is unoccupied because the defensemen are more concerned with giving up the odd man rush than making an offensive play. Zero confidence in the ability to make the initial play to maintain possession and not enough speed to stop the odd man rush any way... good stuff Moj - esp this part. We saw this time and time again in every game except G6 when the D was able to advance the puck, not only quickly but with control, so that the forwards were in sync coming across center ice. G6 was the only game the Flyers were able to work the Rags' zone and forecheck. I'm guessing that G6 was also the only game the Flyers held the possession-time advantage. What was the biggest difference in that game compared to the rest? Besides Mason playing out of his mind I think it was the calm, deliberate passing by the Flyers' D-men. They had a lot of poise retrieving the puck and making smart, quick outlet passes. What a contrast to G7. I'm certainly not dismissing Aziz's point, and whoever else agrees with him. There's no doubt adding a ~70pt. LWer would help the Flyers immensely. Also, a guy like that is probably easier to find/sign than a >24min. D-man who can take charge of the Flyers blue line. I'll be happy with either/or; I only hope Hextall doesn't try to fill both "holes" this summer because I think that would likely take too much shuffling of the roster, the core guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 @doom88Can't hurt.Depends where you go and what you're in to Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 (edited) it's easy to say the forwards were "the problem" when none of them scored more than a few points in 7 games. I'm not trying to jump in the middle of you guys discussion just kind of agreeing with many points here but saying it differently. They struggled in their 5 on 5 play all season and early their PP was all they had to lean on. They went through many ups and down and had a tough schedule where in many stretches they improved the 5 on 5 play and the PP towards the end started slipping and then once the PP struggled badlly towards the end their confidence was shot. And then the 5 on 5 played tanked again and they just couldn't recover cause by the time the playoffs come around their complete game was struggling. They were still getting great goaltending and their PK was still outstanding but now they were gripping their sticks to hard and playing desperate chase the puck hockey never keeping it long which brought on the.....once you're in the O zone fire it from everywhere mentality. Resulting in high shots totals but actually results in poor quality shots. Perfect example the first round verse NY almost every game won the winner had the fewest shots on net. Why because like most things in real life it's really about quality than quantity. And combine that with Rangers playing with confidence and their system had success verse the Flyers and that killed their confidence. But everyone struggled at times in the series. The best guy was Mase. So i hope they learn from this experience. Anyways that is my 2 cents on it best i could do without singling out any one player or coach. Live and learn. Edited May 16, 2014 by OccamsRazor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackhole Posted May 17, 2014 Share Posted May 17, 2014 What I think would create the most improvement, and this is team wide, is passing. Its unbelievably easier to make plays when guys put the puck on the tape. If you have to corral the puck up to your stick, you've already lost the 'window' to shoot/pass or make a move. So many games this year, the passing was worse than I remember seeing from any flyers team in memory. I can't believe these kids have come this far as players because they can't make a pass, but somehow, the passing game has to be overhauled. Whether that's coaching/conditioning/positioning or a combo, I don't know. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted May 18, 2014 Share Posted May 18, 2014 All comes down to cost - I don't expect to see Jussi in O&B. No........but had they been patient with this guy who knows right... LW Brendan Ranford 22 is leading the Texas Stars in scoring right now with 8 gp 7 goals 1 assist +6 was a 7th in 2010. Sad they'll go out and find these guy and won't invest the time it takes to see if they'll pan out. http://theahl.com/stats/player.php?id=5064 just spitballing....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Interesting Stat: Jussi Jokinen has 6 career playoff GWGs in 48 games (1 per 8 gp). Only Nathan Horton has as many among active players in the same number or fewer games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 @OccamsRazor Ranford wasn't much of a skater. He's a smallish player who wasn't strong on the puck either. He had a heck of a season after Philly drafted him, but he came back to earth. I don't think we're losing much there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 @OccamsRazor Ranford wasn't much of a skater. He's a smallish player who wasn't strong on the puck either. He had a heck of a season after Philly drafted him, but he came back to earth. I don't think we're losing much there. I hope not..he is still 22 though and is playing damn well in the playoffs for the Stars and happens to be a LW and the Flyers are really weak at LW throughout the organization. Like i said he helped them bounce Grand Rapids scoring 7 goals and +6 in 8 games...pretty impressive even in the A. Just wouldn't want him to join the legions of other Flyer prospects that were given up to soon on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 @OccamsRazor Just looked up his stats...he had 12 goals all season in the A, then pops in 7 (to go with 1 assist) in 9 games...sounds like a lucky streak to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 Ranford wasn't much of a skater. Are you referring to Bill Ranford? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted May 21, 2014 Share Posted May 21, 2014 @Vanflyer I believe that's his uncle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyClarkeFan16 Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Jokinen would be a great fit on the Couturier - Read line. With that being said, he's going to look for a pay day and I doubt he signs for anything less than 4. If he could come in somewhere between 3 and 3.5, then it would be a good fit. You could bump Raffl to the 4th line with Laughton and Hall, move Hartnell to the second with Schenn and Simmonds and then put a guy like Akeson with Giroux and Voracek (yes, I'm a big Akeson fan and they need to make a spot on the roster for him - he earned it with his play in the playoffs). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Jokinen would be a great fit on the Couturier - Read line. With that being said, he's going to look for a pay day and I doubt he signs for anything less than 4. If he could come in somewhere between 3 and 3.5, then it would be a good fit. You could bump Raffl to the 4th line with Laughton and Hall, move Hartnell to the second with Schenn and Simmonds and then put a guy like Akeson with Giroux and Voracek (yes, I'm a big Akeson fan and they need to make a spot on the roster for him - he earned it with his play in the playoffs). So i'd be ok with this cause with your lines i see no mention of Vinny....so you traded him???? I like it make you GM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyClarkeFan16 Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 So i'd be ok with this cause with your lines i see no mention of Vinny....so you traded him???? I like it make you GM. Yeah, I'd trade Vinny. I mentioned in the Vinny thread that I'd consider Ryan Ellis or the rights to Michael Del Zotto for him or if it's with St. Louis, maybe a guy like Ian Cole. Just get that horrible contract off the books and into someone else's hands..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 Yeah, I'd trade Vinny. I mentioned in the Vinny thread that I'd consider Ryan Ellis or the rights to Michael Del Zotto for him or if it's with St. Louis, maybe a guy like Ian Cole. Just get that horrible contract off the books and into someone else's hands..... I'm ok with that but getting Vinny for next to nothing is maybe more like it a 6th 7th round pick i'd be ok with Preds only have 4 Dmen signed Ellis and Ekholm will be the first resigned, Del Zotto and his rights are obtainable but it will cost more or not they only gave up another Damn for him in Kevin Klein so it hard to call. It is highly unlike though anyone wants Vinny and that ugly contract....but hey maybe Hexy can work some magic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted May 23, 2014 Share Posted May 23, 2014 @OccamsRazor Seeing Vincent from a team with too many centers it's hard to believe anyone would want him. But there are teams where he'd be their best center, and plenty of teams where he'd be an easy #2. I want rid of that contract one way or the other, but i won't be that surprised if we could get something useful for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted May 24, 2014 Share Posted May 24, 2014 (edited) I want rid of that contract one way or the other, but i won't be that surprised if we could get something useful for him. I hope you're right i don't hate the guy but he doesn't really fit the defense first scheme and would just be better off with out him. I'd take just a salary dump for just some picks/players. Hexy has his work cut out for him. But if he comes back for another year it wouldn't be the end of the world. So body out there has to need his services maybe someone needing to get to the cap floor. Edited May 24, 2014 by OccamsRazor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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