Richards out of LA?!

[ruxpin]

@fanaticV3.0

 

 What controversy? I believe Sutter when I heard him say Richards was an important player to him in many different situations. I doubt any of those situations involve goalscoring, but he has plenty of others adept at that. I just don't think Sutter is much of a PC guy and basically calls it like it is.

 

Yeah, during regular season I wouldn't blink at this.  But in the playoffs I think he's smart enough and pragmatic enough to not throw a guy under the bus.

 

That said, if we were talking about a player who was dogging it or who was absolutely worthless, then yes, I could see him saying so, point blank, no questions asked, do not pass go.

 

But with Richards, I think the points made by you, by vanflyer, and by fanatic are valid that he IS contributing but has kind of fallen behind some other players in the pecking order.  So when Sutter says what he has he isn't lying but it is definitely spun in a positive way rather than simply saying, "eh, he's okay but we have so much better."

[fanaticV3.0]

Slice the bread any way you want to. I am not paying any player 5.75m a year as a forward to score 40 pts a year and be a two-way player (I don't care what your name is). 

 

I like Richards and he is a nice player. But it looks as if he is odd man out in LA and also on a decline. Perhaps its because they do not have a role for him there, who knows. 

 

As for Carter, you can not take a blind eye to look at his progression at 200 ft of the ice. 26 goals in 48 games last year. Led the team in GWG. Second on the team in GWG this year behind Kopitar. As a GM, I have no qualms paying 5.25 for that production and especially given his exceptional play this post-season in all areas of the ice. 

 

The premise of your argument make little sense.

 

You are lauding Carter's defensive play and down playing Richards' offensive play when Richards has already been at that level defensively (higher actually) for years and their offensive output is pretty close. Carter had 50 points this year and Richards 40. Career wise, Richards is actually a little better. Carter is playing more and Richards less. This isn't exactly an ass-kicker of an argument you've got here. If Carter's offensive numbers were so good they make you doubt you need the better all-around player, I see your point. Then we've got a conversation. Then it comes down to what do you value more? But aside from his current PO production, Carter isn't killing it offensively.

Edited June 2, 2014 by fanaticV3.0

[fanaticV3.0]

@fanaticV3.0

 

 What controversy? I believe Sutter when I heard him say Richards was an important player to him in many different situations. I doubt any of those situations involve goalscoring, but he has plenty of others adept at that. I just don't think Sutter is much of a PC guy and basically calls it like it is.

 

Yet he's playing less. Weird.

[brelic]

I am not paying any player 5.75m a year as a forward to score 40 pts a year and be a two-way player (I don't care what your name is). 

 

We're pretty much paying that now for a one-way player in VLC.

[fan4ever]

I think Richards has allot to offer still. But not 5.75M a year to offer for another 5 years. Not sure he has the wheels still, but Nashville could use a player like him and he knows lavy's system. He would be a good leader for the forward group. I haven't looked at their centre situation, so don't know if its feasible. Columbus also comes to mind. 

 

But wait Van....I wanted to ship VLC there.....could Nashville use both????????

[Vanflyer]

You are lauding Carter's defensive play and down playing Richards' offensive play when Richards has already been at that level defensively (higher actually) for years and their offensive output is pretty close.

 

Not at all. What I am doing is pointing out that Carter, who always has played 200 ft of the ice is doing it much better these days than in the past. Meanwhile, Richards has always excelled in the defensive play while putting up good offensive numbers. 

 

When you look at the big picture, particularly the Playoffs, Carter is doing everything that Richards does, but much better. 

 

During the regular season, sure, there is not allot of difference between 40 - 50 points. They both play nearly the same amount of minutes. Carters difference is that he gets about 2 minutes more a game on the PP. ES, same, PK, same. But at this point, 5-on-5, Carter is better. Its a fact. 

 

Don't get me wrong. I think Richards has value and produces. But I don't think he has 5.75m value for what he does. Maybe an off year, but I don't think so. Maybe injured, okay, I will give him the benefit of the doubt. 

 

Just put the shoe on the other foot and imagine that both Carter and Richards were on the Flyers performing exactly as they are now for the same salary. There would be a zillion threads about Ritchie being overpaid (Hartnell Esque and perhaps even VLC-esque). 

 

I am not trying to bury him, I just don't think he fits there- at 5.75m per year for even next year, let alone the next 5 years. 

[Vanflyer]

Career wise, Richards is actually a little better. Carter is playing more and Richards less. This isn't exactly an ass-kicker of an argument you've got here.

 

Career wise?? Are you kidding me?? Its what are you doing now? Carter is going to be runner up for the Conne Smythe if he keeps going the way he is and LA wins. Kopitar will probably get it (again if LA wins). Do you hear Richards name anywhere around that discussion? Me either. I hear crickets. 

 

So, when you talk about an ass-kicker of an argument, put that one to point. Add to that a 5.75m contract for a 41 pt two way player and my argument is very solid. 

[Vanflyer]

But wait Van....I wanted to ship VLC there.....could Nashville use both????????

 

For selfish reasons, I wanted to send VLC there as well. 10.5m is a bit rich for my blood for Nash. to take both. Ok, Richards to Columbus (oh the irony!!), and VLC to Nash! 

[Vanflyer]

We're pretty much paying that now for a one-way player in VLC.

 

LOL, so for 1.25m more, I could get 4% points better in FO circle, 4 more points scored and reduce my plus/minus by 8 for the same length? Thrumping my fingers on the table pondering. 

 

I would take Ritchie back at VLC's contract. Lets trade. 

[flyercanuck]

Yeah, during regular season I wouldn't blink at this.  But in the playoffs I think he's smart enough and pragmatic enough to not throw a guy under the bus.

 

That said, if we were talking about a player who was dogging it or who was absolutely worthless, then yes, I could see him saying so, point blank, no questions asked, do not pass go.

 

But with Richards, I think the points made by you, by vanflyer, and by fanatic are valid that he IS contributing but has kind of fallen behind some other players in the pecking order.  So when Sutter says what he has he isn't lying but it is definitely spun in a positive way rather than simply saying, "eh, he's okay but we have so much better."

 

The beating Richards has put on his body playing a big mans game in a not-so-big mans body has taken it's toll. He's certainly not your go-to guy when your team needs a goal. I can see Sutter playing him less in those situations.

 

 But he's still pretty responsible and reliable in a shutdown role. And I think that's what Sutter was alluding to when he brought up his importance. Goal scorers and setup guys will always get the glory, but good coaches know what type of players need to be out in certain circumstances, And I think Sutter is one of those guys who respects bluecollar type players, since his entire brotherhood made their living from their work ethic and not their skill.

[Vanflyer]

I would take Ritchie back at VLC's contract. Lets trade. I will throw in B. Schenn, Couturier and L. Schenn for Doughty as a sweetener!! :-P

[ruxpin]

 

I would take Ritchie back at VLC's contract. Lets trade. I will throw in B. Schenn, Couturier and L. Schenn for Doughty as a sweetener!! :-P

 

 

 

Just to be on the safe side, I'd throw in some actual sweetener.  Or something that has the same powdery texture and color as sweetener.

[ruxpin]

The beating Richards has put on his body playing a big mans game in a not-so-big mans body has taken it's toll. He's certainly not your go-to guy when your team needs a goal. I can see Sutter playing him less in those situations.

 

 But he's still pretty responsible and reliable in a shutdown role. And I think that's what Sutter was alluding to when he brought up his importance. Goal scorers and setup guys will always get the glory, but good coaches know what type of players need to be out in certain circumstances, And I think Sutter is one of those guys who respects bluecollar type players, since his entire brotherhood made their living from their work ethic and not their skill.

 

You're wrong. GFY.   

[Vanflyer]

 Or something that has the same powdery texture and color as sweetener.

 

There is plenty of that abound in both LA and Philly. I am sure something could be worked out- as long as its not baby powder. 

[ruxpin]

There is plenty of that abound in both LA and Philly. I am sure something could be worked out- as long as its not baby powder. 

 

Another reason Kane would have been a disaster in Philly.  They don't have that in Chicago.  Only baby powder (and mustard).

[brelic]

LOL, so for 1.25m more, I could get 4% points better in FO circle, 4 more points scored and reduce my plus/minus by 8 for the same length? Thrumping my fingers on the table pondering. 

 

I would take Ritchie back at VLC's contract. Lets trade. 

 

How about we trade Brayden Schenn and Simmonds to LA for Richards?

[Vanflyer]

Only baby powder (and mustard).

 

Hmmm, how does one ingest that?? Is it like a shot and a chaser type of thing?? 

[Vanflyer]

How about we trade Brayden Schenn and Simmonds to LA for Richards?

 

Pass. Schenn plausible, but the dollars do not equate. We are already short a solid LW, no reason to give our top RW back. The only deal that I would do (in seriousness) is VLC for Richards. Richards is not 5.75m worth, but if I have to watch VLC suck it on the ice for 4 more years at 4.25m, I can certainly handle watching Richards at least give it his all- whatever that may be. 

 

The problem is that its not fiscally responsible. 1.5m for what more? Its not an addition by subtraction trade, unless Richards resurrected himself. I would do it if Richards was to slot on second line C. Nothing more, nothing less. That puts schenn back down to third, which is fine (especially if Richards can give him tutelage on the nuances of defensive play). 

 

The question would be: would LA be interested in one problem (I mean that monetarily) for a lesser problem (monetarily) when they could just pull the chord and say cie le vie?  

[brelic]

Pass. Schenn plausible, but the dollars do not equate. We are already short a solid LW, no reason to give our top RW back. The only deal that I would do (in seriousness) is VLC for Richards. Richards is not 5.75m worth, but if I have to watch VLC suck it on the ice for 4 more years at 4.25m, I can certainly handle watching Richards at least give it his all- whatever that may be. 

 

The problem is that its not fiscally responsible. 1.5m for what more? Its not an addition by subtraction trade, unless Richards resurrected himself. I would do it if Richards was to slot on second line C. Nothing more, nothing less. That puts schenn back down to third, which is fine (especially if Richards can give him tutelage on the nuances of defensive play). 

 

The question would be: would LA be interested in one problem (I mean that monetarily) for a lesser problem (monetarily) when they could just pull the chord and say cie le vie?  

 

Haha, I was kidding! There's no way Richards is worth a Schenn and Simmonds, even with his Cup experience.

[ruxpin]

Pass. Schenn plausible, but the dollars do not equate. We are already short a solid LW, no reason to give our top RW back. The only deal that I would do (in seriousness) is VLC for Richards. Richards is not 5.75m worth, but if I have to watch VLC suck it on the ice for 4 more years at 4.25m, I can certainly handle watching Richards at least give it his all- whatever that may be. 

 

The problem is that its not fiscally responsible. 1.5m for what more? Its not an addition by subtraction trade, unless Richards resurrected himself. I would do it if Richards was to slot on second line C. Nothing more, nothing less. That puts schenn back down to third, which is fine (especially if Richards can give him tutelage on the nuances of defensive play). 

 

The question would be: would LA be interested in one problem (I mean that monetarily) for a lesser problem (monetarily) when they could just pull the chord and say cie le vie?  

 

 

Here's the thing.  With Richards' defensive accountability, he's way better than VLC (sucks) for me.  Is it worth 1.5M more?   No, probably not.

 

Assuming this is completely "what ifs?" what would you do with Couturier?  Doesn't he become fairly redundant with Richards back on the team?

 

I wouldn't bring Richards back unless he's already bought out by LA and wants to sign for $2.5M.   Not happening.  First, I would have to imagine there can't be a very good taste in his mouth toward Flyer management, although maybe Hextall helps that.  Second, as you point out, there's really not a viable spot for him.

[mojo1917]

I hope he winds up in Pgh with Pierre McGuire and they will a billion championships together.

[MadDevil]

If it was 2010 I'd love to have Richards on the Devils, but like others have said he's got a lot of mileage on him and looks like he's on the decline. Still, if he was bought out I might take a shot at him with a 2-3 year affordable deal. He did play for DeBoer in the OHL, so maybe there's a connection there.

[ruxpin]

Man, Richards is only 29 and we're all talking like he's 35 or something.

[Vanflyer]

I wouldn't bring Richards back unless he's already bought out by LA and wants to sign for $2.5M.   Not happening.  First, I would have to imagine there can't be a very good taste in his mouth toward Flyer management, although maybe Hextall helps that.  Second, as you point out, there's really not a viable spot for him.

 

Agree all points. And frankly, if he was to be bought out by LA (which is totally plausible, because anyway you slice, barring a miracle SCF, he is not a 5.75M player for 4 more years), he could find a much happier and welcoming home than Philly. As you point out, the last thing we need is another center (and I did not even mention Laughton which seems to be Richards 2.0 / redux sans the wear and tear / experience). 

[radoran]

Man, Richards is only 29 and we're all talking like he's 35 or something.

 

It's like players that are put onto a top line are more likely to get points or something...

 

Richards isn't going to beat out Kopitar, Jeff Crater is your prototypical second line center and he's not demonstrably better than Jarrett Stoll as a third line faceoffs/shut down guy.

 

That doesn't mean he's worthless (although it's arguable whether he's worth $5.75M - I wouldn't want to pay that) but it does mean - like VLC in PHL - there's not an obvious role for him on the team he's signed to.

 

I *really* don't care what happens to him, but he's got another five, if not ten, years in this league without missing a beat.