caluso Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 i read that umberger has a clause that he can be bought out. is that true? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammer2 Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 @caluso I don't think that kind of a clause would be legal, because it would circumvent other league rulings. You are only allowed the two compliance buy outs, spanning from last year to this year. I don't see how the league would allow a contract with that type of stipulation in it, and they are the ones that approve the deals....or at least the NHL's vast team of executive lawyers. They probably have their own law firm...legal bills must be astronomical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caluso Posted June 28, 2014 Author Share Posted June 28, 2014 @caluso I don't think that kind of a clause would be legal, because it would circumvent other league rulings. You are only allowed the two compliance buy outs, spanning from last year to this year. I don't see how the league would allow a contract with that type of stipulation in it, and they are the ones that approve the deals....or at least the NHL's vast team of executive lawyers. They probably have their own law firm...legal bills must be astronomical.i read he could be bought out for 2 million. i honestly don't know if such a clause is legal or not, but other hard salary cap leagues permit such things. hmmm.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 Every player can be bought out. If the Flyers bought out Umberger, it would be basically 1.5 million on the cap for the next 6 years. I don't know anything about this buyout clause, I've never heard of such a thing, and I don't see how the NHLPA would allow it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyS Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 Can he be stashed in the AHL so his salary doesn't count against the cap? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 Can he be stashed in the AHL so his salary doesn't count against the cap? I think so, since any NTC/NMC should have been voided by the trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 Can he be stashed in the AHL so his salary doesn't count against the cap? Yes but with the new CBA of his 4.6mill cap hit you would only 900K of it. I prefer to move Vinny and maybe GrossamanN if they can. I really can't see them trading for Umberger and then waiving him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 Every player can be bought out. If the Flyers bought out Umberger, it would be basically 1.5 million on the cap for the next 6 years. I don't know anything about this buyout clause, I've never heard of such a thing, and I don't see how the NHLPA would allow it. what are the cap ramifications? I mean if we can unload VLC and buy out umberger than we must be under. Bring Akeson to replace umberger and XXXXX my dog to replace vinny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aziz Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 what are the cap ramifications? I mean if we can unload VLC and buy out umberger than we must be under. Bring Akeson to replace umberger and XXXXX my dog to replace vinny. He said in the post, about $1.5mil against the cap for 6 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 He said in the post, about $1.5mil against the cap for 6 years. ok. So 1.5 and were are under the cap? What about contracts (ie. 50)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aziz Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 @Vanflyer i don't think it'd count against the max contracts. because the contract is gone. buyout window closes monday, btw. also, i think this is a bad idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 i don't think it'd count against the max contracts. because the contract is gone. yeah, we need a warm body there. I get that. But we just lost 2m that we thought we had in the pocket. Press on VLC. Personally, I don't get the urgency of moving hartnell now- otther than pressing a youngling harder. I will eat crow if Umberger scores 20g and 17a. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted June 28, 2014 Share Posted June 28, 2014 I don't get the urgency of moving hartnell now- otther than pressing a youngling harder. Let's see he was just mediocre on the PP with G and Jake....scored 1 even strength goal in the last 29 games of the regular season and into the playoffs where he scored zero in 7 games....he is a power forwards who skills when he is upright just isn't effective power forwards skills erode quickly sometimes. And the Flyers need to sell why his stock is high and are maneuvering to resign the other younger guys ins couple of years. Being proactive instead of like Homer being reactive i thought this is what people wanted cap management....that is what hexy is doing. After the upcoming next 2 seasons these guys will be looking for new deals: UFAs: Jake, Raffl, Coburn, Luke, GrossmanN (who i believe will be gone soon anyways) and as of yet not sure of the backup goalie situation but Mason will be on his last year of his deal RFAs: Brayden, Coots, Straka, Cousins, Alt, and then Stolarz will be on his last year of his ELC contract so he can be resigned during his last year of his deal. Now that is a couple years away and some of these guys pan be gone before then and some may not even pan out but the point is they have to start looking at this instead of getting there then trying to figure it out. Cap management................i know it seems like a foreign term in Philly i had to google it myself because it wasn't even sure what it meant...i can get use to it though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlaskaFlyerFan Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 What the hell are you guys talking about??? The Flyers aren't going to trade for a guy, turn around and buy him out. They've done some stupid stuff in the past, but that top them all. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 What the hell are you guys talking about??? The Flyers aren't going to trade for a guy, turn around and buy him out. They've done some stupid stuff in the past, but that top them all.BryzasterFiring Lavy at the beginning of the seasonBlowing Bobrovsky's waiver exemption prematurelyPronger's 35+ contractPursuing Ryan Suter AFTER he declared he didn't want to be in PhillyAnyway, are you sure that *really* tops them all? I barely warmed up with that list, and I'm an occasional optimist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caluso Posted June 29, 2014 Author Share Posted June 29, 2014 What the hell are you guys talking about??? The Flyers aren't going to trade for a guy, turn around and buy him out. They've done some stupid stuff in the past, but that top them all.that might be the EXACT reason they traded for him. especially, if the whole goal was to clear cap space.as i understand it, if they buy him out, it will only cost 2 mill against the cap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 (edited) that might be the EXACT reason they traded for him. especially, if the whole goal was to clear cap space.as i understand it, if they buy him out, it will only cost 2 mill against the cap. Yeah, but really, if they were to do that, why not just buy out Hartnell and let him go play where he wants (other than the years thing). Edited June 29, 2014 by Vanflyer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Yeah, but really, if they were to do that, why not just buy out Hartnell and let him go play where he wants (other than the years thing). Asked and answered. Remember those buyout cap hits are for twice the remaining contract length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Yeah, but really, if they were to do that, why not just buy out Hartnell and let him go play where he wants (other than the years thing). Yeah but they do that and they don't get a 4th round pick.....so other than that is doesn't makes sense....they have plans for Umberger i mean he was banged up last year and even had to deal with a broken finger. He is faster more disciplined and versatile than Hartnell he can be used and will be. I'm sure if he played all last season with G and Jake he could have produced way more than Hartnell. And he'll be upright waaaaaay more. But he be here this season and we won't have to speculate anymore we'll get to see first hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammer2 Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Ummby will be a good role player on this team, I really believe that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Ummby will be a good role player on this team, I really believe that. Just the difference in the two putting the team down shorthanded (Hartnell 77 PIMs differential) could have been the difference in home ice this past season between the Rangers.............it was real close. Flyers lost several 1 goal games throughout the season. It very well could have when you crunch the numbers the Rags finished with 96 points and the Flyers finished with 94 points are to not think the extra 77 PIMs didn't matter at all....3 points could have helped....right. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 Ummby will be a good role player on this team, I really believe that. I don't doubt that. And he actually proved that already when he played here in the past. But my question is... is that *really* why he is here? In other words, are role players what the Flyers are lacking the most at this point? I would say they need a bone-fide sharp shooter who belongs on the first line with G. As slow and clumsy as Hartnell was, he proved he can play with big-time players. If this roster remians the way it is (which, of course, we can guess is not the case), Umburger will not be playing on the frst line. There is just no way. Simmer would need to be pushed to the 1st line, which will make this essentially a one-line team. I can see the purpose of this trade being a salary dump. But if the Flyers are serious, they need to add skills to the offense. It's pretty evident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 As slow and clumsy as Hartnell was, he proved he can play with big-time players Being proactive instead of like Homer being reactive i thought this is what people wanted cap management....that is what hexy is doing. After the upcoming next 2 seasons these guys will be looking for new deals: UFAs: Jake, Raffl, Coburn, Luke, GrossmanN (who i believe will be gone soon anyways) and as of yet not sure of the backup goalie situation but Mason will be on his last year of his deal RFAs: Brayden, Coots, Straka, Cousins, Alt, and then Stolarz will be on his last year of his ELC contract so he can be resigned during his last year of his deal. Now that is a couple years away and some of these guys pan be gone before then and some may not even pan out but the point is they have to start looking at this instead of getting there then trying to figure it out. This mainly why he had to go by the time this rolls around RJ will be coming off the books....Hexy is planning ahead. Realistically barring a miracle the Flyers ain't winning no Cup next year, but that doesn't have to prevent you for planning for the future to position yourself for a run at one over the next 2-3 years. It's just my 2 cents and Hexy is planning for the future as well as next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammer2 Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 @OccamsRazor Totally agree, Hexy is making plans for the future, like he is gonna be here awhile. He's constructing the defense for years to come, while keeping a watchful eye on the current roster. One of the major things that should be on his list is seeing if both Alt and Laurisden fit into the future plans. The only way to do that is NHL playing time. Injuries happen, they will get their shots....but next year is critical for both of them. Really, we should already have an answer on Oliver, they messed up by not giving him enough big league starts last year. Another guy that is gonna make or break it based on next year is Cousins. He had a stinky first year in the pros and needs to show marked improvement to stay in the org. I was a little worried about how his skating would look in the AHL....hope it is not that that's holding him up, everything else can be worked on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted June 29, 2014 Share Posted June 29, 2014 (edited) Another guy that is gonna make or break it based on next year is Cousins He come on strong the last quarter of the season for the Phantoms i expect a good season from him next year for the Phantoms. Alderson to mak get a long look in preseason play he has NHL size already (6-3 190). Edited June 29, 2014 by OccamsRazor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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