Trainwreck, the offseason of the Detroit Red Wings

[yave1964]

@WingNut722

 

Weiss is working out in his attempt to recover from is second hernia surgery, back in April. He had a quote, I am paraphrasing, "going back to last year I knew I was in big trouble when in the opener I was trying to figure out if I would manage to play the entire game." so it is obvious that he didn't give us his best.

Weiss and Howard have to be huge. I still hope we sign Del Zotto and maybe David Booth as insurance (he could be had for next to nothing). Booth is a local guy and a former linemate of Weiss who scored 30 goals with Weiss setting him up. Low risk, potentially high reward.

[WingNut722]

@yave1964

 

Signing those types of players would be wise.  They can't really get any worse than depending on Kindl and Quincey.  Neither of them should be in Detroit.  Kindl has been around for several years now and has yet to offer any kind of solid, dependable, or even noticeable performance.  There's no reason to hang onto him.  Quincey is just a joke.

 

In general though, if we can't improve on defense, then we must improve on the offense.  The object has and always will be to score more points than the other team.  If we let in 5 per game, we need to be scoring six.   Kindl and Quincy produced a total of only 6 goals and were a combined -9 for the season.  

[jammer2]

  One defensive option that nobody has talked about is Ryan Spoul. He's only had one full season at the AHL level, which would usually mean he has to spend a least one, maybe 2 more years down in Grand Rapids.  That would be the usual Wings calling card....the kid is only 21. Having said all that, he does skate very well and has some offensive upside. He's 6'3 and has NHL size, although he does need to put a few pounds on his frame. He did have double digit goals in his first full year in the AHL....so maybe, just maybe Holland is thinking of utilizing this kid, if he is indeed ready for the jump. There is lot's of offensive upside and he can run a pp, so he has some skills that would be needed by the Wings this year. In the end, his play in his own end will determine his fate.

[J0e Th0rnton]

Yeah sorry about that. It seems Kessel's impression of Paul Bunyan scared the big guy out West.

 

He's sick of the dirty antics in the East, so he's off to bring his message of peace, love, child hugging, and the spirit of Christmas to the mighty West.

He said he picked up Scott to send a message.

I don't see how this is sending any message other than Wilson has a severe concussion.

 

Who gets suspended first on the goon line after they run the kings opening night?

Brown, Torres or Scott?

 

Rofl at the Sports illustrated headline

http://www.si.com/nhl/2014/07/02/sharks-descend-madness-sign-enforcer-john-scott

SHARKS DESCEND INTO MADNESS. SIGN JOHN SCOTT

 

Greg Wyshynski ‏@wyshynski

John Scott signs with the San Jose Sharks, presumably to punch the other 17 skaters in the face if they blow another 3-0 lead.

Edited July 9, 2014 by J0e Th0rnton

[WingNut722]

@jammer2

 

Sproul can absolutely be in Holland's back pocket, especially if the injury bug hits, but I think there are a number of capable defensemen with several years of NHL experience which we should try to get a hold of before we bring on a new rookie.  

[yave1964]

  One defensive option that nobody has talked about is Ryan Spoul. He's only had one full season at the AHL level, which would usually mean he has to spend a least one, maybe 2 more years down in Grand Rapids.  That would be the usual Wings calling card....the kid is only 21. Having said all that, he does skate very well and has some offensive upside. He's 6'3 and has NHL size, although he does need to put a few pounds on his frame. He did have double digit goals in his first full year in the AHL....so maybe, just maybe Holland is thinking of utilizing this kid, if he is indeed ready for the jump. There is lot's of offensive upside and he can run a pp, so he has some skills that would be needed by the Wings this year. In the end, his play in his own end will determine his fate.

Sproul has a booming shot, just wicked. I watched 25-30 Grand Rapids games last year, at least, the kid became more confident as time went on, An absolute laser, a big old Canadian farm boy, I think he needs another year in Grand Rapids, but I love his upside.

[jammer2]

@yave1964  Ahhhh, so you don't see him as part of the equation this year, huh....good to know. Maybe he earns an audition?

[yave1964]

@yave1964  Ahhhh, so you don't see him as part of the equation this year, huh....good to know. Maybe he earns an audition?

 I think that Sproul and Marchenko will be busting their butts to be the first call up when the inevitable injuries occur. Both are solid prospects, I think Marchenko is more complete at this point, but both are solid real prospects, good enough to where they ran Adam Almquist back to Europe. Oullet is good too, if a step below the other two. I think that Sproul and Marchenko (Barring severe injuries) will both get in about 15-20 games this year with both forcing their way into the rotation next season ahead of guys like Lashoff and Kindl. I like the ceiling for both of these guys, I just feel they are not quite ready yet to step in full time.

[J0e Th0rnton]

 I think that Sproul and Marchenko will be busting their butts to be the first call up when the inevitable injuries occur. Both are solid prospects, I think Marchenko is more complete at this point, but both are solid real prospects, good enough to where they ran Adam Almquist back to Europe. Oullet is good too, if a step below the other two. I think that Sproul and Marchenko (Barring severe injuries) will both get in about 15-20 games this year with both forcing their way into the rotation next season ahead of guys like Lashoff and Kindl. I like the ceiling for both of these guys, I just feel they are not quite ready yet to step in full time.

That's ridiculous. If they play more than 9 games, it burns a year on their entry level contract. Most managers are only letting them play 9 games to save an entry level year and cap space later

[yave1964]

That's ridiculous. If they play more than 9 games, it burns a year on their entry level contract. Most managers are only letting them play 9 games to save an entry level year and cap space later

  I know what you are saying, based off of our current roster situation I believe both will get 15-20 games of NHL experience. I know what you are saying, neither are going to make the opening day roster barring a trade but both are solid NHL prospects deserving a shot. With the depth (albeit mediocre depth) the Wings have, when the inevitable injuries occur on the blue line they will both get their time in.

[WingNut722]

@yave1964  @J0e Th0rnton  @jammer2  

 

To add further fuel to this bonfire...Ken Holland just re-signed Dan Cleary to a one-year contract. No details yet as to the terms, but it seems as if he's keeping his word to ol' number 11, I mean number 71, I mean.... 

 

This is a total disaster.  I can't imagine how much effort and negotiation has gone to securing the mediocre services of a broken down winger.  A few years ago, I would have been in favor of this deal.  Cleary was a grinder.  His numbers weren't always impressive but he always pushed the limits, gave 110%, was particularly capable in board battles for the puck and provided grit and leadership in the locker room.  This looks to me like Ken Holland is only keeping his promise from last season, allowing Cleary to come back one more year, and likely reimbursing him for the salary reduction.  With any luck though, Holland demanded a two-way contract and made it crystal clear that he has a standing reservation on the bus to Grand Rapids if Cleary doesn't come through big time.

[Commander Clueless]

So Holland may have just added insult to trainwreck with the Cleary signing...

 

Apparently he's getting a raise? Word is $1.5 million plus $1 million in bonuses.

 

This is just bizarre to me.

 

I mean, I understand them not doing so well in free agency so they need to improve the team internally, but why bring back guys like Quincey and Cleary? And not at all for cheap? I mean, if they were dirt cheap I could understand it for "veteran leadership" or something, maybe?

Edited July 10, 2014 by Commander Clueless

[J0e Th0rnton]

@yave1964  @J0e Th0rnton  @jammer2  

 

To add further fuel to this bonfire...Ken Holland just re-signed Dan Cleary to a one-year contract. No details yet as to the terms, but it seems as if he's keeping his word to ol' number 11, I mean number 71, I mean.... 

 

This is a total disaster.  I can't imagine how much effort and negotiation has gone to securing the mediocre services of a broken down winger.  A few years ago, I would have been in favor of this deal.  Cleary was a grinder.  His numbers weren't always impressive but he always pushed the limits, gave 110%, was particularly capable in board battles for the puck and provided grit and leadership in the locker room.  This looks to me like Ken Holland is only keeping his promise from last season, allowing Cleary to come back one more year, and likely reimbursing him for the salary reduction.  With any luck though, Holland demanded a two-way contract and made it crystal clear that he has a standing reservation on the bus to Grand Rapids if Cleary doesn't come through big time.

Our rebuild is going well.

 

Just resigned Hannan. He brings youthful ......oh wait....

 

OH, and we signed Michael Haley. Another goon. Maybe we are going to punch our way to the cup?

[yave1964]

@WingNut722@J0e Th0rnton

 

Dan Freaking broke down hasn't done nuthin for two years at least Cleary. The hits go on and on.

 

  On the bright side, Wilson beat Holland to John Scott. Heh heh heh. That is all I got.

 

I am still holding out for the Wings to sign David Booth and Del Zotto, but Holland is likely to bring back Darren McCarty and Rick Zombo instead.

[yave1964]

That's ridiculous. If they play more than 9 games, it burns a year on their entry level contract. Most managers are only letting them play 9 games to save an entry level year and cap space later

revisiting this for a minute. Agreed, most teams worry about burning a year on the entry level contract, but the last 4 Wings d-men to break in were:

Dekeyser 11 games rookie year.

Lashoff 31 games rookie year

Smith 14 games rookie year

Kindl 48 games rookie year.

 

  For whatever reason the Wings have never cared about such things. Maybe that is why they have made the playoffs since the first Bush administration. Other GM's worry about this type of thing, the Wings care about winning. At least we used to, until we resigned Quincey and Daniel Freankiin god dern I don't even want to say his damn name Cleary.

 

  Hey Joe, here is a trade offer for you. Dan Cleary for John Scott. Let me know what picks we have to throw in to make this happen......

[J0e Th0rnton]

revisiting this for a minute. Agreed, most teams worry about burning a year on the entry level contract, but the last 4 Wings d-men to break in were:

Dekeyser 11 games rookie year.

Lashoff 31 games rookie year

Smith 14 games rookie year

Kindl 48 games rookie year.

 

  For whatever reason the Wings have never cared about such things. Maybe that is why they have made the playoffs since the first Bush administration. Other GM's worry about this type of thing, the Wings care about winning. At least we used to, until we resigned Quincey and Daniel Freankiin god dern I don't even want to say his damn name Cleary.

 

  Hey Joe, here is a trade offer for you. Dan Cleary for John Scott. Let me know what picks we have to throw in to make this happen......

I'd take it if you throw in a 4th round pick. But only after opening night when we face LA during their banner lift. These signings suck, but I am a bit morbidly curious as to if Wilson plans to go full retard with goons that game to show the supposed tougher team mentality.

 

Dekeyser is the only one there that I hate the idea of burning a year of is ELC. ELC's are starting to become much more valuable in the Salary cap world and I think Dekeyser is going to be something great.

[Old School Hockey]

@WingNut722@J0e Th0rnton

 

Dan Freaking broke down hasn't done nuthin for two years at least Cleary. The hits go on and on.

 

  On the bright side, Wilson beat Holland to John Scott. Heh heh heh. That is all I got.

 

I am still holding out for the Wings to sign David Booth and Del Zotto, but Holland is likely to bring back Darren McCarty and Rick Zombo instead.

Not forgetting Lilja and Lebda!

[jammer2]

@Old School Hockey  Rick Zombo...now there is a blast from the past!

[WingNut722]

@Commander Clueless

 

It's pretty apparent that Cleary's raise was to make up for the paycut he took last year to remain with the team.  He's a favorite of Mike Babcock and I'm sure Babs put in several good words for him.  In an article in the Detroit Free Press this morning, Holland heaped praise and optimism on Cleary but did say that Cleary would have to earn his spot ion the lineup.  Holland is known for his loyalty and this signing is no different.  Kudos to him for sticking to his principles.  Based on Hollands comments, it seems that everybody knows where Cleary stands within the organization.  The favor has been repayed.  Nobody owes anybody anything anymore.

[jammer2]

@WingNut722  Apparently, when Dan came back to the fold last year, Holland promised him a spot on the roster this season. I'm sure they would have rather backed out, but hey....yeah never know, come playoff time, his experience might just come in handy. He's a bitch to play against when the going gets tough in the playoffs...a perfect 4th liner in that situation.

[J0e Th0rnton]

My worries for Detroit are a bit divided.

 

Personally, Detroit gets a lot of credit for their late draft blooming into much better players than ever expected. In a way, it is true. However, a huge factor was also that guys like Zetterberg and Datsyuk were learning from guys like Larionov, Federov, Yzerman, Draper. Kronwall learning from Lidstrom, etc etc.

 

It seems like they always had superstar two way forwards who learned from each other and how to blend the team style perfectly. Effectively.

 

I just do not see the next generation making that jump and learning from Zetter and Dats yet. Maybe it is too early and maybe some of them will have great seasons next year.

 

Granted, some Detroit fans thought the team was doomed when Lidstrom retired, but his loss, while it weakened the team, was barely noticeable in the standings in 2013. In 2014, it is amazing they even made the playoffs given how many injuries plagued the stars of the team. losing both superstar two way forwards for half the season would just cripple a lesser team. Testament to Detroit's Coach IMO.

[jammer2]

I just do not see the next generation making that jump and learning from Zetter and Dats yet. Maybe it is too early and maybe some of them will have great seasons next year.

 

 Call me crazy, but I think Nyguist ends up being better than Zetts (a reference to pure scoring production, not all round game type of thing). I don't think he'll ever outwork him, or play the same type of gritty blood and guts game, but he just might score more when it's all said and done. Wings fans must be looking forward to having Datsuyk and Zetterberg showing these kids the ropes. Those 2 would have invaluable insight, such as how to lead minus ego, how to dart into and out of scoring windows, depending on the match up. Just watching these guys practice would be an insightful learning experience.

 

 The only real thing to debate about Nyqvist is...will he be a star, or a superstar? He's certainly being put into the spot where he can learn, evolve and inevitably, succeed.

 

 There is a line I really want to see, hopefully the Wings throw it together during the pre-season....Daysuyk centering Mantha and Nyguist. Lots of speed, skill and smarts...wow would that ever be a fun line to watch!

[Old School Hockey]

What bad UFA year! Nashville did better than Detroit!