WordsOfWisdom Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 Well, the offensive explosion hasn't happened like so many (including myself) predicted. Thus far, it has been an implosion. I've been saying all along that the Penguins are a "top heavy" team: an amazing trio of forwards, but absolutely no "D". In a cap league, this type of mix doesn't work. You have to compromise everywhere else and the team becomes unbalanced. So onto the unthinkable question: Do you think one of the "big three" (Crosby, Malkin, or Kessel) will be traded before the deadline? (I say yes.)
ruxpin Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 On a strictly on-ice hockey level, I would not trade Crosby or Malkin. I'm not a fan of Kessel, but it's hard to argue with numbers. I understand the Cap reasoning and saying there's too large a percentage of cap on too few players, but I still don't think I trade any of these three. If I could move Letang, I would. I am not a Letang hater. He is a terrific defenseman with this glaring caveat: when healthy. I think you have too much tied up in him to begin with, and his health issues exacerbate that. I know you want a #1 defenseman in this league, but I no longer think he's that. If I'm a Pens' fan, my immediate question would be "but who do you replace him with?" I don't know. But you could probably find a healthy defenseman in the $3-$4.5 million range that gets you the sufficient mileage while being more dependable. And then still have some money to improve your bottom six or find another winger for the top six. I'd also take a look at Fleury. I don't think his salary is absurd. But if you can get out of that contract and do that position cheaper I'd take a long look at that. If you held a gun to my head and said "WHICH ONE OF CROSBY, MALKIN, OR KESSEL!" the answer has to be Crosby. It's Crosby they keep trying (unsuccessfully) to match people with. Maybe you finally just move the person who doesn't play well with others. That said, I'm still not a Kessel fan. I think he infected the rest of the team with his stink.
BluPuk Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 Absolutely. They are going to send Sid to the Leafs for Lou Lamorello and a box of Tim-Bits....
pilldoc Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 Great question...... Even after a coaching change they are stinking up the joint. This team is has too much talent to be this bad. Something has got to give. Maybe a major trade would shake things up. Maybe it is time to bench a player or two or decrease some ice time for others. At this juncture I would consider Crosby and untouchable since he IS THE FACE of this franchise. However, you can't rule anything out. I will tell you this, which is obvious to everyone, ..there is something really wrong with this club. (Not that I am complaining. As a Flyer fan I am enjoying this implosion). I do like/agree with what @ruxpin posted: It's Crosby they keep trying (unsuccessfully) to match people with. Maybe you finally just move the person who doesn't play well with others.That said, I'm still not a Kessel fan. I think he infected the rest of the team with his stink. I do think Kessel is a poison/cancer whatever term you prefer. Also it would not be the first time a super star was traded form his original team. Time for Pens management to start looking at themselves seriously and start asking some hard questions about themselves. I'm enjoying seeing Pens fans squirm a bit here and feeling restless. Some hard decisions are gonna have to be made soon. Has management / coaching staff already lost the locker room and players are tuning everyone out?
pilldoc Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 If I could move Letang, I would. I am not a Letang hater. He is a terrific defenseman with this glaring caveat: when healthy I would think Letang is immovable because of his contract and health issues, BUT see; Timonen, Kimmo (#warrior) Flyers to Chicago trade last year for a 2015 2nd pick and a conditional 2016 pick (which I think will be a 2nd) and I guess anything is possible.
Samifan Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 At this juncture I would consider Crosby and untouchable since he IS THE FACE of this franchise. However, you can't rule anything out. Gretzky was a god in Edmonton and he was traded, so yes anything is possible. Of the "Big 3" forwards, I think Franken-Malkin will be the one dealt if the Pens choose to make a move. He has been the most vocal about their struggles this year and IMO comes with less baggage then Cindy or the Cookie Monster. Plus if the Penguins trade Crosby, who will live in Mario's basement?
B21 Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 I say tank and go for the #1 pick. It's lottery protected (thank you, Toronto) and that strategy has led to three Cups already.
pilldoc Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 Gretzky was a god in Edmonton and he was traded, so yes anything is possible. Yup..I was thinking that very thing as I was typing that that sentence. I remember when that trade went..I was like wow....In retrospect the Oilers have never been the same after that trade except for a few years in the mid 90's.
ruxpin Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 I would think Letang is immovable because of his contract and health issues, BUT see; Timonen, Kimmo (#warrior) Flyers to Chicago trade last year for a 2015 2nd pick and a conditional 2016 pick (which I think will be a 2nd) and I guess anything is possible.I agree with all of that. I was thinking the first part of that. "If I could..." Contact or not and health or not, I have to think there are 10-15 teams that would include a first round pick in a package for him. If I'm Pittsburgh, I'm trading him solely for payroll/cap issues and an attempt to spread money to other needs. But health aside, I think he could still command a king's ransom. You just have to find someone with the cap space that doesn't necessarily have to send that space back in the trade. Or maybe you do get that back but now it's 2 more workable contacts. All of this said, I don't think they necessarily need desperate measures yet. I'm not trading any of those players willy nilly. But I'm probably at least listening.
ruxpin Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 I say tank and go for the #1 pick. It's lottery protected (thank you, Toronto) and that strategy has led to three Cups already. That's awesome. Well played!
B21 Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 That's awesome. Well played! In all honesty, if any one knows what the issue is I am sure Mario, JR & Co. are all ears. You can read 10 different articles and find 10 different reasons. I'm still with you - not time to panic....yet. It's a good team playing badly.
WordsOfWisdom Posted December 19, 2015 Author Posted December 19, 2015 That said, I'm still not a Kessel fan. I think he infected the rest of the team with his stink. It's amazing how teams seem to do better without him. (Boston winning the Cup immediately after ditching Kessel. Toronto being no worse off than they were last year, even though none of the players they acquired for Kessel have done anything of value in Toronto. It was essentially a give-away of our highest scoring winger in exchange for nothing and it still resulted in a lateral move. Amazing.) If you held a gun to my head and said "WHICH ONE OF CROSBY, MALKIN, OR KESSEL!" the answer has to be Crosby. It's Crosby they keep trying (unsuccessfully) to match people with. Maybe you finally just move the person who doesn't play well with others. If I'm GM in Pittsburgh, Malkin is the only one of the three I don't want to lose right now. He's the whole team. I'd be entertaining offers for Crosby or Kessel with the aim of landing a #1 defenceman (particularly an offensive defenceman). Or we do the "three quarters for a dollar" type of deal where you get a bunch of depth guys and part ways with one of the "stars". I'd do a deal like that in a heartbeat.
WordsOfWisdom Posted December 19, 2015 Author Posted December 19, 2015 Even after a coaching change they are stinking up the joint. This team is has too much talent to be this bad. Something has got to give. Maybe a major trade would shake things up. Maybe it is time to bench a player or two or decrease some ice time for others. At this juncture I would consider Crosby and untouchable since he IS THE FACE of this franchise. However, you can't rule anything out. I will tell you this, which is obvious to everyone, ..there is something really wrong with this club. (Not that I am complaining. As a Flyer fan I am enjoying this implosion). I'm enjoying the implosion too. I like seeing Kessel lose. It just feels good.
flyercanuck Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 Pens finally sent Sprong back to junior. Good job JR, way to burn a year off his ELC for nothing.
notfondajane Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 I say tank and go for the #1 pick. It's lottery protected (thank you, Toronto) and that strategy has led to three Cups already. Is there a McDavid or Eichel type player in this draft of 2016? How about 2017?
notfondajane Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 Great question...... Even after a coaching change they are stinking up the joint. This team is has too much talent to be this bad. Something has got to give. Maybe a major trade would shake things up. Maybe it is time to bench a player or two or decrease some ice time for others. At this juncture I would consider Crosby and untouchable since he IS THE FACE of this franchise. However, you can't rule anything out. I will tell you this, which is obvious to everyone, ..there is something really wrong with this club. (Not that I am complaining. As a Flyer fan I am enjoying this implosion). I do like/agree with what @ruxpin posted:The should have gone after the Nashville coach when he was available! This garbage wouldn't be happening! I still think this team needs a Scotty Bowman type coach! I do think Kessel is a poison/cancer whatever term you prefer. Also it would not be the first time a super star was traded form his original team. Time for Pens management to start looking at themselves seriously and start asking some hard questions about themselves. I'm enjoying seeing Pens fans squirm a bit here and feeling restless. Some hard decisions are gonna have to be made soon. Has management / coaching staff already lost the locker room and players are tuning everyone out?
JackStraw Posted December 19, 2015 Posted December 19, 2015 Is there a McDavid or Eichel type player in this draft of 2016? How about 2017?Just lose for Matthews... http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/meet-auston-matthews-the-next-next-nhl-draft-phenom/ The general feeling going into this year's draft seemed to be that if he was one week older he would have been taken #3 after McEichel.
Polaris922 Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 Sullivan has had TWO practices to make any changes. His interview said a lot a couple days ago when he voiced just needing some time to adjust the defense to his up tempo style. He had the offense generating 45 shotsvagainstbthe conference leading Caps. Nearly 50 games left, offense starting to move again... I am in the minority but I like the tempo I see. I think if they could get a couple practices in to make adjustments and trade Lovejoy for some Gatorade, and fire Tocchet they'd be just fine.
flyercanuck Posted December 20, 2015 Posted December 20, 2015 @JackStraw Or before Eichel...people were pretty evenly sided there. I'm not sure what would make me vomit more....the Pens or the Oilers winning the lottery.
flyerrod Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 and fire Tocchet they'd be just fine. This was mentioned in another thread. If you are not looking at the change in play. it might seem that they are still trying to get Tocchet fired too.
notfondajane Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Just lose for Matthews... http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/meet-auston-matthews-the-next-next-nhl-draft-phenom/ The general feeling going into this year's draft seemed to be that if he was one week older he would have been taken #3 after McEichel. let's see if that is Rutherford plan to draft this guy?! I was always under the impression that it was/ is the goal to win the sports most prestigious prize. Not to able to draft number 1!
notfondajane Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 @JackStraw Or before Eichel...people were pretty evenly sided there. I'm not sure what would make me vomit more....the Pens or the Oilers winning the lottery. I thought the Flyers would do that to you!
notfondajane Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Sullivan has had TWO practices to make any changes. His interview said a lot a couple days ago when he voiced just needing some time to adjust the defense to his up tempo style. He had the offense generating 45 shotsvagainstbthe conference leading Caps. Nearly 50 games left, offense starting to move again... I am in the minority but I like the tempo I see. I think if they could get a couple practices in to make adjustments and trade Lovejoy for some Gatorade, and fire Tocchet they'd be just fine. He would not do about our buddy Jim Rutherford?
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