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eleven24

Ghost as Rookie of the Year?

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We're giving away a GHOST BEAR shirt for every Shayne Gostisbehere goal in March

 

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Ghost is 20th in the NHL in scoring among defensemen. He also has played the fewest games among that group.

 

In terms of points per game, he is 5th overall. Even then, he plays 4-10 minutes less per night than the 4 guys ahead of him.

 

I'd say that's damn impressive for a rookie defenseman.

 

In my opinion, he deserves to be a top 3 Calder finalist. His performance is more impressive than Larkin and Domi, but behind Eichel and Panarin. McDavid is also nipping on the heels and I wouldn't be surprised if he finished top 3 in rookie scoring.

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11 hours ago, brelic said:

Ghost is 20th in the NHL in scoring among defensemen. He also has played the fewest games among that group.

 

In terms of points per game, he is 5th overall. Even then, he plays 4-10 minutes less per night than the 4 guys ahead of him.

 

I'd say that's damn impressive for a rookie defenseman.

 

In my opinion, he deserves to be a top 3 Calder finalist. His performance is more impressive than Larkin and Domi, but behind Eichel and Panarin. McDavid is also nipping on the heels and I wouldn't be surprised if he finished top 3 in rookie scoring.

 

Can't say I disagree with anything you said here.  The thing that sticks in my head though is the Calder Trophy is voted on by the Professional Hockey Writers' Association.  They aren't writing about any rookie more than #53 right now.

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You can thank the incredible run the Flyers are having, otherwise Ghost would not be the front runner at all.

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43 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Ghost has been a big part of that incredible run. So I'd say he's deserving of whatever credit he's getting.

 

Absolutely. He has 5 GWG, so is directly responsible for at least 5 wins. Considering all but one of his goals tied the game or gave the Flyers the lead, I'd say he's probably responsible for even more than that.

 

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6 hours ago, JagerMeister said:

You can thank the incredible run the Flyers are having, otherwise Ghost would not be the front runner at all.

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The 'Ghosts' of Flyers Calder Candidates past

 

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Rookies

 

 

No Philadelphia Flyers rookie has ever won the Calder Trophy. It is not that they have not had their share of viable candidates over the years. They've had a few top-end finishers in the balloting and  their fair share who've earned NHL All-Rookie Team selection honors after the season but never an NHL rookie of the year.

Could 

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 make history as the Flyers' first Calder winner? It's possible, especially if he continues to deliver in clutch situations over the remainder of the stretch drive. However, he has two factors working against him (and, no, being a Flyer is not one of them).

First, Gostisbehere is competing in a tough field of Calder candidates. He faces tough competition from the likes of 

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 (Chicago Blackhawks), 

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 (Detroit Red Wings), 

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 (Buffalo Sabres) and possibly even 

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 (Edmonton Oilers) despite the fact that McDavid missed 37 games with a broken collarbone.

Secondly, just as the missed time more likely than not will take McDavid out of the running among the Calder voters in the Professional Hockey Writers' Association,  the fact that Gostisbehere has only played 50 games to date due to starting the season in the American Hockey League (he was not recalled to the NHL until Nov. 14) and a brief injury-related absence could wind up hurting his candidacy just enough to push him down a notch or two on some ballots.

Whether he wins the Calder Trophy or not, Gostisbehere has undeniably had a spectacular rookie season. If he doesn't win the Calder, at least he'll be in good company among past Flyers candidates. Arguably, 

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 in 1972-73, 

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in 1979-80, 

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 (an older rookie at age 24 but still a Calder qualifier) in 1983-84, 

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 in 1986-87 and 

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 in 1993-94 had the most Calder-worthy seasons among the field of contenders during their respective rookie seasons.

Second-place finisher Barber in particular probably should have won out over New York Rangers forward 

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, while 1986-87 Calder runner-up Hextall won the Vezina Trophy but lost out in the Calder vote to LA Kings forward 

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. Propp was fourth in the 1979-80 voting, won by Boston Bruins defenseman 

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. Poulin placed fourth, behind Buffalo Sabres goaltender

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, Detroit Red Wings center 

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 and Hartford Whalers winger 

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. Renberg set a still-standing Flyers rookie scoring record and a strong two-way game, but finished third to New Jersey Devils goalie 

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 and Edmonton Oilers center 

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.

In 1992-93, 

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 missed 23 games his rookie season due to injury but still posted a big impact season (41 goals, 75 points, plus-28 in 61 games). That just so happened to be the same season that Winnipeg Jets 

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 exploded into the NHL with his 76-goal, 132-point rookie campaign, rendering the Calder race a landslide. Lindros finished fourth in the Calder vote behind Selänne, Boston Bruins center 

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 and Toronto Maple Leafs goalie 

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.

The greatest Flyer of them all, 

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, was also a fourth-place finisher for the Calder in 1969-70, trailing Chicago Blackhawks goalie 

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, New York Rangers forward 

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 and Blackhawks defenseman 

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. 

Goalie 

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earned the highest Calder finish -- third place in the Flyers' inaugural 1967-78 season -- among Philadelphia players in the early years of franchise history. Playmaking center

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 finished fifth in 1968-69.

In 1975-76, 

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 finished fifth in the Calder race after the Flyers made him the first overall selection of the 1975 NHL Draft. Flyers' defenseman, 

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 finished fourth in 1978-79. 

Flyers goalie 

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 was third in the 1978-80 vote, one spot ahead of Propp. 

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placed seventh in 1981-82. 

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 was fifth in the Calder vote and seventh in the Vezina Trophy race in 1982-83. 

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 took fifth place in the 1984-85 vote. 

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 came in ninth in 1990-91. Finnish defenseman 

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 was fourth in 1996-97. 

As the 2000s arrived, center/winger 

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 finished in fourth place in the 1999-2000 vote while teammate 

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 placed sixth for the Calder Trophy and ninth for the Vezina. Both players earned NHL All-Rookie Team honors. In 2003-04, defenseman Joni Pitkänen finished seventh in the Calder vote. 

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 placed in an 11th-place tie and Antero Niittymäki was tied for 15th in 2005-06, while neither 

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 nor 20-goal scorer 

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 placed in the vote tallies (it takes at least a fifth-place selection to earn a voting point). 

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 earned a single fifth-place vote to tie for 19th in the 2008-09 vote.

In the 2010s, 

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 received three fifth-place votes to tie for 11th in the 2009-10 race. The next year, Flyers goalie 

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 finished seventh in the Calder vote on the strength of four votes for second place and one for third. In 2011-12, 25-year-old 

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 took fourth place in the Calder vote (including three selections for first-place) while 

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, who was 18 at the beginning of the season, placed ninth overall on a single first-place, three picks for third-place, a single fourth-place and nine fifth-place selections. 

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 did not place.

The NHL All-Rookie team honor came into existence in 1982-83. Among the Flyers rookies who did not place in the Calder vote in their respective rookie seasons, there were two who still managed All-Rookie Team honors: defensemen 

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 in 1983-84 and 

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in the 48-game 1994-95 season.

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, at age 29, was too old to qualify for the Calder Trophy in his first NHL season (2000-01). However, he finished second in the Vezina Trophy race and fourth in the Hart Trophy balloting for NHL most valuable player.

Among current Flyers, goaltender 

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 won the 2008-09 Calder Trophy as a member of the Columbus Blue Jackets. He was also the first runner-up for the Vezina that year.

Bill Meltzer is a columnist for Flyerdelphia. Follow him on Twitter 

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And i ask myself how many of these calder candidates have taken their team from the bottom of the standings to now competing for a playoff spot now???

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8 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

And i ask myself how many of these calder candidates have taken their team from the bottom of the standings to now competing for a playoff spot now???

 

That's a fair point.

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There are the top 10 rookies by points for this season.  By pure stats alone, Panarin obviously sits on top, though McDavid is the only one who is going at a point per game right now.  For the amount of time he was out, it is pretty impressive how quickly he rebounded and racked up points.  

 

I think the biggest question is, who among these players made the biggest impact on their teams?  We obviously know the answer regarding Ghost.  The kid is the main reason we are toying with the idea of the playoffs this year.  Considering he has played less games than all but McDavid and he sits where he does in the top 10, and the huge impact he has had on his team, I think it puts Ghost in a very good position to possibly win the Calder.  Not saying he is any sort of lock, but if he gets the Flyers into the playoffs, I think his chances improve even more.   Even if he doesn't win, he is in some very good company within that list!

 

Fans from other teams or people who regularly watch all the games would have to answer for the impact and importance of the other players to their respective teams.  i admittedly only know about Ghost. 

Edited by Adamflyers
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Sadly, I think McDavid passing Ghost will all but kill any argument of Ghost putting up more points in less games.  At McDavid's pace he could very well end up 2nd or 3rd in scoring.  

 

Regardless, to me the +7 of Ghost is just as impressive as his offensive production considering the biggest knock on him is his defensive play.  3rd on the team in plus/minus behind Raffl and Couturier.  20 of his 39 points are on the PP, yet he maintains a +7 at even strength.

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1 hour ago, Adamflyers said:
 

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There are the top 10 rookies by points for this season.  By pure stats alone, Panarin obviously sits on top, though McDavid is the only one who is going at a point per game right now.  For the amount of time he was out, it is pretty impressive how quickly he rebounded and racked up points.  

 

I think the biggest question is, who among these players made the biggest impact on their teams?  We obviously know the answer regarding Ghost.  The kid is the main reason we are toying with the idea of the playoffs this year.  Considering he has played less games than all but McDavid and he sits where he does in the top 10, and the huge impact he has had on his team, I think it puts Ghost in a very good position to possibly win the Calder.  Not saying he is any sort of lock, but if he gets the Flyers into the playoffs, I think his chances improve even more.   Even if he doesn't win, he is in some very good company within that list!

 

Fans from other teams or people who regularly watch all the games would have to answer for the impact and importance of the other players to their respective teams.  i admittedly only know about Ghost. 

 

The other guy in the mix is Larkin, who by any measure, has had a Calder-worthy season: +18, 5 GWG, and the best even strength production of any on the list. If the Red Wings make the playoffs and the Flyers don't, how can you not say "Larkin helped do that"? Plus, he's such a beautiful player to watch.  Love his game.

Edited by Podein25

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3 hours ago, Adamflyers said:
 

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There are the top 10 rookies by points for this season.  By pure stats alone, Panarin obviously sits on top, though McDavid is the only one who is going at a point per game right now.  For the amount of time he was out, it is pretty impressive how quickly he rebounded and racked up points.

 

I think the biggest question is, who among these players made the biggest impact on their teams?  We obviously know the answer regarding Ghost.  The kid is the main reason we are toying with the idea of the playoffs this year.  Considering he has played less games than all but McDavid and he sits where he does in the top 10, and the huge impact he has had on his team, I think it puts Ghost in a very good position to possibly win the Calder.  Not saying he is any sort of lock, but if he gets the Flyers into the playoffs, I think his chances improve even more.   Even if he doesn't win, he is in some very good company within that list!

 

Fans from other teams or people who regularly watch all the games would have to answer for the impact and importance of the other players to their respective teams.  i admittedly only know about Ghost.


 

2 hours ago, Podein25 said:

 

The other guy in the mix is Larkin, who by any measure, has had a Calder-worthy season: +18, 5 GWG, and the best even strength production of any on the list. If the Red Wings make the playoffs and the Flyers don't, how can you not say "Larkin helped do that"? Plus, he's such a beautiful player to watch.  Love his game.

 

I think the other part of the conversation that is important is that all the players mentioned are forwards.  Ghost is doing this as a defenseman!  Forwards are always expected to score more points.  What Ghost has accomplishes is phenominal. Had he played all year he would start bordering on Karlsson type numbers.

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24 minutes ago, pilldoc said:


 

 

I think the other part of the conversation that is important is that all the players mentioned are forwards.  Ghost is doing this as a defenseman!  Forwards are always expected to score more points.  What Ghost has accomplishes is phenominal. Had he played all year he would start bordering on Karlsson type numbers.

 

 

And now he has been saddled with an AHL defenseman as a partner!!!:biggrin:

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I'll never understand how the league defines "rookie." I watched Duclair skate for the Rangers last year - sat in the stands, he was in a Rags' jersey, wearing skates and carrying (what appeared to be) a hockey stick. I was sitting in the 200s so I can't be sure. At any rate his impersonation of a professional hockey player was first rate.

 

6 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

And now he has been saddled with an AHL defenseman as a partner!!!:biggrin:

 

I figured out how McD got all his NHL contracts. Team GMs can't watch every play; apparently they only caught his good ones - he does make them. The problem is for every good play he makes 3 or 4 boneheaded, weak-ass stupid ones. In the Chi game I counted 4 simple, easy clears he should've made that instead ended up with Chi retaining possession and the Flyers on their heels.

 

"saddled" is exactly the right term.

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There are the top 10 rookies by points for this season.  By pure stats alone, Panarin obviously sits on top, though McDavid is the only one who is going at a point per game right now.  For the amount of time he was out, it is pretty impressive how quickly he rebounded and racked up points.  

 

I think the biggest question is, who among these players made the biggest impact on their teams?  We obviously know the answer regarding Ghost.  The kid is the main reason we are toying with the idea of the playoffs this year.  Considering he has played less games than all but McDavid and he sits where he does in the top 10, and the huge impact he has had on his team, I think it puts Ghost in a very good position to possibly win the Calder.  Not saying he is any sort of lock, but if he gets the Flyers into the playoffs, I think his chances improve even more.   Even if he doesn't win, he is in some very good company within that list!

 

Fans from other teams or people who regularly watch all the games would have to answer for the impact and importance of the other players to their respective teams.  i admittedly only know about Ghost. 

 

No matter who wins...that's one hell of a rookie class.

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From CBS Sports.......

 

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Here's the rest of this month's list.

1. Shayne Gostisbehere, Philadelphia Flyers (Last month: 4): Gostisbehere has been nothing short of remarkable this season and even though his overall production has slowed down a bit in recent weeks, he's still making a massive impact. The 22-year-old is often logging 20-plus minutes of ice time and has been deadly on the Flyers' power play. Of his 39 points, 20 have come with the man advantage. He's been as big a reason as any for the team's overall power-play success. Meanwhile, his 0.76 points-per-game marks the best scoring rate for a defenseman since 1992-93. Calder voters are starting to have to worry less about Panarin's age and more about Gostisbehere's total impact, which at this point appears to be higher.

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Ghost playing with Mcdud is killing his magic. I think it is time to find him another partner. Yesterday watching him play with Mcdud was the most lost i've ever seen him in Philly. Playing with a vet is suppose to give him some kind of security knowing he is out there with someone who understand their objective...

 

....and it is the complete opposite he looks like he has no idea what Mcdud is going to do or who he is covering.

 

Straight up Keystone kops out there especially in their defensive zone. If you don't want to screw his head up and ruin him for this playoff run you better separate the two...before it's too late.

 

But if you want to follow FC's plan and work on a better draft pick :cool[1]:then by all means keep the two together.

Edited by OccamsRazor

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1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

But if you want to follow FC's plan and work on a better draft pick :cool[1]:then by all means keep the two together.

 

Go ahead...mock me. :mad:

Next year when Provorov makes the team as a teenager you can remind how much more important a round of playoff hockey and a later pick would have been. :CelebratingSmiley2:

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Just now, flyercanuck said:

 

Go ahead...mock me. :mad:

Next year when Provorov makes the team as a teenager you can remind how much more important a round of playoff hockey and a later pick would have been. :CelebratingSmiley2:

 

 

HAHA  (i knew you would see that)....Provorov and next year i think are irelavant to the outcome of next year. Anyways my prediction of them being 9th in the East is looking right so they will still get a decent pick.  Dubois want be there anyways the Flyers don't suck enough he is expected to be off the boards by #7 any how.........

 

This young nucleus needs playoff experience. Giroux is all that is left from the Cup run!

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47 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Go ahead...mock me. :mad:

Next year when Provorov makes the team as a teenager you can remind how much more important a round of playoff hockey and a later pick would have been. :CelebratingSmiley2:

 

 

Some of the mocks i have seen have the Flyers taking Riley Tufte whom i'm not familiar with and i'd rather take Max Jones

 

 

 

 

 

from London instead what say you?

Edited by OccamsRazor

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    • 7
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        Ghost has been a big part of that incredible run. So I'd say he's deserving of whatever credit he's getting.
    • 6
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      You know, the other night I was leaving the local ice rink after practice and the game was on the TV in the lobby.  A parent of one of the kids I coach glances over and says "Ghost got another point tonight".  We then started talking about the kid, and how he has almost singlehandedly become the reason many are watching the Flyers again.  Just as we're saying that, Ghost makes a terrific defensive play by anticipating a pass, using his speed, and eliminating the chance the other way - all inside
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      When Ghost made that deke move at the blueline and then rang it off the post with around 5min left vs Winnipeg last night, you could see the confidence in him.  Just after that, on the same shift, Ghost was carrying the puck through the neutral zone aggressively attempting to deke the opposing defenders.  It wasn't a mark of a new-to-the-NHL kid.  It was confidence.   Which is why it surprised me that Hakstol didn't get him right back out out on the ice.  Surprised me even more when du
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      Ghost brought life to the Flyers team. He helped make them a playoff team, and is definitely one of the fun guys to watch in this league.    But if you're going to say McDavid didn't play enough games, can't the Panarin corner say the same about Ghost? Or do we draw the line where it conveniently suits us Flyer fans?   To me Panarin, as great as he is, played 6 seasons of pro hockey and had Kane playing next to him. He definitely had the most help, agewise and teamwise.

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