Ek rumor (e3) Sanheim and 3rd for Pacioretty

[AJgoal]

19 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

He stopped shooting as much in the same time frame and his goals have fallen off a cliff.

 

Not really. He had more shots in both 14-15 and 15-16 than he did in his 28 goal 13-14, and in fewer games. This past season is the huge drop in shots taken - with the exception of the lockout, he hasn't taken fewer than 220 shots since Richards and Carter were on the team. Part of that is decreased ice time, he averaged just over 19 minutes a game this past season, a minute and a half less than the three previous. However, he did take .023 shots fewer per minute this past season vs. the one before, a little less than half a shot per game. 

 

What has happened is his shooting percentage has fallen off. He was in the 11-13 percent range, averaging 12%, from his first full season in 2009-2010 until 20013-2014. In 14-15, he dropped to 9 percent, then to 7 percent this past year. There was no significant injury in the summer of 2014 (the exploding golf club was the year before, the surgery from Crosby the year before that), so I wonder if shot selection started to play a role then.

[King Knut]

2 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

 

Not really. He had more shots in both 14-15 and 15-16 than he did in his 28 goal 13-14, and in fewer games. This past season is the huge drop in shots taken - with the exception of the lockout, he hasn't taken fewer than 220 shots since Richards and Carter were on the team. Part of that is decreased ice time, he averaged just over 19 minutes a game this past season, a minute and a half less than the three previous. However, he did take .023 shots fewer per minute this past season vs. the one before, a little less than half a shot per game. 

 

What has happened is his shooting percentage has fallen off. He was in the 11-13 percent range, averaging 12%, from his first full season in 2009-2010 until 20013-2014. In 14-15, he dropped to 9 percent, then to 7 percent this past year. There was no significant injury in the summer of 2014 (the exploding golf club was the year before, the surgery from Crosby the year before that), so I wonder if shot selection started to play a role then.

 

Let me rephrase,  he started taking fewer high percentage shots.  He's shooting from farther out (high slot/top of the circle) more than he used to.  

 

IF he wings a shot from outside the circle absent mindedly on net in the hopes of someone tipping it or bashing in a rebound, I kinda don't consider that a shot and neither should Hakstol.  

[OccamsRazor]

Montreal needs Dmen to take Markov's place so i say send them...

 

 

...for free don't even need anything back but a 10th round pick maybe!!!!

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

If Sanheim is being dealt, it's not for Pacioretty. Sanheim only gets moved if a young center with potential number one upside is sent back in return. As much as people seem to be down on him, a guy like Sam Bennett would be an ideal target. A move for Pacioretty is only done if the team thinks they have a shot at the Stanley Cup. This club isn't a contender yet.

[jammer2]

On 8/12/2017 at 0:53 PM, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

If Sanheim is being dealt, it's not for Pacioretty. Sanheim only gets moved if a young center with potential number one upside is sent back in return. As much as people seem to be down on him, a guy like Sam Bennett would be an ideal target. A move for Pacioretty is only done if the team thinks they have a shot at the Stanley Cup. This club isn't a contender yet.

 

 I get what you are saying, and I do think Bennett is poised for a break out year. I just don't think the gap between Bennett and our C prospects like Frost, Voribiev etc equal Sans. I'd rather just be patient and not block the young kids. Plus, you have G and Patrick to consider, a good chance Bennett would not be playing in the top 6 in Philly, which means his skill set is wasted. With all the C depth in this org, Bennett seems like a square peg in a round hole type of equation. 

 

 A good problem to have, but a move to the wing is almost impossible due to prospect depth there as well. AND I did not include Bunnaman in the initial C listings, which was a  mistake, cause he will be a Flyer, I'm sure of it. 

[Poconono]

I'd rather give up Morin.  Sanheim can actually play.

[jammer2]

1 hour ago, Poconono said:

I'd rather give up Morin.  Sanheim can actually play.

 

 That is an outrageous statement. Morin is a HUGE, nasty, defensive d-man who is coming along fine. Just because he has limited offensive output or did not make the NHL jump right away does not lessen his value to the org.. His body and mind are just becoming one, finally on the same page after an outstanding height jump several years ago. These kids all develop at different times and speeds,  there is no handbook on when they should be ready, it's an individual thing. 

 

 You do know Chara spent a few years in the AHL before becoming a dominant force, good thing you were not the GM of the Sens, huh?

[King Knut]

On 8/12/2017 at 10:20 AM, OccamsRazor said:

Montreal needs Dmen to take Markov's place so i say send them...

 

 

...for free don't even need anything back but a 10th round pick maybe!!!!

 

 

Price will make him a Norris finalist.

[King Knut]

2 hours ago, Poconono said:

I'd rather give up Morin.  Sanheim can actually play.

 

We need both kinds of player and we already have a Ghost, Provo and Myers.  We don't need both Sanheim and Myers.  The chances are we won't be able to ice both players on the same team even when they're both ready without trading someone.

 

All that said, this is a stupid trade and there's no way I do it.  I'd sooner trade Gudas in two years.  The only to trade Sanheim now is if they have reason to believe he won't develop well.

 

Absolute best case scenario in two years, they trade Gudas so it's:

 

Myers Provo

Sanheim Hagg

Ghost Morin 

[AJgoal]

Just now, King Knut said:

 

We need both kinds of player and we already have a Ghost, Provo and Myers.  We don't need both Sanheim and Myers.  The chances are we won't be able to ice both players on the same team even when they're both ready without trading someone.

 

 

Why not? Myers is a right shot. Sanheim is a left. Provorov has offensive ability, but he's not the same kind of mold as Myers and Ghost. In fact, he's the kind of guy that means you can keep the best of your defensemen regardless of skill set, because he's excellent in both ends. My hope is that you see a top four of Myers - Provorov and Gudas - Sanheim in the coming years. Leaving Ghost, Morin, Hagg, Friedman, etc fighting for a bottom pairing spot.

[King Knut]

57 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

 

Why not? Myers is a right shot. Sanheim is a left. Provorov has offensive ability, but he's not the same kind of mold as Myers and Ghost. In fact, he's the kind of guy that means you can keep the best of your defensemen regardless of skill set, because he's excellent in both ends. My hope is that you see a top four of Myers - Provorov and Gudas - Sanheim in the coming years. Leaving Ghost, Morin, Hagg, Friedman, etc fighting for a bottom pairing spot.

 

I went on to say that in an ideal world they could trade Gudas and have a very balanced squad while keeping both Sanheim and Myers. 

 

Maybe be I should have italicized NEED?

just brainstorming.  I don't want it either. 

 

this deal makes no sense right now and there's no way Hextall worked very hard on it if there was ever any truth to it. 

 

That said, a year or two from now, if the flyers are close or at least much much closer, don't put a trade like this out of the realm of possibility. for that last piece. 

 

I hope not.  I want to see these three and Provo, Morin and Hagg dance circles around the league for the next 6 or 7 years. None are quite Karlsson or Subban material, but I'm sure you're imagining a team with THREE guys ALMOST but not quite  that good, right? 

 

I totally want that team too.  In the end, that's probably going to be more valuable than any Single forward who isn't named McDavid or Matthews. In fact as Flyers fans, we all know damn well that a single forward no matter how good  can get hurt.  I'll take three smooth skating puck moving D men over any single forward.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OccamsRazor]

2 hours ago, King Knut said:

 

Price will make him a Norris finalist.

 

That would be fine by me that would mean he isn't on the Flyers!!!!

[OccamsRazor]

2 hours ago, King Knut said:

 We don't need both Sanheim and Myers.

 

 

Uh yes they do.

[King Knut]

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

Uh yes they do.

 

OH believe me, I want them on the team,  but it's far from a necessity. Unless they start rolling with 4 pairings. 

[murraycraven]

15 hours ago, King Knut said:

We don't need both Sanheim and Myers.

 

slow your roll there buddy!  

[King Knut]

1 hour ago, murraycraven said:

 

slow your roll there buddy!  

 

It's funny how no matter what you say, people are going to focus in on the one part of it that they want to... regardless of what the rest of your post was about.

 

I don't want it to happen.  I could see how it could... and it would still make sense.  

[jammer2]

On 8/14/2017 at 5:49 PM, King Knut said:

 We don't need both Sanheim and Myers.

 

 Myers is an absolute stud. Just developed later than most kids. Every scout has said emphatically that Myers would have been a 1st round pick the year after the whole league passed him up, had the Flyers not signed him to a pro deal. When you stand out on Canada's World Jr team as a d-man, that is just not easy to do. He has jaw dropping skill. Yes, we do need Sans AND Myers. Both huge kids that can skate and have very high offensive upside. 

[King Knut]

1 hour ago, jammer2 said:

 

 Myers is an absolute stud. Just developed later than most kids. Every scout has said emphatically that Myers would have been a 1st round pick the year after the whole league passed him up, had the Flyers not signed him to a pro deal. When you stand out on Canada's World Jr team as a d-man, that is just not easy to do. He has jaw dropping skill. Yes, we do need Sans AND Myers. Both huge kids that can skate and have very high offensive upside. 

 

Seriously.   I give up.  I have no idea what's gotten into y'all.  

 

 

[Claude Monet]

On 8/14/2017 at 2:08 PM, jammer2 said:

 

 That is an outrageous statement. Morin is a HUGE, nasty, defensive d-man who is coming along fine. Just because he has limited offensive output or did not make the NHL jump right away does not lessen his value to the org.. His body and mind are just becoming one, finally on the same page after an outstanding height jump several years ago. These kids all develop at different times and speeds,  there is no handbook on when they should be ready, it's an individual thing. 

 

 You do know Chara spent a few years in the AHL before becoming a dominant force, good thing you were not the GM of the Sens, huh?

He must have been the GM of the islanders! 

[flyercanuck]

4 hours ago, King Knut said:

 

Seriously.   I give up.  I have no idea what's gotten into y'all.  

 

 

 

 What's this I hear you hate Phillipe Myers and his entire family and former Flyer goalie Phil Myre just cause their names are similar?  

[ruxpin]

8 hours ago, King Knut said:

 

Seriously.   I give up.  I have no idea what's gotten into y'all.  

 

 

LMAO 

I understand how you meant it, and you've explained it well. 

 

Yeah, if this goes best case scenario and all the prospects pan out, we're going to have a glut and not enough NHL spots for everyone. 

 

As others have pointed out, perhaps Myers/Sanheim isn't the conflicting pair since they play opposite sides, but at some point some unfortunate decisions will need to be made. 

 

I have to think that several years ago, Predators fans were having similar discussions and some refused to think they could possibly trade Seth Jones. We'll have needs and defense will be the strength to trade from. 

 

I don't have one I want to trade or anything, but at some point it's going to happen. 

[OccamsRazor]

46 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

As others have pointed out, perhaps Myers/Sanheim isn't the conflicting pair since they play opposite sides, but at some point some unfortunate decisions will need to be made

 

Yes.

 

Then if you have a hole you could make a Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen type trade.

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, ruxpin said:

I understand how you meant it, and you've explained it well. 

 

[King Knut]

6 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 What's this I hear you hate Phillipe Myers and his entire family and former Flyer goalie Phil Myre just cause their names are similar?  

 

You got me all wrong.  It's Sanheim I hate.  Can't stand the kid.

 

How can I hate a guy essentially named Philadelphia Myers?

[King Knut]

2 hours ago, ruxpin said:

I don't have one I want to trade or anything, but at some point it's going to happen. 

 

It was almost like everyone had a meeting and decided to play a joke.  It was a good one if so!  It got pretty funny.

 

Anyway, I agree... I wasn't even really condoning trading either one of them so much as I was suggesting why I wouldn't be surprised if and when it happens.  It wouldn't make sense to do it for a guy who will need a new UFA contract by the time both Myers and Sanheim are likely to be every day contributing team members.

 

Let this be our problem!  

 

2 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Yes.

 

Then if you have a hole you could make a Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen type trade.

 

 

I've been thinking more and more about Poile and how badly Homer screwed him over in 2012 and how amazingly he turned it all around... not insignificantly by taking the Coach Homer casually tossed aside and demonstrating that Laviolette is a pretty damn good NHL coach... whereas Craig Berube...   Good lord what the hell was Homer doing?