hobie Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 TO is going to be playing an odd team, here. Philly appears to be built to win now or at least in the near future but then trades Schenn for Lehtera(?) and draft choices? Lehtera makes 4.7 mil. per while Schenn makes 5.1, Lehtera is 29, Schenn 26. On no level can I make any sense of this trade other than maybe Philly's coach didn't like Schenn and since Schenn has been in St.L. he's having an insanely great time, Lehtera meh. I like Philly's young d on paper but it might not be ready yet to be the back bone of a successful team but the top 4 forwards are the real deal. This is going to be one of those games where it should be decided in the 1st period, TO starting on time with hot goaltending seems unstoppable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 7 minutes ago, hobie said: TO is going to be playing an odd team, here. Philly appears to be built to win now or at least in the near future but then trades Schenn for Lehtera(?) and draft choices? Lehtera makes 4.7 mil. per while Schenn makes 5.1, Lehtera is 29, Schenn 26. On no level can I make any sense of this trade other than maybe Philly's coach didn't like Schenn and since Schenn has been in St.L. he's having an insanely great time, Lehtera meh. I like Philly's young d on paper but it might not be ready yet to be the back bone of a successful team but the top 4 forwards are the real deal. This is going to be one of those games where it should be decided in the 1st period, TO starting on time with hot goaltending seems unstoppable I find this to be an incredibly interesting post. Is this the way the Flyers are viewed outside of Philly? Just curious, because most Flyers fans think we're about a year or two behind Toronto in "rebuild" mode. Management doesn't call it that, of course. They say "retool," largely because Toronto is one of only a few cities with less fan patience than Philly. The building would empty until the team was ready. But I found the view from outside kind of interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 "Philly built to win now." ROTFLMFAO The only thing the Flyers were built to win now was the lottery, which they DID win. Schenn was pretty much hated by Flyer fans. I know that sounds crazy, but have you been to Philly? They put liquid cheese on what is basically a roast beef sandwich! You can't reason with people like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 Sorry to say I don't follow the Flyers but I can't understand why Philly would keep 29 and 28 year olds and trade away a 26 year old. I would think a retool would want productive players at the ready when the team is ready to contend and those productive players are rarely in their 30s. I can't understand why Philly traded Schenn for so little and why it doesn't/didn't use Simmonds to get a boatload of potential in a trade. Of the players on Philly Simmonds is probably the most coveted except maybe the untouchable Provorov. Doesn't retooling mean attempting to extend mediocrity rather than going for the Cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 8 minutes ago, Podein25 said: "Philly built to win now." ROTFLMFAO The only thing the Flyers were built to win now was the lottery, which they DID win. Schenn was pretty much hated by Flyer fans. I know that sounds crazy, but have you been to Philly? They put liquid cheese on what is basically a roast beef sandwich! You can't reason with people like that. Leaf fans did the same with Kessel but then Phil was probably TO's only quality player at that time, Phil like Schenn look to be the right kinds of players when on the right teams. Sometimes changes of scenery can liberate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 6 minutes ago, hobie said: I can't understand why Philly traded Schenn for so little It was for 2 first round picks. Lehtera was really just cost of doing business. And boy does he suck as bad in Philly as he did in St. Louis. But it was for the 2 first rounders. I like who they drafted with the first of the two last summer, but I guess only time will tell. Same with the TBD second of the two (this year, so it should be a fairly late round pick). Schenn: really he didn't fit here. As it turns out, it was likely because he was used poorly. But Couturier was given the position that Schenn probably should have been in (but wouldn't have been even if he stayed), so I guess that's okay. The prevailing theory is that when the ping pong balls came up with the 2nd overall pick and it figured to be Patrick or Hirshier, they decided Schenn was expendable for more picks. Great deal for St. Louis despite giving up the picks (I would have lost a ton of money betting against Schenn as a 1C). Again, time will tell on the Philly side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 19 minutes ago, Podein25 said: They put liquid cheese on what is basically a roast beef sandwich! LMAO Okay, first of all, it's steak. Second, only idiots and tourists (not mutually exclusive) put liquid cheese on it. Third of all, poutine is fricken awesome. Evidenced by the fact I bought an AED just because of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 24 minutes ago, ruxpin said: It was for 2 first round picks. Lehtera was really just cost of doing business. And boy does he suck as bad in Philly as he did in St. Louis. But it was for the 2 first rounders. I like who they drafted with the first of the two last summer, but I guess only time will tell. Same with the TBD second of the two (this year, so it should be a fairly late round pick). Schenn: really he didn't fit here. As it turns out, it was likely because he was used poorly. But Couturier was given the position that Schenn probably should have been in (but wouldn't have been even if he stayed), so I guess that's okay. The prevailing theory is that when the ping pong balls came up with the 2nd overall pick and it figured to be Patrick or Hirshier, they decided Schenn was expendable for more picks. Great deal for St. Louis despite giving up the picks (I would have lost a ton of money betting against Schenn as a 1C). Again, time will tell on the Philly side. I wouldn't be surprised if St.L. got the better draft choice last summer in Kostin mostly because of Patrick's injury history. The Schenn trade seems to be a transaction made by a draft choice junkie, 2 1st from St.L. should be in the high 20s while Schenn on the right team should be a very valuable player. Was Schenn's fitting in related to who was on his line, from Schenn's stats I see a mid 50 scorer who was physical? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 7 minutes ago, hobie said: I wouldn't be surprised if St.L. got the better draft choice last summer in Kostin mostly because of Patrick's injury history. The Schenn trade seems to be a transaction made by a draft choice junkie, 2 1st from St.L. should be in the high 20s while Schenn on the right team should be a very valuable player. Was Schenn's fitting in related to who was on his line, from Schenn's stats I see a mid 50 scorer who was physical? He actually killed just about every line he was on. Well over half of his points came on the power play (still useful, though, right?). He bounced up and down the lineup and was horrible 5v5. Didn't mesh with anyone. It's important to note, though (and the reason for my "misused" statement earlier) that he was used almost exclusively on left wing rather than center. This year, they finally put Giroux on wing and have Couturier centering Giroux and (until the last couple of games) Voracek. Couturier has done very well there, but now I wish they'd have at least taken a shot at Schenn there. I argued in favor of the trade at the time, but your pick junkie thing is probably accurate. It was done with rebuild in mind and probably with the thought that Giroux and Voracek's contracts would be difficult to move. So, that's the season-long argument among Philly fans in a nutshell. Funny you compared to Kessel. Yeah, pretty accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 1 hour ago, ruxpin said: LMAO Okay, first of all, it's steak. Second, only idiots and tourists (not mutually exclusive) put liquid cheese on it. Third of all, poutine is fricken awesome. Evidenced by the fact I bought an AED just because of it. Lol, brilliant stuff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 1 hour ago, hobie said: Leaf fans did the same with Kessel but then Phil was probably TO's only quality player at that time, Phil like Schenn look to be the right kinds of players when on the right teams. Sometimes changes of scenery can liberate. Yes, plus Phil knows his way around a plate of poutine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 37 minutes ago, Podein25 said: Yes, plus Phil knows his way around a plate of poutine! I believe it was hot dogs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Some seem to forget we got Morgan Frost and a 2018 conditional first round draft pick for Schenn... so essentially 2 late first round picks. Trading Schenn also allowed Nolan Patrick a roster spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 I believe that draft choices, if good enough, should be included in the lineup, ASAP. But I also believe they need to belong where they're slotted, Patrick, didn't need to be a center this year, simply experiencing the NHL at 18 should be enough with reasonable icetime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPuk Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 I see Philly strictly as a middle of the road team. Their 2018 draft is eighth ? They desperately need to either get real lucky and get a player who is waaay better than his ranking, or make a deal with one of the leagues' bottom feeders to end up with at least a top two pick. Even then, it's a stretch. I agree that the two year window is minimum.... Or, they need to declare themselves as an expansion team ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 2 hours ago, BluPuk said: I see Philly strictly as a middle of the road team. Their 2018 draft is eighth ? They desperately need to either get real lucky and get a player who is waaay better than his ranking, or make a deal with one of the leagues' bottom feeders to end up with at least a top two pick. Even then, it's a stretch. I agree that the two year window is minimum.... Or, they need to declare themselves as an expansion team ....... Meh. The Flyers win too much. In the name of parity, they could do with a few decades of missing the playoffs. Builds character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 2 hours ago, BluPuk said: I see Philly strictly as a middle of the road team. Their 2018 draft is eighth ? They desperately need to either get real lucky and get a player who is waaay better than his ranking, or make a deal with one of the leagues' bottom feeders to end up with at least a top two pick. Even then, it's a stretch. I agree that the two year window is minimum.... Or, they need to declare themselves as an expansion team ....... I'm going to go ahead and respond like that was dead-on serious: Well said. Good analysis, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie Posted December 13, 2017 Author Share Posted December 13, 2017 A near dead Flyer team beat a totally lifeless Leaf team. It might surprise Flyer fans but that is the Leaf team that somehow has ended up in 3rd place in the NHL. Babs will surely come out with some malarkey like well we kept their scoring chances to very few tonite as if that alone is sufficient to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPuk Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 IMHO, the Flyers are a better team than the Leafs when it comes to actually being a "team". Granted I don't see a lot of Flyers' games but every time I do they all seem to pulling in the same direction. The Leafs on the other hand (still) just have a bunch of individuals. They have not gelled. Just sayin' how it looks to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 2 hours ago, BluPuk said: IMHO, the Flyers are a better team than the Leafs when it comes to actually being a "team". Granted I don't see a lot of Flyers' games but every time I do they all seem to pulling in the same direction. The Leafs on the other hand (still) just have a bunch of individuals. They have not gelled. Just sayin' how it looks to me... Blind squirrels and nuts mostly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 13 hours ago, BluPuk said: IMHO, the Flyers are a better team than the Leafs when it comes to actually being a "team". Granted I don't see a lot of Flyers' games but every time I do they all seem to pulling in the same direction. The Leafs on the other hand (still) just have a bunch of individuals. They have not gelled. Just sayin' how it looks to me... Yeah. Flyers have won 4 straight after losing 10 straight. So this Flyer team too has a bunch of individuals. Is rather young being held together shall i say by a buch of odd parts. And a journeyman/mediocre goalie leading them. Headed by a young head coach only 2 and a half years removed from college. That was basically a long way to say i don't know WTF to expect from this team. There are some great young pieces but they are young non the less. Can't call it as a Flyer fan i am unfamiliar with the way Hextall wants to build this team. Not saying it's wrong i'm just still use to them crapping in the draft to only have to go out and over pay in free agency. It's not the way they do it now. Hextall has made some questionable moves in free agency but has stocked them with the best farm system in the NHL today. Now when/will it come to fruition? Guess we'll see in two to three years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 38 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: It's not the way they do it now. Hextall has made some questionable moves in free agency but has stocked them with the best farm system in the NHL today. They do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 58 minutes ago, hobie said: They do? Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobie Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 1 minute ago, ruxpin said: Yes How do you come by that conclusion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 2 hours ago, hobie said: They do? Yes. They. Do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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