Evander Kane?

[brelic]

1 hour ago, elmatus said:

 

I wonder what the price on him would be. It seems odd to get rid of a 22 year old and second overall draft pick when you're entering a rebuild. I have a feeling he's largely off the table minus a socks off trade offer, which I doubt Hex would provide.

 

If that whole rumour with BUF is true, I'm thinking it's someone else. I bet it's ROR. Hex is probably looking to boost the PK and get another two-way player in the mix. Not a terrible idea, but he carries a hefty price tag for that production. Especially considering he wouldn't see top line minutes on this squad.

 

 

 

The biggest obstacle to getting ROR is his price tag. That would be three guys near the $8M mark for several years, and we will have Provorov join them soon, I'm guessing $6M-ish.

 

And he would cost us Morin, Sanheim, or Myers. I'm not against moving one of our prospects for the right player - so is ROR the right player for the long-term? He's yet another center.

 

Apparently Reinhart *is* available, and he can play wing. The knock on him, for what I've googled, is that he's soft and one-dimensional. He might cost less than ROR, actually, with a higher ceiling. Buffalo would  be selling low, in a sense.

 

Just for fun -

 

G/Coots/TK

Simmonds/O'Reilly/Voracek

Raffl/Patrick/Weal

Leier/Laughton/Filppula

 

OR

 

G/Coots/TK

Simonds/Patrick/Voracek

Reinhart/Laughton/Weal

Raffl/Filppula/Leier

 

Maybe Buffalo wants Simmer instead of a prospect, which would make sense because they need stability now. 

 

Anyway, all that to say I feel like Hextall will do next to nothing at the deadline lol.

[brelic]

Just to add more fuel to this... From the Sabres blogger.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/GARTHS-CORNER/Flyers-To-Sabres-Lehn-Me-A-Goalie/6/90983

 

 

I told you on Saturday that the Flyers have been scouting the Buffalo Sabres rather frequently in 2018. Flyers scouts have been attending Sabres games and Rochester Amerks contests. The Amerks vistited the Phantoms Saturday night and it prompted heavy trade speculation. The Elliott injury is a serious punch to the solar plexus of the Flyers, who have 65 points and are currently in third place in the Metropolitan Division. 

 

A four or five game losing streak with Neuvirth tending the bars could derail Philly's playoff aspirations. Neuvirth has been a disappointment this season. He has a propensity to buckle under pressure. 

 

Hextall needs help and he needs it now.

 

The Flyers are one of five teams that continue to scout pending RFA Robin Lehner. The Devils, Flames, Ducks, Blackhawks, Islanders, and Jets are also watching Lehner.

 

Lehner is a gamer. The Big Swede owns a 2.90 GAA and .910 SV%. 

 

The 26 year old veteran has allowed 110 goals on 1,229 shot attempts this season. Lehner reminds Hextall of his yoinger self. Big, tough, competitive and not afraid to two-hand slash and throw a dozen blocker jabs at an opponents face. The Sabres are willing to move Lehner at the NHL trade deadline because they are going to be trading the unrestricted free agent and possibly their RFAs in exchange for blue chip prospects and premium draft choices.

 

The Sabres are out of the playoff race. Jack Eichel is injured for teh next 4-6 weeks and Jason Botterill will be trading away his UFAs and players on expiring contracts in the next two weeks. 

 

Jason Botterill is looking to upgrade his speed, skill and physicality on his blue line. 

 

Phil Housley can use more skill in his top nine forward group. 

 

The Sabres have been scouting the Flyers in hopes of prying away one (or two) of their young D prospects in Samuel Morin or Travis Sanheim. Forward Travis Konecny (1st round 2015) is a young player that can infuse skill into Buffalo's top six forward group.

 

Konecny, 20, has played 126 NHL games and has scored 24 goals and 32 assists for 56 point. In 56 games this season, Konecny has 13 goals and 16 assists and has tied his career high for points scored during a campaign.

 

Morin, the 11th overall pick in the 2013 NHL Draft, is a top four D. He is 6'7" and 230 lbs. and is very difficult to play against. Morin is a big man with heavy fists and soft hands. He plays in all situations.

 

Sanheim is was the 17th overall pick at the 2014 NHL Draft. Sanheim is 6'3" and 200 lbs. Sanheim has top four skill and can play in all situations. On Saturday night, Sanheim collected three assists in Lehigh Valley's 5-3 loss to the Rochester Amerks. 

 

Konecny, 20, has played 126 NHL games and has scored 24 goals and 32 assists for 56 points. In 56 games this season, Konecny has 13 goals and 16 assists and has tied his career high for points scored during a campaign.

Morin and Sanheim each have played in Philadelphia this season. The Flyers blue line is a crowded house with veterans Shayne Gostisbehere, Andrew MacDonald, Radko Gudas leading two young star defenders in Ivan Provorov and Robert Hagg. The two kids are playing remarkably well for Dave Hakstol, which means that Morin and Sanheim have to bide their time in the AHL.

 

The Flyers are said to be interested in Sabres forward Samson Reinhart who has scored 11 goals and 16 assists in 56 games played this season. The second overall pick at the 2014 NHL Draft, Reinhart has scored 51 and 66 for 117 points in 223 career games with the Sabres.

[elmatus]

8 minutes ago, brelic said:

Maybe Buffalo wants Simmer instead of a prospect, which would make sense because they need stability now. 

 

They do? Admittedly, I don't watch Buffalo much; however, they really don't seem like a team that is one or two character vets away from anything remotely resembling a contender. They have more in common with the last decade's Oilers than our 2018 Flyers imo. They seem to need a lot of pieces yet. I'm not sure Simmer is what they would be targeting.

 

I have to guess any team knocking on Hex's door is asking for Sanheim. It just makes sense. He's a prime candidate right now for that type of team. He has some NHL experience and appears to be almost ready for full time duty, and he has a fairly high ceiling, particularly as an offensive dman. Note: Those are all reasons why I would be very hesitant to trade him, but they're also exactly the reasons why teams would want him as a starting piece for any such trade.

 

As far as Reinhart goes, it wouldn't be a silly idea. Again, it would likely be for Sanheim and a pick or something. It could make sense in that we need forwards more than dmen right now, and the Sabres have nothing on the back end to speak of (except for that one guy who's name I regularly butcher when I try to write it out). 

 

I'm not sure I like it necessarily, but I'm not saying I don't either. Reinhart does seem soft to me, but then, I could say the same about Sanheim really...

[elmatus]

13 minutes ago, brelic said:

Forward Travis Konecny (1st round 2015) is a young player that can infuse skill into Buffalo's top six forward group.

 

If this happens for any player not named Eichel, I'm fairly confident my laptop will be in for a personal space meeting with my office window.

[flyercanuck]

I don't want Kane. Period. 

RORs caphit makes his value mediocre at best. On a good day.

Reinhart I would take if the price was low. 

Same with Lehner. 

I'm not sending any ONE of Sanheim/Konecny/Morin for any of the above. Let alone more than that.

[elmatus]

25 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

I'm not sending any ONE of Sanheim/Konecny/Morin for any of the above. Let alone more than that.

 

I really don't know what other trade chips we have the Sabres would want. Again, they're not a potential contender who might be looking for a solid vet like Simmer or something. They're a rebuilding team, much like us, but who are in need of far more pieces than us (the presence of Jack Eichel aside).

 

Kane, Reinhart, ROR... like em or hate em, all are the types of players who will command a solid return. Given what we have and what the Sabres need, it's very hard to imagine a trade discussion that doesn't involve a young dman with a high potential ceiling. Sanheim is the clear favourite I would say.

 

If the convo is about Lehner, that's different. I'm not sure Lehner would require a Sanheim-type return for a deal to be struck. Mostly that's because he's clearly not worth it. Hex should know that as much as anyone here would.

 

Is Sanheim worth it for Reinhart -- a 22 year old second overall pick with two ~40 pt seasons?

Is Sanheim worth it for Kane -- a 26 year old firebrand who loves to pummel the net with a million shots per game?

Is Sanheim worth it for O'Reilly -- an admittedly solid two-way contributor who is getting paid more than he's likely worth?

 

I expect those are the questions Hextall is currently asking.

[murraycraven]

1 hour ago, brelic said:

Just to add more fuel to this... From the Sabres blogger.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/GARTHS-CORNER/Flyers-To-Sabres-Lehn-Me-A-Goalie/6/90983

 

 

I told you on Saturday that the Flyers have been scouting the Buffalo Sabres rather frequently in 2018. Flyers scouts have been attending Sabres games and Rochester Amerks contests. The Amerks vistited the Phantoms Saturday night and it prompted heavy trade speculation. The Elliott injury is a serious punch to the solar plexus of the Flyers, who have 65 points and are currently in third place in the Metropolitan Division. 

 

A four or five game losing streak with Neuvirth tending the bars could derail Philly's playoff aspirations. Neuvirth has been a disappointment this season. He has a propensity to buckle under pressure. 

 

Hextall needs help and he needs it now.

 

The Flyers are one of five teams that continue to scout pending RFA Robin Lehner. The Devils, Flames, Ducks, Blackhawks, Islanders, and Jets are also watching Lehner.

 

Lehner is a gamer. The Big Swede owns a 2.90 GAA and .910 SV%. 

 

The 26 year old veteran has allowed 110 goals on 1,229 shot attempts this season. Lehner reminds Hextall of his yoinger self. Big, tough, competitive and not afraid to two-hand slash and throw a dozen blocker jabs at an opponents face. The Sabres are willing to move Lehner at the NHL trade deadline because they are going to be trading the unrestricted free agent and possibly their RFAs in exchange for blue chip prospects and premium draft choices.

 

The Sabres are out of the playoff race. Jack Eichel is injured for teh next 4-6 weeks and Jason Botterill will be trading away his UFAs and players on expiring contracts in the next two weeks. 

 

Jason Botterill is looking to upgrade his speed, skill and physicality on his blue line. 

 

Phil Housley can use more skill in his top nine forward group. 

 

The Sabres have been scouting the Flyers in hopes of prying away one (or two) of their young D prospects in Samuel Morin or Travis Sanheim. Forward Travis Konecny (1st round 2015) is a young player that can infuse skill into Buffalo's top six forward group.

 

Konecny, 20, has played 126 NHL games and has scored 24 goals and 32 assists for 56 point. In 56 games this season, Konecny has 13 goals and 16 assists and has tied his career high for points scored during a campaign.

 

Morin, the 11th overall pick in the 2013 NHL Draft, is a top four D. He is 6'7" and 230 lbs. and is very difficult to play against. Morin is a big man with heavy fists and soft hands. He plays in all situations.

 

Sanheim is was the 17th overall pick at the 2014 NHL Draft. Sanheim is 6'3" and 200 lbs. Sanheim has top four skill and can play in all situations. On Saturday night, Sanheim collected three assists in Lehigh Valley's 5-3 loss to the Rochester Amerks. 

 

Konecny, 20, has played 126 NHL games and has scored 24 goals and 32 assists for 56 points. In 56 games this season, Konecny has 13 goals and 16 assists and has tied his career high for points scored during a campaign.

Morin and Sanheim each have played in Philadelphia this season. The Flyers blue line is a crowded house with veterans Shayne Gostisbehere, Andrew MacDonald, Radko Gudas leading two young star defenders in Ivan Provorov and Robert Hagg. The two kids are playing remarkably well for Dave Hakstol, which means that Morin and Sanheim have to bide their time in the AHL.

 

The Flyers are said to be interested in Sabres forward Samson Reinhart who has scored 11 goals and 16 assists in 56 games played this season. The second overall pick at the 2014 NHL Draft, Reinhart has scored 51 and 66 for 117 points in 223 career games with the Sabres.

 

 

tell that blogger... this is ludicrous.  No way....

 

Robert Hagg a star defender?   Huh?!?

[brelic]

37 minutes ago, elmatus said:

 

I really don't know what other trade chips we have the Sabres would want. Again, they're not a potential contender who might be looking for a solid vet like Simmer or something. They're a rebuilding team, much like us, but who are in need of far more pieces than us (the presence of Jack Eichel aside).

 

Kane, Reinhart, ROR... like em or hate em, all are the types of players who will command a solid return. Given what we have and what the Sabres need, it's very hard to imagine a trade discussion that doesn't involve a young dman with a high potential ceiling. Sanheim is the clear favourite I would say.

 

If the convo is about Lehner, that's different. I'm not sure Lehner would require a Sanheim-type return for a deal to be struck. Mostly that's because he's clearly not worth it. Hex should know that as much as anyone here would.

 

Is Sanheim worth it for Reinhart -- a 22 year old second overall pick with two ~40 pt seasons?

Is Sanheim worth it for Kane -- a 26 year old firebrand who loves to pummel the net with a million shots per game?

Is Sanheim worth it for O'Reilly -- an admittedly solid two-way contributor who is getting paid more than he's likely worth?

 

I expect those are the questions Hextall is currently asking.

 

For me, Reinhart is the most interesting because he's a top 5 draft talent that people keep saying Cup-winning teams have. And he can play wing.

 

 

 

 

[vis]

What is the deal with Reinhart?  Just looking at his stats, it seems he's been a disappointment, but I'm a little surprised Buffalo would be willing to trade him given his age and contract status.  I see he plays both C and LW.  Where has he mostly lined up in Buffalo?

 

I don't know what to make of Sanheim's worth.  He stands out among our defense, but that might be more of a commentary on our d-men.  My concern with him has been whether, at this level, his offensive contributions will exceed his defensive lapses.  In juniors, he was the offensive catalyst for the Hitmen and, because of his skating, was able to limit or cover up his defensive shortcomings.  That's a lot harder to do in the NHL, especially against stronger players.  Clearly, he will be an NHLer at some point.  But I think it's hard to determine whether he will be solid top pairing d-man or a PP specialist.  At the end of the day, I believe trading him is very, very risky I wouldn't do it unless it's for a solid, blue chip return.

 

All that said, I wouldn't trade Sanheim for Reinhart, Kane or O'Reilly -- at least not straight-up (and probably not in package deal).  ROR makes too much money.  Kane is too risky and, despite what I have said in this thread, I do worry about the lockerroom stuff (also, no guarantee he would resign).  Reinhart is most interesting to me, especially since I worry a little about Laberge and Rubtsov.  (Though how similar is Frost to Reinhart?)  I will say that maybe a more stable organization would benefit Reinhart.  

 

Under no circumstances am I trading Konecny for any of those players.  Keep dreaming, Buffalo blogger guy...

[brelic]

9 minutes ago, vis said:

What is the deal with Reinhart?  Just looking at his stats, it seems he's been a disappointment, but I'm a little surprised Buffalo would be willing to trade him given his age and contract status.  I see he plays both C and LW.  Where has he mostly lined up in Buffalo?

 

Not sure. Bob McKenzie is the one who tweeted out that teams are calling about Reinhart. There's also the belief that either the team or the player may elect for arbitration, which usually doesn't end well. It damages the relationship. So maybe there's a feeling in Buffalo that it makes more sense to capitalize on their asset while they can?

 

9 minutes ago, vis said:

I don't know what to make of Sanheim's worth.  He stands out among our defense, but that might be more of a commentary on our d-men.  My concern with him has been whether, at this level, his offensive contributions will exceed his defensive lapses.  In juniors, he was the offensive catalyst for the Hitmen and, because of his skating, was able to limit or cover up his defensive shortcomings.  That's a lot harder to do in the NHL, especially against stronger players.  Clearly, he will be an NHLer at some point.  But I think it's hard to determine whether he will be solid top pairing d-man or a PP specialist.  At the end of the day, I believe trading him is very, very risky I wouldn't do it unless it's for a solid, blue chip return.

 

All great points. I'm not sure what to make of him either. 

 

Let's say we trade him... we're still left with Ghost, Provorov, Morin, Myers, Hagg, and a few B/C prospects like Friedman, Hogberg, Willcox. 

 

It's still a risk trading him, but so is trading Reinhart. 

 

9 minutes ago, vis said:

Under no circumstances am I trading Konecny for any of those players.  Keep dreaming, Buffalo blogger guy...

 

Haha, yeah, that's never happening.

[elmatus]

57 minutes ago, brelic said:

people keep saying Cup-winning teams have

 

It's not just people saying it -- it's the truth.

 

I agree with you that he's the most intriguing of those options. I will say as well that I'm not necessarily opposed to moving Sanheim to bolster our forward corps. I'm not necessarily a big fan of Reinhart's game; however, if I'm being honest, I wasn't very impressed with Sanheim earlier this year either. Sure, he is likely just learning the ropes, but then we could say the same about Reinhart really, except Reinhart does have 40+ pts in two consecutive seasons already. He's also pretty soft and seems like a playmaker more than a scorer. We have a number of those already...

 

I don't have a solution to all this. It's entirely possible a Reinhart for Sanheim trade would work out in our favour. It's also entirely possible it wouldn't. That's the risk inherent to all such trades I suppose. I will say that it's a reasonable gamble for Hex to take. I could see him doing it, and I can understand why it may work. For what that's worth anyway...

 

It's a darn sight better than trading TK for any Sabre not named Jack Eichel. There's no way that's gonna fly.

[OccamsRazor]

2 hours ago, murraycraven said:

Robert Hagg a star defender? 

 

 

In the making....he still has parts of his game to work on for sure but he leads the NHL in hits pretty decent for rookie.

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, brelic said:

Let's say we trade him.

 

No let's not. NO. NO No!

[murraycraven]

18 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

In the making....he still has parts of his game to work on for sure but h leads the NHL in hits pretty decent for rookie.

 

Oh yeah.... not knocking him whatsoever.   I am not sure if he has "future star" abilities.   I have been happy with him this year.

[Jam1986]

No bad egg.

[brelic]

58 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

No let's not. NO. NO No!

 

Lol, I get it, but that's the point of acquiring a lot of assets. You can deal from a position of relative strength. 

 

 

[RonJeremy]

I am not sold on Reinhart, do we really need a another small guy who is a softie and Kane is a punk. We need a physical guy who is a finisher. If we get either of them, you can be sure that Sanheim is gone and in order to pay another big salary, Simmonds is gone too at the draft.

[vis]

3 hours ago, brelic said:

Let's say we trade him... we're still left with Ghost, Provorov, Morin, Myers, Hagg, and a few B/C prospects like Friedman, Hogberg, Willcox. 

I hear you.  But given Myers' injury history and the org's apparent view of Morin's abilities (and in light of his injuries), how comfortable would you be with trading Sanheim?  Where would that leave them in terms of rebuilding?  Honestly, I don't know where guys like Friedman, Hogberg and Willcox end up.  I have never considered them much.

 

Where would Reinhart slot?  LW or C?  Do they think he replaces Simmonds production if they cannot resign him?

[vis]

6 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

I am not sold on Reinhart, do we really need a another small guy who is a softie and Kane is a punk. We need a physical guy who is a finisher.

I'm kind of with you on this re: Reinhart.  I honestly don't know much about Reinhart, but he doesn't strike me as a goal scorer and not very physical (though I care less about that).  I wish the Flyers could find a guy who just scores goals.  I know we have no idea if Frost makes the NHL or what kind of player he will be at this level, but would he play the same role as Reinhart?

[elmatus]

35 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

Kane is a punk. We need a physical guy who is a finisher

 

I agree with you 100% about Kane. I also want nothing to do with him at all. That said, he *is* a physical guy who is a finisher.

[brelic]

59 minutes ago, vis said:

I hear you.  But given Myers' injury history and the org's apparent view of Morin's abilities (and in light of his injuries), how comfortable would you be with trading Sanheim?  Where would that leave them in terms of rebuilding?  Honestly, I don't know where guys like Friedman, Hogberg and Willcox end up.  I have never considered them much.

 

Where would Reinhart slot?  LW or C?  Do they think he replaces Simmonds production if they cannot resign him?

 

That definitely makes me nervous. I would consider trading Sanheim for someone with fewer question marks than Reinhart. 

 

Of course, to outside teams, Sanheim may also have question marks, like the ones you raised earlier. 

 

Honestly, I wouldn't make any moves simply because we don't need to. There's no pressing need. We've got Lindblom coming up who should be fine - he's proven himself in the SHL, and proving himself now in the AHL. I think he's the prospect with the fewest question marks we have. I think he'll be a productive middle six winger.

 

We also have Aube-Kubel who seems to be putting it all together. Three more assists last night. He's still only 21, and this is his second full season in the AHL. I'd say he's ready for the big team next year.

 

In a way, it's could be a perfect scenario. Let's say next year we roll with a middle six of:

 

Lindblom/Patrick/Voracek

Aube-Kubel/Laughton or Frost/Simmonds

 

It gives the team the chance to see if either of those guys make it a little bit easier to consider trading Simmonds, if they want to go in that direction. 

 

What about you? Would you trade Sanheim given Myers' and Morin's injury history?

[murraycraven]

5 minutes ago, brelic said:

Would you trade Sanheim given Myers' and Morin's injury history?

 

 

Hell no!  

 

Unless there is a dealt that you simply can't pass up Sanheim is not even in the discussion.   It would need to be a younger player under good cap term and will be a solid contributor for years.   To me, Sanheim has the most upside of any defensive prospect.   The kid will be a very good player - his skating is elite, provides offense, and has a great first pass.   He needs to work on his defensive game but I truly think that will come.

 

The kid is 21 years old and has the potential to be a 6'4 version of Ghost.  Unless the other team provides a kings ransom he is going nowhere and playing a full time roll next year with the Flyers.

[OccamsRazor]

23 minutes ago, brelic said:

I would consider trading Sanheim for someone with fewer question marks than Reinhart. 

 

As i said hell no. Sanheims upside once he has matured will put him as the 2nd best Dman on this blueline...properly slotting Ghost where he belongs as the #3.

 

We just have to give him patience. 

 

Do not trade this kid or you'll be kicking yourself in 3 years.

 

The grass in not greener on the otherside.

 

I would rather them do nothing ride this out and let the cards fall where they may than do something crazy like trading Sanheim.

 

Stay. The. Course.

[brelic]

2 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

As i said hell no. Sanheims upside once he has matured will put him as the 2nd best Dman on this blueline...properly slotting Ghost where he belongs as the #3.

 

We just have to give him patience. 

 

Do not trade this kid or you'll be kicking yourself in 3 years.

 

The grass in not greener on the otherside.

 

I would rather them do nothing ride this out and let the cards fall where they may than do something crazy like trading Sanheim.

 

Stay. The. Course.

 

That's a projection. I know we all like to believe our prospects will be awesome, but some will definitely not be. It could be Sanheim. I hope he turns out to be a stud D-man, obviously, but he's still an unknown quantity at this point. Just like Hart.

 

I would also disagree with saying Ghost 'properly belongs' as a #3. Right now, over the past few months, he's been the #1 defenseman in all three zones. No one can touch his offensive acumen, he's effective in the neutral zone and makes high risk plays to stop opposing rushes and often create rushes for the Flyers. And defensively, he's been very active with his stick, aggressive in the corners, and hitting like an SOB on a mission.

 

And this is not taking anything away from Provorov - just a testament to how hard Ghost has worked at becoming a better defenseman in the NHL.

 

But that's all beside the point. 

 

If there is somehow an opportunity to find a future top line forward - a game-changer - and that involves trading Sanheim, I think Hextall would consider it. Defense is our strength - we have a top pairing in the making right now, and bottom pairing players coming along. Plus those bottom pairing guys are easier to acquire in a trade or free agency, if some of ours don't pan out.

 

We have Patrick and TK as the best picks to be top line fixtures for the next gen Flyers. TK is showing right now that he is up to the task. Patrick shows flashes. Who else do we have? Yes, Frost. But he is a huge question mark. 

 

So, I would say it's something worth considering and not just dismissing offhand.

 

Seems like we'll just agree to disagree

 

 

[murraycraven]

37 minutes ago, brelic said:

find a future top line forward - a game-changer -

 

 

but that is a projection in and of itself...   You cant discount Sanheim as being a projection and then say a "future top line forward"...   if you are trading for another young player that is just as much of a risk.  You might project that player to be a top line bu no guarantee.