Flyers 2018 draft discussion

[ruxpin]

3 minutes ago, pilldoc said:

except it's hot here in Florida and I hate typing on my phone

 

First world problems, my friend; first world problems.

 

Frozen was there after we took our kids.  That could be cool (see what I did there?).

[AJgoal]

2 hours ago, ruxpin said:

More than moving up--and I don't know for whom--I could see him trading one or the other first round picks for a current-playing position player.  Not only don't I know who, I don't even know how to narrow it down to forward, defenseman, or goalie.  I just think with the open cap space, I could see him bringing back salary with one of those picks.

 

This is my thought. The trade market could be interesting this year. I'd absolutely be willing to deal one of the firsts for established help.

 

2 hours ago, ruxpin said:

Would the #19 and Gudas get you Hamilton from Calgary, for example.  And would you do that if it would?  

 

I know I spent a lot of time last week defending Gudas. But yes. 

[OccamsRazor]

3 hours ago, AJgoal said:

You're advocating paying a high price for something out of the bargain bin.  

 

 

Not really i would just gauge what they want first...and i would have to have a conversation with the player first before trading for him.

 

And he isn't devoid of talent and you have to pay to get something back....and i said if it was Jake i would need more back.

 

He was the 10th overall pick and only 23 so it won't come for a 4th rounder. You have to pay to play.

 

Can't say no more...yeah i would do a Nish and say Roope Hintz for Jake...but that is me.

[ruxpin]

Maybe trading up and getting a defenseman isn't a horrible idea. I'm starting to think Morin is never going to happen. 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

4 hours ago, ruxpin said:

Would the #19 and Gudas get you Hamilton from Calgary, for example.  And would you do that if it would?  

Or a #19 and something--I like trading Gudas--for Raanta?   His two years remaining on his contract gets you the bridge.  I'm not sure #19 isn't an over-payment, but I also don't think Arizona has a viable option in goal.

Or the #14 and Gudas (insert other name) for Rakell from Anaheim. 

One of the picks and something for Anisimov, Galchenyuk (if the Habs have soured on the latter, they may entertain the possibility of multiple first round picks.  Their 3rd and either 14 or 19)?

What about Faksa as a 3C?    Dallas needs a Dman.  Trade them Gudas!   I don't know that he's worth a 1st and Gudas, though, or that I'd spend my 1st on a 3C in any case.

 

19 and Gudas for Hamilton? At. The. Drop. Of. A. Dime. The top pairing becomes Provorov - Hamilton; second pairing is Morin - Gostisbehere; third pairing is Sanheim - MacDonald. That works for me. I still hate the idea of MacTurd in the lineup, but Haktard has such a man erection for him that there's no way he gets taken out of the lineup.

 

As for 19 and Gudas for Raanta, no. If that's all what's coming back, the Flyers would need more. I'd do 19 and Gudas for Strome and Kuemper though. 

 

14 and Gudas for Rakell is interesting, but gut feeling says Anaheim wouldn't part with their top scorer.  

 

No interest in Anisimov and as for Galchenyuk, I think it's possible he rebounds outside of Montreal. However, his defensive game leaves a lot to be desired and I'm not sure that Philadelphia would be conducive to that kind of success. As well, do you play him ahead of Lindblom on the left wing or do you play Galchenyuk at center? 

 

Faksa is going to be a big part of Jim Montgomery's plans in Dallas, so we can forget about that right now. 

 

The options that are available to the Flyers though really open things up. Having multiple firsts in a good deep draft like this can only benefit the club. Hextall can afford to swing at the fences and if he strikes out, he's still in a position where he can draft two good players. He can also move down and collect even more draft picks. This is a win win any way you look at it.

[ruxpin]

2 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

19 and Gudas for Hamilton? At. The. Drop. Of. A. Dime. The top pairing becomes Provorov - Hamilton; second pairing is Morin - Gostisbehere; third pairing is Sanheim - MacDonald. That works for me. I still hate the idea of MacTurd in the lineup, but Haktard has such a man erection for him that there's no way he gets taken out of the lineup.

 

It's amazing how just the one guy could potentially solidify the rest, isn't it?   It may have to be Hagg somewhere rather than Morin.  The guy just got hurt again tonight.  No idea how serious but they're saying twisted knee.  I have no idea what possessed them to let him play yet this offseason rather than just wait until fall, but...the guy is snakebitten.  I think you can throw the "injury prone" moniker on him at this point.  I mean, it could turn around for him but ...

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

2 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

 

It's amazing how just the one guy could potentially solidify the rest, isn't it?   It may have to be Hagg somewhere rather than Morin.  The guy just got hurt again tonight.  No idea how serious but they're saying twisted knee.  I have no idea what possessed them to let him play yet this offseason rather than just wait until fall, but...the guy is snakebitten.  I think you can throw the "injury prone" moniker on him at this point.  I mean, it could turn around for him but ...

 

I'm not gonna fret Morin's year. This was the first year that he really missed a lot of time due to injury. He'll get fixed up this off season and he'll be ready for training camp. Honestly, this was a freak year.

[ruxpin]

5 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

 

I'm not gonna fret Morin's year. This was the first year that he really missed a lot of time due to injury. He'll get fixed up this off season and he'll be ready for training camp. Honestly, this was a freak year.

 

Man, I really hope you're right.

[elmatus]

16 hours ago, brelic said:

 

Really? I've been getting the impression that it's the opposite. He seems poised to treat next season like taking off the training wheels and actively improving the quality on the ice. 

 

You think? I feel like this is what many of us here want him to do, but he really hasn't shown that he's going to do this yet. I think this draft and off-season will be very telling in this regard, but I'm reluctant to say he's gotten off the quantity bandwagon.

[AJgoal]

22 minutes ago, elmatus said:

 

You think? I feel like this is what many of us here want him to do, but he really hasn't shown that he's going to do this yet. I think this draft and off-season will be very telling in this regard, but I'm reluctant to say he's gotten off the quantity bandwagon.

 

I feel like there was a quote somewhere, but I can't find it right now, other than Hextall saying he needs to be better. Here's some from Holmgren:

 

Quote

 

Holmgren said Hextall will have “free rein” to sign free agents if he thinks they will bolster the team.

The salary cap is expected to climb from $75 million to the $80 million range this summer. If it does, the Flyers could have around $25.5 million of available space if they buy out forward Jori Lehtera.

 

They still have to sign some of their own players, but they should have plenty left over to make a bid for a marquee free-agent like Islanders center John Tavares or Washington defenseman John Carlson or San Jose left winger Evander Kane — if Hextall has that desire. (Keep in mind that Ivan Provorov and Travis Konecny will be due big raises after next season.)

 

Hextall has been the general manager for four years, and “the team continues to show development,” Holmgren said. “Is there a point in time where he looks to add? His job is look at what’s available at whatever time. And if he thinks it’s a deal that’s in the best interest of the organization moving forward, then his job is to act on it.”

This is the first time in his tenure that Hextall will have significant cap room.

“Ron has the flexibility to do whatever he wants with his cap space and his roster,” Holmgren said when asked about the possibilities of signing a free agent. “If that’s the decision he wants to make moving forward, he’s got free rein to do that. I think Ron continues to do what’s right for the organization.”

 

 

I'm not sure if one should read into Holmgren's comments, but Flyers viewership declined 25% this season. It's absolutely possible that with Snider gone, there's pressure coming to do something more than tinker around the edges.

[elmatus]

31 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

 

I feel like there was a quote somewhere, but I can't find it right now, other than Hextall saying he needs to be better. Here's some from Holmgren:

 

 

I'm not sure if one should read into Holmgren's comments, but Flyers viewership declined 25% this season. It's absolutely possible that with Snider gone, there's pressure coming to do something more than tinker around the edges.

 

Yeah, I can see this, and honestly, I agree with the assessment. I think we're only going to go so far with beefing up the prospect pool season in and season out. We'll get some hits and misses, but it absolutely takes actual moves and roster signings to make a contending team. Prospect development alone won't cut it.

 

Hopefully we see some of that moving this draft and off-season. As you've suggested, this really is a prime opportunity for us to grab a key impact player, which is exactly what we need right now. It's foolish to think NAK is going to become a guy like that, or even that Morgan Frost will. We can't always be playing the odds with prospects who are more likely never to get to the level we really need.

 

imo, I would still say Tavares is the most worthwhile of the bunch. Does that put a damper on Couts and his breakout season? I honestly don't care. He's an adult. If his feelings are hurt because Hexy went out and got one of the best players in the league to be the 1C, that's more telling of Couts than anything. The same goes for Giroux or Voracek. Will they be bothered if Hexy brings in a guy and pays him $10 million a year? They shouldn't. He would make the team significantly better. That matters more.

 

That said, it's highly unlikely to happen of course. Barring Tavares, things get murkier for me definitely. Sure, Kane was great in his short stint in San Jose, but he's done this before, and he usually just disappears when he loses interest or whatever. We could look at the last few months of his career, or we can look at the bulk of his work. The bulk of his work is problematic. His character especially.

 

Like others here, I feel the most likely option to benefit the team is the acquisition of a solid 3C. Sam Bennett stands out to me. I don't mind Nugent-Hopkins either. Reinhart is alright, though I don't really feel he brings the kind of playstyle we need right now. Also Reinhart is likely the most expensive of the three, simply because Buffalo always seems to ask for the moon on every occasion (probably because they've been awful forever and need everything).

 

The cheaper option would be Bozak. He would also be the least likely real upgrade. More than likely it would be a Filppula 2.0 situation, which is fine, but it's unlikely to make the team much better next year. Someone (@AJgoal?) flirted with the O'Reilly idea. That would be great, except I don't think Buffalo will need to retain salary to move him, and he's overpaid as it stands imo. I don't want him at $7 million per.

 

I also don't think Buffalo is in a position to accept what we have to offer. Simmonds comes to mind as the most likely trade chip. He would still have considerable value for a contending team in need of a PP boost and physical presence. I think Calgary (Bennett) or Edmonton (RNH) would be a decent spot for him in this regard. Neither are contenders really, but they both seem to think they are.

 

Anyone else worth mentioning? Anaheim? Dallas? LA? Chicago? I really think these are the teams most likely to be interested. We're not going to get traction out of teams in the bottom third of the league without giving up stuff we need ourselves.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

The Flyers have cap space, draft picks and a deep prospect pool. They're going to be one of the teams that cap crunch teams will want to deal with because of that luxury. It's so difficult to say or predict what they're going to do because Hextall is so guarded about things, which is a great thing. Let the guessing games begin!!!!

 

[ruxpin]

If this is what we come away from the draft with, I may cut myself.   Woo at #14 is drafting malpractice, IMO

 

https://www.draftsite.com/nhl/mock-draft/2018/

 

Pick	Team		Player	Position	School	Height	Weight
Round 1 Skip To Round:  1  •  2  •  3  •  4  •  5  •  6  •  7  •  Undrafted
1		Buffalo	Rasmus Dahlin	D	Frolunda HC (SHL)	6' 2"	184
2		Carolina	Andrei Svechnikov	RW	Barrie (OHL)	6' 2"	187
3		Montreal	Filip Zadina	LW	Halifax (QMJHL)	6' 0"	191
4		Ottawa	Brady Tkachuk	LW	Boston University	6' 2"	195
5		Arizona	Oliver Wahlstrom	LW	USNTDP (USHL)	6' 1"	198
6		Detroit	Quinton Hughes	D	US-Under-18(USAH-NTDP)	5' 10"	176
7		Vancouver	Evan Bouchard	D	London (OHL)	6' 2"	192
8		Chicago	Jesperi Kotkaniemi	RW	Assat Pori (SM-liiga)	6' 2"	189
9		NY Rangers	Adam Boqvist	D	Brynäs IF (SHL)	5' 11"	169
10		Edmonton	Ty Smith	D	Spokane (WHL)	5' 11"	176
11		NY Islanders	Noah Dobson	D	Acadie-Bathurst(QMJHL)	6' 2"	174
12		NY Islanders	Joe Veleno	C	Drummondville(QMJHL)	6' 1"	190
13		Dallas	Barrett Hayton	C	Sault Ste. Marie(OHL)	6' 1"	180
14		Philadelphia	Jett Woo	D	Moose Jaw (WHL)	6' 0"	202
15		Florida	Bode Wilde	D	US-Under-18(USAH-NTDP)	6' 2"	194
16		Colorado	Joel Farabee	LW	USNTDP (USHL)	5' 11.5"	160
17		New Jersey	Mattias Samuelsson	D	US-Under-18(USAH-NTDP)	6' 4"	215
18		Columbus	Ryan Merkley	D	Guelph (OHL)	5' 11.5"	170
19		Philadelphia	Calen Addison	D	Lethbridge (WHL)	5' 9"	180
20		Los Angeles	Serron Noel	RW	Oshawa (OHL)	6' 3.5"	192
21		San Jose	Akil Thomas	C	Niagara (OHL)	5' 11"	170
22		Ottawa	Vitali Kravtsov	RW	Belye Medvedi Polar Bears (MHL)	6' 2"	176
23		Anaheim	Rasmus Kupari	C	Karpat Oulu (SM-liiga)	6' 0.75"	183
24		Minnesota	Alexander Alexeyev	D	Red Deer (WHL)	6' 3"	190
25		Toronto	Grigori Denisenko	LW	Yaroslavl (KHL)	5' 10.75"	175
26		NY Rangers	Isac Lundeström	C	Lulea HF (SHL)	5' 11"	175
27		Chicago	Ty Dellandrea	C	Flint (OHL)	6' 1"	186
28		Washington	KAndre Miller	D	USNTDP (USHL)	6' 3"	192
29		Detroit	Rasmus Sandin	D	Sault Ste. Marie(OHL)	5' 11"	192
30		NY Rangers	Ryan McLeod	C	Mississauga (OHL)	6' 1.25"	183
31		St. Louis	Dominik Bokk	RW	Vaxjo (SHL)	6' 1"	177

[AJgoal]

3 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

If this is what we come away from the draft with, I may cut myself.   Woo at #14 is drafting malpractice, IMO

 

https://www.draftsite.com/nhl/mock-draft/2018/

 

 

 

With Kravtsov, Kupari, and Farabee still on the board? Yeah, no thanks.

[ruxpin]

1 minute ago, AJgoal said:

 

With Kravtsov, Kupari, and Farabee still on the board? Yeah, no thanks.

 

Exactly.  Kupari may be a bit of a risk, but he'd be my choice if he's there at 14.  I don't want to risk waiting until 19.  Then Farabee, since you can still make an argument that he's BPA and he's a LW.  If you really want Woo, you could probably trade back and still have a fair shot at him at 25-28, I think.   Kravtsov could still potentially be on the board at 19, but whichever of Kupari or Farabee that you don't take should be gone by 19--I think.   I'll actually be a bit stunned if Farabee is still there at 14, but it depends upon how many teams go defense.

 

Here's a question:   Most mocks I've seen have Veleno going by 12 (this one included).  I really like Kupari, but if Veleno falls to 14, what do you do?

[ruxpin]

Also, if Fonzie has any input on the Columbus draft, I have a hard time believing they take Merkley at #18.

[pilldoc]

13 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

 

With Kravtsov, Kupari, and Farabee still on the board? Yeah, no thanks.

 

beat me too it ...(I just can't type fast enougj) .... No thank you to Woo ..... Besides..who makes these mocks .... a chimp?

[pilldoc]

10 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

I really like Kupari, but if Veleno falls to 14, what do you do?

 

I really like Kupari myself.  That's who I have been leaning on for the past few weeks ......  I just think Veleno has his share of risks also ....

 

"He is the biggest wild card of the draft class." He was the first 15 year old granted exceptional status to play in the QMJHL and is in his third season in the “Q.” Due to nagging injuries in his second season, his point totals were less than his rookie adjustment season. Draft prognosticators and his St. John Seadogs team were looking for big things this season but he didn’t seem to be taking a qualitative jump as a dominant scorer, and he was giving a change of scenery with a trade to Drummondville. Through the middle of March he still hadn’t reached the 20 goal mark but contributed more than 50 assists and has generated offense. No one can argue with his hockey IQ, sense, composure and poise, or his commitment to being a 200 foot centre. He displays a good strong skating stride, and two step quickness at times. He’s got the size to compete and will. Reads the ice like a vet, and can pass off and exchange it smoothly. Fearless and tough, he usually keeps an even keel, but is not going to be a intimidated. At this point, is more of an offensive generator than high end scorer. The essential question is whether he has demonstrated an elite level of offensive skills and shooting ability to rank him as a player who someday projects as more than a complimentary offensive forward. How much of the exceptional status tag blocks honest evaluation? No matter. Whenever he comes off the board, his new team will be rewarded with “safe” player who will at very least play in the NHL.

 

My gut says Kupari ...but then again ..what the hell do I know ????

[pilldoc]

Here is another mock ...

 

http://www.mynhldraft.com/NHL-Mock-Draft/

[ruxpin]

15 minutes ago, pilldoc said:

Here is another mock ...

 

http://www.mynhldraft.com/NHL-Mock-Draft/

 

Yeah, I've seen this one, as well.   I'm sorry to say I've spent way too much time scouring all the mock drafts I can find.  

 

I think I'd be okay with this, but I have to admit I think I'd be a little disappointed.  Kotkeniemi is a decent pick, but I'd be disappointed if they let Kupari by if he's still there.  Denisenko gets you your left winger and he's decent, but there's no "wow" factor for me.   I don't know a heck of a lot about him, though.    Given the way that one shakes out, I either go Dman with Sandin or I trade back.   I talk to Detroit and see if I can shake out their 2nd this year or next for #28.  I might still be able to get Woo or Akil there.   Woo doesn't excite me, but he's a decent pick late in the first.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

1 hour ago, ruxpin said:

Here's a question:   Most mocks I've seen have Veleno going by 12 (this one included).  I really like Kupari, but if Veleno falls to 14, what do you do?

 

The Flyers are one of the few clubs that have had great success drafting players from the Quebec league. If Simon Nolet, the Flyers chief about for Quebec, says that Veleno is the guy, you take him.

[ruxpin]

2 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

 

The Flyers are one of the few clubs that have had great success drafting players from the Quebec league. If Simon Nolet, the Flyers chief about for Quebec, says that Veleno is the guy, you take him.

 

Is he high on Veleno?  I agree, if they take him it's because Nolet said so, and I'm not going to argue it.   

 

If they do, I'm hoping Kupari is still there at #19. He might be because if Veleno is still there at #14, something went weird ahead of that I would think.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

36 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

 

Is he high on Veleno?  I agree, if they take him it's because Nolet said so, and I'm not going to argue it.   

 

If they do, I'm hoping Kupari is still there at #19. He might be because if Veleno is still there at #14, something went weird ahead of that I would think.

 

No mention yet on who the Flyers are high on. I'm high on several players at 14 and 19, but ultimately, the scouts have been pretty darned fine at finding good players at their draft spots, so I'm not complaining. However, if it's Jett Woo and Calen Addison, then we riot....lol

[ruxpin]

@pilldoc

Have you seen the mocks on this site?   I'll post the second one shortly, but I believe this may be the better of the two.   Just silly.

 

https://fansided.com/2018/05/07/2018-nhl-mock-draft-post-nhl-draft-lottery-sabres-dahlin/

 

It's one of those nuisance click-through things with one per page, so below are the picks, if I can get it to format properly (eh, not great...).  It's obviously from before either conference final was finished. I wouldn't be excited about Wilde at #14.

 

Pick # Team Player (pos) 1 Sabres Dahlin (D) 2 Hurricanes Svechnikov (RW) 3 Canadiens Filip Zadina (W) 4 Senators Adam Boqvist (D) 5 Coyotes Quinn Hughes (D) 6 Red Wings Brady Tkachuk (W) 7 Canucks Oliver Wahlstrom ( C ) 8 Blackhawks Evan Bouchard (D) 9 Rangers Ty Smith (D) 10 Oilers Joe Veleno (LW) 11 Islanders Joel Farabee (LW) 12 Islanders (Calgary) Noah Dobson (D) 13 Stars Ryan McLeod ( C ) 14 Flyers Bode Wilde (D) 15 Panthers Rasmus Kupari ( C ) 16 Avalanche Jesperi Kotkaniemi ( C ) 17 Devils Barrett Hayton ( C ) 18 Blue Jackets Vitali Kravtsov (W) 19 Flyers Isac Lundestrom (C/W) 20 Kings K'Andre Miller (D) 21 Sharks Rasmus Sandin (D) 22 Senators (fPittsburgh) Bo Groulx ( C ) 23 Ducks Akil Thomas ( C ) 24 Wild  Jett Woo (D) 25 Maple Leafs  Ryan Merkley (D) 26 Rangers (Boston) Filip Hallander ( C/W) 27 Blues (Winnipeg) Serron Noel (RW) 28 Capitals  Mattias Samuelsson (D) 29 Red Wings (Vegas) Jack McBain ( C ) 30 Rangers (Tampa) Ty Dellandrea ( C ) 31 Blackhawks (Nash) Jared McIssac (D)

 

[ruxpin]

@pilldoc

 

   This one also has us taking Woo.   This one is really pretty lazy.  He has Carolina taking Zadina over Svechnikov.  I wouldn't put Don Waddell doing something so stupid, but if he does, someone should punch him in the face.

 

https://fansided.com/2018/05/08/2018-nhl-mock-draft-rasmus-dahlin-goes-to-sabres/

 

1. Buffalo Sabres – Rasmus Dahlin, D
2. Carolina Hurricanes – Filip Zadina, LW
3. Montreal Canadiens – Andrei Svechnikov, RW
4. Ottawa Senators – Oliver Wahlstrom, LW
5. Arizona Coyotes – Brady Tkachuk, LW
6. Detroit Red Wings – Quinton Hughes, D
7. Vancouver Canucks – Adam Boqvist, D
8. Chicago Blackhawks – Noah Dobson, D
9. New York Rangers – Evan Bouchard, D
10. Edmonton Oilers – Ty Smith, D
11. New York Islanders – Barrett Hayton, C
12. New York Islanders – Ryan Merkley, D
13. Dallas Stars – Joe Veleno, C
14. Philadelphia Flyers – Jett Woo, D
15. Florida Panthers – Jakub Lauko, LW
16. Colorado Avalanche – Bode Wilde, D
17. New Jersey Devils – Calen Addison, D
18. Columbus Blue Jackets – Joel Farabee, LW
19. Philadelphia Flyers – Mattias Samuelsson, D
20. Los Angeles Kings – Jesperi Kotkaniemi, RW
21. San Jose Sharks – Serron Noel, RW
22. Ottawa Senators – Akil Thomas, C
23. Anaheim Ducks – Isac Lundestrom, C
24. Minnesota Wild – Grigori Denisenko, LW
25. Toronto Maple Leafs – Jared McIssac, D
26. New York Rangers – Vitali Kravtsov, RW
27. St. Louis Blues – Adam Ginning, D
28. Washington Capitals – Oliver Rodrigue, G
29. Detroit Red Wings – Alexander Alexeyev, D
30. New York Rangers – Ryan McLeod, C
31. Chicago Blackhawks – Kevin Bahl, D