×
Jump to content
Play Pick'em Daily Read more... ×

Ducks Hockey Forum Coyotes Hockey Forum Bruins Hockey Forum Sabres Hockey Forum Flames Hockey Forum Hurricanes Hockey Forum Blackhawks Hockey Forum Avalanche Hockey Forum Blue Jackets Hockey Forum Stars Hockey Forum Red Wings Jackets Hockey Forum Oilers Hockey Forum Panthers Hockey Forum Kings Hockey Forum Wild Hockey Forum Canadiens Hockey Forum Predators Hockey Forum Devils Hockey Forum Islanders Hockey Forum Rangers Hockey Forum Senators Hockey Forum Flyers Hockey Forum Penguins Hockey Forum Sharks Hockey Forum Blues Hockey Forum Lightning Hockey Forum Maple Leafs Hockey Forum Canucks Hockey Forum Golden Knights Hockey Forum Capitals Hockey Forum Jets Hockey Forum

News Ticker
  • News Around the NHL
Paparanger

Why are people hating on Vegas?

Recommended Posts

31 minutes ago, B21 said:

 

Don't forget the cut of those expansion fees, either. :DancingGrape:

 

I wonder if it's an even split. Or what would be even better is for it to go in escrow as part of the revenue sharing (aka subsidizing) until it's depleted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, CreaseAndAssist said:

I don't think this group of players that Vegas has assembled were guys that teams didn't want anymore.  I think they still wanted them, but just didn't have the spots to protect them.  Its way different than the expansion drafts of old where you got 4th liners / minor league journey man and old vets waiting to retire and that was it.  

 

The Wild took its first draft and selected a bunch of older Europeans just so they'd have some more talent on their roster.  The guys from those old expansion drafts, they were truly players teams probably didn't really want anymore.  Just sayin'...

So how desirable was if for fans? How desirable was it for team owners knowing they were going to be heavily challenged to get people in the gate with a big hill to climb before seeing any wins? Least of which how was it for the players, knowing they were basically there to get beat by just about everybody?

A secondary question to team owners. How many of them bought into an expansion team and didn't have to sell? Granted that's kind of a rhetorical question but it is somewhat relevant.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, rottenrefs said:

So how desirable was if for fans? How desirable was it for team owners knowing they were going to be heavily challenged to get people in the gate with a big hill to climb before seeing any wins? Least of which how was it for the players, knowing they were basically there to get beat by just about everybody?

A secondary question to team owners. How many of them bought into an expansion team and didn't have to sell? Granted that's kind of a rhetorical question but it is somewhat relevant.

 

In Minnesota...the team spent almost nothing on its roster and the fans still showed up and filled the building.  They paid good money to watch one of the lowest scoring teams in the league.  That works when a fanbase that knows and loves the game can understand development is tough.  

 

Don't forget, the 2003 run probably helped not only stave off an exodus of apathy but also raised the expectations.  If you read Tom Lynn's book; he talked about the run was a bit of a mixed blessing...but overall ownership wanted to keep the team on the cheap and they did for a few more years until the fanbase was livid...and they finally spent some money to put a decent roster on the ice.  Coincidentally, that ownership group then looked to sell the club (which they did).  

 

It didn't work out nearly so well in Columbus where they had some pretty rough years attendance-wise.  They had some goofy season ticket rules; sort of like a cell phone contract where you locked yourself in for multiple years at a time...also made it tough to watch a team be mired in mediocrity a long time.  

 

Atlanta ended up relocating...not much left to say...the rancid attendance speaks for itself despite having lots of northern transplants in that city.  

 

Nashville had some dark days too.  Leipold struggled to get corporate partnerships to help them buy up the more expensive lower bowl seats and boxes.  Even when the salary cap was put in place, the Predators didn't spend to the top because they didn't have the finances to do so.  After a bunch of years of struggle; Leipold promised the playoffs and made a guarantee that he'd pay season ticket holders back their increase on Season tickets if they didn't make it.  They didn't, and he paid them back...and then looked to sell the team.  But he looked to sell it to a person that wouldn't move the club out of Nashville.  That was not easy...but eventually they got it done and we all know where he ended up next.  

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, CreaseAndAssist said:

 

In Minnesota...the team spent almost nothing on its roster and the fans still showed up and filled the building.  They paid good money to watch one of the lowest scoring teams in the league.  That works when a fanbase that knows and loves the game can understand development is tough.  

 

Don't forget, the 2003 run probably helped not only stave off an exodus of apathy but also raised the expectations.  If you read Tom Lynn's book; he talked about the run was a bit of a mixed blessing...but overall ownership wanted to keep the team on the cheap and they did for a few more years until the fanbase was livid...and they finally spent some money to put a decent roster on the ice.  Coincidentally, that ownership group then looked to sell the club (which they did).  

 

It didn't work out nearly so well in Columbus where they had some pretty rough years attendance-wise.  They had some goofy season ticket rules; sort of like a cell phone contract where you locked yourself in for multiple years at a time...also made it tough to watch a team be mired in mediocrity a long time.  

 

Atlanta ended up relocating...not much left to say...the rancid attendance speaks for itself despite having lots of northern transplants in that city.  

 

Nashville had some dark days too.  Leipold struggled to get corporate partnerships to help them buy up the more expensive lower bowl seats and boxes.  Even when the salary cap was put in place, the Predators didn't spend to the top because they didn't have the finances to do so.  After a bunch of years of struggle; Leipold promised the playoffs and made a guarantee that he'd pay season ticket holders back their increase on Season tickets if they didn't make it.  They didn't, and he paid them back...and then looked to sell the team.  But he looked to sell it to a person that wouldn't move the club out of Nashville.  That was not easy...but eventually they got it done and we all know where he ended up next.  

 

For whatever it's worth, I enjoy the heck out of your posts.

 

This one is particularly good.  Great read.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

 

For whatever it's worth, I enjoy the heck out of your posts.

 

This one is particularly good.  Great read.

 

Yeah, I  know what you mean. I don't know what the hell  "exodus of apathy" even means, but I sure like it! 

  • Like 1
  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Podein25 said:

 

Yeah, I  know what you mean. I don't know what the hell  "exodus of apathy" even means, but I sure like it! 

 

Maybe a pathetic exit?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@CreaseAndAssist yep, hard to keep an ownership interested when money doesn't roll in. Most markets it's either win and win a lot to keep the fan base or die and sell off the club.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Being a MN fan forever - I tried to follow other teams when I was too frustrated with the moves and players of MN - just couldn't get on board with another team... This year was different - and what I am seeing with my friends down here that are Blackhawk fans, etc - the Knights simply provided us with a reason to watch them since they took some players from everyone... That's what I think changed my mind. Am I huge Knights fan? No. At least not yet. But for someone like me who struggled following Dallas (although going to a Calder cup game next Tuesday and Thursday here in Austin) - not having that massive fan base in Vegas was a big factor as well - they're new...

 

Plus, my business does a lot of business and conferences in Vegas - so that was a huge factor as well...  And, MGM Resorts, who owns that land and a ton of different hotels - well, that definitely helped too...

 

There will be growing pains no doubt - but when I realized what age my 4 year old daughter will be when the Suter/Parise contracts end - I though "oh hell no"...  So, I guess there were quite a few reasons to let the sun set on a team I followed forever - but it all started with years upon years of frustration regarding the PP, line combos, and never having a grasp with the toxicity of the players and management. 

 

I'll be interested to see how they're doing - since I still have family in MN. But lets just say that I don't think I'm vested in them anymore - and my expectation bar is quite low for them to make the right changes...

Edited by Confrontational
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 6/5/2018 at 9:02 AM, Villette/Lavaux said:

"Living is suffering"

 

Nietzsche surely had minnesotan blood in this veins. 

wow, you wild fans are a bleak bunch...welcome !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

According to some people I know, Vegas fans are notoriously toxic and I think it is one of the main reasons why people hate the team. They told me that most of them make hockey look bad. 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, bladerookie said:

According to some people I know, Vegas fans are notoriously toxic and I think it is one of the main reasons why people hate the team. They told me that most of them make hockey look bad. 

 

 

Fanboy, is that you ?

  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 6/8/2018 at 8:44 PM, Villette/Lavaux said:

 

Fanboy, is that you ?

1

 

Now who the heck is that? LOL. Anyway, I heard it from some of my colleagues and I really find it weird. 

 

On 6/9/2018 at 3:12 AM, rottenrefs said:

@bladerookie I've heard the exact opposite.

 Are you saying that the team itself is worse? hahahaa

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 6/8/2018 at 1:31 AM, bladerookie said:

According to some people I know, Vegas fans are notoriously toxic and I think it is one of the main reasons why people hate the team. They told me that most of them make hockey look bad. 

 

You said ^

 

On 6/8/2018 at 2:12 PM, rottenrefs said:

@bladerookie I've heard the exact opposite.

I said ^

 

6 hours ago, bladerookie said:

 Are you saying that the team itself is worse? hahahaa

Then you said ^

 

I'm not sure where you're going with that. You flamed their fans, then re-directed flaming the team?

 

When I said "I've heard the exact opposite" I was saying so off confirmed information I heard.

For instance, when fans on social media promote or support the team (as per our local radio station aired): their front office sends out t-shirts and other fan memorabilia to fans all over the world and the general consensus is those fans are extremely appreciative.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 6/11/2018 at 5:50 PM, rottenrefs said:

You said ^

 

I said ^

 

Then you said ^

 

I'm not sure where you're going with that. You flamed their fans, then re-directed flaming the team?

 

When I said "I've heard the exact opposite" I was saying so off confirmed information I heard.

For instance, when fans on social media promote or support the team (as per our local radio station aired): their front office sends out t-shirts and other fan memorabilia to fans all over the world and the general consensus is those fans are extremely appreciative.

 

Ok. This is awkward. Hahaha. I misunderstood your answer. I'm still getting a hang of this forum. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Most Liked Posts in This Topic

    • 7
      Post
      If you stop looking at porn, maybe your caps lock won't get stuck so much.   Yeah, I really do hate the Caps.  What of it?  I prefer players that don't kiss their sticks and choke.
    • 4
      Post
      I hate Vegas. Passionately. I want them to lose and not only lose, to be embarrassed.   1996 the Nordiques left for Colorado and immediately won the cup, as a Wings fan I hated Colorado more than any team at any time (although the feeling has mellowed looking back on one of the games greatest ever rivalries) and felt they were an imposter, that the fans in Quebec had been hosed and the usurper won a cup that they didn't deserve. Still do.     I feel a team should hit the bottom so that when they reach the pinnacle they deserve and appreciate it. Florida, Arizona, Columbus the Wild and others have been lost in the wilderness forever, when their time comes I will not begrudge them, I just do not think that a new team in a new city winning the cup represents all that is good with the game, quite the opposite. I have absolutely zero give on this. Screw Vegas. Hope the ice melts.
    • 4
      Post
      Players nobody wanted? Wasn't each team allowed to protect just 9 or 11 players(including 1 goalie), depending on the positions of the players protected? That leaves alot of players available that somebody wanted. The expansion draft rules were setup very favorably for Vegas. The NHL very much wanted to see them be successful immediately.
    • 4
      Post
      Can't blame Vegas or the league, but were they foolish transactions?  Specifically, in the case of Minnesota, they thought they were in "win now" territory (that might have been the part that was foolish) and so did at least a sizeable portion of its fan base.  You cannot possibly allow Staal to leave for nothing to Vegas.    So they gave up what they thought were lesser players.   In the case of Haula--who I really like--they were lesser players.  But they were both still players they otherwise wouldn't have wanted to give up.   The Flyers--and 31 other teams--are about to face similar problems when Seattle drafts if they don't change the rules.   The Flyers didn't really have the Minnesota problem last time.  They had so few good players that they basically had what they wanted protected and the rest were "here, take one!"    This time will be different as they have a lot of good, young defensemen and there will be no way to protect all of them.  They'll have issues on the front end this time around, too, but it will likely be one of the kids on defense snatched up.   Everyone is calling the 2 instead of one foolish, but I'd entertain 2 from the "B" list--even though they may still be very good elsewhere--rather than give up an "A-lister."   
      It's a hard judgement call.  I have no doubt Minnesota and its fans will end up missing Haula and Tuch in the not too distant future.  Especially because they're not quite as "win now" as thought.  But giving up Staal for absolutely nothing should have gotten Fletcher fired sooner than he was.   I quoted your post, but I've seen the "foolish transactions" thing quite a bit.   To you, but also to everyone else, this is just meant as, "What should [insert GM] have done?   Why I want to blame the league (specifically whoever agreed to the draft rules) is they cut into teams a bit too far.  It's almost as if they were only thinking of # of protections vs. roster when they actually made the "2-year pro" criteria.  I think teams should be able to better protect assets they've poured time and planning into.   Back to Philly:  they've gone out of their way to use high picks on defensemen and have judiciously brought them along slowly.  Just about the time they (and we fans) should be able to see the fruits of that with them all finally up as a unit, we're likely to lose one to Johnny Come Lately.   As a fanbase suffering years of a build and just about to see that change, that really sucks.      It may be one of the reasons I don't like the first year organization winning the Cup:  they didn't do any work to build.  Instead, they were able to pilfer off other's work and pain of building and voila!   Not to say the staff and players didn't do a terrific job and not taking anything away from them individually or as a group.   But it just has the feel of Bob spending his money on a lottery ticket and John taking it just before the numbers are drawn and casting dispersions at Bob just because Bob isn't happy for him that  he just won a million dollars.   All that said, because they're playing Washington and because I do like the players and the coach, I'm hoping they beat the crap out of the Caps.
    • 4
      Post
      In Minnesota...the team spent almost nothing on its roster and the fans still showed up and filled the building.  They paid good money to watch one of the lowest scoring teams in the league.  That works when a fanbase that knows and loves the game can understand development is tough.     Don't forget, the 2003 run probably helped not only stave off an exodus of apathy but also raised the expectations.  If you read Tom Lynn's book; he talked about the run was a bit of a mixed blessing...but overall ownership wanted to keep the team on the cheap and they did for a few more years until the fanbase was livid...and they finally spent some money to put a decent roster on the ice.  Coincidentally, that ownership group then looked to sell the club (which they did).     It didn't work out nearly so well in Columbus where they had some pretty rough years attendance-wise.  They had some goofy season ticket rules; sort of like a cell phone contract where you locked yourself in for multiple years at a time...also made it tough to watch a team be mired in mediocrity a long time.     Atlanta ended up relocating...not much left to say...the rancid attendance speaks for itself despite having lots of northern transplants in that city.     Nashville had some dark days too.  Leipold struggled to get corporate partnerships to help them buy up the more expensive lower bowl seats and boxes.  Even when the salary cap was put in place, the Predators didn't spend to the top because they didn't have the finances to do so.  After a bunch of years of struggle; Leipold promised the playoffs and made a guarantee that he'd pay season ticket holders back their increase on Season tickets if they didn't make it.  They didn't, and he paid them back...and then looked to sell the team.  But he looked to sell it to a person that wouldn't move the club out of Nashville.  That was not easy...but eventually they got it done and we all know where he ended up next.  
    • 3
      Post
      So, for the past 20 or so years there has been a saying going around by just about any rapper that has a voice and a microphone; "Don't hate the player, Hate the game." So I ask you why all of this negative feedback on the Vegas Golden Knights?   Think about it, They have a GM who couldn't ice a team to get out of the second round so Washington fired him. They have a coach that couldn't get the team into the playoffs and when he did they were out in the first round, so not only was he fired but the Panthers Brass humiliated him and sent him away in a marked taxicab. Then there are the players themselves. A mixture of third and fourth liners with second and third pair defensemen who couldn't break the lineups of their old teams and were in many cases throwaways. I don't know about you, but other than Marc Andre Fleury, James Neal, and Jonathan Marchessault, I didn't know any of the other players except Oscar Lindberg and that's because he was a Ranger at one time and I am a Ranger fan.   The truth is George McPhee did his homework. Gerard Gallant formulated a system and a bunch of third & fourth liners who had something to prove bought into it and showed the hockey world "what's up!   If 50% of the twitter world wants to hate on something, maybe they should hate on their GM's who can't draft properly & find some gems either by trade or Free agency. There are teams that are perennial bottom feeders and that's because of the front office, Not the Vegas Golden Knights. And don't forget the teams that are stuck in the dredded middle either.   One more thing; If you can't find it in your hearts to hate these inept GM's and retread coaches, then hate Gary Bettman since he is the the guy who came up with this format in the first place.    Let's face it. no matter how you feel about the VGK's you have to admit that all the stars aligned on this one and the Jersey's are nice too.   This is going to be an epic series and I can't wait for this final to start tomorrow night. Good luck to both teams.

About HF.net

 We are an enthusiastic community of HockeyFans who enjoy discussing the NHL and more in our Forums.  Our members may also write their own blogs, converse in chat, post pics in our gallery, join our fantasy hockey leagues and more.  If you are looking for a friendly community to discuss hockey then register today and begin your conversation in our NET.

 

 

Contact Us

 

Like what we do? Help us keep doing it!
Supporting Members help keep HockeyForums Advertisement Free
×