Kevin Hayes and Tom Wilson just got 5 million, Simmonds has to be looking for 7 million

[RonJeremy]

If these two guys got 5 million,  you have to figure Simmonds is gonna be looking for 7 million a year and at age 30 hes gonna be looking for more than 5 years for his last big paycheck. I just don't see the Flyers being able to sign him.

[OccamsRazor]

10 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

If these two guys got 5 million,  you have to figure Simmonds is gonna be looking for 7 million a year and at age 30 hes gonna be looking for more than 5 years for his last big paycheck. I just don't see the Flyers being able to sign him.

 

I would give him 7 mill for 4 years tops.

[RonJeremy]

@OccamsRazor, do you think he will go for that , I'm thinking he would want a minimum of 6 years

[Jam1986]

Getting crazy if so bye bye. Where to trade him too get a younger Simmer?

[King Knut]

1 hour ago, Jam1986 said:

Getting crazy if so bye bye. Where to trade him too get a younger Simmer?

 

There aren't any young Simmers.  

 

Some of us have been saying he'd be looking for at least 7 for a long time now.  A down season may have made some people think otherwise, but on the other hand, a guy who was playing through all those injuries still scored 24 goals for you.  Cha-Ching!

 

The thing that I brought up in the other thread (that I cribbed from BSH radio's Steph Driver) that gives me a little bit of hope is that if you sign a sweetheart deal with the Flyers, you kinda know that you'll have a job of some sort or another for the rest of your natural life.  

 

If Wayne has dreams of being a coach some day, sticking around here for less money and getting a  job in the organization somewhere might be a fast track to that path that could avoid stops in high school or juniors.   Lappy still has a job in the NHL, Danny Briere is the GM of an ECHL team, many many former Flyers are scouts, conditioning coaches, etc etc etc.  Or Maybe Simmer is looking at Boosh on those national broadcasts and thinking, "hey, I could do that!"    

 

Then there are the endorsement deals.  Wawa billboards can pay pretty nicely, and far better than they might in town like Phoenix or Columbus or Buffalo.  

 

Point is, there are things that could convince him to stick around for less money that I myself hadn't really been taking into account before.

 

 

[OccamsRazor]

11 hours ago, RonJeremy said:

@OccamsRazor, do you think he will go for that , I'm thinking he would want a minimum of 6 years

 

 

Can't really say without talking to the guy. But i don't want a 35 year old winger making 7 mill a year.

[OccamsRazor]

38 minutes ago, King Knut said:

you kinda know that you'll have a job of some sort or another for the rest of your natural life.

 

 

Exactly.

 

So how much is that worth?? I would think priceless.

 

Hard to put a price on being apart of a club that you say you long for the rest of your life pretty much.

[King Knut]

16 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

Exactly.

 

So how much is that worth?? I would think priceless.

 

Hard to put a price on being apart of a club that you say you long for the rest of your life pretty much.

 

I don't know how much those guys make.  Off hand, I'd guess unless you make it to the level of NHL coach, you're probably earning 7-12 million over 20-25 years.  Weighing that against 14-21 million over three years with the possibility of the same career along a different path after you retire... it really comes down to where you want to be and how much you want to be there. 

[OccamsRazor]

7 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

I don't know how much those guys make.  Off hand, I'd guess unless you make it to the level of NHL coach, you're probably earning 7-12 million over 20-25 years.  Weighing that against 14-21 million over three years with the possibility of the same career along a different path after you retire... it really comes down to where you want to be and how much you want to be there. 

 

 

A lot too is how close do you want to be to where you grew up and closer to your family. That has some to do with it.

 

Like for instance do you want to have to be at the airport and flying during the holidays every year to see your family. How much of a hassle that is too has some to it as well.

 

Maybe Wayne wants to be in the neighborhood/community helping grow the kids interest in the sport.

 

 

No one really knows what he wants to do but him. In the meantime make as much money as you can but have fun while doing so....oh yeah a Cup makes it all better.

[Philly29]

I may be wrong but those contracts suck, and it will make it that much harder to resign Simmer "obviously".

[murraycraven]

If he is looking for a max term and a large payday you have to move him.  As much as I hate it you can't cripple the team's salary cap.   

 

Simmer seems to have a good head on his shoulders but I also won't fault him in trying to get paid.   Tough spot for Hextall but it comes down to business in the end.   

[King Knut]

8 hours ago, Philly29 said:

I may be wrong but those contracts suck, and it will make it that much harder to resign Simmer "obviously".

 

Those contracts do suck and frankly, I can't imagine what either team is thinking.  Hayes at least scored 25 goals... once.  

But Wilson played on a line with one of the best centers in the game and the greatest goal scorer of a generation and was still pretty mediocre.  I can't imagine what the hell the Capitals were thinking other than, "We won the cup finally... DON'T CHANGE ANYTHING!"  

 

 

[King Knut]

21 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

A lot too is how close do you want to be to where you grew up and closer to your family. That has some to do with it.

 

Like for instance do you want to have to be at the airport and flying during the holidays every year to see your family. How much of a hassle that is too has some to it as well.

 

Maybe Wayne wants to be in the neighborhood/community helping grow the kids interest in the sport.

 

 

No one really knows what he wants to do but him. In the meantime make as much money as you can but have fun while doing so....oh yeah a Cup makes it all better.

 

Not to sound all wide eye'd and naive about it, but at this point, I kinda trust Hextall to do what's best for the team with the circumstances he's been given.  This isn't a situation where he's taking a Lehtera in order to make a deal work or signing what he's hoping will be a minutes eating role player in the $2million range.  To me those missteps are excusable because they didn't matter.  Now is when things start to matter.  

 

The Flyers are $13 Million under the cap now and this time next year they'll be an additional $17 Million under, the year after that an additional $11.5 Million at least is coming off the books. 

 

Provo, Konecny & Sanheim Will need bridge contracts next year and Patrick, Lindblom and Myers the year after that.  Whatever needs to happen with Simmer will happen by then, Raffl and Laughton and Weal will either be resigned or replaced by then.  Hopefully many of the holes at forward will be filled from within the organization (Allison, Radcliffe, Frost, Farrabe, Twarynski, etc) , but  the team will probably need at least one or two D men and possibly a Goalie by the fall of 2020 as well.  

 

$42 million is a lot of cap space, but that's also a lot to do, and it'll be a lot easier without $6-$7 million going to Simmer.  It's not impossible by any stretch, but... time will tell.  In Hextall we trust and I kinda do trust him at this point.  

 

 

 

[elmatus]

2 hours ago, King Knut said:

Provo, Konecny & Sanheim Will need bridge contracts next year

 

I doubt Provo will get a bridge. Hexy will just sign him long term right out of his ELC. He should anyway; otherwise, he'll be paying millions more following a bridge.

[King Knut]

1 hour ago, elmatus said:

 

I doubt Provo will get a bridge. Hexy will just sign him long term right out of his ELC. He should anyway; otherwise, he'll be paying millions more following a bridge.

 

 

I totally agree, I'm must running down the bare necessities.  

[Indians58]

Agree with thread premise, Wayne is going to want what they got. I hate it as he is my favorite Flyer.

WHEN to trade is my question! Right now you are getting lesser value because of how he ended last year with injuries. However, if he shows at camp he is healthy and starts the season well, he’s going to have to get get PP time. Taking spot from Patrick - which is ok. However if he and team start well- his value increases - but then you have to trade in season and replace his start. That will certainly be felt in locker room and on ice. 

I also think return in season means getting a replacement in return; unless NAK or someone else deserves chance.

Again IF he and team get off to great start, timing and return is important!

[King Knut]

30 minutes ago, Indians58 said:

Agree with thread premise, Wayne is going to want what they got. I hate it as he is my favorite Flyer.

WHEN to trade is my question! Right now you are getting lesser value because of how he ended last year with injuries. However, if he shows at camp he is healthy and starts the season well, he’s going to have to get get PP time. Taking spot from Patrick - which is ok. However if he and team start well- his value increases - but then you have to trade in season and replace his start. That will certainly be felt in locker room and on ice. 

I also think return in season means getting a replacement in return; unless NAK or someone else deserves chance.

Again IF he and team get off to great start, timing and return is important!

 

I highly doubt Simmer gets traded in season unless the team is doing terribly.  If they're in playoff position, losing his presence any time after camp begins would be too jarring and it's almost definitely something Hextall won't be interested in doing.  

[Indians58]

So he gets traded prior to Opening Night?

[King Knut]

Just now, Indians58 said:

So he gets traded prior to Opening Night?

 

I believe he gets traded before camp or not at all (unless they really really stink).

[OccamsRazor]

I believe it will get sorted out....if not come trade deadline they will get a nice haul for a playoff rental.

[OccamsRazor]

3 hours ago, elmatus said:

I doubt Provo will get a bridge.

 

 

Only thing i'm certain to is Provy will get whatever he wants and will be a Flyer for a long long time.

[RonJeremy]

It's about 3 years before we are serious contenders, and we will have G and Voracek at 33 years old and with diminishing skills/production, still with  big contracts and several years to go on their contracts. As good as Simmonds is , why would we want a third player in a similar situation, when he can be traded for a top young player plus a first round pick and these assets can be up and coming contributors just as we become contenders. 

[King Knut]

21 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

I believe it will get sorted out....if not come trade deadline they will get a nice haul for a playoff rental.

 

I don't think they make a deadline trade (unless it's for a goalie) if the team is in contention at all.  

Remember, this team was battling for first place at the deadline last year.  

 

We like to talk about how they're still 2-3 years away, but most people would have given them the edge if they'd faced the Capitals in the first round instead of the Penguins and the capitals won the damn cup.

 

I'm not saying I expect them to compete for a cup this year, but I am saying that stranger things have happened (see 2010) and I just don't see them trading a valuable asset at the deadline unless it's for something they really really need at the deadline.  

[King Knut]

18 hours ago, RonJeremy said:

It's about 3 years before we are serious contenders, and we will have G and Voracek at 33 years old and with diminishing skills/production, still with  big contracts and several years to go on their contracts. As good as Simmonds is , why would we want a third player in a similar situation, when he can be traded for a top young player plus a first round pick and these assets can be up and coming contributors just as we become contenders. 

 

They shopped him and didn't get the kind of offers Hexy bites on.  So he didn't go anywhere. 

I don't think Hexy brought in JVR for three years from now.  

Maybe we expect them to be competitive in three years time, but that doesn't mean they don't expect themselves to be competitive in the mean time as well.

 

JVR just signed $7million for 5 years.  He's the same age as Simmonds and similar numbers.  Why would they sign him for 5 years and we assume it means they're ready to be competitive soon, but they wouldnt' resign Simmonds for something similar because they're not ready to compete yet?

 

 

 

 

 

[elmatus]

1 hour ago, King Knut said:

JVR just signed $7million for 5 years.  He's the same age as Simmonds and similar numbers.  Why would they sign him for 5 years and we assume it means they're ready to be competitive soon, but they wouldnt' resign Simmonds for something similar because they're not ready to compete yet?

 

Solid point. I think position does matter of course. We needed a 2LW, whereas we have two better-than-Simmonds options on the right at the moment. Also, despite having similar numbers, they don't play a similar game. 

 

As most of us are, I'm pretty curious to see how JVR pans out. It could obviously go either way at this point. You're right in that he's not exactly starting his prime years. At the same time, he will be slotting into a roster that has more talent available than he ever had in Toronto. He has similar numbers to Simmonds without any talented centres. He will have that now. He'll also have better dmen than he ever had in Toronto, and a stronger top six generally. 

 

Sure the current Toronto roster is maturing into a major force now, but that's very recent. He's basically leaving just when the team is finally shaping up into something. His most useful teammates over the years were Kessel, Bozak, and Kadri. That trio doesn't really scream elite to me. Kessel's got his thing, but that thing generally involves volume shooting which would not help JVR much.

 

All to say that I'm not sold on him exactly. It's a lot of money for a guy his age. At the same time, I'm not writing him off either. It'll be an interesting year to watch.