OccamsRazor Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 3 hours ago, ruxpin said: Are you at work? Yes i was but now home about to head to bed....long night on the j-o-b. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted November 2, 2018 Author Share Posted November 2, 2018 56 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: I'm talking about acquiring them with one year left on their deal. Two years wouldn't be killer. But there has to be some talent out there with a year left they could look into adding to help what they already have here. Maybe they will later....in a month or so who knows. Okay, you're talking trade. Yes. Agreed I was still on FA. A little more difficult, though possible. But yeah, what you're talking about is the "be creative" or "be aggressive" thing we're both talking about. But to field this cess pool with $10m sitting there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 12 hours ago, ruxpin said: Several other things: The 3C is a big deal. The drop off in ice time from 1st to 3rd line is astounding, and largely due to the fact that Hak doesn't trust his 3rd line. And that's not because of Simmonds. It's the 3C. And the 3C has been non-existent on the PK. The priority should have been a 3C who excels at the PK. That wasn't done. In fact, the 3C should have been the #1 priority in the offseason. Not a scoring winger. A 3C, then a goalie. Then a 2nd pair veteran defenseman, then a scoring winger. I feel like this was talked about over and over here this summer. Finding a guy to come in and win face offs, play some pk, be cheap and not gum up the works going forward. The problem was, did this guy exist without giving up Phil Meyers before seeing what he can do ? Did this guy sign with another team because he wanted to all along, Riley Sheehan...was he deemed too expensive Bozak, Stasny ? I do know the things we all thought needed upgrading were what you typed there and in that order. I also know that the prospects at forward are starting to pile up between Rubstov, Vorobyev, Vecchione... in LHV so maybe the guy Ron wanted wasn't out there and he hoped one of the 4 guys on the roster, (notice I'm not typing #40 though he hasn't sucked recently) would rise and become the 3C....Thing is, Misha Vorobyev wasn't given much of a chance to grow into the role, the coach stapled his ass to the bench so hard it wasn't funny. So between things not working out over the summer and then again not working out in the beginning of the season here we are. I do question Hakstol's ability at this point. Dudes shouldn't be looking clueless in year 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vis Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 19 hours ago, OccamsRazor said: Execution. Yes, a huge part of it. Last night they played well and executed and they had a very good win, albeit against a struggling team. To be fair, failure to execute could also be a coaching problem. But last night was a good example of a team executing well and keeping at it when things don't go their way. Again, it was against the Kings so I won't get carried away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vis Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 17 hours ago, King Knut said: Because cause your post made me think of these things. Sorry if the the time was abrasive or something but I just think it’s disingenuous to blame A GM for not getting better NHL players from trades or Free Agency when he didn’t have any cap room. Grabner over Weiss would have been nice. But he surprised everyone and Hextall went in on JVR this year. I never absolved hextall of fault, I’m simply pointing out the things I think can realistically be pinned on him and the ones that can’t. Not firing Hakstol when he clearly can’t coach at this level is the biggest one. You said the core was a problem going back to Laviolette, I was merely pointing out that Laviolette is the coach who had his core traded away out from under him and if it’s been a problem since the. It may simply be that the team has had no core since Carter and Richards were traded and Pronger got eye concussioned. Maybe Jake and G are problems. I’m not coming down on a particular opinion there to be honest. My gut says guys that score a point per game tend to be good to have unless they’re named Kovalchuck. Regardless of the above there is CERTAINLY a coaching and systems problem. Both can be true. Systems can certainly make it to LOOK to your eyes like Jake and G are lazy on the back check, but difficult for you to notice that they and Couturier tend to skate about 3 times as much ice surface back and forth as Anyone else on the ice per shift and that they now are playing almost as many minutes a night IN OCTOBER as a #1 d man in the playoffs. Systems absolutely (and almost exclusively) make it so Voracek has no good options on the transition so he has little choice other than to stick handle into a zone and try forcing a risky pass. That’s literally the textbook definition of a system failing a talented player in most cases. Systems are absolutely a reason a team might not play aggressively. That’s kinda what I’m saying. You see lazy and I see Hakstol benching Ghost and TK for trying to be too aggressive and use their skill instead of slowing the game down and hanging back. You see a team not attacking the zone and I see a team waiting to set itself up for a pass from the goal line back to the point for a shot from Gudas instead of generating space on the rush to set up Giroux or TK or Jake or Simmer or Coots in the slot. The lack of aggression in their own zone and on the PK has to be coaching. It’s too Consistent. they are constantly waiting for the other team to make a play. If it WERE the players sitting back, wouldn’t a GOOD coach replace those players or at least TRY another set on the PK? In the D-zone it’s the same thing. You think Hakstol has been telling them to attack attack attack for three years and His favorite players that get all the minutes in those situations keep doing the opposite but he puts Lehtera and Mac our there at the end of the game anyway? A system is is literally about telling players where they are supposed to be or supposed to be going at a given moment to make the flow of play unfold or be stifled the way you want it. If players are consistently out of position, odds are it’s because they’re being coached to be out of position. That’s kinda what a system is, where you go when to execute what kind of play and how that translates from one end of the ice to the other. I’ve always said Hak’s Seem okay at generating zone entries, but they’re kinda crap on generating high % chances, really not good at positioning for the transition to defensive coverage and downright awful at getting a controlled exit out of their own zone. I think its its mostly a systems problem and I think the player issues you’re seeing are a result of that and at this point of Hak just plain losing the room and no one trusting him or his plan. When it doesn’t work this consistently, can you really blame Jake or G or anyone for not pouring 100% effort into things when they know from experience that it’s going to result poorly? 2 years ago Hak saw what was happening to his team and made adjustments. They stopped scoring almost altogether but they started winning more games (including 10 in a row). I chalked that up to him not having the skilled personnel on D to cover the zone. He really should now. Maybe he makes adjustments again, but I haven’t seen many changes and this team is actually talented and it’s time we started seeing that. Gotta be honest. A little tl;dr going on for me with this post, so I didn't read carefully and probably won't reply to everything. In short, I don't think there is a lot of distance between how we feel about the organization. Sounds like we both recognize fault lies among the players, coach and GM. Difference being you seem to allocate more to the coach, particularly in that think system is the root of poor individual play. I think that's where you and I diverge the most. Just a matter of difference of opinion on that. I realize had some limitations, but he hasn't been completely shackled the last few years. Also, @ruxpin made a lot of points I agree with (I hate when that happens), so no use in me reiterating his views on things like the 3C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 1 minute ago, vis said: Gotta be honest. A little tl;dr going on for me with this post, so I didn't read carefully and probably won't reply to everything. In short, I don't think there is a lot of distance between how we feel about the organization. Sounds like we both recognize fault lies among the players, coach and GM. Difference being you seem to allocate more to the coach, particularly in that think system is the root of poor individual play. I think that's where you and I diverge the most. Just a matter of difference of opinion on that. I realize had some limitations, but he hasn't been completely shackled the last few years. Also, @ruxpin made a lot of points I agree with (I hate when that happens), so no use in me reiterating his views on things like the 3C. We'll see how things shake out from here. All of their goals except for Hagg's ENer came from in closer, so maybe Hak is addressing some of the stuff I'm bugged about. They were also 80% and more aggressive on the PK last night... but they were playing the Kings who are playing even worse than the Flyers these days. They keep passing to the slot and having guys shooting from there and I think it'll be a huge start to making us both feel better. Best part is we'll both get to claim we're right. Now the down side is the way the defense plays still concerns the crap out of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vis Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 2 minutes ago, King Knut said: They keep passing to the slot and having guys shooting from there and I think it'll be a huge start to making us both feel better. Best part is we'll both get to claim we're right. For sure. Would love to see heat maps the last two games compared to the previous few games. Yes, these wins came against bad teams whose team defense might be worse than ours, but I'll take what I can get. Curious to see if the chances in the slot continue once they play some better competition. Doesn't hurt they they got good goaltending the last couple of games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted November 2, 2018 Author Share Posted November 2, 2018 1 hour ago, mojo1917 said: I feel like this was talked about over and over here this summer. Finding a guy to come in and win face offs, play some pk, be cheap and not gum up the works going forward. The problem was, did this guy exist without giving up Phil Meyers before seeing what he can do ? Did this guy sign with another team because he wanted to all along, Riley Sheehan...was he deemed too expensive Bozak, Stasny ? I do know the things we all thought needed upgrading were what you typed there and in that order. I also know that the prospects at forward are starting to pile up between Rubstov, Vorobyev, Vecchione... in LHV so maybe the guy Ron wanted wasn't out there and he hoped one of the 4 guys on the roster, (notice I'm not typing #40 though he hasn't sucked recently) would rise and become the 3C....Thing is, Misha Vorobyev wasn't given much of a chance to grow into the role, the coach stapled his ass to the bench so hard it wasn't funny. So between things not working out over the summer and then again not working out in the beginning of the season here we are. I do question Hakstol's ability at this point. Dudes shouldn't be looking clueless in year 4. Really good post. Can't argue with any of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 21 hours ago, JR Ewing said: Age + Playing Style... Yeah. Didn't realize he had turned 30. Not the purest skater by any stretch as it is. Lumbering. This is the key variable in today's game: the rate at which your skating becomes a liability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 20 hours ago, vis said: Last night they played well and executed and they had a very good win, albeit against a struggling team. See sometimes that is what a struggling team needs and i'm not one of the mind set that i am going to discount a win (not saying you are) against a struggling team and win is a win especially in today's tight playoff race....and the Flyers let's be honest are a struggling team too. With the parity inthe race any team can beat any given team i think...all they have to do is going out and out hustle out everything the other team and they can win. So the Flyers are going through a whole lot...from top to bottom so some confidence can put some much needed wind in their sails. They have back to back wins. Let's see how far this can carry them. Next goal?? Get to .500 and go from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 5 hours ago, vis said: Would love to see heat maps the last two games compared to the previous few games. This was last night's... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 6 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: This was last night's... the Flyers side looks much improved a week removed from the Isles game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 30 minutes ago, pilldoc said: the Flyers side looks much improved a week removed from the Isles game. What i think has contributed a lot to all this new found resurgence if you will...is Ivan has returned to the dominant confident franchise defensemen we have seen blossom before our eyes. That my friend can have a huge rippling effect throughout the lineup i think. Combine that with a much more effective Elliott and we are seeing the results. But the offensive side of Ivan's game is really what gets underestimated a lot i think...some may forget he was tied for the NHL lead in goals last year with 17. And just for comparison's sake Drew Doughty only scored 16 in his 2nd season....just saying. Thats is impressive for a two D man playing only his 2nd full season i think. Amazing what confidence can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 2, 2018 Share Posted November 2, 2018 7 hours ago, ruxpin said: Okay, you're talking trade. Yes. Agreed I was still on FA. A little more difficult, though possible. But yeah, what you're talking about is the "be creative" or "be aggressive" thing we're both talking about. But to field this cess pool with $10m sitting there... Yes like i said a about an aggressive move like (for example only not say it has to be this guy) trading for a Tyler Myers who is turning 29 and is in the last year of his deal 5.5 mill cap hit. Ron would have to look around and see if he can find a trade like that would help them in the department of getting ready for a playoff push i mean they don't to react to everyone else's move it ok to lead the charge...set the example he has the the resources to do this. I am not going to spend a lot of time coming up with a scenario for one i don't really have the time right now. But i think you get the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 3, 2018 Share Posted November 3, 2018 On 11/1/2018 at 9:32 AM, Poulin20 said: Hex has misfired a few times with players and I think with Hak as well Yes like trading for Mrazek. He tried and effed it up. But man after watching Mrazek crap the bed 3-0 versus the Yotes tonight, i give Ron kudos for having the balls to acknowledge he f**ked up and moving on from that bum......he makes Elliott look like a Vezina winner....bullet dodged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 5, 2018 Share Posted November 5, 2018 Another thing i'm glad Hextall wised up on............................was letting Manning go. For the Blackhawks he has 2 points 1 goal score the 3rd game of the season and one assist in 10 games since and is -7!!! Thank you Ron now next keep Mcdud out the lineup!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam1986 Posted November 7, 2018 Share Posted November 7, 2018 On 11/1/2018 at 2:25 PM, Podein25 said: I haven't watched very many minutes yet this season, but it looks to me like Simmer has lost a step. Trade him. Do not sign him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.