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elmatus

Flyers and Quenneville?

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So this happened today: 

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We've been chatting about Hakstol's tenure as coach for some time now. Part of the challenge is in finding a suitable replacement that stands to be an actual upgrade and not just a rehash of the same old same old we're used to.

 

Thoughts on Quenneville in this?

 

I'm not saying it's likely by any stretch. I expect he'll have plenty of calls. Why would he choose Philly among all those? I also don't think Hexy is looking to replace Hakstol right now.

 

Still, I do think it's worth ruminating. 

Edited by radoran
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Just now, intheslot said:

Just Say No.. !!!

Care to elaborate? :)

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33 minutes ago, elmatus said:

So this happened today: 

Hidden Content

    Give reaction or reply to this topic to see the hidden content.

 

We've been chatting about Hakstol's tenure as coach for some time now. Part of the challenge is in finding a suitable replacement that stands to be an actual upgrade and not just a rehash of the same old same old we're used to.

 

Thoughts on Quenneville in this?

 

I'm not saying it's likely by any stretch. I expect he'll have plenty of calls. Why would he choose Philly among all those? I also don't think Hexy is looking to replace Hakstol right now.

 

Still, I do think it's worth ruminating. 

 

 

Well, if I am Hextall I am certainly making a call to see where his head is at...  I would take Q any day of the week.  I don't think he is stale whatsoever.  Look at Chicago's roster today...  it is a far cry from their Cup days.  If you have a shot to get a proven future HOF Coach you at least test the waters.  

 

With that said... I imagine Hextall will not even consider it since we just went for 7/8 points to 3 weak teams and 1 good team.  If anyone can tell me why Hak is a better Coach than Q I am all ears... I also have some nice property on time share in Guam to sell you at a discounted price.

Edited by murraycraven

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Not yes, but Hell Yes; Hextall needs to call and explore this option.

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I wonder what the words from Q would be to convince Hextall to fire Hakstol and hire him, should he be interested ?

Quennville coached that team from the time their core were pups, so I don't think he'd be a downgrade as far as player development goes.

 

I know Ron is loyal, I don't think he'd enter into this potential situation carelessly either.

I've been a fan of Q going back to his days in St Louis, that team played hard for him. 

He's the guy I would want to coach my team of all the guys I know of. 

I'm sure there are Sean McVey types out there in jr that I don't know, but Q is a proven winner, you don't hear about guys tuning him out ala Fonzi or Hitch.  

IMO It would be irresponsible for Hextall to not give him a call and talk shop. 

 

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There is no salary cap on coaches. Make the man a very well compensated "assistant" coach who is behind Hakstol. He gets a chance to come in, work with Hakstol on changes that should be made, and take the helm should the team keep having issues. He could actually help Hakstol to be a better coach. Silly idea, huh?

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26 minutes ago, flyerrod said:

Make the man a very well compensated "assistant" coach who is behind Hakstol.

 

 

No future Hall of Fame coach is coming in as an assistant.    

 

Like Babcock - he wont be interviewing...  he will be interviewing Teams.

Edited by murraycraven

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1 hour ago, murraycraven said:

 

 

With that said... I imagine Hextall will not even consider it since we just went for 7/8 points to 3 weak teams and 1 good team.  If anyone can tell me why Hak is a better Coach than Q I am all ears... I also have some nice property on time share in Guam to sell you at a discounted price.

I'm afraid you are dead on here.  Those 7/8 points probably hurt more than it helped.  If they got 2/8, I wonder how hard hextall would go after Quinville.

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2 minutes ago, icehole said:

I'm afraid you are dead on here.  Those 7/8 points probably hurt more than it helped.  If they got 2/8, I wonder how hard hextall would go after Quinville.

 

They are average just enough to **** everything up - LOL.   Q would be a great hire but I just think Hextall will be waiting this out to see how the team does.  If anything I think Hak could be relieved of his duties if they are not improved from last year's results.  

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13 minutes ago, murraycraven said:

 

They are average just enough to **** everything up - LOL.   Q would be a great hire but I just think Hextall will be waiting this out to see how the team does.  If anything I think Hak could be relieved of his duties if they are not improved from last year's results.  

 

I'm presuming "making the playoffs" is a stone cold, mortal lock as a requirement.

 

What constitutes "improvement" beyond that do you think? 43 wins? Losing the first round in seven? 😎

 

It would surprise me - if Quenneville wants back in rightnow - that he would be still available in June. If you're LA, aren't you picking up the phone right now?

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14 minutes ago, Jam1986 said:

Why him?

Why not him?

 

I should note this is predicated on the idea that Hakstol has done nothing to prove he belongs at this level -- which is certainly my position on matters. Someone who believes otherwise may disagree with finding any replacement for him, which is fair. But that's just not how I see the current coaching situation. To me, the entire coaching staff should have been gutted this past off-season. Given that it wasn't, I feel completely justified in looking at possible coaching upgrades now.

 

In terms of best chances of being such an upgrade, Quenneville certainly ranks quite high on the list. With the possible exception of Babs, there are plenty who would argue he's been the best coach of the last decade. He's a slam dunk for the hall of fame, and has a tremendous winning record that includes three Stanley Cups.

 

Again, if what we want is an upgrade, it's hard to imagine a better option at the moment. 

 

18 minutes ago, murraycraven said:

 

They are average just enough to **** everything up - LOL.   Q would be a great hire but I just think Hextall will be waiting this out to see how the team does.  If anything I think Hak could be relieved of his duties if they are not improved from last year's results.  

I hate it, but you're completely right. It would be very out of character for Hexy to drop a coach mid-season. If we see a coaching change, I would expect it to be during the off-season. I'm not even sure it will happen then, but I do think it's much more likely than a sudden drop now.

 

40 minutes ago, murraycraven said:

 

 

No future Hall of Fame coach is coming in as an assistant.    

 

Like Babcock - he wont be interviewing...  he will be interviewing Teams.

This is also 100% correct.

 

If Quenneville isn't an NHL HC somewhere by xmas, it will be because he has chosen to take time off. It definitely won't be for lack of suitors.

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2 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

I'm presuming "making the playoffs" is a stone cold, mortal lock as a requirement.

 

What constitutes "improvement" beyond that do you think? 43 wins? Losing the first round in seven? 😎

 

It would surprise me - if Quenneville wants back in rightnow - that he would be still available in June. If you're LA, aren't you picking up the phone right now?

 

That is where things get a little wonky.

 

To me improvement is a 100 point (+) season and winning in the first round.   IMO, outside of Hextall adding JvR we are still stuck with the same BS in goal and still need a 3rd line center.  Weal has skill but I am not a fan of the penalties and he also gets pushed off the puck way too easily.  

 

Since Hextall has neglected the Goalie position I feel like he has built-in excuses for Hak if they should take a step back.   I am on the side of the fence that Hak will never be the coach that gets the team over the hump.  To me if you have a shot at getting a top tier coach you have to kick the tires.   

 

I agree about Q as well.  I think he sits out the season and then picks the team he is most comfortable with and a team that is a contender or on the cusp of contending - and I don't think the Flyers are either of those things.

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2 minutes ago, elmatus said:

Why not him?

 

I should note this is predicated on the idea that Hakstol has done nothing to prove he belongs at this level -- which is certainly my position on matters. Someone who believes otherwise may disagree with finding any replacement for him, which is fair. But that's just not how I see the current coaching situation. To me, the entire coaching staff should have been gutted this past off-season. Given that it wasn't, I feel completely justified in looking at possible coaching upgrades now.

 

In terms of best chances of being such an upgrade, Quenneville certainly ranks quite high on the list. With the possible exception of Babs, there are plenty who would argue he's been the best coach of the last decade. He's a slam dunk for the hall of fame, and has a tremendous winning record that includes three Stanley Cups.

 

Again, if what we want is an upgrade, it's hard to imagine a better option at the moment. 

 

I hate it, but you're completely right. It would be very out of character for Hexy to drop a coach mid-season. If we see a coaching change, I would expect it to be during the off-season. I'm not even sure it will happen then, but I do think it's much more likely than a sudden drop now.

 

This is also 100% correct.

 

If Quenneville isn't an NHL HC somewhere by xmas, it will be because he has chosen to take time off. It definitely won't be for lack of suitors.

 

 

 

100%

 

The Q situation will be just like Babcock 2.0.

 

He can pick where he wants to go...

Edited by murraycraven

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2 hours ago, intheslot said:

Stale and out of gas ..

 

I don't know that Coach Q is. I think his defense corps, yes you, Keith and Seabrook is out of gas, though.. THAT is not Quenneville's fault. Like Darryl Sutter, if he wants another head coaching job, he'll get one in 10 minutes. Considering the fact that the game is still won with a lot of skill, speed and good goaltending, the game has not passed him by.

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2 minutes ago, murraycraven said:

I agree about Q as well.  I think he sits out the season and then picks the team he is most comfortable with and a team that is a contender or on the cusp of contending - and I don't think the Flyers are either of those things.

This is such a hard thing to come to grips with, isn't it? I know it is for me.

 

Granted, I'm a fan, which means I'm cursed with a bias that's very hard to shake off. Still, when looking at the current Flyers roster, it certainly seems like it should be a team very much on the upswing. It looks like a team that has it all.

 

We have a franchise player and captain coming off a sickening 100+ pt season. We have a solid cast of vets backing him up (at forward anyway). We have a slew of young guns who show every indication of being on the cusp of breaking out into elite top six players. On the back end, we have a a young core, but that core is touted as being one of the best in the league by analysts on a regular basis. Sure, we have awful goaltending, and that is important, but that surely can't account for missing the playoffs when everything else is taken into consideration.

 

And yet despite all of this, the team is underachieving yet again under Hakstol. There is a solid chance they're not making the playoffs at all, let alone challenging for the division lead as so many pundits claimed they would before the season started.

 

To go back to your post: They *should* be a a team on the cusp of contending. The fact they're not is something that is difficult to reconcile at this point.

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14 minutes ago, murraycraven said:

  I think he sits out the season and then picks the team he is most comfortable with and a team that is a contender or on the cusp of contending - and I don't think the Flyers are either of those things.

I disagree,

There are a lot of good young players in this organization, some highly skilled veteran players...the Flyers could be an ideal situation for a guy like Q to come into. The team is stuck in neutral, he could come in and very quickly turn the vets around, while nurturing the young players, and be very competitive for the next 5 to 8 years, should he want to do that. He would be coming into a situation that is not too dissimilar from a situation where he has shown to be effective.

For example I don't think he plasters Vorobyev to the bench and ships him back to LV, I think he finds a way to, you know, coach the kid. 

Frost, O'Brien, Farrabee are in the wings to join Patrick, TK Provorov and Sanheim....I feel there are many similarities between where the Hawks were and where the Flyers are today.

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Would take Quenneville in a minute.

 

Question is whether he wants to be hired right away.  He's been coaching for 11 years in a row.  Lots of long post-seasons sprinkled in.  Why not take a little time to recharge?  Not to mention, more jobs will open up in summer which will enable him to maximize his salary.  I don't know.  If I'm Q, I sit back, do a little TV and cash in during the summer.  I also think Quenneville is a little old school in that he may feel uneasy taking a job away from a coach mid-season.

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So, what got Q fired?  Poor results?  One too many squabbles with Bowman?

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28 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

I disagree,

There are a lot of good young players in this organization, some highly skilled veteran players...the Flyers could be an ideal situation for a guy like Q to come into. The team is stuck in neutral, he could come in and very quickly turn the vets around, while nurturing the young players, and be very competitive for the next 5 to 8 years, should he want to do that. He would be coming into a situation that is not too dissimilar from a situation where he has shown to be effective.

For example I don't think he plasters Vorobyev to the bench and ships him back to LV, I think he finds a way to, you know, coach the kid. 

Frost, O'Brien, Farrabee are in the wings to join Patrick, TK Provorov and Sanheim....I feel there are many similarities between where the Hawks were and where the Flyers are today.

 

 

I dont disagree with the talent but I am sorry - they are still 3-4 years away from being a true contender when you look at the east right now.  Not every prospect is going to pan out.  And there is still that goal tending issue that has haunted us forever.  Hart has been less than stellar and don't expect him to be in the NHL for another 2 years.  Hopefully, he is the real deal but until he performs up to the expectations we are still in limbo and most likely signing another bridge goalie.   

 

Can he build a team that is very competitive given the opportunity?  Absolutely and that is the reason I would ditch Hak but to think Q coming in here and we immediately become a contender is fools gold.   Until the prospects pan out and the goalie situation is solved, or at least adequate, this team will remain in neutral.   

 

Just b/c Frost and Farrabee might be here in two years does not guarantee this team is better in the standings.  Yes, they will be more talented but that does not translate into guaranteed wins right off the bat.  Prospects and rookies take time to find their game in the NHL.

 

Does Q help the process more than Hak?  Absolutely and that is why I wish Hextall would offer him a huge contract today and say goodbye to Hak and his merry band of AHL coaches.  

 

We are approaching year 5 of Hextall's master plan and the product on the ice is no closer than it was last year or the year before.   I am all for patience but every time anybody argues about the "plan" we are consistently always a "few years away."   That has not changed in the last handful of years IMO - we ARE STILL a few years away.  

 

Getting a coach of Q's caliber will only help when we FINALLY start contending.  Otherwise, Hak will keep playing the "heavy" players when a crucial game is on the line.  

 

But, i digress....  Hextall (1) doesn't have the balls to make this type of move and (2) Hak is safe until things go wildly off the rails.  Until then we can all enjoy mediocre hockey with a chance of making the playoffs.   

 

Give the players a coach that is a future Hall of Famer that is widely respected.  They either put up or you ship them out...

 

 

Edited by murraycraven

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1 hour ago, murraycraven said:

To me improvement is a 100 point (+) season and winning in the first round.

 

1 hour ago, murraycraven said:

I think he sits out the season and then picks the team he is most comfortable with and a team that is a contender or on the cusp of contending - and I don't think the Flyers are either of those things.

 

This is confusing to me. 100+ points put the Flyers in the top 4 or 5 in the conference. How is that not a contender? 

 

I get that we have goalie issues, 'youth' issues related to inexperience and development, and questionable coaching. But if the team can still manage to rack up 100+ points, they are a contender in my mind. The same way every other 100+ point team is a contender, yet the same way ALL of them will fail to make it to the Cup final except one.

 

We are not alone in having 'issues.' 

 

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    • 4
      Post
      So this happened today:  Hidden Content Give reaction or reply to this topic to see the hidden content.   We've been chatting about Hakstol's tenure as coach for some time now. Part of the challenge is in finding a suitable replacement that stands to be an actual upgrade and not just a rehash of the same old same old we're used to.   Thoughts on Quenneville in this?   I'm not saying it's likely by any stretch. I expect he'll have plenty of calls. Why would he choose Philly among all those? I also don't think Hexy is looking to replace Hakstol right now.   Still, I do think it's worth ruminating. 
    • 4
      Post
      Yes, and it should be that way. He's a 3 time champion as Head Coach. The question really is, let's face it, does Hextall want someone who he can control a little, or does he want more of a coach who has won 3 Stanley Cups that he might feel a bit inferior to?
    • 3
      Post
      Not yes, but Hell Yes; Hextall needs to call and explore this option.
    • 3
      Post
      Why not him?   I should note this is predicated on the idea that Hakstol has done nothing to prove he belongs at this level -- which is certainly my position on matters. Someone who believes otherwise may disagree with finding any replacement for him, which is fair. But that's just not how I see the current coaching situation. To me, the entire coaching staff should have been gutted this past off-season. Given that it wasn't, I feel completely justified in looking at possible coaching upgrades now.   In terms of best chances of being such an upgrade, Quenneville certainly ranks quite high on the list. With the possible exception of Babs, there are plenty who would argue he's been the best coach of the last decade. He's a slam dunk for the hall of fame, and has a tremendous winning record that includes three Stanley Cups.   Again, if what we want is an upgrade, it's hard to imagine a better option at the moment.    I hate it, but you're completely right. It would be very out of character for Hexy to drop a coach mid-season. If we see a coaching change, I would expect it to be during the off-season. I'm not even sure it will happen then, but I do think it's much more likely than a sudden drop now.   This is also 100% correct.   If Quenneville isn't an NHL HC somewhere by xmas, it will be because he has chosen to take time off. It definitely won't be for lack of suitors.
    • 3
      Post
      I'd love to see Quenneville be the head coach in Philadelphia. Look at the players that were developed under his watch:   Kane Toews Keith Seabrook Saad Panarin Hjalmarsson Ladd Byfuglien Bolland Brouwer Versteeg DeBrincat Schmaltz Crawford   That's an incredibly impressive list. Three Stanley Cup wins as well. The guy knows how to coach and get the best out of his players. The only thing I'd like to see if he were to come to Philadelphia is that he bring back Mike Kitchen with him and that Knoblauch and Dillabaugh keep their jobs. Penalty Kill gets fixed immediately, the defense actually gets some structure and the youth gets served (there's ZERO reason why Sanheim is getting shite for ice time) and there's an actual system that's in place, no some pathetic, second rate, Hakshell-SackHack, garbage, bottom feeding system that is barely passable as even to be classified as a system. Yes, I hate the Hakstol garbage brand of hockey very much.   Realistically though, I know that Quenneville isn't coming to Philadelphia. Hextall simply doesn't have the stones to crap can Hakstol.  
    • 2
      Post
      I don't know that Coach Q is. I think his defense corps, yes you, Keith and Seabrook is out of gas, though.. THAT is not Quenneville's fault. Like Darryl Sutter, if he wants another head coaching job, he'll get one in 10 minutes. Considering the fact that the game is still won with a lot of skill, speed and good goaltending, the game has not passed him by.

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