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OccamsRazor

The future is here: Carter Hart

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1 hour ago, Digityman said:

As of today, chances of making the playoffs:

Buffalo = 50%

Flyers = 1%

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Wow. Long time no see.  Where have you been?

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1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Are you talking from experience says the team who hasn't been there since 2010-11...

 

....and lost to the Flyers...last playoff win was 2006-07. No playoffs again for the Sabres...

 

 

Sure OK.  You are like the energizer bunny.  You just keep on tickin.  Sabres make it. 

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50 minutes ago, Hockey Junkie said:

Sabres make it. 

I think so, too, but they are falling like a rock and need to get things turned around again. It's a long season and likely a mid-season lull, but....

 

I do think they have a decent shot, though. 

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3 hours ago, brelic said:

 

I think this is missing the entire argument. It's not about what Hart might have hypothetically done had he started in the NHL. It's dependent on so many factors.

 

The larger point is that I suspect 30 other GMs would also have opted to start Hart - a freshly-turned 20 year old goalie at the time in his first professional season - in the AHL. He was seen as the goalie of the future, the guy to bring stability between the pipes for the next decade plus. There was absolutely no rush to bring him in that young without some time to acclimate in the AHL and see how he adjusts. Hell, he had his power cut off because he didn't understand he had to pay power bills! 

 

I get the point you're trying to make - but I don't think any GM makes that decision.

 

 

Doesn't matter.

 

If he stayed up and played well Hextall, Hak, Weise and Weal would all be Flyers.

 

I'm happy they are not.

 

Let's move on it can't be changed anyways.

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1 hour ago, ruxpin said:

I do think they have a decent shot, though. 

 

tenor.gif?itemid=8846428&key=f4e7bb95fb5e8228fe3bc3f0da6bbf3268abeb37e53942c7d7e8f368fcd20f0f

Edited by OccamsRazor

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59 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

tenor.gif?itemid=8846428&key=f4e7bb95fb5e8228fe3bc3f0da6bbf3268abeb37e53942c7d7e8f368fcd20f0f

Lol. 

 

Largely because I'm not bullish on Montreal or Carolina, though of the two I'm concerned with Carolina if I'm Buffalo. 

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Nice accolade from Kevin Weekes on NHLnetwork his top 5 young future goalies:

 

#5 Laurent Brossoit

 

#4 Mackenzie Blackwood

 

#3 Jusse Saros

 

#2 Linus Ullmark

 

#1 Carter Hart - only ever two time CHL goalie of the year winner!

 

Nice.

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9 hours ago, Hockey Junkie said:

You said the Flyers might get in. We shall see.  I say the Sabres have a far better chance and most people with any common sense agree

 

Well well you guys lose again. 1-0.

 

Man can even muster one goal?

 

Flyers are only 8 points behind you.

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Flyers have some really sick depth in goal.

 

DyPi9v0W0AELGeS.jpg

 

 

 

When the time is right they will have some good pieces for trades because won't be enough room for all these guys.

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18 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

When the time is right they will have some good pieces for trades because won't be enough room for all these guys.

 

What do you mean?

 

I count 7 goalies. That's exactly enough. :)

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9 minutes ago, brelic said:

 

What do you mean?

 

I count 7 goalies. That's exactly enough. :)

 

There are only 4 spots.

 

2 on the Flyers 2 on the Phantoms.

 

You won't be able to hold all these guy on the Phantoms.

 

And once Sandstrom for instance has proven himself I don't think he will happy be Hart's backup for 10 years.

 

And if you bring Ustimenko over next year too well it speeds things up a little.

 

Then you will need room for Ustimenko and then Ersson and that isn't even taking into consideration of Fedotov and even Tomek.

 

Limited room in a few years. Only one guy can play at a time.

 

It will be a good problem to have when they get there.

 

It will buy sometime if Ersson and Fedotov stay and play in the SHL and KHL another year or two.

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18 hours ago, ruxpin said:

I think so, too, but they are falling like a rock and need to get things turned around again. It's a long season and likely a mid-season lull, but....

 

I do think they have a decent shot, though. 

They played well last night.  Bishop was lights out. I do not understand why he was allowed to get away by Tampa.  Could come back to bite them later.  Now we go home for 7 straight.  Hawks and Wild to start out. Not easy.  

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11 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Well well you guys lose again. 1-0.

 

Man can even muster one goal?

 

Flyers are only 8 points behind you.

It was a game we should have won IMO.  Dallas is the new Devils.  They keep 5 men back.  The goalie, Bishop was on fire and now I see why they are in these 1-0 games all the time. Their offense sucks. We tied the game and lost a challenge on goalie interference by that frenchman we got from Montreal that rarely plays, Belemeau or something like that. The Dallas player knocked him into the goalie but we lost the challenge and Scandella's tying goal was taken down

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1 minute ago, Hockey Junkie said:

that frenchman we got from Montreal that rarely plays, Belemeau or something like that.

 

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

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2 minutes ago, Hockey Junkie said:

It was a game we should have won IMO.  Dallas is the new Devils.  They keep 5 men back.  The goalie, Bishop was on fire and now I see why they are in these 1-0 games all the time. Their offense sucks. We tied the game and lost a challenge on goalie interference by that frenchman we got from Montreal that rarely plays, Belemeau or something like that. The Dallas player knocked him into the goalie but we lost the challenge and Scandella's tying goal was taken down

 

Yeah they do like to clog the neutral zone a lot the Flyers beat them a week or so back 2-1 Flyers just out to a lead quick and they played it safe mostly kind of boring to watch. Carter Hart should have had the shut out but since the Flyers took their foot off the pedal they finally score with 2 minutes left.

 

If the Flyers didn't have such a shi ity power play they could have had a bigger lead.  

 

The Stars did beat them in the faceoff circle and that is saying something Flyers are the top faceoff team in the NHL.

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16 minutes ago, Hockey Junkie said:

They played well last night.  Bishop was lights out. I do not understand why he was allowed to get away by Tampa.  Could come back to bite them later.  Now we go home for 7 straight.  Hawks and Wild to start out. Not easy.  

Vasy is better and younger.  They also couldn't afford to pay him with all the forwards they needed to sign. 

 

Bishop is decent and has his moments, but not as good as Vasy. 

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@OccamsRazor

You do understand brelic was making a joke based on all the goalies the Flyers needed this year, right ?

 

 

 

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18 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Doesn't matter.

 

If he stayed up and played well Hextall, Hak, Weise and Weal would all be Flyers.

 

I'm happy they are not.

 

Let's move on it can't be changed anyways.

 

If he'd stayed up under Hakstol, he'd be just another foot note in the Flyers history of goaltending flops and his Sports Psychologist would be getting OT pay at this point.

 

Weise and Weal still performed better for the Flyers this year than Lehtera and Varone have sorry to say. Almost twice as many Points/60 for both Weise and Weal than Lehtera or Varone had...  But I'll give Varone props for having a slightly better +/- per 60 than Weal.  

 

Weise and Weal weren't good, but they weren't the problem.  Hakstol and maybe Gordo very clearly have the ignominy of that honor. 

 

Hextall's shame is that he either didn't see it or saw it and STILL didn't do anything about the coaches, not the players. It's amusing the way the team (minus Jake) is politely trying to skirt around saying so when asked about their win streak.  

 

I suppose it's possible that Hextall did see it and just didn't want to fire him and thought he had a long enough leash to wait out the season and see if the team could eek out another playoff berth.  But if so, then that was a mistake too because in his own estimation, it was finally (albeit the start of) "go time."  

 

I would have more faith in the direction things are headed now, but it doesn't seem that coaching was the sticking point for Homer and Scott either.  If nothing else, Fletcher could see that Hakstol had to go why it took a few weeks, I never understand.  Probably because they were wooing Joel Q and couldn't pry him back to a new team this year.  

 

Addressing the talent level of the team going forward, replacing Weal and Weise on the roster with guys who are performing decidedly worse than they are isn't my idea of fixing anything.  

 

The goaltending has made a difference.  I wouldn't have started Hart in the NHL either.  I'm not sure many people would have.  And if we recall, he didn't light the AHL on fire right away either.  It was likely very good for him to start there.

 

I will take it a step further though and say that if he'd been brought up while Hakstol was still running things, we'd all be very concerned about him right now.

 

Even as things were, he started his career 2-4-1 because the Flyers were still shaking off the shackles of Hakstolism.  They have been playing significantly better in front of him which isn't to take anything away from him, but rather just to further point out that it's coaching coaching coaching that's making a difference and we should all thank heaven every game that Hart wasn't brought up before Hakstol was fired. 

 

As far as Hextall goes, I'm sticking to my guns and my guns tell me his prospect assessment was great, his cap management was brilliant and his pro assessment was just fine... except in the coaching department where it was inexcusably god awful.

 

What does it matter at this point?  Because now that the team has tossed out the tainted bath water, I don't want them tossing out the baby too.  That's why it matters.

 

 

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, mojo1917 said:

@OccamsRazor

You do understand brelic was making a joke based on all the goalies the Flyers needed this year, right ?

 

 

 

 

No i totally missed i was on the phone with the wife and getting dressed to head out to the gym...multi tasking which i guess i sucked at so no straight over my head.

 

Image result for joke over head gif

 

#itslindrosfault

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1 hour ago, King Knut said:

Weise and Weal still performed better for the Flyers this year than Lehtera and Varone have sorry to say. Almost twice as many Points/60 for both Weise and Weal than Lehtera or Varone had...  But I'll give Varone props for having a slightly better +/- per 60 than Weal.

 

Sure however Varone has played sparingly on the 4th line and Weise and Weal have played all the way up to the 2nd line at some points this season.

 

However these 3 are hardly the problem with this club.

 

The goaltending has let the club down along with the PK and power play yet the goaltending and PK have gotten better which has contributed to the wins picking up.

 

At least if you can't score on the man advantage stop the other team from scoring and they have gotten better.

 

Not sure if it is due to the PK figuring something out or due to just the goalies finally stopping the puck i'm going to lean towards the latter.

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1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Sure however Varone has played sparingly on the 4th line and Weise and Weal have played all the way up to the 2nd line at some points this season.

 

Two of the many reasons Hakstol needed to have been fired two years ago.

 

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

The goaltending has let the club down along with the PK and power play yet the goaltending and PK have gotten better which has contributed to the wins picking up.

 

At least if you can't score on the man advantage stop the other team from scoring and they have gotten better.

 

Not sure if it is due to the PK figuring something out or due to just the goalies finally stopping the puck i'm going to lean towards the latter.

 

It all started to switch about the time Gordon switched their forechecking and the defensive assignments.  I think he's playing more of a 1-3-1 5v5 and pressuring a lot more on the PK.   Getting better goaltending has helped, but they were getting adequate goaltending from Elliott.  The difference is that before they were giving up a LOT of high % chances and now they're giving up a LOT of low % chances and some high % chances that Hart and Stolie have been able to get to.  

 

If you recall, Hart had some terrible games (3 G on 10 shots, 4 G on 14 shots) that I really don't blame on him because the team was giving up golden opportunity after golden opportunity because defensively, they were always out of position.  They were frequently out of position offensively too.  That's the way they were playing for most of the year and why their record is so bad.  

 

It's all deceptive because their record didn't get REALLY bad until December and frankly that's purely a testament to the talent of the players on the ice (the players many seem to think can't cut it).  

 

In reality, they were playing a terribly designed game for several years that somehow got even worse this year.  

 

Now they're playing a somewhat appropriately designed but not game changing game that's working for them and not against them.  

 

  

 

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23 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

Two of the many reasons Hakstol needed to have been fired two years ago.

 

 

It all started to switch about the time Gordon switched their forechecking and the defensive assignments.  I think he's playing more of a 1-3-1 5v5 and pressuring a lot more on the PK.   Getting better goaltending has helped, but they were getting adequate goaltending from Elliott.  The difference is that before they were giving up a LOT of high % chances and now they're giving up a LOT of low % chances and some high % chances that Hart and Stolie have been able to get to.  

 

If you recall, Hart had some terrible games (3 G on 10 shots, 4 G on 14 shots) that I really don't blame on him because the team was giving up golden opportunity after golden opportunity because defensively, they were always out of position.  They were frequently out of position offensively too.  That's the way they were playing for most of the year and why their record is so bad.  

 

It's all deceptive because their record didn't get REALLY bad until December and frankly that's purely a testament to the talent of the players on the ice (the players many seem to think can't cut it).  

 

In reality, they were playing a terribly designed game for several years that somehow got even worse this year.  

 

Now they're playing a somewhat appropriately designed but not game changing game that's working for them and not against them.  

 

  

 

 

I don't think it has a damn thing to do with "systems" and 1-3-1 5v5 and all that jazz (PK changes maybe) and almost everything to do with goaltending and, equally more importantly, the players' confidence in their goaltending. But I barely watch these days, so I could be mistaken (mostly watching curling lately). 

 

Edited by Podein25

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5 hours ago, ruxpin said:

Vasy is better and younger.  They also couldn't afford to pay him with all the forwards they needed to sign. 

 

Bishop is decent and has his moments, but not as good as Vasy. 

Disagree totally

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6 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Yeah they do like to clog the neutral zone a lot the Flyers beat them a week or so back 2-1 Flyers just out to a lead quick and they played it safe mostly kind of boring to watch. Carter Hart should have had the shut out but since the Flyers took their foot off the pedal they finally score with 2 minutes left.

 

If the Flyers didn't have such a shi ity power play they could have had a bigger lead.  

 

The Stars did beat them in the faceoff circle and that is saying something Flyers are the top faceoff team in the NHL.

The way to beat Dallas is to get the lead on them.  Ullmark was lights out so cant blame him.  I would rather have him in than Hutton.  We will see what Housley does. Does he have the balls to do it. Dallas only won because of Bishop.  We do not see much of them so no sense and even giving it another thought.  I am not even sure if we play them again?  We have bigger fish to fry starting Friday.  I am not unhappy with the way we played. I only wish Housley would keep Pilut in the lineup over the Frenchman from Montreal

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9 minutes ago, Podein25 said:

 

I don't think it has a damn thing to do with "systems" and 1-3-1 5v5 and all that jazz (PK changes maybe) and almost everything to do with goaltending and, equally more importantly, the players' confidence in their goaltending. But I barely watch these days, so I could be mistaken (mostly watching curling lately). 

 

 

You're not all wrong, but you're not right.  

 

Hart has made a huge difference, but I guarantee you if the team was playing in front of him the way they were in front of Elliott or the other 6 before Gordon made the changes, they wouldn't have won 6/7 and his stats would be in the toilet and no one would be talking about him.  

 

In Hart's first 6 games, he faced an average of only 25 shots per game and his save % was an uninspiring .900.  But it was rocky- Some games were good and some were bad.  It was a wide spread.

 

In the 7 games since, the shot total has increased to 35 per game, but his save % has shot up to .935.  They're playing better in front of him.  

 

In the games before the shift in the team's play (I'm pointing to Somehwere in between the Calgary game they lost in OT and the St. Louis Game) the goaltending (including Hart) was hitting a save % of .884 despite only giving up 29 shots per game.    In the games since I'm noticing the switch (including 1 game by McKenna and 1 game by Stolarz) the goaltending has produced a save % of .935 despite facing an average of over 35 shots per night.  6 more shots per night, but the goalies are saving significantly more shots.  

 

The team is playing better defense.  They're allowing fewer high % shots and a lot more low % shots.  

 

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      Post
      RE: "the book" I was thinking this too. First time through the league the pro scouts haven't had a good look at him, neither have the skaters. The part that gives me hope though,  is much like Matt Murray the puck "just hits him"...he sees the game well. There's as guy going backdoor for a cross ice pass...Hart is in position to be square to the shooter,  he's not rushing he's not sliding he's crouched and ready and has the angle closed down.  That part I know will vary from time to time, b
    • 5
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      It's not a coincidence that Hart's numbers are better now then when he first came up.   The team in front of him are playing much better and are literally "playing for him."   As someone said above, if Hart would have been with the big club to start the season, he's numbers wouldn't look nearly as rosy as they do now.    I think Hexy was right to start Hart in the AHL.   I don't think Hart would have saved the team from sinking to the basement of the NHL and potentially could have caus
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      I think this is missing the entire argument. It's not about what Hart might have hypothetically done had he started in the NHL. It's dependent on so many factors.   The larger point is that I suspect 30 other GMs would also have opted to start Hart - a freshly-turned 20 year old goalie at the time in his first professional season - in the AHL. He was seen as the goalie of the future, the guy to bring stability between the pipes for the next decade plus. There was absolutely no rush to
    • 4
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      I just don't see it he is just so sound fundamentally checks all the boxes on what you would want in your goalie.   I mean i have read about the stuff on him from reports. But the best part is i am SEEING THEM!!   For myself only seeing is believing. So i hope he keeps it trending upwards.   And he has been talking to a shrink since juniors sounds like he has a head start of many who play goalie in the NHL.   Most of us know how mental playing goalie can b
    • 4
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      Ron Hextall was an NHL goalie who benefited greatly from his time in the AHL, so could it be his handling of Hart was informed by his own personal experience ? Added to his view to the development of Jonathan Quick ?  And let's be honest, Carter didn't exactly tear it up in the AHL in his first few weeks/ months so, maybe back off the mains a little on this one?  Kid needed to learn to be a pro, better to do that in Allentown than under the microscope that is the goaltender position in
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      What do you mean?   I count 7 goalies. That's exactly enough.

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