-=> FLYERS TRADE DEADLINE THREAD <=-

[flyercanuck]

4 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

That's all ya got. Ok.

 

Well I'm not sure what "the way I went" means from you when I was responding to brelic.

 

What are you...my wife?   

[flyercanuck]

22 minutes ago, elmatus said:

 

Hartnell definitely. I hated it then, and I still hate it now. I wouldn't consider the Schenn trade a bad one. He got a solid haul for a guy who was a liability on the ice more often than not. I could easily see Frost being just as good or better than Schenn was. We still have time to judge this one I think.

 

But yes, I agree with you on the timeline front as well. Fletch deserves more than three months before we throw him to the wolves. Let's start by seeing what he does about the coaching staff in the off season. That will be a big one for me.

 

 I think he referred to the roster player being the anchor...not the 2-1sts.

 

 My issue with Fletcher is his entire history as a gm...not his 3 months in Philly. If he turns the team into a contender I'll jump on his bandwagon. But I'm not jumping on it just because Homer hired him. 

[King Knut]

2 hours ago, brelic said:

I mean, at the end of the day, Fletcher has not harmed this team, and in fact, he's done a lot of little tweaks that have made the team better.

 

No, at the end of the day, he's made it significantly better by firing Hakstol.  That's ALL that needed to happen.  That's part of what's bugging me about all this.  

 

Fletcher wasn't brought in to "not harm the team"  he was brought in to make a splash, and "spend to the cap" to get the team where it needed to be.  The team is significantly better, but he has only she cap space and he hasn't added any pieces other than Hartman (and Talbot if he ever figures out how to read a map-but I'll count him after he shows up).

 

Part of my point is that Fletcher has come in and basically done little more than (maybe) accelerate the plan that was already in place by a month or two.  

 

2 hours ago, brelic said:

Weal, Weise, Lehtera, and Folin are gone. People have been clamouring for the first 3 to be banished for years.

 

All but Weise were gone at the end of the year anyway.  Gordon wasn't playing them.  

All trading them did was get us a bunch of minor leaguers who won't impact this team going forward.  

 

2 hours ago, brelic said:

He's got the young guys playing to a degree that does not exist anywhere else in the NHL. We have the most guys 23 and under at 11. That's half the roster.

 

 

Again, that was happening anyway.  He didn't do that.  The most you can say is that trading Folin forced his hand to play Myers when Gudas got suspended.  His other call ups (Varone and Knight) are both 28, so they're actually working against that 23 year old number.  

 

2 hours ago, brelic said:

 

And, he got what he likely could for Simmer, who's value was apparently not that high. I'm not sure why the assumption is always that Fletch failed rather than succeeded in getting the best he could with what he had to work with. Simmer wasn't exactly setting the league on fire. His best offensive days are way behind him.

 

 

Everything you're saying about Simmonds is completely true.  He's not lighting the world on fire, his best days may be behind him especially if he's not going to get PP1 minutes and especially if neither PP is doing remotely well at all.

 

HOWEVER, Not getting more for Simmonds isn't quite my beef with Fletcher.  My beef with him is taking his eyes off the likes of Stone as well as Elliott, Raffl & Gudas all in the name of not getting more for Simmer.    If the gist of Fletcher's plan is to basically accelerate Hextall's previous plan by selling off pieces likely to be gone soon anyway, why not move those guys and get what you can for them as well?  meantime, if you're moving your beloved RW and planning to replace him in Free Agency, why not pay attention to what's happening to the best UFA there was and what was going on with him?    Now I'm pretty sure they can't do a ton better than Simmonds in the UFA market so they will at BEST be overpaying for as good as Simmonds or worse than Simmonds all in the name of bringing in Hartman?  How's that make sense?  

 

Especially when the bill of goods we were sold on him is that he was coming in to take the big swings that Hextall wasn't.  

So far, all his moves have proven to be even safer and more condensing and patient (relating to "go time) than Hextall's.   

 

2 hours ago, brelic said:

All that being said, I'm not sold on Fletcher yet either. While he's made decent small moves, he hasn't made any big moves (signings or trades) yet to shake up the foundation. Those will be more indicative on whether or not he gets it.

 

That's what the offseason is for, and we'll see how he does.

 

I think my problem is that Fletcher DOES get it.  I think my problem isn't actually with Fletcher, it's with Holmgren and Dave Scott.  

I think Fletcher knows he somehow got inserted into a beautiful situation where the hard part was already done.  He made the brain dead easy move of firing the coach that Hextall was somehow inexplicably incapable of doing.   Other than that he just looked at what Hextall had already put in place and said, "let's do that."  

 

He made a bunch of moves that looked like he was doing something when in fact because he'd fired Hakstol and Gordon isn't a complete moron, all he was really doing was putting fresh faces in the press box.  

 

He started Hart because everyone else was hurt and he had to.  And everyone needs to keep in mind that even in spite of Hart being awesome, starting him didn't even work for a couple of weeks until Gordon changed the system.

 

2 hours ago, brelic said:

That's what the offseason is for, and we'll see how he does.

 

I wait with baited breath.  

 

At the end of the day, I'm concerned about Holmgren and Scott doing all the things I was afraid Holmgren would do to Hextall (but apparently didn't) and trying to influence dumb moves for the sake of making a splash with overpriced but familiar names instead of promising but still developing youth because he somehow thinks that's what puts butts in seats.  

 

Essentially I'm afraid of Fletcher trading TK, Patty, Londblom, Sanheim, Myers, Ghost or Morin plus three first round picks for Karlsson or Burns or effing Shea Weber... because you know that's what Homer would have done.  

 

Every day, I curse Hextall for JUST NOT FIRING HAKSTOL.  Not for hiring him... that was worth a shot.  Three years in though, it was obvious.  And now I live in fear of the VLC deal or Bryzgalov or losing Hart to Columbus for an effing 2nd rounder because the cap got screwed up acquiring useless players that used to be good instead of good players that are going to get better (like Stone) or helping the good players he already has become excellent.   

 

 

 

 

[King Knut]

On 2/25/2019 at 7:20 PM, TimKerrFan12 said:

Chuck Fletcher =  Chip Kelly.

 

How does this make any sense at all?  Kelly traded or dismissed a bunch of the team's best players and it worked for half a season and then the team was screwed because he didn't know how to build an NFL team at all.

 

Fletcher so far has traded one good player that was going to have to get traded anyway and everyone's essentially known that for at least two years.  

 

Frankly, if anything, Dave Hakstol = Chip Kelly works a lot better.  

 

Tricks of the trade and the sort of skills that are effective in the NCAA simply don't translate to the pro game where EVERYONE you're skating against each night is better than ANYONE you were skating against in college hockey.  

[King Knut]

On 2/25/2019 at 7:11 PM, mkscrewy said:

for all we know Cam Talbot is still sitting at the bus station waiting for the ride to the airport that Fletcher forgot to send. 

 

Probably trying to buy a map because his Canadian plan doesn't have coverage in the US.  

[King Knut]

43 minutes ago, elmatus said:

 

Hartnell definitely. I hated it then, and I still hate it now. I wouldn't consider the Schenn trade a bad one. He got a solid haul for a guy who was a liability on the ice more often than not. I could easily see Frost being just as good or better than Schenn was. We still have time to judge this one I think.

 

But yes, I agree with you on the timeline front as well. Fletch deserves more than three months before we throw him to the wolves. Let's start by seeing what he does about the coaching staff in the off season. That will be a big one for me.

 

Did you know that Hartnell's contract hasn't expired yet? 

The Blue Jackets are going to be playing him against their cap for two more years.  

Columbus bought him out with two years left on his deal, Nashville gave him a million bucks to play last year and decided not to bring him back.  

 

That's why Hextall traded him.  Not to get Umberger.  Hextall looked at the roster and the contracts he had when he was put in charge and he saw that by the time the team was going to be able to be competitive again for real, Hartnell was going to to be overpaid for how effective he'd be.

 

Now Umberger was doubtlessly worse, but that didn't matter to Hextall because he was looking at 2019, not 2015 or 2016,

 

The Schenn trade is likely going to turn out very well for the Flyers.  If anyone ever offers you two first rounders for any player not named McDavid or Hart, the chances are very good you should probably take it.  

 

Once again, Hextall took Lehtera because he had to or else St. Louis couldn't fit Schenn under the cap.  Hextall didn't care how good or bad Lehtera was.  He was looking ahead to when Lehtera wouldn't be here. 

 

Now if we want to rag on Hextall, let's rag on him not firing the Moron who continued to play Lehtera on the PK and in key situations every damn night of the year.  That's the tragedy. 

 

 

 

 

[King Knut]

35 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 I think he referred to the roster player being the anchor...not the 2-1sts.

 

 My issue with Fletcher is his entire history as a gm...not his 3 months in Philly. If he turns the team into a contender I'll jump on his bandwagon. But I'm not jumping on it just because Homer hired him. 

 

What if he turns the team into a contender by basically not screwing with the plan that was already in place?

 

Long story short, all this team needed was a half decent coach.  What if that no brainer is the only real tweak Fletcher makes?  Is that enough?  To me it's not.  I need to see him take this cap room, give his RFA's smart forward looking contracts and use the remaining cap space to bring in some key pieces that will really help.

 

Maybe bring in Tyler Myers and Waive A Mac or trade Gudas.

 

I honestly don't know what to do about the RW now... but if he can do something savvy there, I'd be thrilled.  

Maybe he can sign Panarin and trade Lindblom or JVR for a RW, but right now, both Lindblom and JVR are looking like key pieces to what's happening for the team.  

 

Outside of that, do we really want him screwing with this team much at all?

[elmatus]

34 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 I think he referred to the roster player being the anchor...not the 2-1sts.

 

 

And that's very true, but that anchor was part of the deal mostly for money purposes. 

 

Now, did he have to keep that anchor around for so long? No, he did not. Powder should have been a permanent scratch or bought out or something ages ago. But as far as the trade itself goes, I'm still completely fine with it today.

 

Also, there's something to be said for Hakstol's role in all this. Just because we have an anchor such as Lehtera on the team, doesn't mean he has to play any meaningful minutes. There's plenty of blame to go around.

[flyercanuck]

8 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

What if he turns the team into a contender by basically not screwing with the plan that was already in place?

 

Long story short, all this team needed was a half decent coach.  What if that no brainer is the only real tweak Fletcher makes?  Is that enough?  To me it's not.  I need to see him take this cap room, give his RFA's smart forward looking contracts and use the remaining cap space to bring in some key pieces that will really help.

 

 NOT signing the Parise/Suter type contracts would be nice...it took Hextall years to dig us out from under those. And yes...signing the RFAs to good deals would help. How he drafts. Again...from how he left the Wild, I'm not confident.

 

8 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

Maybe bring in Tyler Myers and Waive A Mac or trade Gudas.

 

I honestly don't know what to do about the RW now... but if he can do something savvy there, I'd be thrilled.  

Maybe he can sign Panarin and trade Lindblom or JVR for a RW, but right now, both Lindblom and JVR are looking like key pieces to what's happening for the team.  

 

 I'd love to see JVR dealt...just not a fan of his game.

 

8 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

Outside of that, do we really want him screwing with this team much at all?

 

 A GOOD veteran defenceman would be a nice add....but you generally have to pay through the nose for those.

[flyercanuck]

13 minutes ago, elmatus said:

 

And that's very true, but that anchor was part of the deal mostly for money purposes. 

 

Now, did he have to keep that anchor around for so long? No, he did not. Powder should have been a permanent scratch or bought out or something ages ago. But as far as the trade itself goes, I'm still completely fine with it today.

 

Also, there's something to be said for Hakstol's role in all this. Just because we have an anchor such as Lehtera on the team, doesn't mean he has to play any meaningful minutes. There's plenty of blame to go around.

 

I really didn't see the need of buying out guys when the team wasn't ready to contend. All you do is add years onto those players taking away cap space...and I'd prefer they do that before we really need it.

 

I'm not sure any of us understand Hakstols game plans.

[TimKerrFan12]

38 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

How does this make any sense at all?  Kelly traded or dismissed a bunch of the team's best players and it worked for half a season and then the team was screwed because he didn't know how to build an NFL team at all.

 

Fletcher so far has traded one good player that was going to have to get traded anyway and everyone's essentially known that for at least two years.  

 

Frankly, if anything, Dave Hakstol = Chip Kelly works a lot better.  

 

Tricks of the trade and the sort of skills that are effective in the NCAA simply don't translate to the pro game where EVERYONE you're skating against each night is better than ANYONE you were skating against in college hockey.  

 

  I was very  unhappy with the Simmonds trade and posted that.  I was more generalizing that Chip Kelly ruined the Eagles(for a short time) and I think Fletcher is going to do the same to the Flyers.

 

 

[brelic]

29 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

No, at the end of the day, he's made it significantly better by firing Hakstol.  That's ALL that needed to happen.  That's part of what's bugging me about all this.  

 

Fletcher wasn't brought in to "not harm the team"  he was brought in to make a splash, and "spend to the cap" to get the team where it needed to be.  The team is significantly better, but he has only she cap space and he hasn't added any pieces other than Hartman (and Talbot if he ever figures out how to read a map-but I'll count him after he shows up).

 

Part of my point is that Fletcher has come in and basically done little more than (maybe) accelerate the plan that was already in place by a month or two.  

 

Sure, and really, he's had limited time to do those things. Major trades typically don't happen in-season. The ones that do - often deadline day deals - often don't look so great when you sober up the next morning.

 

For me, the offseason is where we'll get a real sense of what Fletcher has in mind. New coach and coaching staff? How is the draft under Fletch? What about trades or signings?

 

29 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

All but Weise were gone at the end of the year anyway.  Gordon wasn't playing them.  

All trading them did was get us a bunch of minor leaguers who won't impact this team going forward.  

 

Yes, that's true. They were going away by attrition. Fletcher accelerated that process.

 

Trading them did more than just acquire minor leaguers - it changed the composition and the chemistry of the team.

 

29 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

Again, that was happening anyway.  He didn't do that.  The most you can say is that trading Folin forced his hand to play Myers when Gudas got suspended.  His other call ups (Varone and Knight) are both 28, so they're actually working against that 23 year old number.  

 

I mean, sure. I think we just have different expectations and see things differently. That's ok. 

 

Maybe it was happening anyway, but the point is he did it. And all those other tweaks. Hextall showed an unwillingness to do the same thing.

 

This is not a comment on whether they're good or bad - they're just different approaches. 

 

29 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

Everything you're saying about Simmonds is completely true.  He's not lighting the world on fire, his best days may be behind him especially if he's not going to get PP1 minutes and especially if neither PP is doing remotely well at all.

 

HOWEVER, Not getting more for Simmonds isn't quite my beef with Fletcher.  My beef with him is taking his eyes off the likes of Stone as well as Elliott, Raffl & Gudas all in the name of not getting more for Simmer.    If the gist of Fletcher's plan is to basically accelerate Hextall's previous plan by selling off pieces likely to be gone soon anyway, why not move those guys and get what you can for them as well?  meantime, if you're moving your beloved RW and planning to replace him in Free Agency, why not pay attention to what's happening to the best UFA there was and what was going on with him?    Now I'm pretty sure they can't do a ton better than Simmonds in the UFA market so they will at BEST be overpaying for as good as Simmonds or worse than Simmonds all in the name of bringing in Hartman?  How's that make sense?  

 

There is an assumption here that a) Stone could be had, and b) Stone would be interested in re-signing with the Flyers. 

 

We just don't know. Money is not the sole motivating factor for players.

 

29 minutes ago, King Knut said:

Especially when the bill of goods we were sold on him is that he was coming in to take the big swings that Hextall wasn't.  

So far, all his moves have proven to be even safer and more condensing and patient (relating to "go time) than Hextall's.   

 

What is a "big swing" that, in your mind, would have made you happy in the past 3 months?

 

29 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

I think my problem is that Fletcher DOES get it.  I think my problem isn't actually with Fletcher, it's with Holmgren and Dave Scott.  

I think Fletcher knows he somehow got inserted into a beautiful situation where the hard part was already done.  He made the brain dead easy move of firing the coach that Hextall was somehow inexplicably incapable of doing.   Other than that he just looked at what Hextall had already put in place and said, "let's do that."  

 

He made a bunch of moves that looked like he was doing something when in fact because he'd fired Hakstol and Gordon isn't a complete moron, all he was really doing was putting fresh faces in the press box.  

 

Ok, but is the team not better right now than when he inherited it? PP is going, PK is solid, goaltending has solidified (more on that in a second, but also, a lot of it was out of Hextall and Fletch's control), coaching is better, deadwood is gone, more young guys are being integrated.

 

I guess I disagree that it was all window dressing.

 

29 minutes ago, King Knut said:

He started Hart because everyone else was hurt and he had to.  And everyone needs to keep in mind that even in spite of Hart being awesome, starting him didn't even work for a couple of weeks until Gordon changed the system.

 

No he didn't. Hextall had the same opportunity but steadfastly refused. Fletch also tried some waiver wire magic and then was faced with trading for a goalie (which almost everyone expected he would).

 

He chose to try Hart first. And it worked. He tried something Hextall refused to try.

 

29 minutes ago, King Knut said:

 

I wait with baited breath.  

 

At the end of the day, I'm concerned about Holmgren and Scott doing all the things I was afraid Holmgren would do to Hextall (but apparently didn't) and trying to influence dumb moves for the sake of making a splash with overpriced but familiar names instead of promising but still developing youth because he somehow thinks that's what puts butts in seats.  

 

Essentially I'm afraid of Fletcher trading TK, Patty, Londblom, Sanheim, Myers, Ghost or Morin plus three first round picks for Karlsson or Burns or effing Shea Weber... because you know that's what Homer would have done.  

 

Every day, I curse Hextall for JUST NOT FIRING HAKSTOL.  Not for hiring him... that was worth a shot.  Three years in though, it was obvious.  And now I live in fear of the VLC deal or Bryzgalov or losing Hart to Columbus for an effing 2nd rounder because the cap got screwed up acquiring useless players that used to be good instead of good players that are going to get better (like Stone) or helping the good players he already has become excellent.   

 

I have the same reservations about Fletcher, trust me. I am not at all convinced yet that he will make smart moves. We'll have a much better picture in about 6 months.

 

[King Knut]

12 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 NOT signing the Parise/Suter type contracts would be nice...it took Hextall years to dig us out from under those. And yes...signing the RFAs to good deals would help. How he drafts. Again...from how he left the Wild, I'm not confident.

 

 

 I'd love to see JVR dealt...just not a fan of his game.

 

 

 A GOOD veteran defenceman would be a nice add....but you generally have to pay through the nose for those.

 

This is what concerns me as well.  He has cap room.  What's he going to do with it?  Especially with Homer and Scott breathing down his neck to spend it.

 

I mean thank God Blake already beat him to Kovalchuck.  

 

Supposedly the Suter and Parise deals came after heavy pressure from ownership.  That doesn't help me feel better because giving in to heavy pressure from Homer and Scott is exactly what I'm afraid of.

 

12 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 I'd love to see JVR dealt...just not a fan of his game.

 A GOOD veteran defenceman would be a nice add....but you generally have to pay through the nose for those.

 

JVR keeps scoring goals the way he is at the rate he is and I'm just fine with his game.  That said, if they want to trade him in order to bring in a Panarin AND a RW, then I'm good with seeing him go.  I just dont' want him traded for the sake of folks not liking his game.

Lots of folks don't like Jake's game, but Jake and JVR have been a big part of a lot of big goals on this team lately.  

 

12 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 A GOOD veteran defenceman would be a nice add....but you generally have to pay through the nose for those.

 

He can afford to this year.  Tyler Myers is my vote.  But he'll have to waive AMac to do it because I don't want Myers sitting and I want Morin to get his chances for fill in when he can.  

 

[King Knut]

8 minutes ago, TimKerrFan12 said:

 

  I was very  unhappy with the Simmonds trade and posted that.  I was more generalizing that Chip Kelly ruined the Eagles(for a short time) and I think Fletcher is going to do the same to the Flyers.

 

 

 

If he continues to do deals as inconsequential as he has been, they'll be okay for a while.  

 

What he does with his cap space this summer is the big question. 

 

The coach is another big question.  Do we really want Q?  Is Gordon a long term answer?  

 

I honestly don't have opinions on these matters yet.  

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Well I'm not sure what "the way I went" means from you when I was responding to brelic.

 

What are you...my wife?   

 

Touchy today I see.

 

I will leave you alone just asked a question no need to get the panties in a wad.

[brelic]

@King Knut and anyone else who wants to chime in.

 

Here's what we have under contract for next season (I'm including the RFAs as being re-signed)

 

G/Patrick/Konecny

Lindblom/Couturier/Voracek

JVR/Laughton/Hartman

 

Provorov/Sanheim

Ghost/Myers

Hagg/Gudas

MacDonald/Morin

 

Hart

 

It's clear that there's a logjam on defense and some opportunities on offense. 

 

What would you like to see Fletch do?

 

 

[flyercanuck]

31 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Touchy today I see.

 

I will leave you alone just asked a question no need to get the panties in a wad.

 

So...what was the question? Cause I don't see one.

 

I see a response that didn't make sense to me.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Podein25]

21 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

So...what was the question?

 

Ack, who knows. But the answer? That we know. It's 42!

[King Knut]

1 hour ago, brelic said:

@King Knut and anyone else who wants to chime in.

 

Here's what we have under contract for next season (I'm including the RFAs as being re-signed)

 

G/Patrick/Konecny

Lindblom/Couturier/Voracek

JVR/Laughton/Hartman

 

Provorov/Sanheim

Ghost/Myers

Hagg/Gudas

MacDonald/Morin

 

Hart

 

It's clear that there's a logjam on defense and some opportunities on offense. 

 

What would you like to see Fletch do?

 

 

See here's where we get into some tricky stuff because I was pretty convinced when Hextall got fired that the only thing that needed to happen to this team was that Hakstol needed to be replaced.

 

It was Scott and Holmgren who promised that big deals and spending to the cap were the issue that was going to be remedied and in fact they didn't even have an official opinion on Hakstol.

 

Most of my beef really seems to come back to that when I think about it.

 

If they'd all just been a little bit smarter and more communicative and less egotistical, they could have just talked about it, fired Hakstol and we could have gotten here a month sooner.    As it is, that isn't what they did, but we eventually got rid of Hakstol anyway.

 

Officially, my panties are in a bunch not because of what management is doing, but because it really looks a whole lot like Management has no G.D. clue what it's doing.

 

But in the name of fun, here's what a fire in his pants type GM might try to do:

 

-Play Morin now as soon as it seems safe to see what the hell is left of the amazing prospect I believe he was two years ago before Hextall screwed him over and put Hagg on the team instead.  PLay him a little bit.  NOT A LOT.  Just get a handle on what he is at this point.  It won't necessarily be pretty.  But have all your scouts watch just to sort through it. 

-Sign Panarin (or possibly Eberle) and Tyler Myers.

-Waive MacDonald. Buy him out if you really want to be friendly, but I'd actually keep him on the Phantoms in case of injuries. 

If you sign Myers, try to Trade Hagg and Gudas

-Maybe package one of the above with JVR or maybe even Lindblom for the RIGHT RW if you manage to pull off Panarin.

-Try to resign Stolarz or possibly try to nab Nilsson when it becomes apparent Tablot's desired salary and duration isn't feasible.  I just can't imagine Cam Talbot taking a Brian Elliott type 2.5 for 2 years type deal to be an NHL backup though... but maybe that's just me.  Maybe he doesn't have a very high opinion of himself and maybe his agent hates making money.

 

 

 

Something like that.

 

[King Knut]

42 minutes ago, Podein25 said:

 

Ack, who knows. But the answer? That we know. It's 42!

 

It's definitely NOT 47, that's for sure.

[Podein25]

Meow!

[King Knut]

> Major trades typically

>don't happen in-season. The ones that do

>!- often deadline day deals - often don't

>look so great when you sober up the next

>morning.

 

...which kinda why I thought firing Hextall when they did was stupid. 

 

>Yes, that's true. They were going away by

>attrition. Fletcher accelerated that

>process.

 

But my point is: to what end other than to make his bosses think he’s doing something?  He hasn’t played anyone he couldn’t have anyway. 

 

>Trading them did more than just acquire

>minor leaguers - it changed the

>composition and the chemistry of the

>team.

 

And I contest that Gordon and Hart did that. Not putting different guys in the press box. 

 

>Maybe it was happening anyway, but the

>point is he did it. And all those other

>tweaks. Hextall showed an unwillingness

>to do the same thing.

 

So the point is he did something pointless. See my confusion? 

 

Hextall showed an unwillingness to fire Hakstol. 

That was the problem. Why would he waive guys whose contracts were expiring when the coach he trusted was playing them every night?  

 

He trusted Hak for some ungodly reason. 

 

That WAS bad, no matter what your approach.  

 

 

>There is an assumption here that

>Stone could be had, and b) Stone would

>be interested in re-signing with the Flyers.

 

I’m not saying he needed to get Stone now.  He needed to be in on it.  It matters. 

 

>We just don't know. Money is not the sole

>motivating factor for players.

 

right.  Maybe he likes the desert and legal prostitution. 

 

>What is a "big swing" that, in your mind,

>would have made you happy in the past 3

>months?

 

I don’t know, I’m not Holmgren.  That’s the same question I asked in advance when they fired Hextall for being unwilling to make moves.  

 

If those moves were firing the coach, I thought, then they’re absolutely right.  But those weren’t the moves they meant.  They were talking about acquiring players and soecifically mentioned spending to the cap and making the change now to assess things in time for the trade deadline. 

 

>Ok, but is the team not better right now >than when he inherited it?

 

...because they fired the coach. 

 

>>PP is going,

 

Mmmmmm kinda. 

 

>>PK >is solid,

 

This is legit true even though Lappy is still there.  Murphy and Hak must have really been terrible. 

 

>>>goaltending has solidified

 

it has... but again... not just because of Hart.  Elliott and Stolarz’s numbers have been just as good if not better since the switch to the 1-3-1 and Hart’s were just as meh before the switch. 

 

>coaching is better,

 

Rhats really it as far as I’m concerned. 

 

>deadwood is gone,

 

gordon wasn’t dressing them, so I’m not sure it matters. 

 

>more young guys are being integrated.

 

Most if that is on Gordon. The only “young guy” Fletch. Brought up that’s stuck so far is Myers.  Gordon’s the one enhancing Sanheim’s role and waking Provo, Ghost and Gudas from the dead. 

 

>Fletch also tried some waiver wire magic

>and then was faced with trading for

>goalie (which almost everyone expected

>he would).

 

i honestly don’t know what you’re talking about here.  

 

 

>He chose to try Hart first. And it worked.

>He tried something Hextall refused to try.

 

He didn’t choose it.  He literally had no choice.  Everyone else was hurt. Faced with the same scenario we have no idea what Hextall would have tried. He brought in Pickard to back up off the wire because Pickard looked good. When guys got healthy, he had to lose Pickard. McKenna seems like a nice guy and good to have around, but at that point after everyone else got hurt and Lyon popped the bed so badly,  why the hell not try Hart?

 

>I have the same reservations about

>Fletcher, trust me. I am not at all

>convinced yet that he will make smart

>moves. We'll have a much better picture

>in about 6 months.

 

Again, I’m kind of arguing counter points rhetorically, but my beef isn’t with Fletcher.  So far in my mind he is a complete non-entity.  He’s done nothing of consequence and a few things I just don’t like (Talbot, maybe Simmonds, definitely Stone, but that’s hazy at best) and one big thing thing that Everyone on earth except Ron Hextall knee needed to happen (Hakstol).  

 

May the end of the day, I remain convinced Hextall was fired for personal reasons having mostly to do with Dave Scott’s ego. 

 

And I hate that because that means the big calls are ultimately being made by ego driven corporate pricks instead of hockey brains. 

 

Again if the argument had come down to Hakstol and Hextall went down defending Hak, then I’m totally on board... but their words and their subsequent actions said it wasn’t.  And the words they used to explain what it was for have been completely betrayed by the guy they hired.

 

They could have fired them both the same day like they did with Clarke and Hitch and ended up exactly where they did, just a month sooner.  But they didn’t. Because they’re morons. 

 

I dont know about Fletcher either.  He seems like a pushover to me and I dont like it, but we’ll see.  My larger issue is that his bosses are idiots and now they may have hired a guy they can push around and make do stupid things... meanwhile the rest of the league and every damn agent on earth will be pushing him around too. 

 

That at does not bode well. 

[OccamsRazor]

On 2/27/2019 at 1:31 PM, brelic said:

@King Knut and anyone else who wants to chime in.

 

Here's what we have under contract for next season (I'm including the RFAs as being re-signed)

 

G/Patrick/Konecny

Lindblom/Couturier/Voracek

JVR/Laughton/Hartman

 

Provorov/Sanheim

Ghost/Myers

Hagg/Gudas

MacDonald/Morin

 

Hart

 

It's clear that there's a logjam on defense and some opportunities on offense. 

 

What would you like to see Fletch do?

 

 

 

I know the kid is still so young but i think the Flyers will discuss this kid a lot and what should they do???

 

 

Do they let him go back to school for his sophomore year or go ahead and sign him??

 

They don't HAVE to sign him but what an impressive freshman year 13 goals 18 assist for 31 points in 33 games.

 

Not bad for a kid who just turned 19.

 

Just for comparison's sake Tanner Laczynski has 10 goals 20 assists for 30 points in 25 games.

 

And he is 21 and a junior will be 22 in June. So would the Flyers go ahead and sign him to an entry level contract?? Not sure.

 

Could be a wild card.

 

Where would you put him?? 

 

G/Patrick/Konecny

Lindblom/Couturier/Voracek

JVR/Laughton/Hartman

Raffl/Vorobyev/NAK

Bailey

 

You could go ahead and sign him to an entry level and play him with the Phantoms.

 

Provorov/Sanheim

Ghost/Myers

Morin/Gudas

Hagg/vet signing

 

My plan involves buying out Mcdud sorry it ain't about the money but it is time to find a vet who can actually help.

 

Top targets if the let Tyler Myers walk i go throw some nice cash at him as priority #1. I would give him a 4 or 5 year deal.

 

My #2 choice if the Jets bring him back would be Anton Stralman. I do want the vet to be a righty.

 

I would give him an 1 or 2 year deal.

 

And the 3rd choice if they let him walk after this year would be Patrik Nemeth.

 

#4 if i had name a guy would be Adam Mcquaid.