Wild Trade deadline day

[Lonkkis]

50 minutes ago, CreaseAndAssist said:

 

This post aged well...

Tell me about it. Heck I'm arguing with several people about the return we got from Granlund over at The Athletic comments section. People are like 'Oh, Fiala is going to be, and has been, so much better than Granlund, especially during playoffs!'

 

How about no? Granny was better the first two full seasons, compared to Fiala. Granny has better playoff performance compared to Fiala (albeit Granny could've been better), 0,5 pts/gp vs 0,25 pts/gp. Fiala also had top-6 minutes when Forsberg etc were injured a lot.

 

Everything about Fiala is worse than what Granny brought, except for goalscoring. And I'll believe in Fiala being a 30+ goalscorer when he has done that on a consistent basis.

Because I don't have much faith in peoples word about him having a high ceiling. Remember, these same people believed Granny would be a 80-90 point guy when he arrived here way back.

 

I really, really hope this trade pans out well for us, but on paper it doesn't look good.

[WileyOz44]

Do not get me wrong I like E. Stall but what was the big hurry to extend another aging vet 2 years? What does that help out right now? Could not wait until summer?

 

Is it possible Fenton made a deal with his Nashville butt buddies "Granny comes back to us this summer"? I just can not believe the madness in this undervalued trade.

 

I agree with a rebuild but not in the return we are getting. If Fenton could have only gained a few draft picks but then again we suck at drafting too.

[Hockey-78]

26 minutes ago, WileyOz44 said:

Do not get me wrong I like E. Stall but what was the big hurry to extend another aging vet 2 years? What does that help out right now? Could not wait until summer?

 

Is it possible Fenton made a deal with his Nashville butt buddies "Granny comes back to us this summer"? I just can not believe the madness in this undervalued trade.

 

I agree with a rebuild but not in the return we are getting. If Fenton could have only gained a few draft picks but then again we suck at drafting too.

I don't get you wrong, you're thinking exactly like I. Seems totally illogical. Especially the way Staal's being playing the last few months.

[Hockey-78]

13 hours ago, TonyOday said:

I like the trade. Granny has always been overvalued here and this year the lack of shooting killed this team. We were not going to win the cup this or next year, more than likely, and his $8 mil number is incredibly high for what he produces here.

Overvalued? The best scorer last two seasons?

And Tony, let me help you out with facts: Granlund was earning $5,75 mil. Last year with that pay he was the best scorer, now 2nd, by all accounts the best puck distributor in the Wild. That was a very good contract for this organization (if one dares call this s*** s*** as such) and they threw it away...

[ClusterChuck]

1 hour ago, Jimtown guy said:

 

We can all agree to disagree and only time will tell how all of this shakes out. Again I’ll give Fenton more time than the short time he’s been with the Wild 

I had to remind myself that's how I've been watching Fenton since he got here.

What he does this summer is when I'll really start to judge his long term plan.

 

Now that Trade Day and all the Drama, Confusion etc is over, I thought...We've really not gone through such a big 'Sell' mode before.

Interesting territory. 

Deals aside, At least we get to see some freshness to watch for the rest of this season, Instead of the stale product we've been handed.

Aberg, Rask, Not so much but Donato and hopefully Fiala will give us some glimmer of future.

 

 

[CreaseAndAssist]

2 hours ago, Lonkkis said:

Tell me about it. Heck I'm arguing with several people about the return we got from Granlund over at The Athletic comments section. People are like 'Oh, Fiala is going to be, and has been, so much better than Granlund, especially during playoffs!'

 

How about no? Granny was better the first two full seasons, compared to Fiala. Granny has better playoff performance compared to Fiala (albeit Granny could've been better), 0,5 pts/gp vs 0,25 pts/gp. Fiala also had top-6 minutes when Forsberg etc were injured a lot.

 

Everything about Fiala is worse than what Granny brought, except for goalscoring. And I'll believe in Fiala being a 30+ goalscorer when he has done that on a consistent basis.

Because I don't have much faith in peoples word about him having a high ceiling. Remember, these same people believed Granny would be a 80-90 point guy when he arrived here way back.

 

I really, really hope this trade pans out well for us, but on paper it doesn't look good.

 

Probably didn't hurt Fiala to be on a team that advances beyond the 1st round most of the time during that span.  More chances more games...its not quite the same sample size as people (the Fiala fanboys) are portraying it to be.  

[EJ0226]

First, can somebody tell Fenton and Leipold they are no longer part of the Predators franchise?

 

I know there is people saying this is what a fire sale looks like. They are half right. This is what a fire sale that has no rhyme or reason looks like. The trades weren't for the future as we got only 1 draft pick which is a 5th round, which I believe is when you pick your water boy. Usually a fire sale involves getting draft picks for the future as you know your core and roster is no where good enough and has aged incredibly bad like cheese left out in the middle of the desert.

 

So we look at it as salary cutting which would be fine if there was big name free agent you know wants to sign with you. Now most big names are going to want to win a Cup and go to a Cup ready team. The Wild are literally at the beginning of a long rebuild. Remember we can't shed Parise or Suters numbers off the books for another 6 years but they will both be hitting the salary cap at $7.538 million a year each. That is a lot of cap room for guys that are/continue to decline and produce less and less. It's going to be hard to attract a big name player to want to sign here and waste years well a rebuild goes on. Right now the Wild look like the perfect retirement for shell of former stars to come and retire. I love Eric Staal but he has won a Cup. And he really fought tooth and nail to not be traded. He only has a year or two left. They just signed him to two years. It looks like the Wild are still continuing the trend of giving aging vets a nice retirement home. This is not something that they want attached to them as the money we saved might end up going to these players as other players who are stars and can provide will pass over.

 

So maybe we saved salary to sign our prospects? Well that would work if we actually had more than one prospect, Kaprizov, who we don't know if he really wants to come to this team especially in state like this. At best it will be 3 years of rebuilding but probably more like 5 to 7 years to reverse everything Fletcher did. Will Kaprizov want to play on a team that could be bottoming out versus staying in Russia and playing on teams that could easily win the championship there and be a star?

 

So let's look at the trades. Nino for Rask. Point wise before this year Rask and Nino were basically same. Watching Rask and how he was playing versus Nino was a difference though. We knew what we had with Nino even though he was in a bad drought. But guess what? Parise has gone through that exact drought too. The difference is Parise gets top TOI well being paired with the two hottest guys to help him start scoring again. The trade overall was not like by Wild fans and Cane fans were saying we got ripped off. It sure points to this especially now. We should have gotten a draft pick for along with Rask. This trade to just make some noise was a poor choice.

The Coyle trade. On paper it's a really poor trade. Coyle is a 34 point season average. Donato starting in 2017 and his short career has point totals of 9, 9, and this year 4 for a average of 7 per season. We also got a 5th round pick. There is no way that was a good trade and Fenton is lucky that Donato is playing out of his mind. We will have to see how Donato looks the rest of this season and start of next season to really make a ok guess on how this trade turned out but on paper there wasn't a good trade by the Wild.

Granlund trade. Now this is a touchy one. Granlund is basically getting in the prime of his career. He has improved steadily each season and the past 2 seasons have scored at least 67 + points and this season looks like he will hit it again. He also is our most consistent scorer and been top 3 the past three seasons. In exchange we got a Kevin Fiala. His best season he scored 48 points. Still 21 points behind Granlund. Yes Fiala is young but he also shattered his femur. People keep saying he has such a high upside and talent but I throw this out to you. If he does have all of that then why would they let him go so easily especially after breaking his femur unless they did see something wrong. But this trade should have also gave us at least a third round pick if not a second round. We were robbed just looking at the history of these two. But Fenton showed his foolishness by messing his pants at the possibility of getting a guy he picked on Nashville over here for a guy that has shown to be way more effective. It should have been a package deal for Granlund. This was a stupid trade. Yes, Granlund was going to command more money but not a crazy amount. They just resigned Staal for $3.25 million a year for two years that we could have used that money to sign Granlund. It's not like the Wild couldn't have signed him cause the Staal signing shows they could have.

Matt Hendricks trade was so minor it's almost not worth saying anything about. A 7th rounder.

But overall you look at the Wild and wonder what Fenton is thinking on these trades. It's not like we traded to stock pile draft picks. It's not like we traded players to improve. And it's not like we are making cap room to sign a bunch of top prospects cause we really only got one and he is in Russia and we aren't even for sure if he will come here. I am fine with trading and having a fire sale but have a reason for what you are doing. This looks more like Fenton made moves cause...well... he can make moves. You want to make a message to the locker room then he should have traded Zucker. The guy he signed to that fat contract and is showing little interest in the game as he leaves plays to go to the bench and ignore what is going on around him. Players would know the GM is serious as he sent his first signing packing for poor play even if we got a little low balled. These trades leave a bad taste in the mouth and don't exactly point to the future either.

 

[Hockey-78]

@EJ0226 The best post of the year in this forum and it's not even close! Way to go bud!!

[Jimtown guy]

2 hours ago, ClusterChuck said:

I had to remind myself that's how I've been watching Fenton since he got here.

What he does this summer is when I'll really start to judge his long term plan.

 

Now that Trade Day and all the Drama, Confusion etc is over, I thought...We've really not gone through such a big 'Sell' mode before.

Interesting territory. 

Deals aside, At least we get to see some freshness to watch for the rest of this season, Instead of the stale product we've been handed.

Aberg, Rask, Not so much but Donato and hopefully Fiala will give us some glimmer of future.

 

 

Looks like we are in the minority on this deal CC. And that’s fine. If we all agreed it would make for a boring message board 

[EJ0226]

3 minutes ago, Hockey-78 said:

@EJ0226 The best post of the year in this forum and it's not even close! Way to go bud!!

Thank you. The more I think about it the more I am confused. What is the game plan here? Are saving money to hopefully sign a big name free agent? If so that starts to limit what else you can do and puts a big question mark if there is going to be a rebuild. You don't spend a ton of money on a player or two just to go into rebuild mode. It's not like you stockpiled draft picks for the future. On paper the guys you got don't improve the team. It's extremely confusing and I have to question this big time. Sometimes making moves is worse then not doing that.

[Hockey-78]

40 minutes ago, EJ0226 said:

Thank you. The more I think about it the more I am confused. What is the game plan here? Are saving money to hopefully sign a big name free agent? If so that starts to limit what else you can do and puts a big question mark if there is going to be a rebuild. You don't spend a ton of money on a player or two just to go into rebuild mode. It's not like you stockpiled draft picks for the future. On paper the guys you got don't improve the team. It's extremely confusing and I have to question this big time. Sometimes making moves is worse then not doing that.

Yeah! The more I think of this all I come to the conclusion Fenton just pushed the panic button after trading Nino. Fenton has no game plan. He just dumped salary and the strategy together with the flow of his wit ended there.

 

Let me draw a clearer picture of this fire sale and "rebuild" mode Fenton supposedly started:

 

Nino aged 26, Coyle 26 and Granny 26 around 800 points together, three 1st round picks themselves acquire us a 5th round pick.

Matt Hendricks 37, 115 points a 5th round pick himself acquires us a 7th round pick. I guess one could try and argue "hey, he got a fantastic return for Hendricks" or...

 

Who is paying Fenton to ensure the Wild remains a bottom feeder for the next 5 years?! SMH

 

 

"rebuild" you losers says Paul.

[WileyOz44]

1 hour ago, Hockey-78 said:

Yeah! The more I think of this all I come to the conclusion Fenton just pushed the panic button after trading Nino. Fenton has no game plan. He just dumped salary and the strategy together with the flow of his wit ended there.

 

Let me draw a clearer picture of this fire sale and "rebuild" mode Fenton supposedly started:

 

Nino aged 26, Coyle 26 and Granny 26 around 800 points together, three 1st round picks themselves acquire us a 5th round pick.

Matt Hendricks 37, 115 points a 5th round pick himself acquires us a 7th round pick. I guess one could try and argue "hey, he got a fantastic return for Hendricks" or...

 

Who is paying Fenton to ensure the Wild remains a bottom feeder for the next 5 years?! SMH

 

 

"rebuild" you losers says Paul.

 

Post of the year ^^^^^^

[Jimtown guy]

2 hours ago, Hockey-78 said:

@EJ0226 The best post of the year in this forum and it's not even close! Way to go bud!!

 

[Jimtown guy]

20 minutes ago, WileyOz44 said:

 

Post of the year ^^^^^^

 

[Megawild]

I guess I fall into the underwhelmed on value for Fiala, but hey, maybe we'll be surprised after all is said and done.  No matter what, something had to change.

 

Count me in the 'wait and see group'.

 

 

[EmptyShelf]

What's really scary now, is the dearth of players that are left to move/trade.  What do we trade now before/during draft?  Brodin, perhaps?  Spurgeon?  Zucker at his low point?  We acquired NO MEANINGFUL draft picks in moving Coyle, NN, and Granlund!?!  IF I told you prior to the year that we would trade all 3, you would at least assume we received a 1, 2, and 3 (or higher) in addition to fodder for them - wouldn't you?  I am NOT saying the Wild know how to draft either - the 1st rounder from last year is not even worth mentioning.  So, as I have been asking since this trading charade started, does anyone see a Plan here after the 'a few tweaks' edict from CL?  I see a clusterfack of desperation, and a GM that cannot value assets and negotiate....They had better fly to Russia with a dump-truck full of money to keep fans interested after next year, as I see the X beginning to look like Carolina, while the geriatric Country Club further deteriorates for 1, 6, and 6 more years of misery

[EmptyShelf]

BTW:  Welcome to the HATERS, Fargo.  Glad to see you have purchased your membership, even if reluctantly.  You can still be an ANGRY fan.....

[rottenrefs]

Up until the recent trades... The future of the Wild was being given to Coyle and Granlund. Both of them were given far more ice time when it seriously wasn't warranted (their rookie year and the year after) and from then on they've still received prime treatment - of the core of younger players that everyone accused of not stepping up enough.

 

However, while the Coyle, Granlund and Nino's of the team were accused of not stepping up and growing as anticipated; they actually had gotten better, but the aging core that Leipold keeps protecting by feeding them all kinds of ice time, cushy contracts and verbal rave... They haven't done squat to 'up their game' and the reality is their game has all dropped off (due to age.)

 

Why did I say Leipold? Because the same turn of events keep repeating themselves regardless of who the had coach is or who the GM's are. What I see are a bunch of investors sitting at a table blindly committing this team to where they think it needs to be... Because there's not one head coach (in our case there's been 4: Richards, Yeo, Torchetti & Boudreau) across the rest of the NHL that serves an owner (and two different GM's: Fletcher & Fenton)... By not being able to put one frikking line together [which spans 10 years now*] for more than a month and leave it the hell alone. Can ANYONE other than truly frustrated Minnesota Wild hockey fans comprehend that dreadfully embarrassing feat?

 

* Richards was signed as head coach in 2009. Since then it's been what I call 'Scrambled Eggs' for all the line changes this team keeps seeing.

 

So ummm, what's in the water in those meetings anyway? Could there, or can there be any other reason for such stupid moves since Leipold took over?

[rottenrefs]

9 minutes ago, EmptyShelf said:

BTW:  Welcome to the HATERS, Fargo.  Glad to see you have purchased your membership, even if reluctantly.  You can still be an ANGRY fan.....

He's complained just like everyone else but... but... lol

[Megawild]

I see all this ranting about not getting high/good enough draft picks.

 

I always have to chuckle at rage in any league for fan anger at value from a trade.

 

It takes two to tango, if there are no takers, then you get what you get.   Yes I understand Fenton may be a bit in love with his own previous pick since he didn't ask, but I thought Donato would be a disaster.  I like marvelling at him taking shots I know Chahlie never would have taken.

 

We'll see with Fiala.  Hopefully we are all pleasantly surprised.

 

As far as draft picks, IMHO the NHL is not like the NFL...  the draft (other than the top couple spots) seems like a total crapshoot.   I have no idea why anyone would get too upset about it.

[EmptyShelf]

1 hour ago, Megawild said:

I see all this ranting about not getting high/good enough draft picks.

 

I always have to chuckle at rage in any league for fan anger at value from a trade.

 

It takes two to tango, if there are no takers, then you get what you get.   Yes I understand Fenton may be a bit in love with his own previous pick since he didn't ask, but I thought Donato would be a disaster.  I like marvelling at him taking shots I know Chahlie never would have taken.

 

We'll see with Fiala.  Hopefully we are all pleasantly surprised.

 

As far as draft picks, IMHO the NHL is not like the NFL...  the draft (other than the top couple spots) seems like a total crapshoot.   I have no idea why anyone would get too upset about it.

Draft is a crapshoot, and we have a suspect history.  However, it is the cheapest way to build, and the best way (with an astute pick) to mitigate the loss of a player in a one-sided trade.  Look at Greenway - we are getting happier all the time.  He was a 2nd.  If we had acquired one 1 or 2 in Granlund deal, it could have similar potential payoff.  That is the issue for me....It could also be an Aberg, Rask, or Lucia - all 2nds too...

[Jimtown guy]

1 hour ago, Megawild said:

I see all this ranting about not getting high/good enough draft picks.

 

I always have to chuckle at rage in any league for fan anger at value from a trade.

 

It takes two to tango, if there are no takers, then you get what you get.   Yes I understand Fenton may be a bit in love with his own previous pick since he didn't ask, but I thought Donato would be a disaster.  I like marvelling at him taking shots I know Chahlie never would have taken.

 

We'll see with Fiala.  Hopefully we are all pleasantly surprised.

 

As far as draft picks, IMHO the NHL is not like the NFL...  the draft (other than the top couple spots) seems like a total crapshoot.   I have no idea why anyone would get too upset about it.

Spot on buddy 

[EmptyShelf]

2 hours ago, rottenrefs said:

He's complained just like everyone else but... but... lol

I am just happy that archaic Wild decisions are chipping away at ALL apologists and dissenters to our cause.  Brings more members to the Haters Club, so that we can collectively bitch and moan without resistance

[rottenrefs]

Whoops, I did that wrong. It was supposed to be a regular quote. Dang fingers! lol

[Lonkkis]

8 hours ago, Megawild said:

I see all this ranting about not getting high/good enough draft picks.

 

I always have to chuckle at rage in any league for fan anger at value from a trade.

 

It takes two to tango, if there are no takers, then you get what you get.   Yes I understand Fenton may be a bit in love with his own previous pick since he didn't ask, but I thought Donato would be a disaster.  I like marvelling at him taking shots I know Chahlie never would have taken.

 

We'll see with Fiala.  Hopefully we are all pleasantly surprised.

 

As far as draft picks, IMHO the NHL is not like the NFL...  the draft (other than the top couple spots) seems like a total crapshoot.   I have no idea why anyone would get too upset about it.

 

You don't always have to take what you get, atleast for time being. Fenton didn't even ask for a pick along with Fiala. He basically traded a known commodity for an unknown, without any backup whatsoever. And it does not really matter if it's a 3rd rounder or not, Kaprizov was drafted at 5th round and we all know what we feel about him. 

 

I am waiting to see what happens with Fiala, no doubts about that (heck I was patiently waiting to see what became of Granny and Dumba). But he better be at Tarasenkos level at his peak. Because that's how good Fenton and Fiala-fans reckon he's going to be.

 

Anything less, and I'll be miffed about it.