Raffl: "when we play top teams, boys show up"

[Jsterry666]

Raffl was quoted as saying the team really gets up for the top teams and it really pisses me off to hear this, there Is a lack of leadership with this team. Year after year same old **** play hard against the best teams and call it in with the lower teams. It should not matter who your playing and the same for the first period no show  game after game wake the **** UP FLYERS until this culture changes this team is going  nowhere 

 

 

ADDED: ADDED: To put this in context:

https://lancasteronline.com/sports/icehockey/nhl/voracek-scores-in-ot-flyers-beat-blues/article_65db45d4-0f40-5b82-b414-559c4907e6b2.html

 

Quote

"It's just a different vibe, a different feeling in the locker room,” Raffl said. “It seems like when we play the top teams boys show up, boys are ready, and it was a lot of fun lately."

 

 

Edited January 17, 2020 by radoran
added link and quote

[ruxpin]

15 minutes ago, Jsterry666 said:

Raffl was quoted as saying the team really gets up for the top teams and it really pisses me off to hear this, there Is a lack of leadership with this team. Year after year same old **** play hard against the best teams and call it in with the lower teams. It should not matter who your playing and the same for the first period no show  game after game wake the **** UP FLYERS until this culture changes this team is going  nowhere 

 

I really can't disagree with any of that.  It seems as if Raffl and some of the "core" say it almost as if they should be applauded for getting up for the top teams.   But it really is an indictment of their preparation for the other 75% of the league and of any kind of consistency.  

 

It's almost the Mike Richards' "it's just one game" mentality that almost made them miss the playoffs in 2010.  I don't know when this team got infected with this attitude but it almost precedes the current core (except for Giroux).   

 

I don't know what else you change.  We've changed everything else.   I'm not arguing to move Giroux, and return for Jake would need to be significant, but that's really the only thing that hasn't changed.

[radoran]

[radoran]

"I understand emotionally, but points are the same. This game was worth two. Last game was worth two. You gotta get up for it. You gotta get yourself ready."

- Alain Vigneault

 

https://www.nhl.com/flyers/video/116-postgame-players/t-277437426/c-5120269

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, Jsterry666 said:

It should not matter who your playing

 

Bingo.

 

Every game is worth two points.

 

At the end of the year no one cares how you got them.

 

All that matters is you have enough to make the dance.

 

It starts with the Captain. Like it or not.

 

Leaders lead. And he isn't.

[OccamsRazor]

24 minutes ago, radoran said:

"I understand emotionally, but points are the same. This game was worth two. Last game was worth two. You gotta get up for it. You gotta get yourself ready."

- Alain Vigneault

 

https://www.nhl.com/flyers/video/116-postgame-players/t-277437426/c-5120269

 

I really need to read through threads more before posting it would save me a lot of typing I could just hit the like button...

[radoran]

35 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

Every game is worth two points.

 

At the end of the year no one cares how you got them.

 

The "$10M goalie" thread I posted had a comment that the Habs have lost to the Red Wings three times this year. That's six points they don't have. They're seven points out of a playoff spot rightnow. Detroit has 12 wins all season.

 

Two points are two points. You don't get extra for "getting up" for top teams.

 

Games in October are worth as much as games in January are worth as much as games in March...

 

If the Flyers had beaten the Habs last night they're "in" the playoffs "if the season ended today."*

 

 

 

* we'd all be Very Surprised

Edited January 17, 2020 by radoran

[tucson83]

it's amazing how the vets accept the core ones are speaking the truth and the core players is talking the same bs.

 

i think we all know what the problem is.

Edited January 18, 2020 by tucson83

[jammer2]

It's called lack of professionalism. You are paid millions of dollars to perform a function...do it no matter which team/conundrum is placed before you. Beyond that...and more important is self pride and being the Alpha Male.. not letting anyone dictate the play to you...take what is yours...like a Lion in the wild. Not enough Alpha males on this team.

Edited January 18, 2020 by jammer2

[Mad Dog]

If Raffl's statement reflects the true mindset of the team as a whole (I hope it doesn't), this is DESPICABLE and PATHETIC.  Boy.... what a wonderful set-up, isn't it?  Why can't *I* only take certain clients of mine seriously and do a crappy job for the rest of my clients!?  Effort - or the lack thereof - should not even factor into the equation.  And shame on the coach if he sees this and doesn't address it.  You are professional athletes. The money you get paid is what 90% of the general population can only dream about getting.  And you are telling me that you *deliberately* lie down on the job.  I am sorry, but that's as reprehensible as it gets.

[flyer4ever]

I think this is why they brought JVR back. To address this apathy and lack of intensity.

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, jammer2 said:

being the Alpha Male.

 

Sorry but the don't have any of them at forward....maybe Coots and TK...that's it.

 

Farabee i'm holding out he has some dog in him...but right now i think he is just trying to stay on the team and not make mistakes.

 

We'll know by the end of next year i think....

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, Mad Dog said:

Why can't *I* only take certain clients of mine seriously and do a crappy job for the rest of my clients!?

 

Because in the real world you will be held accountable and will be subject to scrutiny and if it persists will you be unemployed just like on my job....very rarely do my bosses give me a pat on the back or a atta boy....but God forbid if i screw up it will be blown out of proportion and then come raise/review time i will have to answer for it or be hit in the wallet.

 

To bad athletes aren't held to the same standard...

[tucson83]

5 hours ago, Mad Dog said:

If Raffl's statement reflects the true mindset of the team as a whole (I hope it doesn't), this is DESPICABLE and PATHETIC.  Boy.... what a wonderful set-up, isn't it?  Why can't *I* only take certain clients of mine seriously and do a crappy job for the rest of my clients!?  Effort - or the lack thereof - should not even factor into the equation.  And shame on the coach if he sees this and doesn't address it.  You are professional athletes. The money you get paid is what 90% of the general population can only dream about getting.  And you are telling me that you *deliberately* lie down on the job.  I am sorry, but that's as reprehensible as it gets.

the coach can only do so much, it's up to the players, i said in the beginning of the year, if the flyers want to make the playoffs, it depends on the core players stepping up. if they dont show nothing at the end, they have to go and that's the reason.

Edited January 18, 2020 by tucson83

[mojo1917]

On 1/17/2020 at 1:53 PM, ruxpin said:

 

I really can't disagree with any of that.  It seems as if Raffl and some of the "core" say it almost as if they should be applauded for getting up for the top teams.   But it really is an indictment of their preparation for the other 75% of the league and of any kind of consistency.  

 

It's almost the Mike Richards' "it's just one game" mentality that almost made them miss the playoffs in 2010.  I don't know when this team got infected with this attitude but it almost precedes the current core (except for Giroux).   

 

I don't know what else you change.  We've changed everything else.   I'm not arguing to move Giroux, and return for Jake would need to be significant, but that's really the only thing that hasn't changed.

I can disagree with plenty of what you can't.

First of all , it is human nature to want to knock the monkey at the top of the tree down. So of course there's a little more juice for the top teams.  

Also, a lot of the players being relied upon are young, 66% of the defensemen are under 24 and are still learning to be pros, part of the difficulty being a pro is keeping the performances consistent. Dudes have less than 200 games at this level there's still learning happening. 

This is what letting guys learn at the NHL level looks like. 

Also, I didn't watch the game vs Montreal so I can't speak to what the eye test said about it; but the box score says Price played awesome and the chances were even. The Flyers PP let them down which is an area where they've been struggling. 

Was the effort really not there ? 

 

I expect this team to be better than last year and so far it has been, I expect this team to make the playoffs and they are in the mix with 30 + games to go, playing in the most competitive division in the league.  I really don't get all of the teeth gnashing. I don't, they're more fun to watch than they have been in years, they don't suck.

 

[ruxpin]

3 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

but the box score says Price played awesome

 

He really did, actually.   They had their chances and they was robbed.  Robbed, I tell ya.

[ruxpin]

1 hour ago, mojo1917 said:

I expect this team to be better than last year and so far it has been, I expect this team to make the playoffs and they are in the mix with 30 + games to go, playing in the most competitive division in the league.  I really don't get all of the teeth gnashing. I don't, they're more fun to watch than they have been in years, they don't suck.

 

I haven't looked for a day or two, but when I did, they were 11th overall in the league.   I realize "overall" is like winning the popular vote in the presidential election.  It gets you bupkis.

 

But the fact remains that this team that is largely young kids and has faced a ton of injuries--including largely lost seasons for both their 2-year removed #2 over all pick and (at the time) their leading scorer, their starting goalie, etc. etc.--is in the top 3rd of the league and would be challenging for first in some of the other divisions.  They can't help that they're in the same division as several other strong teams, including teams with the first- and fourth-highest point totals.   They're holding their own and, are frankly, much better than they were last year despite obvious growing pains and challenges.

 

Yeah, I get your post.  I largely agree with it.  

 

But I really don't like Raffl's quote.  I suppose it could be interpreted in several ways, but it struck me--maybe out of context--as too matter of fact and too Mike Richards, "it's just one game."   

Edited January 20, 2020 by ruxpin

[CoachX]

On 1/17/2020 at 11:34 AM, Jsterry666 said:

Raffl was quoted as saying the team really gets up for the top teams and it really pisses me off to hear this, there Is a lack of leadership with this team. Year after year same old **** play hard against the best teams and call it in with the lower teams. It should not matter who your playing and the same for the first period no show  game after game wake the **** UP FLYERS until this culture changes this team is going  nowhere 

 

 

ADDED: ADDED: To put this in context:

https://lancasteronline.com/sports/icehockey/nhl/voracek-scores-in-ot-flyers-beat-blues/article_65db45d4-0f40-5b82-b414-559c4907e6b2.html

 

 

 

And there it is! 

 

We all knew it. We all saw it. And now the players are openly admitting it

 

What an "Effing" joke! Blow this team the "F**k" up already

 

 

[radoran]

It's easy to look at a score sheet and say "Price made 40 saves and stood on his head."

 

It's another to watch the game and see a team playing at home against a team playings it's second game of a back to back on the road and have the home team unable to generate a high pressure scoring chance for the better part of two periods.

 

Then have that team explain how they were so overcome with a regular season win that they just couldn't get up for the Habs.

 

Vigneault called it like he saw it.

 

The B word.

[OccamsRazor]

So my question will it never change?

 

We're just supposed to accept they're human it happens and move on like it's no big deal?

 

Does this happen to all the clubs and I just don't watch enough games that don't include the Flyers?

 

We're all over reacting?

 

Asking for a friend....

[ruxpin]

13 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

So my question will it never change?

 

We're just supposed to accept they're human it happens and move on like it's no big deal?

 

Does this happen to all the clubs and I just don't watch enough games that don't include the Flyers?

 

We're all over reacting?

 

Asking for a friend....

It probably happens to a lot of clubs. It's how I explain the Flyers being able to beat some of the better teams. 

[radoran]

1 hour ago, ruxpin said:

It probably happens to a lot of clubs. It's how I explain the Flyers being able to beat some of the better teams. 

 

Well exactly. It's quite possible the Flyers didn't get the A game from BOS and STL - and they were able to eke out an OT win and a shootout and then pat themselves on the backs for it.

 

That's why playing consistently in the regular season is important. BOS and STL took home points in those games. The Flyers got nothing from the Habs game.

[ruxpin]

50 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

Well exactly. It's quite possible the Flyers didn't get the A game from BOS and STL - and they were able to eke out an OT win and a shootout and then pat themselves on the backs for it.

 

That's why playing consistently in the regular season is important. BOS and STL took home points in those games. The Flyers got nothing from the Habs game.

 

Exactly this.  Well said.

 

This is why those clubs are in first and the Flyers are fighting for the  AYSO "I showed up" trophy.

[OccamsRazor]

2 hours ago, ruxpin said:

It probably happens to a lot of clubs. It's how I explain the Flyers being able to beat some of the better teams. 

 

Sounds good, let's go with that it helps me maintain my sanity what little I have left...

[mojo1917]

10 hours ago, radoran said:

It's easy to look at a score sheet and say "Price made 40 saves and stood on his head."

 

It's another to watch the game and see a team playing at home against a team playings it's second game of a back to back on the road and have the home team unable to generate a high pressure scoring chance for the better part of two periods.

 

Then have that team explain how they were so overcome with a regular season win that they just couldn't get up for the Habs.

 

Vigneault called it like he saw it.

 

The B word.

That's why I asked about the effort.

I didn't see the game, looking at the box score it looked pretty even.

Which is also what AV said- the bit about parity. 

More than one thing can be true.

With the amount of important minutes being played by young players especially on defense I think there will be lapses.

 

My hope is the boys learn to be more consistent with their execution.  Other than the first Pens game and the fiasco in San Jose I havent seen poor effort from this group.

I don't view this team as a finished product in terms of players reaching their top level of play nor do I think the roster is done being constructed. 

 

I definitely think they're improved over last year and have overcome a decent amount of adversity in terms of losing key players/projected key players. Situation could be a lot worse.  I think this team is a green arrow trending upwards. 

I'm regularly surprised by the amount of negativity that pops up from a loss.