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hobie

Trade Deadline

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I think I'm hearing TO is going to trade for just about every d-man both alive and dead that ever played/plays in the NHL. There's also rumors TO is looking for a backup. I can't say trading for these players would be a bad idea but really it depends. TO traded for Muzzin, that cost 2 prospects plus a first, it was the type of trade that should've been designed to get TO out of pretender status to a legitimate Cup contender. It didn't work out last year and that's alright but the biggest problem for me is and has been Muzzin's age, he's going to be 31 Feb. 21. I'm hoping that if TO is going to again trade for player(s) they trade for ones that possibly are presigned and a bit younger. The rumor is Dubie is looking for players who have term on their contracts, this I like. 

 

Lately a rumor has TO interested in Dumba, age wise this is good, he's 25, he has 3 years left on his contract, again a good thing but those are only 2 considerations. My evaluation of him is he's Phanny lite, good shot, physical but defensively a nightmare. At 6 mil. per he's way overpaid and TO can't afford to overpay. I feel he's a classic Rielly type of player, Minny gave him a contract that hoped/expected he'd be able to grow into but he hasn't. 

 

Other d-men TO has been linked to, Colin Miller, 27, who wasn't highly thought of in Vegas and Buffalo has been benched occasionally in Buffalo, pass, Alec Martinez, 32, too old and Josh Manson, 28, a traditional 2nd pairing d-man who's stats aren't particularly impressive but he is phycical, his stats aren't much better than Ceci's. The question here is, is TO good enough to overpay for d-men/d-man that will only help TO make the playoffs.

 

The goaltender TO has been linked to most often is Alexander Georgiev, 23, he has 0 years left on his ELC and the 2 times I've seen him he's handled TO pretty well but otherwise there is little to support the notion that he's superior as his stats are SSV% .910, GAA 3.11 so he probably is an upgrade on Hutchinson this year but historically Hutchinson has stats that are even better than Georgiev's.

 

I've never had an issue with TO using the NHL as it's farm system, young roster players,  draft choices and prospects should always be options to move to improve the team now but I'd like TO to keep in mind the future in any transaction.

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6 hours ago, hobie said:

I think I'm hearing TO is going to trade for just about every d-man both alive and dead that ever played/plays in the NHL.

 

As long as the team isn't giving up any more draft picks to acquire them I'm fine with it. The Leafs need to avoid falling into the trap of raiding their farm system to get guys in the NHL. It's cheaper to just draft your own. I think the Leafs should go a different route, given where they are in the standings. I think the Leafs should SELL at the deadline and see how many bright young prospects they can get on "D" and how many first round draft picks they can get. (With the intention of drafting a defenceman with that first round pick.) 

 

The core group is young. We can draft the missing pieces if nothing presents itself in a trade. 

 

The WORST THING the Leafs could ever do right now is start jettisoning draft picks and top forwards for over-the-hill, overpriced, middle tier defencemen. That will lead to a weak group that can't win the big one and a farm system that is bare. 

 

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Players that TO might draft might take between 3 to 5 years before they're ready for the NHL. In essence they won't be available to TO during much of the prime of what TO has now, what TO has now could possibly be very special if the proper support is accumulated, now.

 

I think loading up on draft choices should be a strategy for teams that are rebuilding like TO did after jettisoning Kessel and Phanny.  I think TO should strike while the iron is hot otherwise the window could pass quite quickly.

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Right now Toronto is on the outside looking in they may be sellers of some of their UFA d-men instead of buyers by the deadline.

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That looked like a snarky comment or trolling please believe me it isn't meant that way. Just saying Toronto is having a down year and it is possible with Muzzin, Ceci and Barrie all UFA's at year end and Reilly out, it may be time to rethink things a bit. I love Liljegren and Sandin and think it is a tremendous opportunity to get them solid minutes the rest of the year and make their mistakes that all kids go through as part of the learning curve. I would think long and hard about seeing what the market is for the three others especially if the feeling is they cannot or will not be resigned. Top four blueliners always go for a premium at the deadline, the Leafs could be big winners at the deadline by adding futures.

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I'm wondering if Darnell Nurse would be a good target for the Leafs:

 

-He fits in their age cluster.

-He plays a style which would be welcome for Toronto. He's a defender that plays a hard-nosed physical game, but is an excellent skater and can transport the puck (not a great pass out of the zone, though).

-Edmonton has a glut of left-handed defensemen.

-He's due for a raise that the Oilers may not be able to fit within their cap.

 

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6 hours ago, hobie said:

Players that TO might draft might take between 3 to 5 years before they're ready for the NHL. In essence they won't be available to TO during much of the prime of what TO has now, what TO has now could possibly be very special if the proper support is accumulated, now.

 

I think loading up on draft choices should be a strategy for teams that are rebuilding like TO did after jettisoning Kessel and Phanny.  I think TO should strike while the iron is hot otherwise the window could pass quite quickly.

 

I know it seems that way, but in my view... the window already closed on this group. Their best chance to win was before they re-signed Matthews, Marner, and Nylander to huge contracts. Now they've entered into the "post-Cup win" phase of overpaying to retain existing talent. This is the phase where the team now loses valuable depth players in order to preserve their existing core group and enters into a period of decline. We're already there. The window slammed shut on this group the moment they bumped up against the cap ceiling with a defence that ranks ~28th best in the league and nothing to show for it in the standings or playoffs. 

 

Toronto's only viable move now is a "mini-rebuild" where they dump some of those max-money contracts for #1 picks and promising young NHL players (with a focus on getting defencemen of course) and rebuild this thing so the Leafs can compete again in another 3-4 years. In the meantime, they'll drop down and be in the draft lottery again. 

 

Otherwise, the Leafs will put themselves in a position where they have to overpay for defencemen, and they'll destroy their farm system and their entire forward group trying to patch the holes on one of the worst defences in the NHL. My two cents.  :( 

 

In a previous lifetime (before the cap)... the Leafs could just go out and buy someone to fill the hole on defence. But now, they're dead in the water. But at least they're making money, so who cares whether the team wins or not right? All that matters is if MLSE is getting richer. ;) 

 

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TO isn't a finished product but I think it's on the right path.

 

 TO has 59 points in 50 games and needs, probably, 39 points in the last 32 games to at least make the playoffs, I don't think that isn't something that's possible. If TO does get 98 points that would only be 7 points less than 2 years ago so I don't think this is a down year, it more than likely is a year where TO will make the playoffs a different way, not accumulating significant points early in the year.

 

TO's d isn't ideal but then that's the case with most teams, the ds of any team will never be good enough if the forwards don't buy into participating. Last night Holl pinched and Marner was in the area to back him up, Marner put in a very token backup effort and Nashville scored. The d isn't the problem as Babs had claimed and I'm sure Keefe would also.

 

Wasting TO's forward depth to prop up imaginary defensive problems might in fact be counter productive, it might and probably would send the wrong message to the forwards that would be left. The forwards have to be invested in defending for any team to succeed and bringing in supposed d upgrades might contribute to the forward mindset of not needing to defend.

 

I don't think a mini rebuild makes any sense, in any way. The players need to learn to thrive under pressure, they need to understand how essential they are to the success of the team, they need to take ownership of the results instead of having excuses like bad defenders/bad coaching/injuries/youth. 

 

They need to take ownership of the results, a sign of maturity and the path to successes. 

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11 hours ago, hobie said:

If TO does get 98 points that would only be 7 points less than 2 years ago so I don't think this is a down year, it more than likely is a year where TO will make the playoffs a different way, not accumulating significant points early in the year.

 

Then what?  

 

11 hours ago, hobie said:

TO's d isn't ideal but then that's the case with most teams, the ds of any team will never be good enough if the forwards don't buy into participating. Last night Holl pinched and Marner was in the area to back him up, Marner put in a very token backup effort and Nashville scored.

 

That was going to be my next point. Maybe the Leafs need to move some one-dimensional forwards out for some guys who are of the "Selke" variety.  When I talk about Toronto improving its defence, it's a team thing.  :) 

 

11 hours ago, hobie said:

I don't think a mini rebuild makes any sense, in any way. The players need to learn to thrive under pressure, they need to understand how essential they are to the success of the team, they need to take ownership of the results instead of having excuses like bad defenders/bad coaching/injuries/youth. 

 

All I'm saying is that if this group can't get it done, and if nobody is willing to part with what the Leafs need at the trade deadline, then Toronto needs to go back to the drawing board and draft what they're missing. If you can't acquire a Selke quality forward or a Norris quality defenceman, then just build your own. 

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I thought you were saying TO doesn't have the right players because you've stated TO should start shedding players before the TDL.

 

These players with this coach are well positioned to make the playoffs and perhaps even do well.

 

Holl and Sandin look to me to be quality players that TO has now and will into the future, Engvall and Mikeyev are substantial adds this year, I really like the way the team is looking right now and I think it's going to be dangerous especially if it ever gets fully healthy.

 

Hy/Matthews/Marner

Mikheyev/JT/Ny

Johnsson/Engvall/Spezza

Tima/Kerfoot/Kappy

 

I think this forward group can do a lot of damage especially when supported by an active d, something we'd never see with Babs.

 

Rielly/Barrie

Muzzin/Holl

Sandin/Dermott or Ceci

 

This is the best lineup I can remember TO having in about 20 years and I'm expecting a lot from it.

 

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5 hours ago, hobie said:

Holl and Sandin look to me to be quality players that TO has now and will into the future, Engvall and Mikeyev are substantial adds this year, I really like the way the team is looking right now and I think it's going to be dangerous especially if it ever gets fully healthy.

 

Agreed. They all look good.  :) 

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On 1/29/2020 at 9:26 AM, WordsOfWisdom said:

 

Agreed. They all look good.  :) 

 

 

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      Right now Toronto is on the outside looking in they may be sellers of some of their UFA d-men instead of buyers by the deadline.
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      That looked like a snarky comment or trolling please believe me it isn't meant that way. Just saying Toronto is having a down year and it is possible with Muzzin, Ceci and Barrie all UFA's at year end and Reilly out, it may be time to rethink things a bit. I love Liljegren and Sandin and think it is a tremendous opportunity to get them solid minutes the rest of the year and make their mistakes that all kids go through as part of the learning curve. I would think long and hard about seeing what t
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      I know it seems that way, but in my view... the window already closed on this group. Their best chance to win was before they re-signed Matthews, Marner, and Nylander to huge contracts. Now they've entered into the "post-Cup win" phase of overpaying to retain existing talent. This is the phase where the team now loses valuable depth players in order to preserve their existing core group and enters into a period of decline. We're already there. The window slammed shut on this group the moment the
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