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flyercanuck

Flyers top goal scorer per 60 minutes this season

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It was fun trying to push your buttons, but now you're just being too logical. I have to admit, you appear spot on with NAK. I hope he becomes more than just a grinder, and Those skills we all saw are legit.

 

I still want more physical play, but what else is new. As for the ED, jake and jvr wont be hard decisions to make

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2 minutes ago, CoachX said:

I still want more physical play, but what else is new.

 

The whole team needs to be more physical for sure. Gone are the Flyers of old.

 

What i am wondering can he maintain his impressive sniping ability i had read many times he had an impressive shot just didn't use it as much as he needed too but he shot at a 14.6% clip this past season there were only 4 Flyers who had better numbers.

 

Laughton 17.6%

Konecny 17%

Lindblom 15.3%

NAK 14.6%

 

So is that an anomaly or is he that deadly with his wrist shot?? Guess we'll see what he can do with this playoff run.

 

I love how he keeps it simple and just puts it on net and good things happens it seems...

 

 

 

 

...i think some more forwards could learn to play his way honestly. It is how Hayes became one of AV's favorites take care of the puck first do that and you can flourish within this team don't and you won't be in the lineup long.

 

Anyways i am pulling for NAK always loved the long shot guys who are willing to work for what they want.

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I think i heard somewhere, "trust the process". It seems to me the blue collar guys on this team are of the same mentality that Lappy had when he played. Grant, Thompson, Pitlick and NAK are guys willing to lay it out there game after game. Laughton too, but I think he's been slacking the last few seasons 

 

So mix these guys in with a very talented core of stars (JVR aside), and this could be a destiny type of team. Av and Fletch have done a good job.

 

I have a hope for this team 

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2 hours ago, CoachX said:

Laughton too, but I think he's been slacking the last few seasons 

 

Lol, he's not only one of the most consistent at the blue collar game and mentality that you talk about, he's been one of the most consistent Flyers period. If you think playing against Scott Laughton is easy you haven't been paying attention. 

 

Do you think playing against Scott Laughton is easy? Do You?!

 

ANSWER THE QUESTION!

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I personally would have a tough time playing against the popcorn vendor.

 

But its not all about me.

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Sounds like the kid is out to prove something. Good for him.

 

 

#dogwillhunt

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On 7/18/2020 at 9:25 AM, OccamsRazor said:

Sounds like the kid is out to prove something. Good for him.

Yes. He has to win me over

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35 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

Sounds good...

 

 

Cause we all know, rookies are the all knowing voice of reason

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35 minutes ago, CoachX said:

Cause we all know, rookies are the all knowing voice of reason

 

Of course not.......we are all waiting for your blessings...patiently waiting... 

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as I have said all along, this NAK that you speak of, appears to have something special

 

 

i like what he brings. 🤣

 

 

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17 minutes ago, CoachX said:

as I have said all along, this NAK that you speak of, appears to have something special

 

 

i like what he brings. 🤣

 

 

 

 

:LiesSign:

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2 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

:LiesSign:

 

🤯

 

im hurt. Youre name is going down in my book

 

at best I was misquoted, or misunderstood

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Posted (edited)

Most of the findings in our Philadelphia Flyers forechecking tracking project — at least that relate to individual players — have been limited to trying to measure which players were most effective as the first man in on the forecheck.

The reason was simple. The “F1,” as the player is known in hockey terminology, is guaranteed to have an impact (positive or negative) on every forecheck. Every time a team dumps the puck into the offensive zone, the F1 is going to at least put a degree of pressure on the puck, or a player on the opposing team successfully retrieved it. The F1’s effect on the play is undeniable.

But the F1 isn’t the only forward involved in an offensive-zone forecheck; after all, there’s a reason the “1” is a necessary part of the designation. Each forward on the ice at five-on-five has an impact on forechecking puck retrieval, and the F2 and F3 function as the second wave of puck pressure. On a regular basis, the F2 or F3 comes up with the puck on a retrieval, either after the F1 forced a defenseman into a less-than-ideal decision or through stellar anticipation on the part of the second wave of forecheckers.

So which Flyers forwards were most effective as “support” forecheckers this season when serving as the second or third man in on the attack? To answer this question, let’s use the same two primary metrics from our evaluation of F1s: Recovery Percentage (which measures what percentage of forechecks ended with the Flyers gaining possession of the puck) and Combined Forecheck Success Rate (the percentage of forechecks leading to a recovery or at least an uncontrolled exit by the opposition).

The usual suspects at the top

In theory, the best first-man-in forecheckers aren’t necessarily going to be the top support forecheckers. Perhaps speed and aggressiveness are what make a player a great F1, but anticipation and hockey smarts win out when serving as the second or third player in.

That might be the case for some forwards. But on the 2019-20 Flyers, generally speaking, the players who graded out strongly as the F1 also were at the top of the effectiveness charts for support forechecking.

Hidden Content

Let’s start with the players whose placement on the above list isn’t a surprise. Sean Couturier ranked first in Recovery Percentage and fourth in Combined Forecheck Success rate as an F1; it’s little surprise that he’s second in both categories while serving as an F2 or F3. Couturier is great at everything. Nicolas Aubé-Kubel was another F1 forechecking standout (third in Recovery Percentage, first in Combined Forecheck Success) and that dominance carried over to his support work as well. Travis Konecny (fourth and fifth, respectively, as the F1) shouldn’t come as a shock either.

Connor Bunnaman’s placement, however, is more intriguing. As an F1, he graded out similarly to Joel Farabee, one of the weakest performers tracked in this project. But in support, Bunnaman grades out like a forechecking star. Why the disconnect?

One theory is that Bunnaman is simply far better at coming in as the second wave than being the first man in. But here’s another plausible theory: Bunnaman spent 99:39 of his 190:16 at five-on-five alongside Aubé-Kubel; perhaps his stellar support results were a product of piggybacking off of Aubé-Kubel’s excellent work as the F1 (and support forechecker)?

The discrepancy between James van Riemsdyk’s poor rankings as an F1 (10th and 11th in our respective metrics out of 12 players) and much-improved results in support (ninth and fifth, respectively, out of 15) is easier to swallow. JvR is far from a physical player, but his instincts and offensive IQ are unquestioned. A more read-and-react type of role would seem to naturally play to his strengths better than “attack, attack, attack.” Claude Giroux also possesses plus read-and-react instincts, but unlike JvR, he graded out fine as an F1 (eighth, third). This is also unsurprising: Most would agree he’s a more complete player.

Then there’s Morgan Frost, who, as we saw a few weeks ago, graded out as something of a “super F1” in a limited sample. That success didn’t carry over to his results in a support forechecking role, which leaves three possible explanations for the discrepancy. First, perhaps at this stage of his career, he’s better as an F1 than a complete forechecker. Second, maybe his stellar F1 metrics were a bit misleading. Or third, the small sample of 20 games makes it difficult to know what kind of NHL forechecker he is at this point.

Full forechecking metrics — F1 + Support

We’re coming to the end of our individual players findings, and the tracking project as a whole. So now that we’ve looked at how each forward performed as the F1 and in an F2/F3 support function, why not combine the two?

Essentially, these are the results for each player when they were involved in the offensive-zone forecheck, regardless of role. Think of it as the closest thing you’re going to get to “on-ice” forechecking metrics for individual players: Which forwards helped the Flyers to the most forechecking success when they jumped over the boards for their shifts at five-on-five?

Hidden Content

 

If there’s a “winner” who has emerged in this forechecking project, it has to be Aubé-Kubel, who finished tops in both our primary forechecking categories. But after Aubé-Kubel (and the anomaly, Bunnaman), you have … basically a list of the Flyers’ best forwards: Couturier, Giroux, Konecny, van Riemsdyk, Oskar Lindblom; even Voracek sneaks into the top half of the list. Forechecking may be glamorized as a job for the players at the bottom half of the lineup, the muckers and grinders. But at least in Philadelphia’s case, with the occasional Aubé-Kubel-ish exception, it’s the elite forwards who get the puck back the most after dumping it in.

 

Final observations

Time for another quick recap of what we learned through our findings. What stood out this time?

1. Aubé-Kubel, the forechecking king

He dominated as the F1. He excelled as a support forechecker in an F2 or F3 role. Aubé-Kubel, as a rookie, was quite simply the Flyers’ most effective forechecking forward. His future looks bright.

2. Bunnaman is a good support forechecker … maybe?

The numbers certainly hint that Bunnaman might be a strong support forechecker, but considering the extensive time he spent alongside Aubé-Kubel after his second call-up, it’s also possible his results could be a bit inflated. It’s worth further inspection in the coming months and years to see if this talent appears in larger samples and with different combinations of linemates.

3. Giroux and van Riemsdyk excelled in support

While Bunnaman’s success in a support forechecking role merited a degree of skepticism, Giroux and van Riemsdyk seem like the type of players who would thrive in the second wave of a forecheck. At least this season, it was a strength of both of their games.

4. Couturier deserves to win the Selke

Does the fact that Couturier graded out as probably the Flyers’ second-best offensive-zone forechecker in 2019-20 necessarily mean he should win the Selke Trophy? Well, no. But does he indeed deserve to win it? 

Hidden Content

. Moving on.

5. Frost’s F1 prowess didn’t carry over to support forechecking

Frost produced surprisingly monstrous results on first-man-in forechecking during his initial 20-game stint in the NHL. But it’s not difficult to argue he graded out as the team’s worst in terms of helping the Flyers recover loose pucks and prevent transition rushes while serving as the second or third forechecker. As a result, he ended up in the bottom half of the overall forechecking rankings. Perhaps it’s best to pump the brakes a bit on putting him on the level of, say, Aubé-Kubel.

6. Disappointing results for Farabee and Hayes 

Farabee’s biggest forechecking issues centered on physical immaturity, problems that he may be in the process of addressing considering his strong work at Phase 3 camp. Kevin Hayes’ poor grades in our forechecking project are a bit tougher to explain. The Flyers broke even from a play-driving standpoint with Hayes on the ice this season, so it’s not like his weak forechecking was burying the team. And Hayes is perhaps more familiar with Alain Vigneault’s system than any other Philadelphia forward, given his time with the head coach in New York. So why did he end up at the bottom of every list? Maybe the bounces just didn’t go his way this time around. Or maybe it’s hinting at a potential hole in Hayes’ game. This is certainly worth closer inspection moving into the playoffs and beyond.

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Edited by OccamsRazor
edited just for coach

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I refuse to react or comment on the above charts,

 

because I dont want to

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I've always like NAK, right back to his junior days. He's a good solid player. He's also a great case of what can happen when bad coaches sink their claws into you. Once Vigneault got him though, he got him fixed up. Honestly, NAK could end up being an Alex Burrows type player under Vigneault and there's nothing wrong with a potential 25 to 30 goal a season guy who can play throughout the lineup and will get special teams time in the future. That's going to be his bread and butter. He'll get peanuts for regular strength time, but he'll get boatloads of PK and PP time. He's a forechecking demon that also has that uncanny ability to always be around the puck. Honestly, he and Farabee are going to be real fun to watch as they mature.

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11 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

I've always like NAK, right back to his junior days. He's a good solid player. He's also a great case of what can happen when bad coaches sink their claws into you. Once Vigneault got him though, he got him fixed up. Honestly, NAK could end up being an Alex Burrows type player under Vigneault and there's nothing wrong with a potential 25 to 30 goal a season guy who can play throughout the lineup and will get special teams time in the future. That's going to be his bread and butter. He'll get peanuts for regular strength time, but he'll get boatloads of PK and PP time. He's a forechecking demon that also has that uncanny ability to always be around the puck. Honestly, he and Farabee are going to be real fun to watch as they mature.

 

I thought NAK was very good today. An absolute hound and some sneaky skill. He had a few looks today, had one quite good chance from the top of the circle but it was blocked. I like the Burrows comparison.

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5 minutes ago, Podein25 said:

 

I thought NAK was very good today. An absolute hound and some sneaky skill. He had a few looks today, had one quite good chance from the top of the circle but it was blocked. I like the Burrows comparison.

I like how he hit everything that moved 

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1 minute ago, CoachX said:

I like how he hit everything that moved 

 

He certainly did. Right on the edge. Havoc.

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On 7/8/2020 at 5:48 PM, CoachX said:

NAK? pbbbbt! The love affair this forum and the Flyers has with this guy is mind boggling. He's an overrated 4th line grinder. He's Zac Rinaldo without the fight ability. I cant believe they give this guy ice time over a playmaker like Vorobyev. And now HE has no choice but to go to Russia. Its pure racism

 

NAK scored a nice goal once. Yay! But he forechecks like a marhmallow, is defensively irresponsible and a cancer in the room. 

 

Ugh! Im done. I cant take it anymore. I need to quarantine myself

 

 

 

Over rated 4th liner you say?

 

You still feel this way about the guy?

 

One guy is off to the KHL...

 

...and the other scored the game winner to help clinch the #1 seed.

 

I'll let you guess which is which.

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19 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Over rated 4th liner you say?

 

You still feel this way about the guy?

 

One guy is off to the KHL...

 

...and the other scored the game winner to help clinch the #1 seed.

 

I'll let you guess which is which.

I have no idea what you are babbling about.  I clearly said how much I like this kid in another post

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On 5/15/2020 at 12:48 PM, flyercanuck said:

 So take a guess who leads all Flyers in goals per 60 minutes played this season. I'll give you a hint...the pick has been ridiculed for years as a bad choice, yet it really wasn't. 

 

 

  1. Scott Laughton: 1.245 goals per 60 minutes.
  2. Travis Konecny: 1.241.
  3. Oskar Lindblom: 1.152.
  4. James van Riemsdyk 1.107.
  5. Sean Couturier: 1.041.
  6. Kevin Hayes: 0.927.
  7. Nic Aube-Kubel: 0.809.
  8. Claude Giroux: 0.756.
  9. Derek Grant: 0.728.
  10. Tyler Pitlick: 0.696.

 

  Laughton has had some problems staying healthy. But when he is healthy, he's really been a pretty damn good player. Not a star, but then you shouldn't really get them where he was picked anyway.

 

 Plus this is better than staring at the wall.

 

I'll leave this here...

 

Flyers' playoff goal-scorers.

 

Image

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21 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

I'll leave this here...

 

Flyers' playoff goal-scorers.

 

Hidden Content

 

Ya....we'd better see more guys making big money on that list or we won't be going too far.

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40 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Ya....we'd better see more guys making big money on that list or we won't be going too far.

 

Yeah they have been outscored and barely lead the series.

 

There is too much talent not to bea able to put them away Friday.

 

I would sit Bunnaman for Frost.

 

Just me.

 

Giorux - Coots - Jake 

Farabee - Hayes - TK

Laughton - Grant - NAK

Pitlick - Frost - Raffl

 

Thompson does some good things and not so good things trying to inject some more speed.

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    • 2
      Post
      So take a guess who leads all Flyers in goals per 60 minutes played this season. I'll give you a hint...the pick has been ridiculed for years as a bad choice, yet it really wasn't.      Scott Laughton: 1.245 goals per 60 minutes. Travis Konecny: 1.241. Oskar Lindblom: 1.152. James van Riemsdyk 1.107. Sean Couturier: 1.041. Kevin Hayes: 0.927. Nic Aube-Kubel: 0.809. Claude Giroux: 0.756. Derek Grant: 0.728. Tyler Pitli
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      So you're saying Laughton should be credited as the first 80-goal scorer in franchise history?   I've been critical of him but he has emerged as a solid 3C which is better than nothing.
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      Ya sure?
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      I can't believe it took TWELVE posts!
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      Nodl would outscore him!  🤪
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      Lol, he's not only one of the most consistent at the blue collar game and mentality that you talk about, he's been one of the most consistent Flyers period. If you think playing against Scott Laughton is easy you haven't been paying attention.    Do you think playing against Scott Laughton is easy? Do You?!   ANSWER THE QUESTION!

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