brelic

21 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

Well from what i am hearing and from what i seen of the highlights because i didn't get to watch it sounds like he could benefit from maybe being sent to the Phantoms for a week or so to work on his game.

I'm not sure that solves the problem. Who is the other NHL goalie in this scenario? Don't say Lyon, because at absolute BEST he is a mediocre backup in very limited play. Does that mean Elliott is the starter? 

That is the real problem - the alternative to Hart is not able to handle a starter workload while Hart figures it out. 

21 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

But if they want to keep him up and just let him work on it in practice i guess i can understand. But at some point he will have to get back in a game....the only way to overcome it...i guess i knew it just couldn't be Philly without some issues in net. SMFH.

 

I think the kid will figure it out go thing he already has his own shrink.

 

Not making excuses maybe the Flyers were tired being a back to back....the Isles were rested. Either way they will get it figured out.

 

I do have faith in them.....for now.

I don't think we have "issues" in net. The "issues" are with the fans' expectations. 

With a young goalie like Hart, and any young player - it's hard to put a timeline to it. Matt Murray won two cups by the time he was 22 and was lights out excellent. Binnington didn't really get his NHL shot until last year at 25. Rinne wasn't in the NHL until he was 26 (is he REALLY turning 37 next week????). Tim Thomas wasn't a thing until he was 31.

Hart's timeline could be weeks, months, or years.

He's just 21 and fans were counting on him being "exceptional" in his development, Fletch included, if we take the Elliott signing as evidence.

Which is why a reliable backup capable of being the starter is kinda critical.

Yeah, Hart was all kinds of bad last night. So was the defense. 

Elliott made 2-3 major saves that basically erased a gaffe by the team. Now, it was not as significant in a game whose outcome was already pretty much determined, but those are the kinds of the saves he's been mostly giving us, and Hart has not. I don't want to pin it all on the goalie, but if Hart makes a few saves early on, maybe we preserve that early lead and get energy from the saves. 

Instead, Hart was deflating last night. It'll be interesting to see what they do tomorrow night.

Hart or Elliott? I'd go Elliott - he gives us the best chance to win at this moment. 

Oh, and Morin was all kinds of bad. Rusty or not, Manning would have been an improvement.

Oof. Rough start for the team and Hart. 

14 hours ago, blocker said:

They've spilled south of the border along with cold weather and Celine Dion's CDs.  

You can keep all three! 

Meh, I wouldn't trade Jake for Benn. 

In both cases, they've peaked for their careers and are on the decline. Benn is signed for more for longer. No thanks. 

To me that's a sideways move at best (Lucic for Neal kind of trade). 

7 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Off topic but i found this interesting especially since it wasn't Eklund...

 

@TSN1040
LISTEN
@TSNBobMcKenzie
: Hearing some low trade rumblings around Troy Stecher; on Leafs, Wild, Flyers

 

...a right hand shot under contract at 2.2 mill. Flyers are already stacked on the blueline but for say Hagg i'd listen.

 

I could see the Wild being more on this....if even true.

I wonder what would be going the other way, and why. We already have a logjam on defense... 

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

I have to think the Flyers will go to Elliott vs the Blackhawks but i would understand AV going back to Hart to show he hasn't lost confidence in him.

 

Hell even Binnington has looked average this year so far. So maybe they try Hart back in the crease. But they might stay with the hot hand.

 

Guess it's his call after he gets a look at them in practice i can see it going either way.

 

He has preached not to panic and said he wants to show his players he has faith in them and well the goalie shouldn't be any different i certainly do want to damage his psyche. 

I'd go with Elliott against the Hawks , and then go with Hart against the Blue Jackets on Sat. Elliott has earned another start.

2 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

He will once he gets into a pro workout schedule and by the time he turns 20 his body will start to add more muscle to his frame.

 

He is already up to 180 and well his Captain is only 5 pounds heavier than him but he will also have to learn as best he can to avoid contact by no shying away from it but know how to brace himself for impact...but as we have seen guys can be 6-3 220 and with the right or more like the wrong hit to the dome be out for a while....see Eric Lindros Jeremy Roenick for examples.

 

The weight will come in time i didn't start packing on some solid muscle till i got out of bootcamp and with my command and i was the same age...so know telling how big he will end up. I think he tops out at 6-1 or 6-2 and around 200-205. Which is ore than enough.

 

Someone needs to start feeding hm the steak and cheeses for lunch every day....and hit the weights.

Oh, I know he'll get bigger and steadier as time goes on... it was just an observation from last night. He really did look puny.

9 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

I agree. I think Farabee will be a very nice sniper once he has settled in and has found some linemates to work with.

Man, there was a point last night where a Flyer went to the board to retrieve the puck and a Vegas player was bearing down on him, and my thought was "who's the little kid with a Flyers jersey?" and it was Farabee.

He is positively tiny. Chicken legs. That guy could have plastered Farabee... but thankfully he didn;t.

Dude needs to put on some serious weight.

Hard to believe TK has more points than Giroux, Voracek, JVR, and Ghost COMBINED.

27 minutes ago, elmatus said:

 

I'd say it's very possible. I'm also not very surprised by it. This is especially true in the goal department, where we really don't have a top flight goal scorer on the roster right now.

 

 

In pts yeah, but none of those guys are real goal scorers (maybe Couts, but his goals are usually net front goals rather than shots). TK certainly has a better shot than any of those three. They do other things well, but they're not snipers by any stretch. I can definitely see TK especially leading this team in goals in this year.

 

Voracek doesn't belong in any conversation related to scoring goals. I'm pretty sure he grew up shooting into a soccer net.

I guess I'd ask what your definition of a "sniper" is? 

That goal from TK last night, I'd say was a snipe. Same as his backhanded top shelf goal against... the Hawks I think? Then he had a goal coming down the side with speed and just sniped it in the far corner.

He looks like he will hit 30 this year easily, and I'd definitely call him a sniper. 

9 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

Strange to see TK and Lindblom leading the Flyers in goals on the season

Interesting you say that. During the game, I kept thinking, "well, I guess this is the year that the torch is passed from the older guys to the younger guys."

Also, PP2 looks soooo much better than PP1.

Oskar in particular is a possession beast. 

36 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

I have to say i like Appleyard's idea even better...

 

 

 

 

Just send Twarynski to the Phantoms.

 

Those are much better lines and Laughton is a 4th center at best.

They did send Twarynski back and recalled Vorobyev. 
 

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Looks like our voices have been heard....wonder who sits.

 

 

You know what this means, right?

We’re definitely gettin Coach Q!

2 hours ago, radoran said:

Easy for a goalie with no "book" on him to come in and look strong. Andrew Hammond comes to mind top of head...

 

Teams have identified weaknesses and it's now on the goalie and coach to adapt to them.

 

But the addition of two vets to shore up the blue line and defensively responsible Hayes at 2C was supposed to mitigate that.

 

If you give up 15 shots in a game you're not supposed to see 3 goals against, sophomore slump or no sophomore slump...

This is what Fletch more or less accepted (and the fan base) when he anointed Hart as the starter. A 21 year old is going to come with bumps and bruises. 
 

In other words, if Fletch’s Plan was to be competitive this year, that probably wasn’t the best goalie choice. I love Hart and believe he will develop into a #1, and may even find his game and more consistency as the season wears on. But he might not, and that’s the risk Fletch went with. 
 

Always 2-3 years away from being 2-3 years away

Thankful I had fun things to do last night and didn’t get to watch. 
 

Was it as bad as it sounds? Flyers booed off home ice already?

Lol the honeymoon lasted one home game. 

Some interesting observations from an Oilers perspective...

https://www.beerleagueheroes.com/2019-20-edmonton-oilers-gm7-game-grades-wtf-was-that/

Somebody has to explain to me how the Edmonton Oilers can drop a six-spot on the Philadelphia Flyers at home but lose in almost every other significant statistical category.

Oh yeah… Bad goaltending and Connor McDavid. Are you kidding me?

52 shots to 22 is how the game ended. I get score effects had something to do with it, but that is ridiculous. The Oilers are THIS close to putting their foot through the rusted out floor of their car with how hard they’re pushing the gas pedal. The bottom’s bound to fall out here folks…

McDavid put up sub 40% possession numbers for the second game in a row. That’s a bit weird. A 26% night on the Corsis doesn’t usually end with five points added to your statline. I like what Brian Burke had to say, “The Flyers weren’t outplayed, they were out-Connor’d.”

18 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

Just 30 minutes I guess Patrick might be further away than we think.

Yeah, I’d be surprised if we see him before US Thanksgiving. Probably not before Christmas. 
 

Patrick hasn’t played a hockey game in almost 7 months. His practices are short, slow, and without contact. There’s a long way for him to go still.

16 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

@brelic

 

So Mike Hoffman is on the block since the word is he won't resign in Florida.

 

So would you trade Jake for him?

 

Or what about JVR for him asking for a friend.

 

I am asking you because if I remember right you suggested this past offseason....I think it was you and I said no.

 

But i have changed my stance now.

 

So i wonder would Florida take one of those two because they are under contract for a few years and have no NTC or no NMC.

 

 

Interesting. 
 

I’d be tempted to ask about Hoffman, and a swap would depend on a few things. What’s going the other way? And how much for how long does Hoffman want? He’s 29, so not really interested in giving him a 7 year deal. If he wants 5 or less, I’d swap Voracek for him. 
 

If we actually want to start changing the core, this is one way to do it.

I’d keep JVR. 

2 hours ago, radoran said:

 

There's likely a "100%" emoji I'm missing, so just take that as read, eh?

 

I absolutely stopped watching last season. Paid attention a little. Came back to see Hart for a while. Came into this one looking for something different to be on the ice and, really, have yet to see much change.

 

It's early. Five games. But after the past seven years I'm not in the "The VeeGees will figure it out and lead us to the promised land!" camp.

 

They could do it and I'll be happy as all get out if they do.

 

But it's really disappointing when I'm watching other teams play and enjoying the game and the sport and then find myself wondering "why is my team not doing that?!?!?"

That’s pretty much how I feel these past few years. 
 

There might be a bit of grass is greener going on where, at least for me, I only see other teams when they play the Flyers, so I see a small sample of them vs a huge dose of Flyers. Obviously I have more context and sample size for the O&B. 
 

I know the Leafs fans are already antsy and there have been threads upon threads plus media musing on whether Babcock has worn out his welcome. There are many ex players who think he’s just a flat out dick. Peters’ post game comments on the Oilers/Flyers game were not rosy. NJ is in panic mode. The Isles were struggling before their three game win streak, the Panthers’ start is probably underwhelming to the fan base. The Stars are a mess. 
 

But it is early in the season, and a convincing Flyers 3 game winning streak would quickly change things. 

4 minutes ago, Poulin20 said:

 

In fairness, he is still with the team.  I see him around the arena quite a bit, he just doesn't work on the ice anymore during games.

Marshy is an awesome dude. When I worked as a musician for the Sens, my buddy and I would hang out at Marshy's (his bar in the Sens' whatever-the-heck-the-arena-is-called-now - I think it changed THREE times while I worked there). We'd down tequila shots with other fans and bar staff before, during, and after games. He was always around, he'd sit with us, tell us stories, and I just always felt like he genuinely enjoyed just hanging with us and the people around. He knew my by name and would always say hi, ask how I was doing when I'd run into him. Therien's sister was often with us and she was great, so were other ex-players, broadcast teams, training staff, etc. Just a good bunch of peeps, and Marshy was always at the center of it. 

One of the best gigs of my life.

Just now, radoran said:

 

STL just won the Cup with just two guys over 60 points (O'Reilly 77, Tarasenko 68) last year. The Bruins they beat had four (Marchand 100, Pastrnak 81, Bergeron 79, Krecji 73)

 

The Kings won two Cups with one (Kopitar 76 in '12 and 70 in '14).  The '11 Bruins had two (Krejci, Lucic 62 each).

Right, so maybe the "elite" talent thing is overblown. 

I'd gladly put Couturier up against ROR any day, and between G and V, we have the Tarasenko factor.

They also had Binnington. We have Hart who could be that.

Maybe my frustration is more over enjoyment factor lol. I haven't enjoyed watching the Flyers in YEARS.

5 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

FWIW, that's exactly what they are trying to do now: "Add a 2C and some vet presence on D and *voila* competitive!"

 

The main difference is they have some nice talent from the Hextall drafts, whereas they had nothing in the cupboard after Holmgren. I won't go all Marc Antony on you again

 

There aren't a whole lot of Cup winners since the lockout that didn't "bottom out" before they got good...

Absolutely - that's exactly what Fletch is doing, presumably after the Hextall "rebuild". I'm just saying that Hextall had an opportunity to "bottom out" but chose not to (or wasn't allowed to). At this point, the fanbase and Comcast would not accept a true bottoming out. That ship has sailed.

And again, don't get me wrong on the Hextall regime. He did what he thought was right. With the benefit of hindsight, it's fine for us to question whether it was the right approach.

I've said it before that my main concern if I look 5 years into the future is that we have zero players in the system right that you can look at their *actual* performance to date and say, "yup, that guy could replace G's production in X years."

Konecny's fast start has me thinking he might. But we'd need to see a 60+ point season from *someone* before we start thinking it's possible.

Couturier and Ghost are the only guys that have done that lately. Simmonds reached 60 five years ago. And before that, there was Hartnell. 

Ironically, the years we lost to the Hawks, we had only two guys above 60 points. Richards (62) and Carter (61).

So maybe I just defeated my entire line of thinking.

Thanks for playing everyone! lol

Good back and forth, guys. 

I think what all of this really speaks to is a frustrated fan base living through an unprecedented period of badness/mediocrity for this franchise. Fresh from expansion, the team made the playoffs in their first year, and 4 of the first 6 years. 

Then there were the 89-93 dark years with no playoffs.

So it's a strong case that this is the franchise's worst stretch of futility / insignificance despite having one of the top NHL point producers this decade.

For me personally, the frustration is in seeing NJ benefit from two #1s, but moreso Toronto deliberately bottoming out and turning it around rather quickly with top level elite talent to emerge as a Cup contender.

Hextall chose the path familiar to Flyers fans - the on-the-fly retool. *Something* had to be done following the drunken Homer years to return this franchise to sustainability. But Hextall's solution, we're seeing, has not yielded true elite talent nor has it kept the team competitive. They've burned through three coaches and a GM.

Whatever you might think of Patrick and his ceiling, there is no denying that he is one of the weakest top 2 picks of the decade. Ain't much we can do about that but hope he reaches MUCH MUCH higher than he has shown thus far.

We're 2-2-1. 

Let's see how they do the next 5.