BobbyClarkeFan16

3 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

So where does that money come from when Hart, Patrick and Sanheim and backup goalie also need new deals?

 

And the Flyers are ok at center but with Barkov, Coots, Hayes they would be arguable the deepest in the NHL.

We'll have to see what the cap situation looks like. I know it's flat for next year and the year after. On top of it, Hart, Patrick and Sanheim aren't going to get the big pay day that we all think they're going to get, especially in a flat cap situation. I fully expect that they'll sign for a moderate raise during the flat years, but then try to maximize after the flat years are done. 

As for Hamilton, I don't think he's getting a 7 or 8 million dollar deal this offseason. I think those days with those kind of contracts are going to be things of the past for the next little while. No one is going to tie up that kind of money anymore into those types of contacts. The current world conditions have changed all that. You might see a 7 million per year deal, but that's going to end up being rare. Honestly, I think you'll see 6 - 6.5 as the standard high numbers going forward.

22 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

Columbus better not give him to the Rangers , they better demand the Rangers best prospects. I’m stilled pissed off they got the #2 and #1 pick two years in succession.

Agreed.  How funny is it that the largest market in the NHL ends up with top 2 picks two years in a row.  I don't believe for Ione second that some sort of fix wasn't in. 

We get the Penguins who conveniently win the Crosby sweepstakes,  the Devils who win the Hughes sweepstakes and now the Dangers who win the Lafreniere sweepstakes. It's a farce. Do the draw live.  Throw all the balls in and do the draw that way for all to see. 

18 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Forget Dubois he wants to play for the Rangers.

 

Forget Laine.

 

Go after Barkov.

 

His contract is up after next season and said he want resign with Florida.

 

So spend the assets for that guy!!!

 

I send them Patrick, JVR, Frost and Cam York.

 

It may need more but it is a start to discussions!

 

Down the middle:

 

Barkov

Coots

Hayes

Laughton

Nope.  Flyers are good from a center aspect. They need a legitimate right handed defenseman to balance the roster.  Make the pitch for Dougie Hamilton when he becomes a UFA. Get that top fight player to go alongside Provorov. 

22 minutes ago, Podein25 said:

 

I don't think this is true. But I'm prepared to be proven wrong.

No,  he was a right winger when he was drafted. 

I think put all the jack rabbits on one line - Farabee/Frost/Konecny. Let them use their speed and free wheeling to drive the opposition nuts.  You can't hit what you can't catch and they'd be great at that.  

Next line I'd go with is Lindblom/ Hayes/Voracek. There's size, offense and defense there.  Let Hayes bulldoze the center ice area to open lanes for Voracek and you can park Lindblom in front of the net for the garbage goals. 

Third line would be JVR/Patrick/Giroux. Patrick gets the benefit of playing with Giroux and Giroux gets to be the playmaker on the line without the defensive responsibilities of being a center. 

You can then leave your fourth line of Raffl/Laughton/NAK. 

Of course,  these aren't a 1 through 4. The Hayes line would be 1, Patrick 2, Frost 3. Just how I'd put the lines together. 

9 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Trying to keep the thread from dying.

 

PLD to Philly is a fantasy.

 

Flyers will stay the course with what they have.

 

It will take a desperate club IF they want to move him.

 

NJ or NYR might be in on him.

Pierre LeBrun said that Columbus was getting serious offers for PLD and that if things don't go smooth in the first month,  expect the trade chatter to heat up.

I think the Flyers will investigate as they should, but I really believe the Flyers will try to acquire a right handed top pairing defenseman before they even consider a move for PLD. 

18 minutes ago, elmatus said:

 

I can't imagine NAK being protected over Jake. I like NAK and all, but he has one season under his belt and a whopping 15 pts to show for it. Jake may not be the second coming of Clarke, but he's still a 60 pt per year guy. NAK is more likely to play a supporting bottom six role for whatever amount of years he plays in the league.

 

Projections are fine to an extent, but Fletch isn't going to project NAK morphs to becomes a 60pt per year scorer on the basis of a single 15pt NHL season. Again, I do like NAK, but that's one hell of an oversell at this point. 

 

On that topic, if Jake is exposed to Seattle, he will almost certainly be their pick. They may not like what they get at times, but he'd be a pretty obvious choice from our team. 

 

Let's not forget:

2020 he was our third highest scorer (TK, Couts)

2019 he was our third highest scorer (Giroux, Couts)

2018 he was our second highest scorer (Giroux)

2017 he was our top scorer

2016 he was fourth (Giroux, Simmonds, Schenn)

2015 he was our top scorer

2014 he was second (Giroux)

 

If he's available, he'll almost definitely be their pick.

I can't see the Kraken taking Voracek if he's available. For these start up franchises, especially once the damage from the pandemic is taken into consideration and just how much the cap will do, that will just cause all sorts of cap issues for them.  

With that being said, I'm feeling very certain that Voracek will be protected in that he's good friends with the captain, is well liked by his teammates, and is not a locker room distraction or problem. Those three factors are incredibly important. Losing a player like Voracek could have a devastating effect on the locker room and I think Fletcher knows that. 

Any deal for Dubois begins with Frost and probably Zamula or Sanheim. Any talk of Ghost or Voracek or JVR is out the window. If Ghost is hurt again (just speculating here,  but I'm wondering if it's a degenerative knee condition), there's no value there.  JVR and Voracek simply have too much money on their respective deals. 

Anyways,  I think a deal ends up something like this:

To Columbus: Frost, Zamula, Laughton, Philadelphia 1st

To Philadelphia: Dubois, Jenner, Columbus 3rd

38 minutes ago, CoachX said:

Laughton has bored me to death. Not sure why everyone is so high on this guy

He fills a role and does his role well. Skates hard,  is always on the puck and nerve takes a shift off. Let's not forget that there was some skill there until Hextall and Hakstol basically didn't want him to use his skill and just be a checker. They wasted him. With that being said,  he's replaceable,  especially if guys like Allison and Laczynski hit their ceiling. 

Gut feeling says they move Frost. I don't think they want him in Philadelphia. He's not a Fletcher/Vigneault type of player.

8 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

See this was my concern the vets.

 

Man they let this team down big time.

 

Giroux, Hayes, JVR, Niskanen, Braun and Jake all looked gassed.

 

Jake not as much vs Montreal but vs the Isles the whole group had nothing to give.

 

Giroux looked like he had mentally opted out.

 

And Niskanen's play fell off a cliff.

 

So with out that lead by example group the kids had no chance.

 

So if they are to do anything their best players have to be their best players as AV said last year.

 

And if they do the kids will follow suit and maybe not feel so much pressure.

I get what you're saying. My issue I have with the club and most clubs around the league is that you can have talented youth in the lineup and in most cases, they'll outplay the vets, but there's this misguided sense that you have to play the vets because 'they've been there' while the youth have to sit and watch because they've 'never been there' and this is a 'learning opportunity' for them. It's garbage thinking. The Flyers are at a point now where the veterans should be supporting the youth and the youth should be playing the critical roles. We're seeing that with the defense, but we still don't quite see that with the offense. The young guys seem to be bounced all around the lineup while the Girouxs, Voraceks, Hayes, etc....all seem to have their spot secured, so no matter how crappy they play, they'll always be guaranteed the playing time in top roles. It baffles me. 

As for Niskanen, gone. I absolutely loathe the idea of Braun being around, especially when the statistically worst defenseman in the league (Robert Hagg -> out of 196 defensemen in the league, he was rated 196th on advanced stats) occupies a spot in the lineup. This was a chance for Fletcher and Vigneault to get younger and more mobile on the blueline and they kept the status quo. I'll never understand it.

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Truth be known every team that makes the playoffs is a contender.

I'll openly admit I have incredibly high standards.  I understand that everyone who qualifies for the playoffs is a contender,  but that just doesn't fit the bill for me. 

As mentioned, I've watched this club for 40 years and visually,  you can tell when you have a true Stanley Cup contender just by the way they play.  There's a crispness and a dedication to system and style of play and I don't see that fun this group,  yet. 

They're getting there.  The veterans might already be there,  but its the young players who need to get there.  Meyers and Sanheim are close to reaching that point,  but they aren't there yet.  Farabee looks like he could get there. Lindblom has questions and so does Patrick.  We don't know if Frost will ever crack this roster and if he does,  how far is he away from hitting that crispness and compete level that's required. 

I don't know if I'm making sense,  but that's how I see things right now.  The maturation process simply can't be rushed and sometimes this franchise does that. They don't show players to make mistakes and learn as that's part of the process.  We all saw how Haktard crucified Konecny and Ghost and we even saw Vigneault do that with Ghost as well,  even though he and the staff knew that Ghost was injured (in all honesty,  Ghost should have never been playing last year,  but that's on the medical staff). 

In my mind  there are just too many question marks to make them a legitimate cup contender.  We can see the window opening,  which is a great sign, but there's still a lot of work to do. 

5 hours ago, CoachX said:

Two seasons away......

It's not wrong though. They're a playoff contender,  but they aren't a Stanley Cup contender and that's perfectly fine.  Personally,  I think the club overachieved last season and I'm fairly certain that there will be a bit of let down/reality check this year.  There's still work to do and there are still a number of questions this group has to answer. Let's not forget that there were some who were still questioning whether this club would have made the playoffs last year and they didn't exactly have the greatest of starts. Not much has changed from last year to this year,  so yeah, I'm reserved in my view of the club.  I've been a fan for over 40 years and I'm just not sold yet with this group.  They're competitive,  but there's still a lot of maturing that need to be done, especially physically with some of these players.  The Flyers are also going to depending on a guy who hasn't played in over a year to be a pivotal player. They'll make the playoffs and they'll win a round or two,  but they simply aren't at a level that a club like Tampa Bay is at.  And that's OK because they should eventually get there.  Until then,  stick with the process.  Get these young guys playing more so they're ready to take over the club and move out the players who don't fit what is trying to be established. 

3 hours ago, Zzeke said:

 

I'm a believer. This is a very, very, good team. Anyone else a believer?

 

They're not a Stanley Cup contender yet.  The defense is still about two seasons away from hitting peak status.  The club also needs to hope that Frost and Farabee hit their stride in two seasons as well. Giroux and Voracek are on the downside of their career and they've started to show down in terms of production. The kids need to step up and I just don't see that happening this season. I think Vigneault shelters them this year and then lets them loose next year. 

35 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

We'll see but I ain't feeling it.

 

He has a lot of work to do to get better in his own end still.

 

Will he get there? No sure.

This is where the coaching staff needs to decide what they want to do with Sanheim.  Are they going to free him and let him wheel and deal on offense or do they want him to be a lock down defender first? It certainly doesn't help matters that Sanheim has had several different coaches and provide him with no sense of direction. I say let him loose and let him free wheel. 

....and Bjorkstrom just signed a new contract today with a higher aav than Dubois. I fully expect a full court press now to be moved.  This is going to get ugly.

39 minutes ago, SCFlyguy said:

The main value of Zamula/York etc. is that two or three years from now when Sanheim and/or Myers need to be paid $6M per year, you have a younger, cheaper version to replace them.

Myers will be going nowhere.  He is the only high end right handed defenseman in the organization right now.  The Flyers have an abundance of left handed defensemen.  And let's be honest - there's no capital tied up in Zamula in that he was an undrafted free agent. I doubt the Flyers part with any player in which equity like a 1st round pick was used. 

On 1/4/2021 at 9:09 AM, mojo1917 said:

Half these guys aren't even invited to camp. Kase, Rubie and Sushko are staying in Europe. 

 

Well so much for that.  I thought they were coming back to North America when the season started.  Guess not. 

Dubois is one of the few players in the league that I would include Frost in a deal for. Honestly, if Columbus is looking to rebuild the pipeline,  I'd offer Frost, Zamula, Gostisbehere and a draft pick for.  Columbus would be getting two elite prospects,  a defenseman who would thrive on that blueline. As for the draft pick,  they aren't getting a 1st or a 2nd. That's quite a good haul for a player who doesn't want to be in Columbus and more important, a player who could possibly cause friction in the locker room with regards to wanting out.  I get that Columbus isn't going to sell him for pennies on the dollar,  but they have to realize that if he becomes a distraction,  it could be enough to sink the team.  No GM or head coach would risk that.  If they sit him out,  he loses value. 

5 hours ago, Zzeke said:

Flyers Camp on-ice starts today Jan 4. Nine days with lots of scrimmages. First game is Jan 13 vs Pens.

 

What are the top questions to be answered over these 9 days 'in order of importance'?

 

I would suggest these questions [and my opinions]:

 

1) Who to play on the right side defence 1st pair with Provorov? [I say Gus]

 

2) Will Patrick's health hold up as the 3C over these 9 days? If not, Frost as 3C?

 

3) Will the optimism for a strong Lindblom prove out, and what line? [I say yes, and 1LW]

 

4) Who will win the vacant 3RW job? [I say Sandin or Laczynski]

 

5) What will be the status of JVR? [I say #14 forward, pending a trade if possible]

 

6) What will be the satus of Ghost? [I say #7 defenceman, pending trade soon, before Expansion Draft]

 

7) Who will be on the 6-man Taxi Squad in addition to goaltender Lyon? 

[I say 
Frost (C)
Laczynski (C/LW/RW) - or - Sandin (RW/LW)

Morin (LW/LD)

Friedman (RD)
Zamula (D)
Lyon (G)]

 

What key roster questions have I left out?

 

What are your opinions?

 

1) I think they try going back to Provorov - Gostisbehere as the top pairing.  Now that he's had his knees fixed and he liked relatively good in his short time in the playoffs, I really believe that Ghost knows this is a big year for him.  It's actually make or break. I expect him to be on fire this year. 

2) Nolan Patrick is pretty much in the same boat as Ghost. This is going to be make or break as well, but for an entirely different reason.  As the 2nd overall pick his draft year,  he's been a disappointment in terms of where everyone thought he'd be at this point in his career.  Big things were expected of him and he simply hasn't delivered. Add in the migraines and missing the entire season and he knows that this might be his last chance in Philadelphia.  With that being said,  I don't think he plays on the big club right away.  I think they see how he does in scrimmages and if he looks good,  they'll bring him along slowly to get his feet back underneath him. I think he splits time at 4C to start.  If he's successful,  they'll move him to 3C. If he has a flare up of his migraines,  he's done. That's the reality. 

3) Lindblom is going to be in the left side of Hayes - Konecny.  His spot is already marked. 

4) The 3rd right wing spot is already owned by Aube-Kubel. He's done enough to be the incumbent.  Sandin will probably be the 4 RW to start the year. 

5) Van Useless should be waived.  Nothing but a 6'3 bag of crap that is lazy and a floater.  $7 million for that piece of garbage.  Can't wait until that waste of a roster space is gone.  People can talk about advanced numbers,  but watch the on ice product.  He's garbage.

6) See number 1 with Ghost.  Once he reestablishes some value,  he will be moved.  It's clear that Provorov, Sanheim and Myers are the defensemen that week be protected for the expansion draft. The Flyers will move Ghost for probably a prospect, pick and a player they can expose in the expansion draft. 

7) The taxi squad. It kind of sounds like a movie.  Anyways, my six for the squad - Sushko, Rubtsov, Kase, Zamula, Wylie, Sandstrom. They'll want at least three guys who have been playing and it makes sense. They'll have for in this list,  and three of the guys have never been with the big club.  This is a good opportunity for some of these young guys to see what they need to do in their development in order to move ahead to the next level. 

As for big stories, I think we're going to see the club push a guy like Farabee a little more in terms of getting his game up to snuff offensively. His development might come at the expense of a guy like Giroux,  so it will be interesting to see how the captain responds.  Farabee is also normally a left winger, so it's possible that he and Giroux swap positions in that Giroux goes to playing the right side in order to accommodate Farabee.  

The other thing that needs to bear watching is how the team performs with elevated expectations. For the past number of years it has been good year followed by bad year.  They need to break that and if they go back to the good year/bad year team,  there will be wholesale changes.  It won't surprise me if there are a number of veterans who know that this could possibly be their last year in Philadelphia,  so they know that a slow start or bad play could be the end.  

I don't know how they'll respond.  We'll know more over the next 9 days.  If they come out flat the first 5, 10 games , heads will roll. 

I really like the York pick more and more.  He's so smart with the puck and he's such an effective defender without being overly physical. He's a thing of beauty to watch.  If he plays though,  Vigneault tries to use left- right handed pairings as much as possible.  It also looked like he can play the right side as well. The depth of our defense prospects is impressive.  

As for Brink,  his skating has improved immensely.  Another year of doing what he's doing will fix it completely.  His stride was so noticeable and he was really able to get that first gear jump. Now, it just needs done five tuning, in particular,  his edge work needs to be cleaned up.  If that can be done, Brink will be an elite skater. He's close now.  Now,  he isn't going to be a burner,  but he's gig to be plenty fast and sturdy on his skates.

Gotta give props.  Fletcher and Nature Boy hit it out of the park in their first draft in 2019. They need to commended for doing a good job.

8 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

Don’t forget Jay O’Brien , that’s four first round picks who could end up as flops due to repetitive injuries.

Jay O'Brien was a waste of a pick.  Never played beyond high school hockey and was a complete farce.  He took the easy way by staying in a league he dominated and didn't bother going the USHL route to be challenged by better players. Hard to believe that Hextall and Pryor wasted a pick on him. The Flyers could have had someone like Veleno or Bernard-Docker or Kupari, but they chose this waste and then followed up with another chunky monkey in Adam Ginnifer. Not sure what was going on with Hextall and Pryor,  but those were two uncharacteristically bad picks for them. 

I'm going with Zach Stortini

Hey if Morin is to skate north/ south and keep the opposition honest, that's a win.  We know he's a good skater, we know he's good defensively, we know he can lower the boom and he's got a hell of a shot. I think 8 to 10 minutes a night in a Clutterbuck/Martin role will suit him. He's not being asked to play a scoring role.  We know he's a heavy.  Plus,  if there are injuries on the blue line, you drop him back there and you keep that size in the lineup.  This is a critical year for Morin and he knows it. This is a guy who's going to be hungry and motivated.  

I know, myself, I like Roslovic as a player and I think he's a more than capable top six forward. To me,  this is exactly what happens when coaches use a 2-1-1 system in terms of forward deployment.  You get offensively talented players who are stuck in roles that they aren't suited for.  So in the case of Roslovic,  who has scored everywhere he's played in his career,  he's stuck with pluggers and scrubs and is stuck in a defensive oriented role with no room for growth.  Think Couturier his first three to four seasons and you've got Roslovic.

Paul Maurice is also an asshat. That's a man who went out of his way in Carolina to punish and embarrass rookie/young players and in some cases,  bully them,  if they made a mistake.  I hate that cocksucker with a passion. Now you've got two young guys,  plus multiple veterans who gave moved on under his watch and at some point,  you've got to think something is wrong in that locker room that so many young guys want out and numerous veterans moved on.