SCFlyguy

26 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

This group was never going for a full tear down.

I'm not saying it is surprising they didn't go for a full tear down.  In fact, I'm saying it was obvious all along, despite the corporate rhetoric.  So get ready for a lot of seasons going forward like the ones we've seen the last 20 years.

Basketball and Hockey aren't comparable from a building standpoint, but the Sixers problem wasn't the teardown, it was what they did after they already built it back up.  Choosing Harris over Butler and the Mikal Bridges trades were very bad decisions that squandered the remaining resources they had from the teardown.

Good thing Scott Laughton and Nick Seeler are still here to steady the ship instead of 2-3 more picks in upcoming drafts.

This mid round draft pick is sure going to put us over the top next year.

You can’t be half pregnant, but Little Danny and the Flyers are going to try again.

Couturier is here until he retires, which won’t be until his contract ends in 6 years.

Good thing he isn't tied up for years.

We can extend Konecny on a big contract so he can be the old, overpaid captain when Couturier retires - in 6 more years.

On 3/16/2024 at 2:46 PM, mojo1917 said:

In Laughton's case the FO mentioned his intangibles being more valuable to the Flyers.

This is corporate speak of the worst kind and I would put no stock in it whatsoever.

This is an easy issue.  Laughton's value will never be higher than it is right now and he will never contribute to a contender because he will be sitting on a couch somewhere by the time the Flyers are the real deal.

Everything else is just people trying to talk themselves into a silver lining in this decades long cloud.

So trade him for any reasonable offer (2nd is fine with me).

3 hours ago, GratefulFlyers said:

lol c’mon…like that tells us anything about Johnson’s effectiveness? Nearly 3 blowouts in 4 nights I’d be surprised if anyone in the O&B is a Plus the past 4 games. 
 

Hmmm, do you think there is any connection between the arrival of Johnson and the blowouts?  So what exactly is Johnson helping with that we needed to give up anything for?

1 hour ago, mojo1917 said:

They put an asset to immediate use. 

 

Johnson has no future here.  

This sounds like the opposite of a rebuild.  This sounds like using $10 to light your furnace.

A competent scouting department should be able to turn up a Laughton or Seeler nearly every draft.  If you get a second for either of them, you would take that and run with it.

Turning your Laughtons and Seelers into shots at a Giroux is how you do a rebuild.  The Rangers didn't keep their Grabners (age 29 in 2016) for their rebuild.  They kept guys who were 25 and under.

1 hour ago, GratefulFlyers said:

"Proof" that they kept Seeler and Laughton for more than this year's POs is the contract to Seeler. They might've been able to negotiate a 1-year deal for stupid money and both sides would've been happy with it. Or they didn't have to extend him at all, right? AFAIK nobody was threatening to "offer-sheet" him.

 

And then there's all the talk (and the ice time) all year about those 2, how valuable they are to the team - this particular team that's trying to build a personality - with a lot of young guys.

 

Laughton as far as I can tell they didn't "keep" so much as they didn't get an offer they felt was worth it. The proof of that is Briere's own words - he said exactly that.

 

 

Briere is overvaluing these guys if he can't find a deal he likes.  Their value to the Flyers rebuild is quite limited.

9 hours ago, radoran said:

Panarin being available was one thing.

 

They did keep Zibenijad.

 

The key thing was identifying the players they WANTED to keep.

 

The Flyers have Couturier, Konecny, Sanheim, Laughton locked up.

 

The Rangers are actually a pretty good example of a rebuild. You don't sign 30-somethings.

Agree with this, except they didn't so much "keep" Zibenijad as he was the first domino of the rebuild even if we didn't know it at the time.  They acquired him (and a 2nd round pick) by trading Derrek Brassard, who was six years older at the time.  Eighteen months later they sent out the letter, traded McDonough, and the rebuild was on.

We could do the same thing by trading Konecny for a player that better fits a rebuild timeline instead of a let's maybe make the playoffs timeline.  Instead, we will sign him to a long term deal and wonder why the team hasn't done anything in 5 years.

4 hours ago, GratefulFlyers said:

They did but they didn’t “tank” in any meaningful way prior to the famous letter to the fans or even after. Well I guess you could call it a “tank” when they traded their captain McDonogh but that was after they got their 1 and 2 picks.
 

Anyway, point taken, the Rangers are not a path the Flyers can follow or even try to follow. Not to mention they haven’t even won the Cup since picking 1/2 in successive years.
 

But who knows maybe Bedard or McDavid will suddenly decide they want to live on Philly cheesesteaks…

 

This is bizarre.  The Rangers did tank - they sent the letter to fans and traded away nearly every player that was on their Stanley Cup losing team (other than Kreider).  They were just smart and lucky about their trades and were able to rebuild more quickly than people thought.

I am against trading multiple picks to move up in the first round.  The Flyers don't have enough assets to take fewer bites at the apple.

You want higher picks?  Stop keeping assets that should have been traded at their high point.

AT BEST, the Flyers' moves say, "maintain the status quo", meaning a fragile 3 seed with a shot at the playoffs.  They don't say, "we are thinking of 3-4 years down the line."

56 minutes ago, GratefulFlyers said:

You didn't think the Flyers would have a pipeline full of talent in Year One did you? Of course not. You wanted Briere to create a team that would lose a ton of games for a few years. Finish low draft high. You're convinced that's the only legit rebuild. Maybe you're right. Briere didn't do that but he didn't do the opposite. Nothing he's said or done shows he's "going for it" - or that he ever had any intention of "going for it." Unless he's one helluva liar.

The Flyers problem the last 12 years hasn't just been "going for it".  IMO the "going for it" is a byproduct of the Flyers not being realistic about where their team is at.  Like a lot of people here they always overvalue the current players and see a clear line of progression where the team keeps getting better and better from their current position instead of assuming half the players they draft won't amount to a thing.  They see some nice players like Farabee, Konecny, etc. and think these guys will keep getting better instead of being mostly finished products with identifiable ceilings.  The Flyers continue to think and do these things because they have no other plan if these things aren't true.

3 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

GM Nick Seeler

lol

1 hour ago, flyercanuck said:

Right now, we have 1 (one) up and coming potential star player in Michkov. If anyone thinks thats enough to make this team a cup contender, no wonder you thought Hayes and Deangelo would too. We didn't get him by having a playoff round either. 

My view is if this team had right now the 99th percentile version of what we all hope Michkov to be it still would not be a serious contender.

Can someone tell me where the horses for the Flyers "rebuild" are going to come from in the next 3-5 years?

I don't really follow the Phantoms, but the last time I can remember them doing anything was during the lockout in 04-05 when Carter and Richards joined midseason and they won a Calder Cup.  There were a number of other players from that team who went on to play significant roles for the Flyers in the next several years.

I see they are again the Phantoms are at near the bottom of their division, which seems like every year.  Even when they have made the playoffs in recent years they have done nothing.

These are mostly the players who are supposedly going to graduate to the Flyers and provide the basis for us being a contender.  I don't see it.  I don't see a single player absolutely dominating at the AHL level and demanding playing time on the Flyers.

If the infusion of talent isn't coming from Allentown, aren't the Flyers relying on the few prospects that aren't in the AHL: Bonk, Michkov and the handful of others drafted last year?  Seems thin.  Seems like you would need every one of these non-AHL draftees to be a superstar to have enough talent to be a perennial contender.

I would love for someone with more knowledge of this stuff than me to explain the path to contention when the farm is exceedingly thin.

But they said the word "rebuild".  That's all that matters.

19 minutes ago, GratefulFlyers said:

 

But it wasn't "thrown away" and Eric Johnson is not a "washed up bum." He's just not.

 

Whatever you think of the plan - the rebuild or whatever - adding a D-man, which the Flyers truly need right now with all the injuries on the back end - for 18 frikkn games, 18 + the POs - c'mon is that really throwing a monkey wrench into the plan?

Little Danny Briere messed his depends at the deadline and you're digging in like it's chocolate pudding.

1 hour ago, GratefulFlyers said:

Me I think a PO series will be great for this roster;

Just like when they lost to the Rangers in 7 in the first round in 2013-2014.  It built so much character.  I remember all the playoff runs that followed. 

Danny Briere doesn't understand rebuild any better than he understood how not to take a hooking penalty in the offensive zone.

I just got to the part where they resigned Seeler.  That is incredibly dumb.

Paying a guy $2.7M at that age because he's too unskilled to do anything other than not get out of the way of the puck is not a winning move. 

My guess is he loses a step at 32 and is basically unplayable from that point on.

I was going to say this was a great trade until I saw that Johansen has one more year.  So it's a good trade instead - not sure how much cap is going to matter next year (i.e. how competitive will they be).  

The bottom line is that the Flyers leveraged their assets (UFA and cap space) for a much better future asset.

Next year they may be able to deal Johansen for something at the deadline.

3 hours ago, GratefulFlyers said:

But everything I hear tells me he’s been a big part - a big reason- for the attitude adjustment amongst the roster this year.

This would be the saddest indictment of a sports franchise ever.