radoran

There's a good chance Matthews is available and there's a definite need for a goalie in Tronno. The outlines are there. I don't think the Flyers ultimately have the pieces other teams can offer in terms of picks and prospects they'd be willing to part with. Danny Jonsey will make the decision whether the deal is worth making if the Leaes make it known Matthews is available. We'll know more in the last couple of weeks of June.

Why would they not? Then don't make the trade. Being willing to move Hart isn't the same as driving him to the airport. This isn't Kevin Hayes. And if you don't put it out there, you don't know what might be on offer.

Would you take Casey Mittelstadt+?

The Flames have $1.25M in cap space.

Claude Giroux was great in the Worlds.

True, and it's a matter of being a franchise players want to play for. The Flyers tell themselves they're that because guys like Laughts, Coots, and Sanheim want to be here. The question of whether they would have the roles and the contracts they have elsewhere never seems to come up Nobody ever plotted to sign in Newark...

I've been caught up for about 37 years now. Checking if a Matthews is available - something I've been clear I don't think will happen - is different than signing Vincetrick LeKanevaliere for multiple years "as a veteran presence." A Matthews might be the start of a core that could need that veteran presence, but neither of those guys are "it" and even with a Matthews trade (again, which is not happening) next year is not "when."

There is a time to do that in this process. Now is not that time. They don't need a Kane (or a Corey Perry) to lift them into the playoffs. They're not expecting to make the playoffs. And neither of those players should be interested in playing here anyway. The organization* has finally embraced "two years away from being two years away" and we'll see if they stick to the plan.

Buffalo did OK on the return and fleeced Fletch but they've been wandering in the wilderness since I lived there 15 years ago. The Flyers didn't embark on that path and don't need to. They have a pretty good pipeline and need to add top line talent. I'd try to get rid of anyone over 26 but entertain discussions on many. Young prospects should be kept until they need to be moved. The Devils and Rags are not a bad comparison but also they haven't won. Build resources and cap space and be able to make a splash when the opportunity presents itself and is right. We'll see once the Cup is lifted where they go.

Ah, and in true Flyers fashion they traded Luke Schenn alongside him. Who, of course, they had traded their second overall pick for... So the Flyers turned the #2 overall pick into Jordan Weal and a 3rd rounder. Also took over a season to get done.

Agreed. Has to be at least six years.

Welcome to Hextall: The Early Years, Part II JVR is a hot topic of the day but VLC was a real thing...

Not disagreeing on the production, but $7M wasn't terrible at the time. I'd give you an Anders Lee as a comparable, signed a $7M deal the next year coming off 34-, 40-, and 28-goal seasons. It wasn't a good idea at the time, but it wasn't an outrageous number. Lee went on for 60 goals over the next three years. JVR put up... 60 goals over the same span. I think we'd all rather have had Lee, but since they "had to" sign JVR the year before, they weren't going to be in the market (Lee signed on July 1 so he "hit the market"). Then they "had to" sign Hayes and they "had to" trade for Ristolainen and they "had to" trade for TDA and they "had to..."

He also didn't play the last few weeks of the season and Lyon started the first three games of the playoffs. "rested" doesn't even begin to describe it the flip side concern is "rutsy" but he certainly hasn't shown that. The Sabres got the rights to Levi and a #28 overall pick for Reinhart (a #2 overall pick). Levi's looking good in limited action. Their pick hasn't come over from Czechia yet. You take that for Konecny? (I'd like a little more...)

I don't think they needed to overpay for JVR and I don't think they really did. The Flyers mentality I see at work in that move was the "make the playoffs and anything can happen" spectre. The Flyers - definitely a playoff team - wanted to add a top FA to bolster their next season's push for the playoffs. Johnny Pajamas wouldn't come here (and, hey, let's just say thank God for that, eh?). JVR, legitimately, for better or worse, was the #2 best available UFA on the market that year. 30-goal scorer and had the advantage of being a former Flyer(!) Boom, five year deal. It's back to the question of making the right move at the right time, not making a move because you feel you have to make the move. JVR was the wrong move, but the move they believed they "had to make" at the time. It's one of many things Hextall failed at. I initially wondered if the JVR move it was pressure from up top to "make the playoffs" but his track record in Pittsburgh wasn't much better.

Wait, someone else hired Fletch? (@pilldoc the gif thingy isn't working)

I'm like this all the time. Am I trying to move Konecny? Not particularly. If someone wants to blow my doors off, great. So, not on ice, then? Last year was a "go for it!" year - obviously. Throw away some picks on a guy to replace the guy you threw away picks to get rid of and extend a guy who had 35 points five years ago for eight years. Definitely a playoff team. Anything can happen.

Certainly didn't mean to offend. Wasn't saying you were saying they were "a few players away" - just reacting to the concept. They both are "just a few players away" because of the holes they have and not "just a few players away" because they don't have the capacity to fill those holes at the moment. To your point (which I said a couple times noting that it wasn't "a few players away") the traditional Flyer way would be to fill whatever "hole" they saw with whatever "fill" they found, and slap a 7-8 year contract on it. That's why they're still paying Bryzgalov. That's why they have Hayes. That's why they had to move Voracek for Atkinson. That's why they dealt Ghost. That's why they.... It just goes on and on. If they do that they will continue to have problems. Make the right move at the right time and you wind up sending Weeger and Huberdeau to Calgary for Tkachuk.

It was pointed out in the Carolina thread that it could look like the Canes were swept easily, but they were four one goal (2 OT) games against a scorching hot goalie. It's possible to play really well and still lose. See: Bowl, Super 2023. Barkov's been in the league 10 years and he's about to turn 28. Ekblad and Reinhart then add Tkahchuk and Bennett all in their mid-20s. That's where you want to be when constructing your roster. And every one of them is signed for the next two seasons. Along with Bobrovsky. And the Flyers had to have Kevin Hayes for seven years to win a playoff round that one time. Anything can happen.

This team does not need to add anyone over the age of 30, probably not over the age of 25. They have their "Flyer way" guys in @CoachX's pet Laughts and good ol' Coots. They have the "Torts way" guy in ol' Ats. Likely should be picking top half for the next two years. Those high 2nds can be real valuable if you use them right.

Thing is, they're not not "just a few players away." Get a legit superstar 1C, a legit star 1D, shed some anchors and add some role players and you're not far. They just don't really have the assets to pull off getting those legit assets to actually compete. They are not "just a few guys away" next year. They are "a few guys away" as they look for those guys over the next few years. To your point, don't keep thinking you can make it every year. Don't sign a guy to a seven year deal to fill "next year's" hole. Don't try to "get another Cup for Ed" or "get Gee 'his Cup'". I would just primarily like to see an abandonment of the "make the playoffs and anything can happen" philosophy. Yes, I get St. Louis and yes, Florida is in the Finals this year. St. Louis had been to a Conference Final two years before and Florida won the President's Trophy, has #1, 2 #2s, #4, and #6 overall picks on the roster, and just emerged from the shadow of a legit dynastic Lightning team. The difference between those situations and "just make the playoffs" is glaring.

You mean 20 points a year for four years isn't a good return for $6M?

There was the Finals run in 2010. The 2008 Conference Final. The 2004 Conference Final. The 2000 Conference Final. The 1997 Swept Final. Then we're 35 years ago. "Patience" Let's not ever forget the indelible and monumental achievement of the past 12 years when the skies opened, the sun shone down, the angels blew trumpets from the heavens and they won a playoff round. "Patience"

I mean, as a cautionary tale, that's not such a bad look... "What Not To Do" - apprenticeship notes from Danny

I think there are "stars" and there are "superstars" A star player is above average and can contribute to a franchise. A superstar can carry the load. I'd say Konecny is a "star" player, for example. He's not a "superstar" Farabee, Gauthier, and Hart have the best "star player" potential. Tippett in the mix. Are any of them superstar caliber? Open question. I'm leaning "no."