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That the Flyers will trade Bob. I know you can't put a lot into what they report but man signing Brzy for 9 years sucks. Now they are going to trade Bob who I think is a better goalie for a rental. Sometimes I like what the FO does but I really hate what they have done with the goalie situation.

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Guys, I completely understand the dislike of Bryz. But I really think the faith in Bob is misguided and likely the result of contrast to what the Flyers have had the past couple years. I'm afraid Bob sucks. With some work, he'll be average at best. If the Flyers can dump him for Nabby or another competent goalie, do it. With our offense and now the size on defense, if we even have competence back there in net, we should be highly competitive.

Bob doesn't cut it, and won't. His positioning is lousy, he's extremely poor when the puck is near his feet, and his glove is suspect. And most importantly, he's folded every single time he's been given the opportunity. I don't see any of that changing.

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Guys, I completely understand the dislike of Bryz. But I really think the faith in Bob is misguided and likely the result of contrast to what the Flyers have had the past couple years. I'm afraid Bob sucks. With some work, he'll be average at best. If the Flyers can dump him for Nabby or another competent goalie, do it. With our offense and now the size on defense, if we even have competence back there in net, we should be highly competitive.

Bob doesn't cut it, and won't. His positioning is lousy, he's extremely poor when the puck is near his feet, and his glove is suspect. And most importantly, he's folded every single time he's been given the opportunity. I don't see any of that changing.

I agree, but the difference is that Bob is only 23. I'd rather keep him and find out for sure, over the next 5 years, if he has another level or if this is it. Nabokov probably gives us a better chance for a playoff run if the stars align (i.e. if we don't face the Rangers or Bruins in the 1st round), and we don't know how much difference Kubina and Grossman will make on our blueline, but I'm thinking a lot.

Bourdon was brutal yesterday (5 turnovers all by himself compared to 6 total for the Pens) and he needs to go back to ADK. It was great exposure for him to play with the big boys, but he needs more seasoning.

But, forgive me if I'm not super excited about going into the offseason with Bryzgalov and Nabokov as our goalies, and basically having to decide between re-signing a past his prime Nabby or some stiff like Leighton to back up our $51M headcase.

If you can trade JVR, Bryz, Read or Schenn, and a 1st for Nash and Mason, you do it.

Bryz is a colossal mistake and if you can parlay that into tangible assets instead of taking a $40M 'capital loss' business expense, I would think your bosses would be much happier.

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He is still "Soul Searching". Sam&Dave would be proud. Maybe Homer could hire a team mystic? Couldn't hurt.

Bryz makes to much money. It bothers him with the state of the world. At least in his mind. And that is really all that matters. Listen to him talk. He just can't figure out how he got where he is. Why me? Life crisis? In a way. This is a very smart guy that reads furiously and he truly educated. He is a guy that treats G as a job, that there is a bigger purpose and vocation in life. That there are many things in life that are more important than G. As a G, his focus is simoly not there. Not at all in a competitive sport that maybe 1% of 1% of 1/2% make it to the NHL at his level. So why is this important? Because he has the tools. It is in his head. If I were the Flyers, I would get him the best sports psychologist money could by. This is coreectable. And play him every game.

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I agree, but the difference is that Bob is only 23. I'd rather keep him and find out for sure, over the next 5 years, if he has another level or if this is it. Nabokov probably gives us a better chance for a playoff run if the stars align (i.e. if we don't face the Rangers or Bruins in the 1st round), and we don't know how much difference Kubina and Grossman will make on our blueline, but I'm thinking a lot.

Bourdon was brutal yesterday (5 turnovers all by himself compared to 6 total for the Pens) and he needs to go back to ADK. It was great exposure for him to play with the big boys, but he needs more seasoning.

But, forgive me if I'm not super excited about going into the offseason with Bryzgalov and Nabokov as our goalies, and basically having to decide between re-signing a past his prime Nabby or some stiff like Leighton to back up our $51M headcase.

If you can trade JVR, Bryz, Read or Schenn, and a 1st for Nash and Mason, you do it.

Bryz is a colossal mistake and if you can parlay that into tangible assets instead of taking a $40M 'capital loss' business expense, I would think your bosses would be much happier.

I don't think Bryz is moveable and was talking with that assumption. I was previously thinking that Bryz WILL be better next year once he can get past this horrible season. However, the more he talks, the more I'm beginning to think this is simply wishful thinking and unlikely.

I think Grossman (in particular) and Kubina will make a huge difference on the blueline. But I don't know that defense is going to help THAT much when our goalies are giving up multiple gimmies a game. I agree with you on Bourdon. He's been brutal for awhile and needs to go down to continue to season.

Nabby has actually done extremely well this year. Better than I was expecting. Behind a better team, he probably does quite well. But at the same time, he's never shown he would be spectacular (by any stretch) in the playoffs. I'm afraid Bryz makes too much to sit on the bench, but any combo with Bryz as the number one is going to be less than good.

If you can move Bryz, go ahead. I really don't want to include Read in any trade and would be an untouchable right now, for me. I wouldn't be happy about moving Schenn right now, either. I guess forward line is our position of strength and you have to trade something to get something, yadda yadda, but I'm not a huge fan of the Nash/Mason idea. First, I think Nash is overkill and doesn't address a real need, and I don't trust Mason for being anything more than a Marty Biron. I think the Columbus thing would be yet another mistake.

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I don't think Bryz is moveable and was talking with that assumption. I was previously thinking that Bryz WILL be better next year once he can get past this horrible season. However, the more he talks, the more I'm beginning to think this is simply wishful thinking and unlikely.

Totally agree. He sounds like he's mentally done and almost publicly admitting that he can't handle the pressure of playing in a real hockey city.

I think Grossman (in particular) and Kubina will make a huge difference on the blueline. But I don't know that defense is going to help THAT much when our goalies are giving up multiple gimmies a game. I agree with you on Bourdon. He's been brutal for awhile and needs to go down to continue to season.

Nabby has actually done extremely well this year. Better than I was expecting. Behind a better team, he probably does quite well. But at the same time, he's never shown he would be spectacular (by any stretch) in the playoffs. I'm afraid Bryz makes too much to sit on the bench, but any combo with Bryz as the number one is going to be less than good.

Yes, Nabby has done very well with the Isles this year, similar to Vokoun with the Caps (though not as much lately). I guess the difference with Nabby is that he is a legitimate starter and Bob is not (yet), so Nabby does give us a better chance in a way. Philly would be the laughing stock of the league (if they aren't already), if they bring in a THIRD goaltender because their $7M Russian Duo can't hack it, so we needed a troika.

If you can move Bryz, go ahead. I really don't want to include Read in any trade and would be an untouchable right now, for me. I wouldn't be happy about moving Schenn right now, either. I guess forward line is our position of strength and you have to trade something to get something, yadda yadda, but I'm not a huge fan of the Nash/Mason idea. First, I think Nash is overkill and doesn't address a real need, and I don't trust Mason for being anything more than a Marty Biron. I think the Columbus thing would be yet another mistake.

Between Read, Couturier or Schenn, my choice is to give up Read. And to be clear, the only way I even consider trading for Nash is if it enables us to get rid of Bryzgalov. Otherwise, I'm not interested. Bob and Mason would not necessarily be a better pairing, but for me the difference is the absence of boat anchor of a contract.

And in another thread, I brought up Elliott's numbers under Hitch. We can do the same for Mason. Under Hitchcock, he has his sensational rookie season (.916, 2.29) and his 2nd season, when Hitch was fired, his numbers went down. They've been worse since that time under a different coach. That sample isn't large enough by itself, but his career numbers show how he can transform just about *any* team into a defensive squad. Of course, Hitch has his share of 'issues' like any other coach...

Anyway, how about Mike Smith? 5th round draft pick.

Season Age Tm Lg GP W L T/O GA SA SV SV% GAA SO PIM MIN GPS G A PTS

2006-07 24 DAL NHL 23 12 5 2 45 511 466 .912 2.23 3 2 1213 3.5 0 0 0

2007-08 25 TOT NHL 34 15 19 0 84 848 764 .901 2.59 3 12 1946 4.4 0 1 1

2007-08 25 DAL NHL 21 12 9 0 48 510 462 .906 2.46 2 6 1172 3.0 0 0 0

2007-08 25 TBL NHL 13 3 10 0 36 338 302 .893 2.79 1 6 774 1.5 0 1 1

2008-09 26 TBL NHL 41 14 18 9 108 1282 1174 .916 2.62 2 23 2471 8.7 0 1 1

2009-10 27 TBL NHL 42 13 18 7 117 1165 1048 .900 3.09 2 14 2273 5.4 0 0 0

2010-11 28 TBL NHL 22 13 6 1 58 576 518 .899 2.90 1 2 1202 2.5 0 1 1

2011-12 29 PHX NHL 46 25 14 7 100 1386 1286 .928 2.25 4 4 2668 10.7 0 1 1

Had a sensational rookie year in Dallas and a very good 2nd year as well. Then he had 4 mediocre years in TB, a run and gun type team at the time. And now that Bryz is gone, he's the starter in Phoenix and is having a career year.

Dave Tippett is his coach in Phoenix, and lo and behold, Tippett was also his coach when he was in Dallas.

I'm not about to start a Fire Laviolette brigade, but the problem for our defensive play starts with him.

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His positioning is lousy, he's extremely poor when the puck is near his feet, and his glove is suspect.

the glove, i agree...the others, though...not sure i've seen that. yeah, that goal on saturday that came across the line and hit his far skate, that sucked, but i don't know that i've seen that being a persistent problem.

bob has absolutely failed to wow in the games he has been given, no doubt. how much of that is guy in his second year not knowing how to coming in for spot starts? would it be the same if he played 8 of the next 10? i don't know, but i don't think what we've seen thus far this season can be fairly projected into that regular start scenario.

and that's the thing, we don't know. it isn't about a conviction that bob is an allstar in waiting, it's that no one knows. we are pretty sure about bryzgalov, though. talk about bad positioning, bad with pucks around his feet, bad glove. add in poor skating, weak lateral movement, below average flexibility, and general headcase-ness.

now, bryzgalov is here to stay. he is obviously not worth his contract, which means he can't be traded, even if he were to allow it, or even request it. so alternate solutions have to framed as being in the shortterm. if a nabokov deal is possible for minimal assets, bob included, then i agree, do that. bob might be awesome one day, but he no one other than bryzgalov is a long term answer in philly, and he is not awesome right now. i don't see him as fundamentally flawed as you do, but i agree he has things to fix. as the flyers head into the 11-12 playoffs, bob is as much a questionmark as bryzgalov. if that questionmark can be answered without giving up too much, then to me it's an obvious thing.

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@ruxpin

"Sievegivesalog doesn't cut it, and won't. His positioning is lousy, he's extremely poor when the puck is near his feet, and his glove is suspect. And most importantly, he's folded every single time he's been given the opportunity. I don't see any of that changing."

There, I fixed it for ya. ;-)

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@ruxpin

"but I'm not a huge fan of the Nash/Mason idea. First, I think Nash is overkill and doesn't address a real need, and I don't trust Mason for being anything more than a Marty Biron. I think the Columbus thing would be yet another mistake."

Me either. I just don't get all the love. Really nice player and all that, but still just ONE player- and particularly one that we don't need at present time (though Jagr is showing his age and we will need to plug a RW in there and i dont think it is Voracek because he is too much a play maker and becomes overly redundant with Giroux). So nash will give you an extra what 10-15g at a cost of 7.8M. So what. What does that gain us in the end? Especially when you look at all the assets that are rumored to be going the other way. As inept as Columbus management is, I highly doubt they are forgetting the fleecing that happened last summer.

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@doom88-

You know WHO is a sure thing in shootouts: Kolvalchuk. I was looking at the devils 13 SO games (10 of which they have one) and Kovalchuk has scored the first goal in 90% of the games. Not sure about nash.

Wow. That is stunning. He might actually be earning his insane contract.

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Between Read, Couturier or Schenn, my choice is to give up Read. And to be clear, the only way I even consider trading for Nash is if it enables us to get rid of Bryzgalov. Otherwise, I'm not interested. Bob and Mason would not necessarily be a better pairing, but for me the difference is the absence of boat anchor of a contract.

And in another thread, I brought up Elliott's numbers under Hitch. We can do the same for Mason. Under Hitchcock, he has his sensational rookie season (.916, 2.29) and his 2nd season, when Hitch was fired, his numbers went down. They've been worse since that time under a different coach. That sample isn't large enough by itself, but his career numbers show how he can transform just about *any* team into a defensive squad. Of course, Hitch has his share of 'issues' like any other coach...

Anyway, how about Mike Smith? 5th round draft pick.

Season Age Tm Lg GP W L T/O GA SA SV SV% GAA SO PIM MIN GPS G A PTS

2006-07 24 DAL NHL 23 12 5 2 45 511 466 .912 2.23 3 2 1213 3.5 0 0 0

2007-08 25 TOT NHL 34 15 19 0 84 848 764 .901 2.59 3 12 1946 4.4 0 1 1

2007-08 25 DAL NHL 21 12 9 0 48 510 462 .906 2.46 2 6 1172 3.0 0 0 0

2007-08 25 TBL NHL 13 3 10 0 36 338 302 .893 2.79 1 6 774 1.5 0 1 1

2008-09 26 TBL NHL 41 14 18 9 108 1282 1174 .916 2.62 2 23 2471 8.7 0 1 1

2009-10 27 TBL NHL 42 13 18 7 117 1165 1048 .900 3.09 2 14 2273 5.4 0 0 0

2010-11 28 TBL NHL 22 13 6 1 58 576 518 .899 2.90 1 2 1202 2.5 0 1 1

2011-12 29 PHX NHL 46 25 14 7 100 1386 1286 .928 2.25 4 4 2668 10.7 0 1 1

Had a sensational rookie year in Dallas and a very good 2nd year as well. Then he had 4 mediocre years in TB, a run and gun type team at the time. And now that Bryz is gone, he's the starter in Phoenix and is having a career year.

Dave Tippett is his coach in Phoenix, and lo and behold, Tippett was also his coach when he was in Dallas.

I'm not about to start a Fire Laviolette brigade, but the problem for our defensive play starts with him.

Consider me in your corner. Great posts. Can't really bring anything else new to the table except that I agree with both of you.

Bryz sucks.

We are stuck with Bryz because of his contract.

We DO NOT need Nash...However if it means moving Bryz count me in.

I hate the thought of giving up Read / Schenn/ Simmonds / or Coots

I'm ok losing JVR if we can move Bryz

Mason will not be the answer.

Pronger's career is over in my opinion.

Try for Schenn (this season) / Shea / Suter.(during FA)

I said from the beginning of the season ...this should not be a cup run year...but no they had to overpay Bryz because Snider was pisssed at the end of last year. (with good reason)

Oh how the hell the do the Flyers do this to themselves year in and year out.........

SNAFU in Flyers-land

Situation Normal All F ucked up

PS I am NOT in the fire Lavy camp..however HItch would have this defense playing better, but would we be #1 in scoring?? Can't have it both ways.

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Guys, I completely understand the dislike of Bryz. But I really think the faith in Bob is misguided and likely the result of contrast to what the Flyers have had the past couple years. I'm afraid Bob sucks. With some work, he'll be average at best. If the Flyers can dump him for Nabby or another competent goalie, do it. With our offense and now the size on defense, if we even have competence back there in net, we should be highly competitive.

Bob doesn't cut it, and won't. His positioning is lousy, he's extremely poor when the puck is near his feet, and his glove is suspect. And most importantly, he's folded every single time he's been given the opportunity. I don't see any of that changing.

I think one can justify a trade but one can't justify an even up trade or predict at this point what Bob will be. An even up trade is absolute robbery and I can't imagine Homer agreeing to it. Also, Bob is, after all, a second year goaltender. Lousy positioning on some nights goes with the territory. Unlike Bryzgalov, he's actually played brilliantly at times; in fact the Isles may be interested because he absolutely stoned them the last time the teams played in Uniondale. He stole a game for the Flyers.

By the way, does anyone out there really think bringing in Nabokov is going to settle our goaltending situation? I mean...we sign Bryzgalov for 9 years and then bring in another Russian vet? This would be the definition of "dysfunctional" and might also be the final straw for Rain Man. I don't give a damn about Bryzgalov but there is only so much drama that the rest of the team can be subjected to.

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