Samifan Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 Live look at Mrazek in net trying to get back into position! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 hours ago, King Knut said: It's not even JUST that he doesn't have the skill to recover. IT's like it doesn't even occur to him. It's almost like he's drunk or something, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, ruxpin said: Except for Mzarek. He is simply horrible. Just horrible. Mrazek is horrible *here*. A few caveats - 1. I don't think for a second that Mrazek would be that bad over a long period of time with the Flyers. 2. Over 6 years in Detroit with a middling team, he put up respectable numbers - 2.65, .912. For Philly, only Neuvirth has been better (2.61, .915) but barely. That being said, I wouldn't spend the money on Mrazek moving forward. So, again, we're back to a team-wide issue rather than goaltending per se. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 3 minutes ago, brelic said: Mrazek is horrible *here*. By here, do you mean planet earth? He's been horrible in Detroit. Simply horrible. It's nothing new. And Detroit gave up a 26 year old goalie for a conditional third round pick and picked up salary. That really should tell you all you need to know about his career trajectory. If they sign him, I may become a soccer fan. Quote So, again, we're back to a team-wide issue rather than goaltending per se. Well, I acknowledge that, but that's the expectation with a young, inconsistent team. If we had reasonable goaltending, we'd probably be okay. But our starter was hurt and our backup hurt his pancreas watching the sun come up. Then we're stuck with who will likely be a career AHLer or a spot 20 game/year back up. Mrazek is simply a different category from the rest. He's a disaster behind a defense/team that is already defensively suspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, ruxpin said: By here, do you mean planet earth? He's been horrible in Detroit. Simply horrible. It's nothing new. And Detroit gave up a 26 year old goalie for a conditional third round pick and picked up salary. That really should tell you all you need to know about his career trajectory. If they sign him, I may become a soccer fan. Lol, no, by *here* I mean Philly. C'mon, I get that you don't like him, but 2.65, .912 is objectively *not* horrible. And if he was truly horrible in Detroit - which I just can't accept as a premise - what does that say about the Flyers as a whole? We must be a defensive sieve if ALL of our goalies are underperforming compared to where they were before. I understand maybe he lost himself over the past season or so... like Mason near the end in Philly. But I would never say Mason was horrible in Philly. And maybe Mrazek never gets back on track. In the end, the point I'm trying to make is not really about Mrazek - just that ALL of our goalies are capable of playing better, yet they're all, you know, not good. So something else more significant is going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 6 minutes ago, brelic said: ALL of our goalies are capable of playing better, yet they're all, you know, not good. So something else more significant is going on. Yes. I'll agree with that. I still think that's part and parcel with a young team and specifically a young defense that still has scattered older players that simply aren't that good. And Gudas has been castrated, so maybe put him in his own category. There's no doubt in my mind that all of them -- Elliott, in particular -- has better numbers behind a more consistent, better positional team defense. Lyon would probably be sufficient--or at least have better numbers--if that were the case. Neuvy has actually done okay when he's played but even his numbers would probably be slightly better. Like Gudas, he's in a different category because he gets 3rd degree burns just brushing his teeth (with a non-electric toothbrush!). No quarter to Mzarek. It's not just dislike. He was terrible in Detroit, and they gave up on him in favor of maybe the equivalent of Elliot (Howard) and an AHLer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, brelic said: But, how much of it is on the goaltenders and how much of it is on our defensive game / systems in place? The PK is atrocious, like historically bad. But even so, it's definitely the goalies this past stretch. They've had to pull each goalie on separate occasions in last week. Last night it was a combination of the 20 missed shots on net and the goalie being bad. The first goal was BAD. LIke awful bad. The second goal, people will excuse him for because they'll say the Flyers gave up positioning, but I would argue that goal was just another example of Mrazek's terrible rebound control and awful tendencies to be way way way out of his net for no good reason. On Sunday, the goaltending was bad. They're losing games in OT that they could be winning because the goaltending is just straight up bad at times. I don't care how many "amazing" saves a goalie makes. If he can't make basic saves and control controllable rebounds, he makes it MORE NECESSARY to make AMAZING saves. That's why I liked Stolarz and why I liked Boosh. They won't get you the amazing save, but they will calm things the hell down in their own zone. Defenses know that if they can limit the opposition to low percentage shots, they'll have a good chance of making the save and regaining control. With guys like Lyon (because apparently he's just really jumpy) and Mrazek (because he's always overcommitting) , you can't count on them saving the low percentage shot or controlling the easy rebount. HENCE CHAOS ENSUES. At this point I think they're best bet is to start the one they don't want to and then just pull him in to get the other guy in the right mindset to actually play. I never thought I'd miss Neuvirth. Maybe he can play for two whole games and that can bridge us to Elliott's return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, brelic said: Mrazek is horrible *here*. i love your optimism kid... but Mrazek blows. LOL! When is the last time you saw a goalie turn his back to the freaking play after a rebound?!? Enough said... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 4 minutes ago, King Knut said: The PK is atrocious, like historically bad. But even so, it's definitely the goalies this past stretch. They've had to pull each goalie on separate occasions in last week. Last night it was a combination of the 20 missed shots on net and the goalie being bad. The first goal was BAD. LIke awful bad. The second goal, people will excuse him for because they'll say the Flyers gave up positioning, but I would argue that goal was just another example of Mrazek's terrible rebound control and awful tendencies to be way way way out of his net for no good reason. On Sunday, the goaltending was bad. They're losing games in OT that they could be winning because the goaltending is just straight up bad at times. I don't care how many "amazing" saves a goalie makes. If he can't make basic saves and control controllable rebounds, he makes it MORE NECESSARY to make AMAZING saves. That's why I liked Stolarz and why I liked Boosh. They won't get you the amazing save, but they will calm things the hell down in their own zone. Defenses know that if they can limit the opposition to low percentage shots, they'll have a good chance of making the save and regaining control. With guys like Lyon (because apparently he's just really jumpy) and Mrazek (because he's always overcommitting) , you can't count on them saving the low percentage shot or controlling the easy rebount. HENCE CHAOS ENSUES. At this point I think they're best bet is to start the one they don't want to and then just pull him in to get the other guy in the right mindset to actually play. I never thought I'd miss Neuvirth. Maybe he can play for two whole games and that can bridge us to Elliott's return. I get all of that, and I agree that whomever we pull out of Goaltender Surplus Depot gives up at least one bad goal a game. That's been the norm this year. I'd say there were about half a dozen games where we received top level goaltending. That being said, how many goals have we scored that would fall in the same category? I'm sure there are one or two that Pens fans think Murray should have had. Ditto with Lehtonen. Ditto with Holtby (or whoever was in goal). I can't remember the NYR game very well, but IIRC Georgiev played really well. There are maybe 5-6 goalies in the league that will consistently refuse to allow bad goals - they are very few and far between. We still need a solid, reliable goalie. That much is certain. But we can also mitigate that need (or at least lessen the stink factor) by upping our defensive game and PK. I mean, we LEAD the league in SHG against. That's a pretty strong statement on how we play the game - high risk high reward, and when we get caught, it usually hurts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 5 minutes ago, murraycraven said: i love your optimism kid... but Mrazek blows. LOL! When is the last time you saw a goalie turn his back to the freaking play after a rebound?!? Enough said... Lol, I know it seems like I'm defending Mrazek, but I'm really not. I don't think Hexy should sign him, period. But, I mean, c'mon, Detroit didn't put a HORRIBLE goalie in their net for 6 years! He's capable at playing at a high level, but we just haven't seen it here. He needs a new home and some time to focus on the game, and it certainly won't be in Philly. We ain't got time for that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 minutes ago, brelic said: Lol, I know it seems like I'm defending Mrazek, but I'm really not. I don't think Hexy should sign him, period. But, I mean, c'mon, Detroit didn't put a HORRIBLE goalie in their net for 6 years! He's capable at playing at a high level, but we just haven't seen it here. He needs a new home and some time to focus on the game, and it certainly won't be in Philly. We ain't got time for that! I know... I am just having fun!! I just let him walk and say thanks for your "effort" and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 hour ago, brelic said: Elliott is 2.72, .908 with Philly. Funny they ran a guy ouy of town last year with a 2.66 and 908....i forget his name. Then the even trade for the bum Mrazek. Makes wonder what happens if they stayed the course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pucked in the head Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 I'll pay his can fare to the airport!!! Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 minute ago, OccamsRazor said: Funny they ran a guy ouy of town last year with a 2.66 and 908....i forget his name. Then the even trade for the bum Mrazek. Makes wonder what happens if they stayed the course. and you hit the nail on the head. the goal-tending issues, to me anyway, is squarely on Hextall's shoulders. Since Neuvy received a huge raise after being the statistically worst goalie in the league I would expect Hextall to restructure is deal and pay him more next season. Makes total sense... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pucked in the head Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 In their eyes maybe! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samifan Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 hours ago, Samifan said: Live look at Mrazek in net trying to get back into position! 2 hours ago, ruxpin said: It's almost like he's drunk or something, huh? @ruxpin great minds think alike! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 hours ago, brelic said: I get all of that, and I agree that whomever we pull out of Goaltender Surplus Depot gives up at least one bad goal a game. That's been the norm this year. I'd say there were about half a dozen games where we received top level goaltending. That being said, how many goals have we scored that would fall in the same category? I'm sure there are one or two that Pens fans think Murray should have had. Ditto with Lehtonen. Ditto with Holtby (or whoever was in goal). I can't remember the NYR game very well, but IIRC Georgiev played really well. There are maybe 5-6 goalies in the league that will consistently refuse to allow bad goals - they are very few and far between. We still need a solid, reliable goalie. That much is certain. But we can also mitigate that need (or at least lessen the stink factor) by upping our defensive game and PK. I mean, we LEAD the league in SHG against. That's a pretty strong statement on how we play the game - high risk high reward, and when we get caught, it usually hurts. It's not so much the one soft goal a game as it is the chaos in his own end. Those goals hurt and that's typically why the end up getting pulled, but in the case of these two especially, it's the turning of easy saves into not only goals, but bad rebounds and chaos in front of the net. The Penguins game winner wasn't a soft goal... it was a fat rebound that Mrazek was 6 feet away from and facing the wrong way. Even the tying goal last night... that was a great hand eye coordination play on a player that really didn't have great positioning on the defender.... but the rebound went RIGHT TO HIM. I mostly judge a goalie on what happens after a save... where the puck goes and where his momentum is taking him. Mrazek attacks attacks attacks all the time and it puts him out of position for the rebounds and puts the rebounds in spots that it's very difficult for the defense to control. Goalies that frustrate the FLyers so much don't just frustrate us because they make big saves... they frustrate you because you do all this work to get a decent shot and you hope it at least generates a chance but instead the Rangers, Caps, Knights or whoever are skating out of their zone instead of Simmer or Coots hammering it home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 48 minutes ago, Samifan said: @ruxpin great minds think alike! Exactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 hours ago, murraycraven said: and you hit the nail on the head. the goal-tending issues, to me anyway, is squarely on Hextall's shoulders. Since Neuvy received a huge raise after being the statistically worst goalie in the league I would expect Hextall to restructure is deal and pay him more next season. Makes total sense... I only agree in that it was under Hextall's watch that Jeff Reese was allowed to quit and for good reason. I blame hextall for that. I don't blame him for Mason or resigning Neuvy or any of that. There are a million reasons why that all went down the way it did and I don't blame Hextall for any of those. Jeff Reese though? THis team waited 15 damn years to have a respectable goaltending coach and they just sent him packing because he had the audacity to tell Berube he was being foolish. Seems like he'd have been clashing with Hak this whole time anyway... but he would be right. Chief and Hak were and are wrong about how they've been playing the goalies. Can't believe Hextall sided with chain of command. Stupid. Everything else, I think he handed the way he needed to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 3 hours ago, ruxpin said: It's almost like he's drunk or something, huh? Or like he thinks he’s the goaltending version of Ovie in the skills competition and is goofing off because he flat out doesn't give an eff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pucked in the head Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 They should tether him to the net so he doesn't fall in a drunken stooper too far out of the crease Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pucked in the head Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Well we only have to put up with him for a few more games... Then hopefully it's good friggin riddance...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 22 minutes ago, Pucked in the head said: Well we only have to put up with him for a few more games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 6 hours ago, ruxpin said: It's almost like he's drunk or something, huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pucked in the head Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Man this dude is like herpes "just can't rid of em " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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