icehole

I used to fight this fight with 97.5 constantly. The flyers could be 60-0 right now and this is what the talk would be: 1. Harden 2. Eagles Draft 3. NFL Draft 4. NcAA tournament 5. MLB lockout 6. Godfather 7. Parks Casino 8. MMA 9. Flyers Unfortunately, I can't fight that fight right now. The flyers aren't worth talking about, and to be honest, and the city really doesn't care about hockey. I really believe that. Philadelphia is not a good hockey town anymore.

Is that a great prospect pool though? I won't pretend to know what the rest of the league looks like, or even what these flyers prospects are expected to do. I just feel like fans have been getting way too excited for mediocrity coming from prospects lately. Frost was a very popular prospect since they drafted him, and he can barely crack the lineup even with all the injuries. You named players like Radcliff, forester, and Allison, and you use words like "compete for a roster spot". I don't want guys that will compete for a roster spot. The flyers have plenty of those players. I want guys that will be impact players. I know it's not easy, but you'd think they could get it right every now and then.

A few weeks ago, flyers scored a goal, and the camera focused in on the guy with the painted face. He was screaming like it was game 7 and they just tied it up. I'm sorry, but I wanted to punch him in the face. He might get paid to show his enthusiasm, but if you're not upset about what's going on, and one goal in a meaningless game during a meaningless season gets you that excited, you're not a fan. I wish it would be completely empty also, but I think (hope) they got the message already.

I'm actually surprised at those numbers...better than I remember. I guess I get caught up in the "what have you done for me lately?" I feel like I haven't seen any bright spots in his game lately. Full transparency, I haven't had the stomach to watch many games lately. Maybe I'm the TK of hockey fandom...once I see the direction this is going, I go 20 games without watching.

Are you saying Giroux is the reason? I believe Giroux has probably been the best #2 player in the league since he's been an NHL player. The problem is that they never gave him a #1. Imagine Backstrom passing to Voracek for 10 years instead of Ovie.

I couldn't agree with you more about Hayes. Lazy is a perfect description. I said I could find 10 goalies that could play average on a bad team. I know this will be a very unpopular opinion, but I really don't find the goaltender position to be very important. A very bad goalie (like Bryz) can destroy a good team's chances, but an average goalie like Niemi can win cups. I see good teams come to play the flyers with guys like Anderson and Binnington (who is losing his job to a guy I've never heard of), and I have to wonder how much impact they have on these teams being as successful as they are. Pens won a cup with Fleury, then they let him go. They win a cup with Murray, then they let him go. Did they miss a step with Jarry? Caps are doing OK without Holtby. The best goalie in the league is probably with the current cup winner, but if they lose him, they won't fall off a cliff. I don't belive in Fletcher either and I think he needs to go. I also think any player could go and I wouldn't be upset. As I said in a previous post, it would be nice to win a trade for once. Maybe you lose TK and he goes on to be a career third line guy. But you get something in return that gives you 30+ goals a season. Wouldn't that be nice?

@CoachX I see what you're saying. It's hard to get a good read on individual players right now because theres really no motivation to give it your all. I can defend Hart if he isn't great for a game here and a game there. All players are going to take off a few games over the season, especially if it's a bad season. I think my problem with TK is that he's underperformed so far in his NHL career as a whole. And to go 20+ games without a goal on top of that, that's hard to swallow. It could just be a product of how the season has gone, but as a fan, I want change. And as a couch GM, I know I have to give up something desirable to get something desirable. Flyers don't have a ton of desirable players, so I'd be willing to say goodbye.

I don't know. Am I over exaggerating if I think TK has done nothing for this team? Maybe. It's all in relation to what I think a top 6 guy should be though, and what he has done to make the team better. When the flyers are where they are, it's hard to say anyone makes them better. The only guy I have no problem with is Giroux, and I want him gone because he will give me the biggest return. I am seriously unattached to any other player. I hear people always say that Hart is untouchable. Not to me. Again, has he made this team better? He's played to the level of the team in front of him. I can find 10 goalies who could do that. Everyone is so scared to ever lose Coots. Although he has become a better player than I thought he would be, you're not going to win anything putting 4 lines of couturiers out there. Provorov plays 26 minutes but his play has regressed. So what are we holding onto here people? These players are the reason we are where we are. They are all great individual talents but they just don't get it done. Change it! When was the last time you actually felt that the flyers really "won a trade"? I feel like it was around the time of the Hartnell, Timmo, Coburn deals. And that was by a guy who everyone hates. One of the reasons they haven't won a trade is because they haven't really offered up anything significant in a while. Was Patrick significant? I say give Danny a chance. Is he qualified? Hell if I know. I don't care...it's change. What's the worst that could happen...flyers become a bottom team in the league? Isn't that what they are anyway?

The big focus at the trade deadline is to try to get what they can for Giroux. He is their best bet to get some decent players/prospects for the future. In a deal like that, lower impact players may be included in the deal just to make it work. For the first time, I saw Travis Konecney's name mentioned as a trade possibility. Apparently LA is interested. What are your thoughts? I don't know what LA has to offer in return, but I wouldn't mind saying goodbye. Just like many flyers in the past 30 years, he was so promising in the beginning. Then 5 years goes by and you have to ask what has he done? He's a small agitator with a reputation of getting under players' skin. I usually like players like that but I think he's a punk. I think his act is tired. I think if you go 20 games without scoring a goal, you should put your head down and shut your mouth. I think when you're playing Buffalo, you're down a few goals and someone wants to mix it up, but you turtle to get a PP (which they never do anything with anyway), you're just a pu$$y. Bye Bye!

Because I'm bored, when Conor Sheary and Tom Wilson scored, I decided to look up their goal totals for the season. Conor Sheary - 11 goals in 40 games Tom Wilson - 11 goals in 35 games Claude Giroux - 11 goals in 40 games A lot of people look at Wilson as being a goon. Conor Sheary is a scrub. I love Giroux but he has underperformed greatly for a few years now. Your star captain can't be tied with Conor Sheary

Rinaldo was worth a third...just sayin

Not a problem man. We're all a little tense these days. I also don't want to seem like one of these new age guys that doesn't believe in fighting. I like it and believe it serves a purpose. I think the right players have to do it at the right time though. Even if they went old school and put a goon out there every night, that would make more sense. It just didn't feel like genuine emotion for a guy that doesn't really have a bond with this team who plays about 4 minutes 5 games a season to ragdoll a smaller guy at the end of a second wooping, when he wasn't even involved in the first one. Here's a hot take. I would take Rinaldo or Carcillo on this team for 82 games a season rather than play Morin for 5. Those two guys contributed more than Morin ever will.

I don't see it as emotion. Emotion would be to start something early because you're emotional about the last game. I don't think he played the last rangers game. Emotion is starting something after 3-0 to pick your team up. This isn't his team...they don't care what Morin does. Emotion is setting the tone for the next meeting. This doesn't work if you just got outscored 17-3, because the rangers don't care what tone you set, you just got outscored 17-3. Plus Morin probably won't play on Saturday so he's a non factor. You're right this is more than a rut. More reason why a meaningless fight at the end of a blowout won't get you out. Giroux and Voracek and Hayes and Tk and so on haven't done anything. That's the troubling part. A meaningless player fighting a meaningless fight isn't going to make me feel better about it. If he was a contributor all season and stepped up to show he's not going to take this beating, I'm all for it.

This isn't directed toward anyone, but I wanted to comment on something I've been reading. People liked the Morin fight??? Why? If the team is good and fighting to compete with another good team but they get beat bad, I like it. If the team is in a rut and he wants to set the tone early, I like it. This team is embarrassing though. Fighting at the end of your second embarrassing loss for your team that you barely know because you can't even get into the lineup is just stupid and it does nothing for me. Also, if Wayne Simmons, having a 30 goal season, goes after someone after an embarrassing loss, it gets me amped up. Who is Sam Morin? He won't even be on the team next game. This team doesn't even know how to start something when they try.

I keep reading about voracek or JVR being possible trade bait. What is their value to another team? I think we (flyers fans) keep talking about it as a possibility because we want it to happen. I dont know if players like that are in demand though. I think the return would be average draft picks, average prospects, or another underachieving player looking for a change of scenery. I never thought I'd say this, but the flyers need to get back to concentrating on the draft. I watched a phantoms game a few weeks ago and it was tough. I didnt know any of the players and they just looked like a bad AHL team. All of those prospects we gathered are on the big team now. So what do we think about this team? When we were waiting for Hextalls plan to come together, is this what we were expecting? I really like this team and I like where they are going, but I just watched every highlight of the 2012 penguins series, that team was much better than what we have now. If Hart was on that team, things could have turned out much better.

You certainly can get a good player at 11. I just pointed out that flub because I'm not happy with this organization right now. It's a crapshoot outside of the first few picks. I actually like Morin and I hoped that he would add a presence and toughness the team was lacking. I watch a little but of phantoms hockey though, and it always looked like not much was going on upstairs. It's almost like the game moves too fast for his brain to process what's going on.

I really hope there is a Sam Morin type available. I hope the flyers draft him and groom him for five years to be a 7th or 6th defenseman in the NHL one day.

I would say yes. They thought they had a chance to win every year too. They even made some "rental" trades to do so but that didn't work out.

I understand the importance of picks. I dont put as much importance on them as others do, but I understand. In the NHL draft though, after 5th or even 3rd pick sometimes, you dont know what you're getting. So if you can get something that is known, and it cost you a role of the dice in the second round, I dont mind that strategy. For the record, I dont think it was fair to fire Hextall now. For someone like me who wasnt a fan of Hextalls philosophy, the damage was done when you hired him to carry out his plan. You might as well see it through. Hiring a new GM wont put butts in the seats immediately unless he does something drastic (we'll see soon). I think a coaching change would make more of an impact on the way the team plays. I like the excitement of change especially because this team has been irrelevant. Fletcher seems like a guy who wont let this team get stale like it has been. His resume doesn't impress me though. I've never liked Minnesota's teams. Parise wasnt at superstar level and a guy like Suter wouldn't thrill me. His other deals weren't exciting either. I think Hextall did set the table nicely but maybe Holmgren didnt have confidence that he would take the next step. Hopefully Fletcher will continue with what Hextall left for him while adding a little bit of his own touch to add some star talent.

You're right...I would take Ghost over McDavid.

That is very exciting and would be a nice change of pace.

Unfortunately there would be people on here saying "that's such a Homer move. You cant go handing out second round picks like candy. That pick could turn out amazing in 5 years."

Teams hold on for that one point now as it is. At least they would have to get to a shootout to earn it and wouldnt be able to get another in the shootout. To me, there has to be a winner and loser and they can't play 80-90 minute games 10-15 times a year. Shootout makes sense but it can't be as important as it is.

Let me start by saying the thing I hate most in sports is a tie. Soccer may be the most popular sport in the world but one thing I hate is the ties. It's like the game was never played. Fans leave the game feeling empty most of the time. On the other hand, I think there is too much importance put on the shootout. You can be completely outplayed for 65 minutes but because you have a player with the pedigree of a southern Cali in-line men's league that can twirl a puck, you could get double the points. It just doesn't seem right. I enjoy the shootout. It's neat to see the moves and you can leave feeling like your team lost or won the game. I just want to lessen its importance a little. So I came up with this system. Not sure if it was suggested yet but I haven't seen it. What about 2pts for OT or regulation win/ 0pts for OT or regulation loss. If after a 5 minute OT there is no winner, both teams get 1pt...that way there are still only 2pts available for each game instead of 3pts for some and 2 for others. Both teams battled and deserve a point. The game would then go to a shootout but you would receive a win for winning the shootout and a loss for losing the shootout. Shootout winner = 1pts+W/ Shootout loser gets 1pt+L. This would make teams want to win more in regulation or OT for that extra point. Here's one scenario Buffalo goes 20-45 in reg or OT but goes 12-5 in the SO. That gives them 57pts and 32wins (32 wins should get you 64pts...shootout doesn't make much difference) Detroit goes 45-20 in reg or OT but goes 5-12 in the SO. That gives them 107pts and 50wins (50 wins should get you 100pts...shootout doesn't make much difference) Wins would still come into play as far as tie-breakers go but points are the ultimate goal to climb in the standings. I tried to come up with scenarios that would make this system a bad thing but my brains are scrambled eggs. Let me know what you guys think

No. I woukdn't wait 5-8 years for a rebuild. I am proud to say the Flyers are more successful than the Pens because the flyers have the second best winning % of all time. The Pens are 20th. They have 3 cups because they were so terrible for so long and they got lucky in the draft.I don't think it has to happen that way though. This team could gel or they could continue to be mediocre or sink. As an outsider looking in, I don't like this team. They don't do the things I like. Giroux is their best player and I can remember at least three times this year that I saw him coasting and his man scored an important goal. I can't have that from my captain. I think that if you bring in the right GM, he can add guys that don't coast back, add the right coach,and have this team competing again in a year or two. I don't want to hold out hope that giroux will mature or cotourier will get tougher or schenn will live up to "top prospect" material.If they do turn it around, I'll be cheering them on but I'm sick of holding on because of expectations.