radoran Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 i'd say patrick thoreson is the better comparison, but raffl has the hands to keep him in the NHL that patrick didn't. the work ethic and even skating reminds me of him, though. FWIW, I was considering using Thoresen in this comparison, but was looking for a player with more of an offensive upside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 We did but you chose to ignore it...he is better defensively no matter which line he played for juggled to eventually to everyone of them at some time during this season......we're you sleep when he got put on the 1st line and jumped started G and Jake????All they did was set career highs in points streaks.......both of them...thanks to Raffl....they didn't even do that with the Great Jagr skating with them!!!!!No, I've been apparently sleeping for the past 16 games where Raffl has two points with Giroux and five overall.Again, if he's such the catalyst, where'd he disappear to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Again, if he's such the catalyst, where'd his disappear to? So the kid has a whopping 43 games in his NHL career and all you can do is blame just him how about his veteran linemates how many goals over those 16 games had G scored??? How about Jake???? But it's all Raffl's fault??? Well just send him to Adirondack that will teach him!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Again, if he's such the catalyst, where'd his disappear to? Besides he is tied for 7th among all Flyers players in +/- he'll be ok there are bigger problems on this team besides Raffl he is on the 4th he'll work his way back up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 So the kid has a whopping 43 games in his NHL career and all you can do is blame just him how about his veteran linemates how many goals over those 16 games had G scored??? How about Jake???? But it's all Raffl's fault??? Well just send him to Adirondack that will teach him!!!! Phew.... I wass beginning to think you were never going to stop w/ the overly large font! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 (edited) Phew.... I wass beginning to think you were never going to stop w/ the overly large font! Sorry it's my laptop Tourettes acting up!!!!!!! Edited February 3, 2014 by OccamsRazor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 i'd say patrick thoreson is the better comparison, but raffl has the hands to keep him in the NHL that patrick didn't. the work ethic and even skating reminds me of him, though. Yeah, Thoreson is a pretty good comparison. I was thinking of Nodl, partly but not entirely because of the Austrian connection. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Sorry it's my laptop Tourettes acting up!!!!!!! LOL.... just joking around! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 LOL.... just joking around! Me too it's all good!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I shouldn't be picking at people whom have have that...so just kidding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 So the kid has a whopping 43 games in his NHL career and all you can do is blame just him how about his veteran linemates how many goals over those 16 games had G scored??? How about Jake???? But it's all Raffl's fault??? Well just send him to Adirondack that will teach him!!!! Jake's got twice as many points (11) over the same stretch... Giroux has three times (15) the points.Two of Giroux's are related to Raffl. No one said send him to Adirondack or "blamed him for everything". There are a few people saying he "can play anywhere" and has ignited the top line with his play. My only point is that the fire he ignited has apparently gone out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Yeah, Thoreson is a pretty good comparison. I was thinking of Nodl, partly but not entirely because of the Austrian connection.Nodl is another good comparison. He's back in Austria now. Thoresen is in the KHL. And IIRC, there were a few that had Nodl "outscoring Jagr" in this league... when he was still with the Flyers. Again showing how some players can be overvalued when they are wearing your team's jersey*. Hell, I've seen comparisons to Renberg being made on this board. I went with Leino because he had scored 19/53 in a season in this league. His totals from that season are about the same as Nodl and Thoresen's career NHL numbers. Combined. * And, of course, undervalued... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 No one said send him to Adirondack or "blamed him for everything". Alright just checking i understand it, we need a whipping boy mine was Coburn but he has played better over the last 3 weeks, then it was Mezz (whom i still want traded) but my new one is Downie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Hell, I've seen comparisons to Renberg being made on this board. hey, leave me outta this Rad 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Alright just checking i understand it, we need a whipping boy mine was Coburn but he has played better over the last 3 weeks, then it was Mezz (whom i still want traded) but my new one is Downie. Not at all. Raffl is hardly a "whipping boy". This is more like an arbitration hearing where one side says he's the second coming of Mikael Renberg and the other says he projects to be better than Andreas Nodl and Patrik Thoresen. I'm not comparing him to Leino's Flyer season to downgrade him, but to determine where people think his upside lies. JackStraw has said he thinks Raffl can be a 20/50 guy in the league. I hope he's right. I wouldn't make that bet, but that's not to say that Raffl has no value and should be sent to Adirondack. Again, Raffl is coming in at an age relatively similar to Matt Read. Read came out of the gates as a 20-goal scorer and backed that up the next season (and this one). Raffl's projecting to 10/30 this season which is a respectable 3/4 line guy and one certainly worth the RFA qualifier with a look to extending on a longer, more valuable deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 No, I've been apparently sleeping for the past 16 games where Raffl has two points with Giroux and five overall.Again, if he's such the catalyst, where'd he disappear to?He was moved off that line to attempt reignition of Hartnell, G, and Voracek. I don't know why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilsFanDrew Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 @OccamsRazor Also fair to point out the level of competition the Flyers were racking up points in that stretch wasn't very stiff. I think that more than Raffl's play helped G and Jake's production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 He was moved off that line to attempt reignition of Hartnell, G, and Voracek. I don't know why. Just off the top of my head, I'll give you five more years at $4.75M per reasons why... But looking a little more closely, after his initial flurry on the line - 8 points in 8 games (Dec 4 - Dec 19) - he had 5 in his next 15 (Dec 21 - Jan 22) He provided a nice change of pace from Hartnell and gave some energy which took some teams by surprise, but he is simply not a Top Six forward nor have I seen anyone here seriously suggest he is. Teams adapted and his game is what it is. 13 in 23 certainly isn't chopped liver, but the way they came wasn't enough to keep them from trying to get the magic back with Hartnell. If that time - and future cups of coffee - in the top six gives him more confidence down in the 3/4 trenches and he can provide some inexpensive depth scoring - 10-15 - I'm all for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 I'm not comparing him to Leino's Flyer season to downgrade him, but to determine where people think his upside lies Well honestly i haven't seen enough of him, been several games i've missed and many times he's been moved about so with that said i haven't seen enough consistencey with him to call that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Just off the top of my head, I'll give you five more years at $4.75M per reasons why...But looking a little more closely, after his initial flurry on the line - 8 points in 8 games (Dec 4 - Dec 19) - he had 5 in his next 15 (Dec 21 - Jan 22)He provided a nice change of pace from Hartnell and gave some energy which took some teams by surprise, but he is simply not a Top Six forward nor have I seen anyone here seriously suggest he is. Teams adapted and his game is what it is. 13 in 23 certainly isn't chopped liver, but the way they came wasn't enough to keep them from trying to get the magic back with Hartnell.If that time - and future cups of coffee - in the top six gives him more confidence down in the 3/4 trenches and he can provide some inexpensive depth scoring - 10-15 - I'm all for it.You're probably right. Which kinda sucks.I do think Raffl could be a line two winger though. It might take a season to adapt and develop further, but he's a good two way guy that can skate well. Decent work ethic too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Just off the top of my head, I'll give you five more years at $4.75M per reasons why... But looking a little more closely, after his initial flurry on the line - 8 points in 8 games (Dec 4 - Dec 19) - he had 5 in his next 15 (Dec 21 - Jan 22) He provided a nice change of pace from Hartnell and gave some energy which took some teams by surprise, but he is simply not a Top Six forward nor have I seen anyone here seriously suggest he is. Teams adapted and his game is what it is. 13 in 23 certainly isn't chopped liver, but the way they came wasn't enough to keep them from trying to get the magic back with Hartnell. If that time - and future cups of coffee - in the top six gives him more confidence down in the 3/4 trenches and he can provide some inexpensive depth scoring - 10-15 - I'm all for it.You also have to take into consideration that there are really only two spots where Hartnell is of any use. 1st line LW or 2nd line LW. Hartnell on a checking line is not going to make anyone happy. So when Vinnie came back from injury, Raffl was the only real candidate to get moved down. I mean, we know VLC isn't going to be playing on a 3rd or 4th line either. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 You also have to take into consideration that there are really only two spots where Hartnell is of any use. 1st line LW or 2nd line LW. Hartnell on a checking line is not going to make anyone happy. So when Vinnie came back from injury, Raffl was the only real candidate to get moved down. I mean, we know VLC isn't going to be playing on a 3rd or 4th line either. I'll just opine that a good general manager takes all that into account when constructing his team in the first place, especially when it comes to giving out five and six year long deals with No Movement Clauses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 I'll just opine that a good general manager takes all that into account when constructing his team in the first place, especially when it comes to giving out five and six year long deals with No Movement Clauses. Yes, but wwhd? (what would Homer do) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude Monet Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 i'd say patrick thoreson is the better comparison, but raffl has the hands to keep him in the NHL that patrick didn't. the work ethic and even skating reminds me of him, though.[/quotHaving two nuts helps as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam1986 Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 A keeper he's a guy you need to win with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted February 4, 2014 Share Posted February 4, 2014 During the broadcast they showed a quote from Berube saying that Raffl made the players around him better. He's elite! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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