radoran Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I like that line too. That doesn't leave many options for Read. Umberger should move to the 4th line and bring Bellemare to the third? I know it won't be popular, and you don't want to put the "4th liner" tag on a possible trade piece, but could you move both Couturier and Umberger to the 4th line? I guess if you believe that Couturier needs to be out there against the best, he needs more than 4th line minutes. Umburglar is a potential buyout candidate, not a potential trade piece. If anything, having Umburglar on the team is preventing trades because Hextall won't give up a youngun without adding in dead weight. I'd move Umburglar to the press box or, better yet, to Allentown. At least in Allentown they get $900K in cap space back... Couturier is just fine right where he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Montreal was going to take this guy and a pick for Subban 3 years ago? Maybe when the series was in its prime in the early 1980's but not now. LOL.... now where is Catherine BAch when you need her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 LOL.... now where is Catherine BAch when you need her. Hopefully wearing those Daisy Dukes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Hopefully wearing those Daisy Dukes ask and you shall recieve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Umburglar is a potential buyout candidate, not a potential trade piece. If anything, having Umburglar on the team is preventing trades because Hextall won't give up a youngun without adding in dead weight. I'd move Umburglar to the press box or, better yet, to Allentown. At least in Allentown they get $900K in cap space back... Couturier is just fine right where he is.I wasnt suggesting Umberger was a trade piece. Couturier is the trade piece. As soon as you move him to the 4th line though, trade value would drop. Flyers dont have anymore buyouts. Dont move Umberger to Allentown...I will be there Saturday night! Maybe they should just alternate Vinny and Umerger on the 4th line from the press bix. That way maybe theyre both fresh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I wasnt suggesting Umberger was a trade piece. Couturier is the trade piece. As soon as you move him to the 4th line though, trade value would drop. Flyers dont have anymore buyouts. Dont move Umberger to Allentown...I will be there Saturday night! Maybe they should just alternate Vinny and Umerger on the 4th line from the press bix. That way maybe theyre both fresh. You can always* buyout players. It just comes with a cap hit. Flyers would "save" $3M on the cap by buying out Umburglar in the first two years (and then take a $1.5M cap hit the next two). IMO, that's a better "value" than having Umburglar. http://www.capgeek.com/buyout-calculator/?player_id=588 Buy out VLC and you "save" another $1.7M http://www.capgeek.com/buyout-calculator/?player_id=884 With $4.7M you can get yourself an actual, honest-to-God 20/50 winger in the current market, which is an upgrade from having both of them... I'd rather have $4M in dead space on the cap than have to try to fit in Umburglar and VLC. A better example of addition by subtraction you will be hard pressed to find. YMMV. * after the season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I think the question is on the right track, but a little off. Let's just take Coots out of it for a second. If you're Read and Umberger are both affected by what their line is asked to do. If they're on a line with Giroux, yeah, they'll score more. Conversely, if Coots is given wingers who can skate, create some space, get open and make a few things happen, he might be a bit more effective of a play maker. As it is, Coots isn't spending his shifts waiting for an outlet to then transition into offense for the other two to get open for or clean up after. If he were, I'm sure Read and Umberger would be scoring more. At the same time if Read and Umberger were guys who could get open for an outlet, carry the puck a bit more before getting checked or dig it out of a corner a bit better, I'm sure Coots would be more productive. Honestly, I expected Read to be a bit more spunky and win a few more battles and Umberger should at least be good for a cycling or corner battle winning approach... but those aren't happening. I'm surprised by that. Still think that if Coots spends a bit more time with Simmonds and maybe Raffl, we'll see a lot more goals from all three. But that might take more than 3 shifts to develop. So, but here's the question no one (myself until just now) is asking: are Couturier's wingers holding him back (offensively) or are his wingers being held back by their center?I'm the biggest critic of Couturier but I don't know if he's holding back Umberger. Read might be a little better with another center though. Maybe Read can be a wing for Laughton with Schenn on the other side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I think the question is on the right track, but a little off. Let's just take Coots out of it for a second. If you're Read and Umberger are both affected by what their line is asked to do. If they're on a line with Giroux, yeah, they'll score more. Conversely, if Coots is given wingers who can skate, create some space, get open and make a few things happen, he might be a bit more effective of a play maker. As it is, Coots isn't spending his shifts waiting for an outlet to then transition into offense for the other two to get open for or clean up after. If he were, I'm sure Read and Umberger would be scoring more. At the same time if Read and Umberger were guys who could get open for an outlet, carry the puck a bit more before getting checked or dig it out of a corner a bit better, I'm sure Coots would be more productive. Honestly, I expected Read to be a bit more spunky and win a few more battles and Umberger should at least be good for a cycling or corner battle winning approach... but those aren't happening. I'm surprised by that. Still think that if Coots spends a bit more time with Simmonds and maybe Raffl, we'll see a lot more goals from all three. But that might take more than 3 shifts to develop. Yeah, I buy all of that, especially as it pertains to Couturier. With moving Couturier to a line with Simmonds and Raffl, you're proposing stick another center between Read and Umberger or splitting them? Are we just assuming that if we center anyone with those two that that center is offensively doomed. Or, would another center who isn't expected to be shut down and therefore get them more starts in the offensive end be better for them ("them" being Read & Umberger)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I think the question is on the right track, but a little off. Let's just take Coots out of it for a second. If you're Read and Umberger are both affected by what their line is asked to do. If they're on a line with Giroux, yeah, they'll score more. Conversely, if Coots is given wingers who can skate, create some space, get open and make a few things happen, he might be a bit more effective of a play maker. As it is, Coots isn't spending his shifts waiting for an outlet to then transition into offense for the other two to get open for or clean up after. If he were, I'm sure Read and Umberger would be scoring more. At the same time if Read and Umberger were guys who could get open for an outlet, carry the puck a bit more before getting checked or dig it out of a corner a bit better, I'm sure Coots would be more productive. Honestly, I expected Read to be a bit more spunky and win a few more battles and Umberger should at least be good for a cycling or corner battle winning approach... but those aren't happening. I'm surprised by that. Still think that if Coots spends a bit more time with Simmonds and maybe Raffl, we'll see a lot more goals from all three. But that might take more than 3 shifts to develop. make the most sense regarding the whole Coots discussion. Who were Coot's linemates last year? I know at one point he had Talbot and then Downie. Was Read there too? If so, IMO, Read has really regressed. Most games he invisible. Remember at one point last year the 3rd line was really clicking. So what changed....the addition of Corpseburger. Could RJ really be that detrimental to the 3rd line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I wasn't aware of that. It sounds like the right route for me but there has to be some reason they don't do it. Maybe we can't see that reason because we aren't the ones signing million dollar checks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertmega Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I don't know who is holding whom back, but I would be reluctant with messing with other lines just to get Read or Couturier going. To me, if two lines are clicking and the third is not, you can either mix and match with the 4th line, or you can bring someone else in from the phantoms or another team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 @Bertmega... He is doing more laying there concussed than he has all this season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 @Bertmega... He is doing more laying there concussed than he has all this season Ouch. True, but ouch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I wasn't aware of that. It sounds like the right route for me but there has to be some reason they don't do it. Maybe we can't see that reason because we aren't the ones signing million dollar checks. They have done it. Just not at that level (Bartulis, for example). And at this point they can't do it with Umburglar and Lecadaver until after this season. But they have been willing to plunk down MILLIONS to buy out players - see Bryzgalov, LeClair... The team has the money to do whatever they want with it. Comcast is sitting on over a billion "cash on hand" and has a market cap that is ridiculous. IMO, I expect at least one if not both to be bought out unless they can find some sucker to take them on beforehand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertmega Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 @murraycraven I was going to put a caption below the gif, however, I do not wish injury on a player. But if he and Vinny accidentally collided like that in practice I wouldn't loose any sleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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