fanaticV3.0 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 when this season is all said and done. They are out as far as a high draft pick goes (which isn't the end of the world), they're going to miss the playoffs, and in their misguided attempt to make the playoffs they're not going to be sellers; which they should be doing especially since they won't get a high draft pick. That last one is the real kicker. If we're lucky, Timonen will be gone, but his return will be practically non-existent. Trading him is more of a favor than anything. Aside from him, I don't see them moving many guys. They should be talking Coburn up big time and throw him in with Timonen, since the two have had success together. Turn that minimal value Timonen has into something. They should be trading Streit, because he makes a lot of money, they are not a playoff team (if they were, I'm keeping him), and you're never going to get another opportunity to get as much for him as you can now. The MacDonlands, VLCs, and Umbergers of the world are obvious. They should be moved, but are also very unlikely to be moved, which is why you should move the small handful of guys who have some value. But they won't, because they are the Flyers and have to "go down fighting" or some bullshit like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Trading him is more of a favor than anything. Aside from him, I don't see them moving many guys. FV3.0, I mentioned this in another post but I have an odd feeling this is going to be a very quiet deadline for the Flyers. Let it be noted that this is just my gut feeling but my worry is that we are in the same boat come the draft. At this point I think any move that can be made to shed salary (more so on defense) is a start. Hextall needs cap room to work with and roster spots need to be cleared for a few of the kids next year. My fear is that we are stuck with the same roster after the deadline which really would keep us in the "land of mediocrity" a bit longer. Another issue is that I really feel the Flyers overvalue some of these players... It is a very frustrating time for sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 FV3.0, I mentioned this in another post but I have an odd feeling this is going to be a very quiet deadline for the Flyers. Let it be noted that this is just my gut feeling but my worry is that we are in the same boat come the draft. At this point I think any move that can be made to shed salary (more so on defense) is a start. Hextall needs cap room to work with and roster spots need to be cleared for a few of the kids next year. My fear is that we are stuck with the same roster after the deadline which really would keep us in the "land of mediocrity" a bit longer. Another issue is that I really feel the Flyers overvalue some of these players... It is a very frustrating time for sure... If nothing is done to this roster i will be pissed....i'll be happy with just trading guys for picks and or prospects back...i don't care if they get any rental back but i want some from this roster gone....and no old past their prime players back i want youth to prepare for next year...i can't see them making the playoffs so let just focus on staying healthy and evaluating for next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 If nothing is done to this roster i will be pissed....i'll be happy with just trading guys for picks and or prospects back...i don't care if they get any rental back but i want some from this roster gone....and no old past their prime players back i want youth to prepare for next year...i can't see them making the playoffs so let just focus on staying healthy and evaluating for next year. And the playoff race is really a 4 team fight now, with the Panthers picking up Jagr and ahead of us (with a game in hand). The Sens are one point behind us with THREE games in hand. The Flyers are probably the least likely of the 4 to earn the playoff berth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I agree that the Flyers need to sell some assets, but the question is at what point do you look at what teams are offering and say "no thanks?" If teams are offering a 3rd for Coburn, do you take it just to get rid of him? I don't. Grossmann for a 5th? pass. These guys' contracts aren't so bad that you HAVE to get rid of them. We won't know what other teams are offering, but I assume that if no deal is made, Hextall isn't getting what he considers to be value for various players, and that's ok, there's still the draft to make moves. Now, a 2027 7th rounder for Andrew MacDonald? I'll drive him to wherever he's going AND pay for the gas and his meals along the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 And the playoff race is really a 4 team fight now, with the Panthers picking up Jagr and ahead of us (with a game in hand). The Sens are one point behind us with THREE games in hand. The Flyers are probably the least likely of the 4 to earn the playoff berth. Yes agree...they are just to inconsistent and have issues with the 5 on 5 play. Damn this team is frustrating...they fix the 5 on 5 play and then the special teams struggle....they get better on special teams and then the 5 on 5 play starts to suck....WTF GUYS!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 FV3.0, I mentioned this in another post but I have an odd feeling this is going to be a very quiet deadline for the Flyers. Let it be noted that this is just my gut feeling but my worry is that we are in the same boat come the draft. At this point I think any move that can be made to shed salary (more so on defense) is a start. Hextall needs cap room to work with and roster spots need to be cleared for a few of the kids next year. My fear is that we are stuck with the same roster after the deadline which really would keep us in the "land of mediocrity" a bit longer. Another issue is that I really feel the Flyers overvalue some of these players... It is a very frustrating time for sure... There's been no indication they are going to do anything. That doesn't mean they won't, just going with the odds. Hextall has said they won't be buyers, which is fine, but there's no buzz about them trading anyone and all you hear from the team revolves around trying to make the playoffs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 If nothing is done to this roster i will be pissed....i'll be happy with just trading guys for picks and or prospects back...i don't care if they get any rental back but i want some from this roster gone....and no old past their prime players back i want youth to prepare for next year...i can't see them making the playoffs so let just focus on staying healthy and evaluating for next year. I'm in the same boat. They're not going to get better by just sitting on their hands. Shed some salary, stock pile some picks and prospects, any maybe keep an eye on the FA marketing depending on how much salary you're able to get rid of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I'm in the same boat. They're not going to get better by just sitting on their hands. Shed some salary, stock pile some picks and prospects, any maybe keep an eye on the FA marketing depending on how much salary you're able to get rid of. Yes i agree. And not to be negative i'm just a realist....and this team just doesn't have what it takes to get to the playoffs and if by a miracle they do it will be one and done. So i'd prefer to purge as much as you can utilize the remaining games say for call ups maybe to evaluate some talent below this season is shot mights as well use it for the future. This team isn't that far off the have some good parts to build around so remove as many guys as you can who aren't going to be a part of the future and add as many parts for the future as you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 I agree that the Flyers need to sell some assets, but the question is at what point do you look at what teams are offering and say "no thanks?" If teams are offering a 3rd for Coburn, do you take it just to get rid of him? I don't. Grossmann for a 5th? pass. These guys' contracts aren't so bad that you HAVE to get rid of them. We won't know what other teams are offering, but I assume that if no deal is made, Hextall isn't getting what he considers to be value for various players, and that's ok, there's still the draft to make moves. Now, a 2027 7th rounder for Andrew MacDonald? I'll drive him to wherever he's going AND pay for the gas and his meals along the way. Hell yeah I do. That's $8 mil in cap space and if they had the smarts/balls (which they don't) to trade Streit it's even more cap room and you'd actually get a nice return for him that you claim you're losing in trading the other to for something not all that sexy (I don't think they are worth much more than that, but that's not the point). We know what this team is with these guys on the roster. They're not going to get better with this same roster next year. They could trade some of these guys in the off season, but their value is simply higher this time of year and since this team likely isn't going to make the playoffs, it makes more sense to trade them now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyClarkeFan16 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 If Timonen comes off LTIR and plays this weekend, then they'll have to make a move because they'll be over the cap if they don't. I think a big move is coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 Yes i agree. And not to be negative i'm just a realist....and this team just doesn't have what it takes to get to the playoffs and if by a miracle they do it will be one and done. So i'd prefer to purge as much as you can utilize the remaining games say for call ups maybe to evaluate some talent below this season is shot mights as well use it for the future. This team isn't that far off the have some good parts to build around so remove as many guys as you can who aren't going to be a part of the future and add as many parts for the future as you can. Don't apologize for being realistic. If somebody is offended by it, that means they are a stepford, and their feelings don't count. That's exactly how I see it. They're not a good team, but they are not (or shouldn't be) that far off from being good enough to be back into the mix. The young core is actually versatile too. It's not like they are a sh-t team that had a high draft pick in the last few years and has 1 or 2 dominant offensive players and nothing around them. They have the two-way guys in the bottom six to support them. They need a top line winger, 2nd line center, and some defensemen. Some of these will hopefully be filled by guys in the system and the last 1 or 2 would come from the FA market in the next couple of years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 If teams are offering a 3rd for Coburn, do you take it just to get rid of him? No i'd rather keep him i'll take no less than a 2nd and after what Sekera got there is no reason why Coburn shouldn't fetch a 1st and something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 The young core is actually versatile too. It's not like they are a sh-t team that had a high draft pick in the last few years and has 1 or 2 dominant offensive players and nothing around them. They have the two-way guys in the bottom six to support them. They need a top line winger, 2nd line center, and some defensemen. Some of these will hopefully be filled by guys in the system and the last 1 or 2 would come from the FA market in the next couple of years. Beyond G, Jake, and Simmonds, their forwards all play like bottom six. They need true 2nd line players that can elevate the 5v5 offensive game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 No i'd rather keep him i'll take no less than a 2nd and after what Sekera got there is no reason why Coburn shouldn't fetch a 1st and something else. There's nothing to be gained by holding onto him. If we're talking about the difference between a 5th and a 2nd fine, but a 3rd and a 2nd? Nope, he's gone (or should be). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 There's nothing to be gained by holding onto him. If we're talking about the difference between a 5th and a 2nd fine, but a 3rd and a 2nd? Nope, he's gone (or should be). Not really but i'm not giving him away you can try to move him at the draft then. He value even still with the team. No way i just give him away i can't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 If Timonen comes off LTIR and plays this weekend, then they'll have to make a move because they'll be over the cap if they don't. I think a big move is coming.Couldn't they just waive coca cola? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 Beyond G, Jake, and Simmonds, their forwards all play like bottom six. They need true 2nd line players that can elevate the 5v5 offensive game. Right now, yeah. What's the definition of a true 2nd line player? If Simmonds, who is on pace for around 55pts, is, but Schenn (who is on pace for around 45) isn't that tells me something. It tells me that they need a 2nd line center, not that Schenn should be in the bottom six. Besides the fact he's not really good enough defensively to play in the bottom six, he'd be a disaster there, he's young and make progress statistically. It's minimal, but it's there. This is only going to be the 2nd season he's actually played a full season. You put him and Simmonds with a legit, proven, maybe even veteran 2nd line guy and there's your 2nd line imo. If he's scoring 40-45 on his own, I have little doubt you can get him up to where Simmonds is, at least statistically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fanaticV3.0 Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 Not really but i'm not giving him away you can try to move him at the draft then. He value even still with the team. No way i just give him away i can't do it. I don't think he is good enough - or that there's enough difference between a 2nd and 3rd - that I'd consider trading him for a 3rd giving him away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Couldn't they just waive coca cola? No eff that he'll get claimed...waive Zac no one wants him. But i'll take a trade too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I don't think he is good enough - or that there's enough difference between a 2nd and 3rd - that I'd consider trading him for a 3rd giving him away. He has his issues but he is a better defenseman than Sekara and he basically netted 2 1st round picks...so i'm sticking to my guns i wouldn't give him away. He'll fetch a 1st at the witching hour! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Right now, yeah. What's the definition of a true 2nd line player? If Simmonds, who is on pace for around 55pts, is, but Schenn (who is on pace for around 45) isn't that tells me something. It tells me that they need a 2nd line center, not that Schenn should be in the bottom six. Besides the fact he's not really good enough defensively to play in the bottom six, he'd be a disaster there, he's young and make progress statistically. It's minimal, but it's there. This is only going to be the 2nd season he's actually played a full season. You put him and Simmonds with a legit, proven, maybe even veteran 2nd line guy and there's your 2nd line imo. If he's scoring 40-45 on his own, I have little doubt you can get him up to where Simmonds is, at least statistically. Yeah, I agree that Schenn *could* be that guy. Coots *could* be that guy too. But as of right now, the only one who *is* that guy is Simmonds. There's a real lack. So maybe time and patience is the answer. Or maybe Laughton is the long-term answer. Or Cousins. Or maybe we trade Couturier for Ryan O'Reilly. I don't know. I just know that beyond G, Jake, and SImmonds, we have a bunch of bottom 6 players as it currently stands. That's one of the primary reasons for our struggles this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Or maybe we trade Couturier for Ryan O'Reilly Well O'reilly is very versatile, he can play center AND LW....i can't say i followed them much this year but last year he scored 28 goals 36 assists for 64 points playing LW. And is only 24. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Well O'reilly is very versatile, he can play center AND LW....i can't say i followed them much this year but last year he scored 28 goals 36 assists for 64 points playing LW. And is only 24. I would do this in a heartbeat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 No i'd rather keep him i'll take no less than a 2nd and after what Sekera got there is no reason why Coburn shouldn't fetch a 1st and something else.The problem is that you need the right buyer for the right return.Sekera garnered what he did because the Kings wanted him AND he is a true rental.Flyers have precious few true rentals and fewer still with reAl value... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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