Off He Goes....

[Commander Clueless]

Don't know if anyone posted it yet, but Babcock gave a farewell interview in Detroit:

 

https://youtu.be/Bz5huscPor4

[WingNut722]

@Commander Clueless

 

Thanks for posting that.  It really shows that he had a tough time with this decision.  Looks like the mental vote was 51 Toronto, 49 Detroit.  

 

"I been here a looooong friggin' time...!"    Classic!

[Commander Clueless]

 

 

 

Sorry, re-post with the embedded format.

 

 

A very emotional goodbye from Mr. Babcock.

[jammer2]

IMO Babcock teams overachieve.He gets them to play with structure. I would say without Babcock the Wings would have missed the playoffs at least once in the last 3 years. Probably more. IMO Babcock is the best coach in the NHL by a wide margin. I have zero confidence that Blashill is going to be the new best coach in the NHL. This league is a parity league. Coaching is the only place you can use money to get a decided advantage. Blashill has been executing Babcock's system well but that is very different than creating the system. The overwhelming majority of coaching candidates fail at the NHL level. The average career is very short and only a handful of coaches are capable of winning a cup. Blashill is merely a prospect. Sure, he has had success everywhere but so has every failed coach in NHL history. I seriously doubt we make the playoffs this year and I wouldn't be surprised if Blashill's career is 3 years long. I hope I am wrong.

 

 

  A lot of hyperbole in there....here are some things to consider....the Leafs have not one young forward that can match what Jurco, Sheahan, Nyqvist or Tatar offer, that's not even talking about Larkin, Mantha or Pulkkinen..or Bertuzzi or Anthisiaiou (sp..lol) or Ferraro....I just named 4 current young NHL players and 6 prospects....all of whom are very worthy of being talked about...you have what...JVR...and Nylander...and ZILCH.....I don't care who the Leafs draft this year, cause look at the last 6 drafts, the Wings find a better player in the mid 20's...almost every time. This year may be different due to the high end talent in this particular draft....but I'm not holding my breath...the Wings pick will be a good solid contributor at the NHL level.

 

 

 AND I might note, Blaishill has already coached the above listed players for years and years, knows them like the back of his hand, how to motivate, when to take off pressure etc etc....half the battle right there!

[Capsized]

  A lot of hyperbole in there....here are some things to consider....the Leafs have not one young forward that can match what Jurco, Sheahan, Nyqvist or Tatar offer, that's not even talking about Larkin, Mantha or Pulkkinen..or Bertuzzi or Anthisiaiou (sp..lol) or Ferraro....I just named 4 current young NHL players and 6 prospects....all of whom are very worthy of being talked about...you have what...JVR...and Nylander...and ZILCH.....I don't care who the Leafs draft this year, cause look at the last 6 drafts, the Wings find a better player in the mid 20's...almost every time. This year may be different due to the high end talent in this particular draft....but I'm not holding my breath...the Wings pick will be a good solid contributor at the NHL level.

 

 

 AND I might note, Blaishill has already coached the above listed players for years and years, knows them like the back of his hand, how to motivate, when to take off pressure etc etc....half the battle right there!

I agree the Wings have a bunch of good prospects but I think structure, discipline, and accountability trump skill. It remains to be seen if Blashill can bring these things at the NHL level. All NHL players have talent. It also remains to be seen if Blash can attract quality people. Babs has a lot more cache in that respect. 

[hf101]

I have been saying Babs was gone to Toronto and sticking to my guns since Carlyle was fired with the team in playoff contention, if they had snuck into the playoffs and won a round no way could they have fired Carlyle. The firing was the first shot in the battle to land Babs and to the Leafs credit they went out and spent ungodly stupid money and got their man. I posted elsewhere if the Leafs win a cup under Babs his face will be on the money.

 

Yeah, I don't know where that thread is, but I also think Babcock's mindset to consider coaching Toronto took place after the last Winter Olympics as he was proud to coach that Championship for Canada.  What he didn't say in the in the video above staying politically correct was that he wants to bring the first Stanley Cup to Canada in ?? years.  I think that is the challenge that he seeks for himself. 

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

You know guys, I'm not saying Blashill will be the next great coach, but he DOES have some things in his favor with regards to knowing the 'Detroit way' and the players on the team now and in the pipeline.

 

And let's not forget...Mike Babcock himself was a 'nobody' when Anaheim decided to give him the reigns and say "Do something with this".

Babcock made good on that.

He is acknowledged as one of the better minds in hockey because he was GIVEN an opportunity to prove it.

 

Attract quality people?

Ummm....yea, well, winning will do that.

If Blashill can prove he can motivate and keep the team winning, quality free agents will find their way to Detroit.

 

On the flipside, even with a sterling reputation like Babcock's, if the Leafs continue to be an unfettered mess, NO quality veteran free agent (or coach for that matter) will want to go to Toronto.

At the very least, people are going to take a 'wait n see' attitude to what the new regime is doing in Toronto.

 

Coach Babcock was smart enough to know what glories will be bestowed on him if he can help fix the disaster that is Toronto...he also knows that even in failure, he will just be one of many who have tried and failed...but will be a very rich man for his trouble.

A 'can't lose' situation for a coach if there ever was one.

 

As for Blashill, hey, he may or may not work out.

But all one needs to do is look at teams like division rival Tampa Bay and see a guy (a former lawyer of all things) who was given an opportunity because he knew the systems and players, and with the skilled players he had, is proving he can coach a winning team.

 

Don't see why Blashill, if afforded the same opportunities and tools to get the job done, can't do the same.

Detroit surely is NOT lacking for talent.

[jammer2]

I agree the Wings have a bunch of good prospects but I think structure, discipline, and accountability trump skill.

 

Sometimes sure it can. Especially in a 7 game series. Over the course of a full year, the talent usually trumps hard work. Anyways....it feels odd being a Flyer fan, convincing a Wing fan that his team is gonna be really good.

 

 The other point I was going to make regarding the Wings was....they are not going to go from being responsible players to running all over the ice...Blaishill looks like a smart dude....he's going to know that structured play and accountability are where it's at. I can't believe he could watch Babcock for the past few years, and not have some of that rub off on him....accountability will be huge with Blaishill, I can almost guarantee it.

 

  Thing is....Blaishill has the roster to utilize that type of game...Babcock is going to try to make things work with roster full of players that at least last year, could care less about accountability....honestly, the whole lot of them looked they didn't care from Mid-Dec on. Wings team Corsi was 3rd last year, Leafs #27....that's a pretty big difference.

 

   Good luck being a young player on the Wings and try and not pull your weight on defense....Zetts, Pavs and Kronner would be in his face so quick, his head would spin. The players will make sure there is accountabiltiy....cause they know it works also.

 

 I've been grinning since the Leafs signed Babber....CAN'T WAIT until training camp, when that tool Kessel shows up fat and out of shape, Babcock is gonna go OFF.....LMAO!!

[Polaris922]

Is this why??

[jammer2]

@Polaris922  Oh, that is good.

[Capsized]

You know guys, I'm not saying Blashill will be the next great coach, but he DOES have some things in his favor with regards to knowing the 'Detroit way' and the players on the team now and in the pipeline.

 

And let's not forget...Mike Babcock himself was a 'nobody' when Anaheim decided to give him the reigns and say "Do something with this".

Babcock made good on that.

He is acknowledged as one of the better minds in hockey because he was GIVEN an opportunity to prove it.

 

Attract quality people?

Ummm....yea, well, winning will do that.

If Blashill can prove he can motivate and keep the team winning, quality free agents will find their way to Detroit.

 

On the flipside, even with a sterling reputation like Babcock's, if the Leafs continue to be an unfettered mess, NO quality veteran free agent (or coach for that matter) will want to go to Toronto.

At the very least, people are going to take a 'wait n see' attitude to what the new regime is doing in Toronto.

 

Coach Babcock was smart enough to know what glories will be bestowed on him if he can help fix the disaster that is Toronto...he also knows that even in failure, he will just be one of many who have tried and failed...but will be a very rich man for his trouble.

A 'can't lose' situation for a coach if there ever was one.

 

As for Blashill, hey, he may or may not work out.

But all one needs to do is look at teams like division rival Tampa Bay and see a guy (a former lawyer of all things) who was given an opportunity because he knew the systems and players, and with the skilled players he had, is proving he can coach a winning team.

 

Don't see why Blashill, if afforded the same opportunities and tools to get the job done, can't do the same.

Detroit surely is NOT lacking for talent.

Datsyuk and Zetterberg are getting old fast and there aren't replacements in the pipeline. They have been a bubble team the last few years and Babs pushed them over the edge with a couple of Jack Adams worthy seasons. Detroit has a ton of 2-3 line players and no D. They don't have any elite players behind Pav and Z. Blashill will have to be among the top 3 coaches in the league to get in the playoffs. If he fails he will be run out of town as the 1st guy in 25 years to not get in. If you watched their series with Tampa you saw them compete strongly with a team that on paper is vastly superior. That's Babcock's influence. Odds are Blashill isn't as good.

[Samifan]

Is this why??

He would also have gotten every April and May off if he had chosen Buffalo

[jammer2]

Datsyuk and Zetterberg are getting old fast and there aren't replacements in the pipeline. They have been a bubble team the last few years and Babs pushed them over the edge with a couple of Jack Adams worthy seasons. Detroit has a ton of 2-3 line players and no D. They don't have any elite players behind Pav and Z. Blashill will have to be among the top 3 coaches in the league to get in the playoffs. If he fails he will be run out of town as the 1st guy in 25 years to not get in. If you watched their series with Tampa you saw them compete strongly with a team that on paper is vastly superior. That's Babcock's influence. Odds are Blashill isn't as good.

 

 Are you *sure* you're a Wings fan?  LOL!

[Capsized]

 Are you *sure* you're a Wings fan?  LOL!

I am. That's why I am bummed about losing Babcock. In a cap era the one place you can gain a huge upper hand is coaching. We had an elite coach and now we have a prospect. The vast majority of coaching prospects fail. Odds are the Wings will not contend for many years to come.

[SpikeDDS]

I agree the Wings have a bunch of good prospects but I think structure, discipline, and accountability trump skill. It remains to be seen if Blashill can bring these things at the NHL level. All NHL players have talent. It also remains to be seen if Blash can attract quality people. Babs has a lot more cache in that respect. 

 

On the other side of Babs' coattails, though, is that there were so many that came because of him...and within 2-3 years--some a little more than that--they left, because he grew 'em, maybe too much. Then he had to find others to replace them. Lather, rinse, repeat.

 

I dunno, but Scotty Bowman seemed to hold onto assistant coaches better than Babs has. Maybe it was winning Cups that made them stay. But the unified coaching team under Bowman sure had more success than the revolving door that Babs' coaching team had, and I think that affected us, especially the last few years when the talent level dropped off some.

 

The addition of Granato was a great pickup, and I hope he and Blash (assuming it's Blash, which is a pretty safe assumption) hit it off and he sticks around for a while. Stability at the helm is a good thing. The head coach is the most vital, but the other pieces are still important. The difference Granato has made over Renney is significant. But Granato's a bigger name amongst assistant coaches, so he may leave in not too long...unless we have success in the short run.

 

We need to find good people who are going to make an impact and stay for a bit. Get guys too good, and you'll have them for a year, maybe two, and then they are gone too.

 

Kenny Holland obviously sees something very positive in Blashill to pay him what he's paying him as an AHL coach. Yes, it was a hedge bet against Babs leaving, but he COULD have counted on getting a more elite coach once Babs bolted, and he didn't do that. And it's not like Blashill's coaching took a dive after he got the big AHL money. He's still competing for the Calder.

 

Is sustained success at lower levels as good as NHL success? Nope. But it IS something that will peak interest of quality young coaches looking for an opportunity to be a part of a successful run. There's potential here, so let's not assume it's gonna turn to pot just because the odds are it could.

[yave1964]

Datsyuk and Zetterberg are getting old fast and there aren't replacements in the pipeline. They have been a bubble team the last few years and Babs pushed them over the edge with a couple of Jack Adams worthy seasons. Detroit has a ton of 2-3 line players and no D. They don't have any elite players behind Pav and Z. Blashill will have to be among the top 3 coaches in the league to get in the playoffs. If he fails he will be run out of town as the 1st guy in 25 years to not get in. If you watched their series with Tampa you saw them compete strongly with a team that on paper is vastly superior. That's Babcock's influence. Odds are Blashill isn't as good.

Dude you act like the pipeline is bare. Dylan Larkin and Andreas Athanasiou are both top six centers with mad skill, both will be in Detroit within a year or so. I really think you are selling the Wings prospects short, we have more NHL ready players than nearly any other team and the top end prospects (Pulkinnen, Mrazek, Mantha, Larkin and Athanasiou among them) are the envy of the league. Players get old, youth must be served, the Wings will be fine.

[jammer2]

@yave1964  If I was a Wings fan, I wouldn't be worried about losing...but which wicked young talent is going to break through next. There is not even room for all the prospects, the young guys on the Wings now and 7 or 8 more very legit prospects ....they will inevitably have to trade away some of them, start the cycle again and get more picks for the guys that don't make it. The key here is Mrazek...he has clearly shown he is the goalie of the future, so that is a HUGE thing off Hollands to do list. Mrazek is only going to get better with more time in this league. Right about now, I wouldn't blame a Wings fan for being a little smug....heck...3rd rated prospects at Hockeyfutures....that is impressive. Have not looked to see which 2 teams are ahead of them, but I suspect Winnipeg is one them.

 

 I do agree with Cap on one thing....when Zetts and Pavs do hang them up, the Wings will might not have a 1st line center in the pipeline. Of course, there is time to address it, perhaps Andreas will rise up the ranks and develop quickly...and it does look like Sheahan will be on a steady upward rise for the foreseeable future...where do you see Sheahan fitting in long term?....a lot of stuff would need to happen...but there is an outside chance he could become a #1, stranger things have happened. Next year is huge for him, and we should get a much clearer read on his upside.

[SpikeDDS]

@yave1964 @Capsized @SpikeDDS-

 

I just don't see that happening in Toronto (anytime soon anyway, specifically with Spike's prediction of conference finals in 4 years - that's a bit aggressive).  

 

I'll give you a playoff berth in four years but admittedly, Brendan Shanahan has a LOT more work to do to make that little dream come true.

 

That only means winning two rounds. I think he can make that happen. I'm NOT saying they will WIN the conference title. Just clarifying my prediction. You can still say it's aggressive. You may very well be right. I just happen to believe that good leadership breeds success, and I think he can get more out of what he's even got currently than his predecessors have been able to. And Shanny will be shopping too, although there's only so much that he can do.

 

Having said that, he couldn't get the Wings to the conference finals toward the end here, even with the teams we had. I acknowledge that. I just think he changes the mentality of the front office of that franchise, he and Shanny. Babs smelled it when they interviewed him. 

[SpikeDDS]

@yave1964

 

Did you read that Blashill's planning to put Larkin between Mantha and Athanasiou next game? That should be VEEERRRY interesting.

[jammer2]

@SpikeDDS  Just curious....what do you think Sheahan's upside is?  I'm conflicted...I know he will get much better...just not sure how much.

[SpikeDDS]

@SpikeDDS Just curious....what do you think Sheahan's upside is? I'm conflicted...I know he will get much better...just not sure how much.

This may sound I don't like Sheahan, and I will tell you that that's not true, but having said that , I don't see him as a true top-line center. 2-line? Yes. I see him able to make other players better, but I just don't see the offensive powerhouse that is normally associated with a top-line center. If the question is "Who is gonna step up and replace Pav and Z?" I don't see Sheahan alone replacing Pav. He's not that dynamic. But could he replace Z? Maaaaybe, but that's a bit of a stretch.

I think he can certainly develop into a very dependable second line guy for sure if he works hard, and I can seed have m doing that. Putting top-line expectati bs on him is asking too much at this point IMHO.

But we should ask @yave1964 , he's usually more right than wrong and right now he's on a roll.

[SpikeDDS]

@SpikeDDS Just curious....what do you think Sheahan's upside is? I'm conflicted...I know he will get much better...just not sure how much.

This may sound I don't like Sheahan, and I will tell you that that's not true, but having said that , I don't see him as a true top-line center. 2-line? Yes. I see him able to make other players better, but I just don't see the offensive powerhouse that is normally associated with a top-line center. If the question is "Who is gonna step up and replace Pav and Z?" I don't see Sheahan alone replacing Pav. He's not that dynamic. But could he replace Z? Maaaaybe, but that's a bit of a stretch.

I think he can certainly develop into a very dependable second line guy for sure if he works hard, and I can seed have m doing that. Putting top-line expectati bs on him is asking too much at this point IMHO.

But we should ask @yave1964 , he's usually more right than wrong and right now he's on a roll.

[yave1964]

@yave1964

 

Did you read that Blashill's planning to put Larkin between Mantha and Athanasiou next game? That should be VEEERRRY interesting.

THRILLED with that, Mantha has one goal in the postseason and has looked lost, with two ridiculously skilled players on his line that should change. Thrilled to see the three of them together on one line, they could be the future of the Wings.

Andy Miele is simply killing it with the Griffs, I know he is considered one of those guys who is too small and gets pushed around but he is setting up Pulkinnen like a pro.

@jammer2

My opinion is Sheahan is what he is, a solid third liner who can help on the power play or P/K but that is about it. A top six role is going to be a stretch. I think the Wings have gotten all out of him that he has to offer. I love the guy, I rank him in the top ten 3rd line centers in the league, as a matter of fact, Pavel, Z, Telly Tubby and Glendening give the Wings a fantastic middle.

That said, now that Babs is gone, I think that Weiss is going to be a number two with Z moving to the Wing next year. Babs simply hated the guy and buried him. I think that he will get going next year. It is possible, short term that Weiss centers the third line and Sheahan moves up to number two but I think if so, before long Sheahan will be back in his perfect role as a number three.

[yave1964]

@SpikeDDS

I was posting right along with you, and great minds think alike.

[jammer2]

@yave1964  I see some hidden offensive potential in Sheahan, but who knows, it can go either way. I would definately try him out in a top 6 role and see how he handles the responsibility. Sometimes, you never know with these kids unless you give them chance...ie scoring linemates and offensive zone starts etc.