2nd greatest bruin (post expansion)

[ruxpin]

Sell me on Bucyk

Oh, now you did it.

[JagerMeister]

I don't know Bucyk, but he did not appear to be a standout player by any means. Definitely has the career though. 22 years or so? But none of them did he appear to be the best at his position.

 

Bourque is the only one who who beats Lidstrom out in how many Elite years he had(By a comfortable margin) and he WAS the bruins for 20+ years, so I dunno.

 

Sell me on Bucyk

Thats debatable, 

 

Points 

1962-63 NHL 66 (7)

1964-65 NHL 55 (9)

1967-68 NHL 69 (9)

1970-71 NHL 116 (3)

1971-72 NHL 83 (8)

1972-73 NHL 93 (7)

Career NHL 1369 (24)

 

Goals 

1962-63 NHL 27 (9)

1964-65 NHL 26 (6)

1967-68 NHL 30 (9)

1970-71 NHL 51 (2)

1972-73 NHL 40 (9)

Career NHL 556 (26)

 

Assists 

1958-59 NHL 36 (9)

1961-62 NHL 40 (7)

1962-63 NHL 39 (10)

1970-71 NHL 65 (3)

1971-72 NHL 51 (8)

Career NHL 813 (28)

 

Do these combination of point, assist and goal finishes not stand out? Going off of this data, he was elite in all offensive aspects of the game. 

 

in 1970-71 he was third in scoring, with only Esposito and Orr ahead of him in points. They don't appear to be left wingers...

however, thats the only year he was unanimously the best left winger. The rest of his prime though he was always among the best.

[J0e Th0rnton]

Thats debatable, 

 

Points 

1962-63 NHL 66 (7)

1964-65 NHL 55 (9)

1967-68 NHL 69 (9)

1970-71 NHL 116 (3)

1971-72 NHL 83 (8)

1972-73 NHL 93 (7)

Career NHL 1369 (24)

 

Goals 

1962-63 NHL 27 (9)

1964-65 NHL 26 (6)

1967-68 NHL 30 (9)

1970-71 NHL 51 (2)

1972-73 NHL 40 (9)

Career NHL 556 (26)

 

Assists 

1958-59 NHL 36 (9)

1961-62 NHL 40 (7)

1962-63 NHL 39 (10)

1970-71 NHL 65 (3)

1971-72 NHL 51 (8)

Career NHL 813 (28)

 

Do these combination of point, assist and goal finishes not stand out? Going off of this data, he was elite in all offensive aspects of the game. 

 

in 1970-71 he was third in scoring, with only Esposito and Orr ahead of him in points. They don't appear to be left wingers...

however, thats the only year he was unanimously the best left winger. The rest of his prime though he was always among the best.

I have a hard time ranking scoring back then. Being top 10 in categories is an accomplishment in a post 6 team era once most team established themselves. But when it was only 6 teams, I am not sure how much 9th place is regarded, etc

 

Another thing is, how awful those expansion teams were, and how suddenly Bucyk went from being a 55-70 point guy to 90-100 once Esposito and Orr hit the scene. In fairness, I have the same problem with Espo since my Dad insists Orr deserved the Hart just about every year and inflated people's numbers with his unparalleled possession game.

 

In any case, Bucyk was often 7th-9th in scoring, so that's something. But Bourque was usually no less than top 3 Among all defensemen in the league(And oftentimes, was robbed of Norris trophies by less deserving candidates). In an era when defense was more stacked than any other time in History with Hall of famers and Elite players.

[yave1964]

Espo when he went through his six years in a row of leading the league in scoring earned the nickname 'The Babe Ruth of Hockey. He was the first ever player to score 100 point or 60 goals or 70 goals. His Boston career was short or I would have easily went for him over Bourque. I still go back and forth, If Orr's shortened career is not held against him and his massive hardware is enough to put him over the top, well, the same could easily be argued for the Babe Ruth of Hockey.

Bucyk was one of those steadyplayers who puinch the clock every year and put up consistnet numbers, He never was a league leader bot for two decades he was sold, unspectacular but bordered on being a star. Top ten many times with his numbers, just a brilliant player.

I still went Bourque for the reasons that Joe listed, my top four would be

Orr

Bourque

Esposito

Bucyk

And I would take any of them any day of the week.

[jammer2]

@J0e Th0rnton  I have always been a huge Bucyk fan. He was always hanging around the top 10 in scoring. Probably his best attribute was his leadership skills. Easily one of the great captains of all time in my books. Lead by example, teammates respected the hell out of him because he just never stopped working. Tremendous skater, very nice wrist shot. Trying to remember his linemates, pretty sure it was Ken Hodge and Wayne Cashman.

 

  Johnny played at a high level for a very long time, 22 years with a lot of playoff time thrown in there as well. He always seemed to come up big when it mattered most. To be honest, Bourque had a higher skill level, but Bucyk had all the intangibles. Great on draws (even though he was a LW, he did take a lot of draws), one of the best ever at positioning in all 3 zones. Highly disciplined, he would ALWAYS give you an honest blood and guts effort.

 

 When Johnny retired, he was the highest scoring LW in NHL history. He is well known for his 418 consecutive games played, starting back in 69 and lasted 7 years....during one of the hardest hitting era in NHL history.

 

 Johnny was never considered the best at his position, mostly because he played at the same time as Bobby Hull and Frank Mahovlich.

 

 If I had a buck for every time Johnny lined an opponent up for one of his patented hip checks, I'd be retired. In an odd twist though, despite throwing MANY crunching body checks, he actually won the Lady Byng....so clean but devastating hits.

 

 When the Hockey News came out with their famous top 100 players of all time a few years back, he ranked #45.

 

 In an era where 20 goal seasons really meant something, he totaled 16 of them...quite the impressive achievement. He still holds the record for oldest player to score 50 goals....he did that last when he was the ripe old age of 35.

 

 When the Bruins won the cup in 2011, he got his name engraved on the cup again, having done it twice as a player (captain for both of those cup wins). 2011 marked his 53rd season being affiliated with the Bruins....that is incredible!!!

 

 To this very day, he has the most games played by any Bruin in history and also holds the most goals mark at 565.

[jammer2]

  Bucyk was actually drafted by the Red Wings. He was a slow starter, only scored 11 goals in almost 100 games for the Wings.....then *it* happened. Perhaps *the* most lopsided trade in NHL history. The Wings moved him to Boston in return for a very past his prime and aging Terry Sawchuck. Terry was a shadow of his former self, and Johnny went on to score 500+ goals and captain his team to 2 Stanley Cup victories.

[yave1964]

Bucyk was actually drafted by the Red Wings. He was a slow starter, only scored 11 goals in almost 100 games for the Wings.....then *it* happened. Perhaps *the* most lopsided trade in NHL history. The Wings moved him to Boston in return for a very past his prime and aging Terry Sawchuck. Terry was a shadow of his former self, and Johnny went on to score 500+ goals and captain his team to 2 Stanley Cup victories.

It was a horrible deal but I beg to differ that Sawchuk was aging and past his prime. He managed to stick around for another 14 years, winning a couple of cups with the Leafs and all, the problem was the Wings were slipping as a group, Boot nose Abel was past his prime, Montreal came on and won five in a row, sawchuk bounced from Detroit to the Leafs and Kings and Rangers as his own worst enemy before his untimely death, but after the Bucyk deal he won a couple more Vezina's, was top five in the Hart voting three more times. His career record post trade from Boston was 216-202-88 on a mixed bag of clubs.

Let me be clear, Bucyk deserves credit as a great player with over 500 career goals and a long career mostly with boston, but his hardware case POST TRADE still does not come close to measuring up to what Sawchuk did after the deal. Bucyk for his entire career was a first team all star once, 2nd team once and twice won the Bing. That is it, not a bad total but even after the trade and his demons were battling him as much as the opponents were, Sawchuk still had more great years than Bucyk did.

The difference however is Bucyk was like punching a clock, you knew he was going to put up around 25-30 goals a year back when that still counted for something, five times each he was top ten in goals, assists and points. Like a fine wine he aged well and his numbers actually went up towards the end of his career instead of down creating the illusion that he was better in his thirties. The truth was scoring went up and he had mates like Orr and Espo around him.

So Bucyk was steady as a rock, every year, never a superstar but always in the level just below. And Sawchuk?

When he was good and wrestled his mental issues to a draw you couldn't fire a pea past him. His first year back in Detroit he played every second of every single game. By the time he was 39 and winning his final cup with the Leafs as a part timer he went 15-5-4.

But when his demons were defeating him, well, he went 23-36-8 his second season back in Detroit. He had seasons of 14-21-8 and 11-14-6. When he was bad, he was downright awful. And a bad teammate as well. Story after story is out there of his mates keeping a weary eye out on him at all times.

so the Wings dominated the first half of the fifties and then dealt Sawchuk to make way for Glen Hall who turned out to be an all time great. Then they gave up on Hall too early and legitimely brought back Sawchuk when his demons made him too unreliable. And the cost to get him back was Bucyk who went on to a long career as one of the most respected players ever. Hall won the Calder as a rookie and then was a first team All Star in his second year before he along with Ted Lindsey were given to Chicago because of their role in attempting to start a players union.

So in 1955 the Wings had Sawchuk, Hall (who went on to earn the nickname Mr. Hockey and Bucyk chomping at the bit ready to earn his playing time. Within a few years Hall and Bucyk were gone and Sawchuk was still brilliant and would be for another fifteen years but was not the superstar that he had once been.

[JackStraw]

Trying to remember his linemates, pretty sure it was Ken Hodge and Wayne Cashman.

 

Pretty sure he was on the 2nd line. Hodge, Espo, Cashman was the big line.

[JackStraw]

So in 1955 the Wings had Sawchuk, Hall (who went on to earn the nickname Mr. Hockey

 

I think you mean "Mr Goalie". "Mr Hockey" was some other guy who played for Detroit.  

[yave1964]

I think you mean "Mr Goalie". "Mr Hockey" was some other guy who played for Detroit.  

Yep Mr. Goalie, lol.