2023-24 Phantoms/Flyer prospects

[GratefulFlyers]

On 7/30/2023 at 10:53 AM, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

He's a mental nightmare. He doesn't deal with adversity and when things are going bad in a game, he doesn't battle, he gives up. He's easy to rattle and he's easy to knock off focus.

If this is your impression from watching the games I respect your opinion but I don’t share it. Early last season Hart was the reason the Flyers won any games at all. True the Ws only hurt the Flyers on draft day but that’s another story. If he was really the spineless quitter you describe here don’t you think everyone would know it by now? 

 

I won’t worry about Hart or try to evaluate him (or Sanheim or TK, York, Frost etc.) until the Flyers are further along in the rebuild. Briere has made some progress but obviously there’s a long way to go before the Flyers are legit Cup competitors. 
 

Anyway what would you get for him? Let’s revisit the topic at the TD. At that point if the Flyers appear to be as far away as ever then maybe trade Hart for picks. But if things are looking up? No way unless the offer is too good to refuse.

[MaineFlyFan]

https://www.nhl.com/news/world-junior-summer-showcase-day-2-notebook/c-345475972?tid=281266438

 

Short write-up on Gauthier...

 

"

Gauthier resumes development at World Junior Summer Showcase

Forward skates for U.S. after skipping Flyers camp"

[OccamsRazor]

Could this kid shock us all this upcoming season?? I think so...

 

 

[OccamsRazor]

 

[OccamsRazor]

Well so much for going to Vermont.

 

Guess we'll see how this goes.

[OccamsRazor]

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

On 7/31/2023 at 12:36 PM, GratefulFlyers said:

If this is your impression from watching the games I respect your opinion but I don’t share it. Early last season Hart was the reason the Flyers won any games at all. True the Ws only hurt the Flyers on draft day but that’s another story. If he was really the spineless quitter you describe here don’t you think everyone would know it by now? 

 

I won’t worry about Hart or try to evaluate him (or Sanheim or TK, York, Frost etc.) until the Flyers are further along in the rebuild. Briere has made some progress but obviously there’s a long way to go before the Flyers are legit Cup competitors. 
 

Anyway what would you get for him? Let’s revisit the topic at the TD. At that point if the Flyers appear to be as far away as ever then maybe trade Hart for picks. But if things are looking up? No way unless the offer is too good to refuse.

 

If the season were determined in the first 10 to 15 games, Hart is a championship caliber goalie. I don't deny that. Once you cross that 15 game threshold, watch what happens to him. He slowly begins to unravel. It usually starts by giving up a weak goal and then he'll be sharp and then he'll give up a weak goal, then he'll be sharp again and finally lets in a back breaker. And it gets worse. There's usually a good game or two thrown in there, but for the most part, from game 20 to game 60, you can count on Hart falling apart, then he suffers a mysterious injury, then he comes back, gets into the same funk, gets hurt again and then by the time the season is over, Hart steps up his game and looks all world. I'm not asking for Hart to be a perennial all world goaltender. I want some consistency, not a guessing game of which Hart we're going to get. IF Hart can maintain a .915 save percentage and a 2.50 GAA, I'll change my mind. That would put him 14th in the league in terms of goaltending stats. That's fair and not unreasonable to ask for.

[flyercanuck]

12 hours ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

 

If the season were determined in the first 10 to 15 games, Hart is a championship caliber goalie. I don't deny that. Once you cross that 15 game threshold, watch what happens to him. He slowly begins to unravel. It usually starts by giving up a weak goal and then he'll be sharp and then he'll give up a weak goal, then he'll be sharp again and finally lets in a back breaker. And it gets worse. There's usually a good game or two thrown in there, but for the most part, from game 20 to game 60, you can count on Hart falling apart, then he suffers a mysterious injury, then he comes back, gets into the same funk, gets hurt again and then by the time the season is over, Hart steps up his game and looks all world. I'm not asking for Hart to be a perennial all world goaltender. I want some consistency, not a guessing game of which Hart we're going to get. IF Hart can maintain a .915 save percentage and a 2.50 GAA, I'll change my mind. That would put him 14th in the league in terms of goaltending stats. That's fair and not unreasonable to ask for.

 

You know what else is not unreasonable to ask for? That your GM doesn't try to collect all the worst defencemen in their own end in the entire league.

 

Or build the team around one of the slowest, laziest players in the game. 

 

Ya, those two things could help a goalie.

Edited August 7, 2023 by flyercanuck

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

On 8/7/2023 at 6:34 AM, flyercanuck said:

 

You know what else is not unreasonable to ask for? That your GM doesn't try to collect all the worst defencemen in their own end in the entire league.

 

Or build the team around one of the slowest, laziest players in the game. 

 

Ya, those two things could help a goalie.

 

I'm more than willing to concede that the defense isn't stellar and that Hayes was someone not to build around. At the same time, there's nothing wrong with saying that Hart simply hasn't delivered. He has had one good season in his career. One. Once again, not asking for an all world performance, but pedestrian would be acceptable.

[flyercanuck]

1 hour ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

 

I'm more than willing to concede that the defense isn't stellar and that Hayes was someone not to build around. At the same time, there's nothing wrong with saying that Hart simply hasn't delivered. He has had one good season in his career. One. Once again, not asking for an all world performance, but pedestrian would be acceptable.

 

I won't disagree that he hasn't been great...but he's pretty good when there isn't a complete joke playing in front of him. I would like to see what he could do with a decent team.

[Lindbergh31]

2 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

 

I won't disagree that he hasn't been great...but he's pretty good when there isn't a complete joke playing in front of him. I would like to see what he could do with a decent team.

It's the same old story the goalie is either the hero or the goat! Hart is pretty good and it would be more obvious if he did have a decent team in front of him, he was responsible for a lot of the Flyers wins last year. Unfortunately, under Briere's plan I don't think Hart will be around to see the completion of the rebuild.

[GratefulFlyers]

12 hours ago, Lindbergh31 said:

Unfortunately, under Briere's plan I don't think Hart will be around to see the completion of the rebuild.

Would you care to elaborate? I’m not disputing it I’m curious. I don’t get the feeling Briere is going for an accelerated rebuild (thank god). On the other hand he hasn’t been complacent either. It doesn’t look like he’s anticipating a decade-long rebuild. 
 

Hart turns 25 this Sunday so barring injury he’s got another 5 years minimum playing NHL hockey. He may play until he’s 35.

 

Before I trade him I want to see how he plays with a decent roster in front of him. Decent that’s all. Minus Hayes, JVR and DeAngelo the Flyers should be decent next year. At least they should be motivated to give their teammates an honest game. That alone will be a huge difference. If that happens (and I expect it will) Hart may benefit the most and his Save%, if nothing else numbers-wise, should improve.

 

 

[Lindbergh31]

54 minutes ago, GratefulFlyers said:

Would you care to elaborate? I’m not disputing it I’m curious. I don’t get the feeling Briere is going for an accelerated rebuild (thank god). On the other hand he hasn’t been complacent either. It doesn’t look like he’s anticipating a decade-long rebuild. 
 

Hart turns 25 this Sunday so barring injury he’s got another 5 years minimum playing NHL hockey. He may play until he’s 35.

 

Before I trade him I want to see how he plays with a decent roster in front of him. Decent that’s all. Minus Hayes, JVR and DeAngelo the Flyers should be decent next year. At least they should be motivated to give their teammates an honest game. That alone will be a huge difference. If that happens (and I expect it will) Hart may benefit the most and his Save%, if nothing else numbers-wise, should improve.

 

 

I agree Briere isn't going for an accelerated rebuild, I believe he wants to strip it down to the bare bones and start from scratch. If that's the case based on other goalies who have played in their 30's I think Hart has at least 10 good seasons in him which brings him to the age of 35. So the question is does Briere want to waste 4 or 5 years of Hart's career during the rebuild or trade him to get assets to help the rebuild. Lots of goalies don't come into their own until the age of 25 so that's the age Hart is at now, personally I hope they don't trade him and let him grow with the young group but hey I'm just a fan who posts on the fan forum so what do I know.

[GratefulFlyers]

On 8/9/2023 at 12:42 PM, Lindbergh31 said:

personally I hope they don't trade him and let him grow with the young group

 

Me too. And considering it's the Flyers, with their history in net, it's a relief (and a huge advantage) that goaltending won't be much of a concern while they're rebuilding. Hart (and Ersson) will provide some much-needed stability while the rest of the roster is in flux.

[Brewin Flames]

Flyers sign No. 22 overall pick Oliver Bonk to 3-year deal

• Reuters

Aug 21, 2023, 01:21 PM ET

The Philadelphia Flyers signed defenseman Oliver Bonk, their first-round pick in the 2023 NHL Draft, to a three-year, entry-level contract on Monday.

 

The team did not announce any financial terms.

 

Bonk, 18, was the No. 22 overall pick in the June draft, and he took part in the team's development camp the following month.

 

He spent the 2022-23 season with the London Knights of the Ontario Hockey League and posted 40 points (10 goals, 30 assists) in 67 games. A native of Ottawa, Bonk has 43 points (10 goals, 33 assists) and 44 penalty minutes in 77 games with the Knights over two seasons.

 

Bonk added 12 points (one goal, 11 assists) and eight penalty minutes in 28 playoff games with the Knights.

[OccamsRazor]

Another Stout draft will do nicely to stuffer the prospect coffers... 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

On 8/22/2023 at 5:30 PM, OccamsRazor said:

Another Stout draft will do nicely to stuffer the prospect coffers... 

If they don't end up with 1 or 2 and if he's available, I want Sam Dickinson. Give me another defenseman from a real good program in London. He's got size, skating, physical ability and incredible hockey IQ. He's going to get a huge role this year and he's going to play in all situations. He and Bonk will make great cornerstones. 

[OccamsRazor]

From reports this kid is finally healthy and playing well. I expect him to help big time the adding physical presence to the bottom 6 and some needed toughness.

 

 

May not ever amount to much more than a AHLer NHL pinch call up.

 

However should be huge in helping them make the playoffs and push deep.

[GratefulFlyers]

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

May not ever amount to much more than a AHLer NHL pinch call up.

Weren’t people talking about him as a can’t-miss, or at least a very promising prospect a couple years back? I forgot all about him. 

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, GratefulFlyers said:

Weren’t people talking about him as a can’t-miss, or at least a very promising prospect a couple years back? I forgot all about him. 

 

I think a few had high expectations due to some play they seen in juniors.

 

But i sort of had a few too maybe a good fit on a 4th line at least.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

I think a few had high expectations due to some play they seen in juniors.

 

But i sort of had a few too maybe a good fit on a 4th line at least.

Wisdom scored 59 points in 62 games his draft year and then 38 points in 43 games in his D+2 year with Kingston. Add in an incredible physical presence with superb forechecking and two-way skills, plus a work ethic like no tomorrow, and he was at the very least a potential 20 goal, bottom six, two-way winger with a very heavy physical game. Yeah, there's legit 20 goal upside and incredibly underrated hands. Once again, it's going to come down to Flyer development. Do they concentrate on developing the skill he has or do they focus on Wisdom just playing a physical game? To me, it's a no brainer that you develop the skill because he knows how to play physical, but this is the Flyers we're talking about. Development over the years has pretty much ignored developing skill. It was all role based. If they allow Wisdom to develop his skill in Lehigh Valley, that adds another dimension to his game. I'm hopeful Briere and Alyn McCauley understand this. I think Wisdom can be a very good player for us.

[OccamsRazor]

On 9/19/2023 at 10:32 PM, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

Wisdom scored 59 points in 62 games his draft year and then 38 points in 43 games in his D+2 year with Kingston. Add in an incredible physical presence with superb forechecking and two-way skills, plus a work ethic like no tomorrow, and he was at the very least a potential 20 goal, bottom six, two-way winger with a very heavy physical game. Yeah, there's legit 20 goal upside and incredibly underrated hands. Once again, it's going to come down to Flyer development. Do they concentrate on developing the skill he has or do they focus on Wisdom just playing a physical game? To me, it's a no brainer that you develop the skill because he knows how to play physical, but this is the Flyers we're talking about. Development over the years has pretty much ignored developing skill. It was all role based. If they allow Wisdom to develop his skill in Lehigh Valley, that adds another dimension to his game. I'm hopeful Briere and Alyn McCauley understand this. I think Wisdom can be a very good player for us.

 

Well good news...

 

...spots may become available.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Well good news...

 

...spots may become available.

As it should be. This franchise for the longest of time has had a large number of players that had an attitude of complacency and entitlement that it's good to see a coach come in and say "not gonna happen - you need to earn your spot." It's kind of refreshing.

[OccamsRazor]

 

Edited September 23, 2023 by OccamsRazor

[OccamsRazor]

Great start for the kid...