Why cant Sens beat Pittsburgh?

[Buffalo Rick]

I just dont get it? Ottawa has played very well this year and way over their heads. Pittsburgh has been lucky much of the time and I just do not for the life of me knkow why Ottawa just cant seem to beat them. The Sabres I will use as a measuring stick. We cant beat Ottawa this year. Pittsburgh we handled pretty well. Including sweeping them on their ice. i think Ottawa simply believes they cant beat them? There is no reason to think they cant beat them on paper.

[Polaris922]

Pretty big talent disparity bud. And the Pens were guilty of not taking your Sabres seriously and your Sabres had nothing to lose. This is the playoffs... The Islanders MAY have woke the Pens up. We'll get a better feel for that Friday.

[ruxpin]

I just dont get it? Ottawa has played very well this year and way over their heads. Pittsburgh has been lucky much of the time and I just do not for the life of me knkow why Ottawa just cant seem to beat them. The Sabres I will use as a measuring stick. We cant beat Ottawa this year. Pittsburgh we handled pretty well. Including sweeping them on their ice. i think Ottawa simply believes they cant beat them? There is no reason to think they cant beat them on paper.

Honestly, HJ, it's because they really aren't in the same league.

They've done a nice job as a team this year battling through injuries, etc. So give credit when due. But they have a horrible offense. Anderson--and give some credit to the defense--has gotten them here. But they just simply need more offense if they're going to compete with the Pens.

I really think the Sens faced the best possible matchup in the first round. With the very possible exception of Washington, I think Montreal loses a seven game series against any playoff team in the east. They're just one big hot mess that starts with a really poor choice of a coach.

The Pens are not Montreal. The best the Sens can hope for is that something happens to Vokoun (physically or mentally) and Pitt has to go back to Fleury. At that point, all bets are off. But until then, the Sens really should be reserving tee times.

[Polaris922]

@ruxpin

And unfortunately for the Sens, the Pens have abused Anderson like a two bit hooker since he came into the league. There are some goaltenders who just don't perform we'll against certain teams.

[flyercanuck]

@Polaris922

You mean like Fleury and Bryzgalov against teams in the playoffs?

[ruxpin]

There are some goaltenders who just don't perform we'll against NHL teams.

True. But let's leave Bryz out of this.

[Polaris922]

@Polaris922

You mean like Fleury and Bryzgalov against teams in the playoffs?

Sure seems it these days huh??

[nossagog]

I would not go as far as saying they can't beat them, it just has to be the how to beat them. They're not going to beat them trying to run and gun. I think they are going to try to play on the edge of legality with the hitting, and see if the Pens get caught responding. If the Senators get their power play going, it could be a whole different ball game.

[Polaris922]

I just dont get it? Ottawa has played very well this year and way over their heads. Pittsburgh has been lucky much of the time and I just do not for the life of me knkow why Ottawa just cant seem to beat them. The Sabres I will use as a measuring stick. We cant beat Ottawa this year. Pittsburgh we handled pretty well. Including sweeping them on their ice. i think Ottawa simply believes they cant beat them? There is no reason to think they cant beat them on paper.

Something else to think about... you said the Pens were lucky this year. I beg to differ. I don't see a 15 game win streak, the majority of which were 1 goal games, as lucky. I don't think you go 36 and 12 being lucky. The Pens dominated Ottawa. The Pens dominated pretty much every team they faced in the season. It's not like they were a fluke getting where they are. Now having said that... maybe the appropriate question to ask is...

How on earth did the Sabres beat the Pens twice this year? Now THAT is a puzzling question.

[B21]

And we beat them soundly. On their ice we swept them. And we did not do too badly vs Boston either. I think the East is weak. The teams left. There are many teams sitting home that could have just as easily have made it if not for some bad luck. The Flyers and /Sabres are both on that list. I think the West teams are better and Chicago or LA can take care of whoever gets there. The Rangers look horrendous as a unit

I think you are putting way to much stock in a couple of wins. Carolina beat you 6-3, 3-1 and 4-3. So are they better than the Sabres despite their finishing 6 points below you? You were also 1-2 against Florida who finished dead last. 0-3 against Winnipeg who finished next to dead last.

The Flyers and your Sabres weren't unlucky. They were bad. Just like the Pens and Bruins were good. Very good.

Luck is nice but luck doesn't win you the conference by 9 points in a shortened season nor does bad luck have you finishing 7 points out of a playoff spot.

[Polaris922]

The East is weak? Maybe the lower half was... The Pens challenged for the President's Trophy despite Chicago's great start and major injury time. I fail to see how that equates to weak.

[ruxpin]

The Flyers and your Sabres weren't unlucky. They were bad.

I won't comment on the Sabres, but that statement is very true regarding the Flyers.

[ruxpin]

The East is weak? Maybe the lower half was... The Pens challenged for the President's Trophy despite Chicago's great start and major injury time. I fail to see how that equates to weak.

I don't agree that the East is weak, but the challenging for the president's trophy thing doesn't necessarily argue the point. (notice "necessarily." I'll allow that it CAN). Since the two conferences didn't play each other at all and there isn't any head-to-head or common opponents to base a claim on, it's difficult this year to make a claim either way. Yeah, Pitt can have almost as good a record as Chicago but one could make the argument it was built against weaker opponents. I wouldn't necessarily agree with that, but one could.

I think a shortened season makes the discussion even more difficult.

But in both east and west, I think there really were 2 teams in each that were bonafide "strong" teams and then a significant drop off. And then a handful of teams before another drop off to the cellar teams.

I think any comparison between the two conferences, this year, has to be based solely upon one's preference for style. I prefer the eastern style, so I'd argue that way myself. I just don't think it's a quantifiable argument.

[Polaris922]

@ruxpin

I've actually argued the west is weak in years past. There would always be two or three powerhouse teams then a significant drop to the rest. The east seems like a barroom brawl most seasons, with tight races and games full of rivalries and aggression.

[ruxpin]

@ruxpin

I've actually argued the west is weak in years past. There would always be two or three powerhouse teams then a significant drop to the rest. The east seems like a barroom brawl most seasons, with tight races and games full of rivalries and aggression.

I have argued the same. But--and this is strictly me here--MY argument on east vs. west should be taken with a significant amount of grainage because I see a lot more of the east than I do of the west. Even in a "normal" year. The largest part of my west "intel" is based on highlight reels, stats, box scores, standings, etc. and is very limited in firsthand knowledge. (FC, if you're reading this, SHUT UP).

I suppose it could be argued that the east is a barroom brawl because they're all fairly equally mediocre, but I don't personally buy that argument. And, like I said, this year there was no inter-conference play so no head-to-head or common opponents to base any real opinion on this year.

I personally like Eastern style of play better, so I'm in your camp that east > west. But I also think east/west style differences are a little overblown, too.

Anyway, long post to explain that I agree with you.

[ruxpin]

and games full of rivalries and aggression.

I agree with this. I wonder if this is at least partially due to the closer proximity of eastern fan bases...generally speaking.

[B21]

We played carolina early in the season. And Florida too. We were still under Ruff then. Things were different than when we beat Pittsburgh. We and your Flyers are not as bad as you think. Just not our years. I think both will bounce back with a vengeance. But many big moves must be made in the coming month. And some are very important in Buffalo. Like, getting contracts for Miller, Vanek and Ott.

My bad. 0-1 against Carolina post-Ruff. 1-1 against Florida. Still 0-3 against Winnipeg. So 1-4 against the two worst teams in the league after Ruff was fired.

Congratulations on going 2-1 versus the Pens though. You lost 4-3 in February. Ended the 15 game winning streak when they were kinda...due?....for a loss. And then won the next to last game of the season when they had clinched everything they could clinch.

Want to keep playing?

if I am picking a team for a bounce-back year I'll take "my" Flyers over the Sabres.

[hf101]

LOL .....

@Hockey Junkie, note B21 is a Penguins FAN

[ruxpin]

LOL .....

@Hockey Junkie, note B21 is a Penguins FAN

Damn you. That coulda been fun.

[B21]

Damn you. That coulda been fun.

Maybe the Slovak flag isn't the dead giveaway I thought it would be.

[ruxpin]

We now can see Pittsburgh has major flaws,.

Hey, how are ya?

I think "major flaws" is probably a better statement than "not that good."

I still think they're pretty good but it's clear that they still have chinks in the armor that can be manipulated by a good (very good) and disciplined team.

Unless by "not that good" you simply meant "not good enough to play against" the type of team I just mentioned. Then yeah.

Gotta tell you I'm shocked...stunned...by the Pens in this series. I think you called that one going in if I remember correctly. I just really thought they had themselves together a bit more than they apparently do. Plus, some credit needs to go to Boston so far.

[DaGreatGazoo]

I think the balance of power and the entire axis of the NHL will shift out West if the rumors are true and Miller gets traded to Phoenix.

[B21]

I would not make judgements until I see what moves are made next months. Many are coming. And we now see Pittsburgh is not that good

So winning the East by what...10 points?....and getting to the ECF is "not that good"? "Major flaws"? Wow. If those words describe the Pens, I may need to invent new ones to describe the Sabres.

Atrociouslyawfulsuckagenessofmonumentallymonumentalproportions.

HorrificallyballsweatslobbingdregsletspayVilleLeinolikehesCrosbyness.

Yeah. That works.

[ruxpin]

So winning the East by what...10 points?....and getting to the ECF is "not that good"? "Major flaws"? Wow.

I get your point. Out of context (the way *I* meant it anyway) "major flaws" is ridiculous. But it IS a major flaw that there seems to be a pattern of how to get in their heads. It's only a handful of teams that can back up that first ingredient with enough skill to take advantage of it, so if the Pens draw correctly they're fine. And they're good enough on straight up talent to be in any serious contention conversation..and they'll continue to be. But if they lose this series, the flaw is major enough to have cost them what could have been a really good time. They need to correct that.

Not to take anything away from Boston. It takes a pretty good effort to do what they've done. Not any team could have. But the "flaw" has proven fatal for the Pens several years in a row now.

And I don't mean any offense to someone like you who's clearly a good fan of the team.

[B21]

I get your point. Out of context (the way *I* meant it anyway) "major flaws" is ridiculous. But it IS a major flaw that there seems to be a pattern of how to get in their heads. It's only a handful of teams that can back up that first ingredient with enough skill to take advantage of it, so if the Pens draw correctly they're fine. And they're good enough on straight up talent to be in any serious contention conversation..and they'll continue to be. But if they lose this series, the flaw is major enough to have cost them what could have been a really good time. They need to correct that.

Not to take anything away from Boston. It takes a pretty good effort to do what they've done. Not any team could have. But the "flaw" has proven fatal for the Pens several years in a row now.

And I don't mean any offense to someone like you who's clearly a good fan of the team.

No offense taken. Just having some "fun" with Clueless.