Commander Clueless Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Now I know what you are thinking: is this a rant thread? Absolutely! Who doesn't love a good rant thread? I'd like to preface this by saying that Mr. Burke did some good in Toronto, starting with a franchise that was almost beyond help and taking it to actually having some respectable young talent on it. Now that the positive stuff is out of the way, it's time for the fun stuff. I realize we are less than ten games into the season, but I can't help but look over at Calgary and compare them to the struggling Buds. Brian Burke, while not technically GM, has had a hand in shaping that franchise's rebuild. Now the Leafs have some decent young guys, but the Flames are being built the way Burkie said he'd build the Leafs. Strength down the middle (Monahan, Bennett as recent draftees), strong defense (Giordano is awesome and Brodie is looking better and better), and goaltending (okay so maybe they need some work in that department). Obviously Calgary isn't out of the woods yet, but it looks like Burke might actually be championing a rebuild according to his own plan. So what happened with Toronto? Impatience? Corporate mandate? Temporary insanity? Well, I can't be sure, but I do have a thought: Shanahan is hiring all sorts of stats and scouting guys (Dubas and Hunter), but maybe what he should be looking for is the best psychics and voodoo masters money can buy. We really need to find out what curse is on this team, and then figure out how to remove it before we have any chance of doing anything useful. My main question to you, the faithful followers of the sport that is hockey - what in the world compelled Burke to go against his own designs for how to build a team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishjim Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 its simple the pressure to win now is greater in toronto then it is in calgary. hence bad signings and i bet an owner that puts in his/her/their 2 cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Clueless Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 @Irishjim But isn't that why they brought in Burke to begin with? A tough guy who wouldn't let the fans and media get to him who would build a team his way? If all that is true, all I have to say to that is good luck Shanahan, because you've got a heck of a job apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JR Ewing Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Ah, don't worry too too much about it. All matters of what goes in Toronto aside, Calgary has been terrible this year. They have the 2nd worst Corsi% (43%) in the league, but the 5th highest GF% (60%) in the league as well. Only one team has had fewer offensive zone starts than Calgary. They're tied for 1st in PDO. Their goalie with a career SV% of .916 is currently sitting at .948..... None of this is even close to sustainable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammer2 Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 @Commander Clueless I love the start of your post, crafted like a internet veteran. State the potential arguements that dissenters can have and then basically dismiss them. This can actually save a thread from useless banter and get things off the intended topic. Admitting that Burke did some good and added a few quality youngsters is not only true, it avoids the thread turning into a fiasco. Agreed with the basic premise though, Burke did a lot more harm than good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Clueless Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 @JR Ewing Hmm...winning with bad Corsi...that sounds vaguely familiar. I sense a Brian Burke 18-wheeler comment incoming. I agree with you, and obviously the early starts of both teams have a skewed effect on the fan emotions, and I would be surprised if the Flames maintained this position in the standings. But even if you put the standings aside, it pains me a little bit to see Burke (mostly) building Calgary following his stated formula for team building, while he did the exact opposite in Toronto. I readily admit that my views are most likely influenced by the fact that I am a biased fan who is upset by his team's perpetual struggle to even be mediocre, much less good. @jammer2 I fully acknowledge that there are some positives in there somewhere, but this is a topic for negativity, damnit! Optimism will not be tolerated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wharf61 Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 The last thing I would want to do is help the Leafs but my suggestion would be to open the Ballard Bunker at Maple Leaf Gardens and perform an exorcism to release the spirits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihabs1993 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 @Commander CluelessGreat post!I have always been a firm believer that the Toronto Maple Leafs are the Verruca Salt of the hockey world. Ever see Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory? "I want the world! I want the WHOLE WORLD!" When Toronto sees someone they want, they put aside whatever long term goal they have in place to satisfy their need; their desire for what's right in front of them. Take for example the infamous Phil Kessel trade. It appeared that the Leafs were "going for it" when this move was made, but the team was nowhere close to that level of playoff contention, let alone cup contention. This move lost them Tyler Seguin, Dougie Hamilton and (prospect) Jared Knight. More recently, you saw the Leafs in rumors involving Roberto Luongo. The Leafs dodged a huge bullet in not acquiring Luongo. Not to say Luongo is a bad goalie, but the Leafs would have had to give up an arm and a leg to get him and seeing how Toronto has dealt with goalies as of late, it could have ruined Bobby Lu. If Toronto stays patient and doesn't make a "going for it" trade, they should be fine down the road. The Flames, who have Brian Burke in their front office, are putting together an excellent rebuild. Calgary is a team who in 5 years should be incredible. So to answer your question, I think it's just Toronto being Toronto. They are "the center of the hockey world" as everyone seems to say, so they act like it and rightfully so. If they don't try to make big moves like this, the general population of the fan base gets disinterested and starts to lose faith in the team. I don't like the corporation that is the Toronto Maple Leafs Sports and Entertainment as I feel they have too much influence on the day to day operation of the club. I mean look around. No other team has a company based around them like Toronto does. It negatively effects the team and puts every Leaf General Manager in a position where it would be impossible for them to succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 @Commander CluelessGreat post!I have always been a firm believer that the Toronto Maple Leafs are the Verruca Salt of the hockey world. Ever see Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory? "I want the world! I want the WHOLE WORLD!" When Toronto sees someone they want, they put aside whatever long term goal they have in place to satisfy their need; their desire for what's right in front of them. Take for example the infamous Phil Kessel trade. It appeared that the Leafs were "going for it" when this move was made, but the team was nowhere close to that level of playoff contention, let alone cup contention. This move lost them Tyler Seguin, Dougie Hamilton and (prospect) Jared Knight. More recently, you saw the Leafs in rumors involving Roberto Luongo. The Leafs dodged a huge bullet in not acquiring Luongo. Not to say Luongo is a bad goalie, but the Leafs would have had to give up an arm and a leg to get him and seeing how Toronto has dealt with goalies as of late, it could have ruined Bobby Lu. If Toronto stays patient and doesn't make a "going for it" trade, they should be fine down the road. The Flames, who have Brian Burke in their front office, are putting together an excellent rebuild. Calgary is a team who in 5 years should be incredible. So to answer your question, I think it's just Toronto being Toronto. They are "the center of the hockey world" as everyone seems to say, so they act like it and rightfully so. If they don't try to make big moves like this, the general population of the fan base gets disinterested and starts to lose faith in the team. I don't like the corporation that is the Toronto Maple Leafs Sports and Entertainment as I feel they have too much influence on the day to day operation of the club. I mean look around. No other team has a company based around them like Toronto does. It negatively effects the team and puts every Leaf General Manager in a position where it would be impossible for them to succeed. I agree with everything you said up until "If they don't try to make big moves like this, the general population of the fan base gets disinterested and starts to lose faith in the team." This is the Leafs. Harold Ballard owned this team for 18 years. He ran it like he was trying to run it into the ground. he humiliated the players and fans alike. And they never budged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Clueless Posted November 4, 2014 Author Share Posted November 4, 2014 I agree with everything you said up until "If they don't try to make big moves like this, the general population of the fan base gets disinterested and starts to lose faith in the team." This is the Leafs. Harold Ballard owned this team for 18 years. He ran it like he was trying to run it into the ground. he humiliated the players and fans alike. And they never budged. Loyalty, stubbornness, fanatical fandom, or just plain stupidity? Or all of the above? You decide, North America! @ihabs1993 I agree, although as @flyercanuck said above, "disinterested" isn't quite the word. Perhaps it would be a bit more accurate to say they get mad and get loud, mob style (although never quite so loud as Les Habitants, yes? ) And then when GMs cave to the pressure, we get future traded for now and we end up worse off. All that said, I do think the Leafs are at a crossroads. If they stay patient, guys like Lupul, Phaneuf, and maybe even Bozak and Kessel will be getting a bit older and might out-age-range the core. It's certainly a risk if they stay the course. On the other hand, if they do their patented "all in on a bluff" style trade, we could end up back to square one. It's a tough call to be made by Shanahan and his team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihabs1993 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 @ihabs1993 I agree, although as @flyercanuck said above, "disinterested" isn't quite the word. Perhaps it would be a bit more accurate to say they get mad and get loud, mob style (although never quite so loud as Les Habitants, yes? )And then when GMs cave to the pressure, we get future traded for now and we end up worse off.All that said, I do think the Leafs are at a crossroads. If they stay patient, guys like Lupul, Phaneuf, and maybe even Bozak and Kessel will be getting a bit older and might out-age-range the core. It's certainly a risk if they stay the course. On the other hand, if they do their patented "all in on a bluff" style trade, we could end up back to square one.It's a tough call to be made by Shanahan and his team. Habs fans are the most easily disappointed hockey fans in the world. That's not even a question haha... Best start since 1961 and the fans are crying for mutiny. But I see what you're saying. It's a microscope of a city. Disinterested isn't the right word because even if the team is in last place, Toronto will still sell tickets and people will still buy them, even if they come to the game to chant "Let's go Bluejays!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Clueless Posted November 4, 2014 Author Share Posted November 4, 2014 @ihabs1993 My favourite is the waffle throwing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 but maybe what he should be looking for is the best psychics and voodoo masters money can buy. We really need to find out what curse is on this team, and then figure out how to remove it before we have any chance of doing anything useful. I think all the parade planning over the years, the drawing of maps and routes, the ordering of champagne and ticker tape, the arranging of security, the setting up of the 72' plasma TVs along the route, etc etc. All of it adds up to so much bad karma. I could go on but I gotta run: I have to plan the Flyers parade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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